Road tubeless tyres, where and how much?

davidof

6wheels wrote:

Hope your e commuter is going well.

Has a weird shutdown on the ecommuter - I think it was maybe heat. Haven't commuted much over the summer due to heat here - 40C and 25C in the mornings!

cycleclinic

just got a pair of mavic yskions 25mm to test. I do 2000 miles on them and see how they look. I might do a long term test on the maxxis tyres as well.

The IRC formula pro lights have been decent but looking at the rear tyre this morning which has done 2640km it is looking fairly worn. These are race day tyres. I except the rear wear dot to be gone in the next 1000km. however they are fairly cut free and been ridden alot in heavy rain. So that is one test nearly completed.

Next the mavic tyres, then maxxis pardones, another go at schwalbe pro ones, then some hutchinsons.

sloppyschleckonds

Skip the Pro Ones and go straight to Maxxis Padrones

cycleclinic

The test will the pro ones will be short. With the mileage I do a month if they last a couple of months I will be impressed.
The yskion 25mm tyres weight 258g each. The packet says 260g so for once a claimed weight that is true.

bobones

I've covered just over 2000 miles on my Pro Ones since I fitted them mid-May, and they are still in pretty decent nick.

stevie63

I wanted to give an update to my own Tubeless adventures. I am using Archetype rims which as we know are not a Tubeless specific rim and when they need to be replaced I will definitely go for something else. The main problem that I find with the Archetype rims is that some tyres will only mount with CO2 and not even the Airshot.

Anyway for the last 2500 miles or so I have been running the Fusion 5 All Weather Tubeless tyres and wanted to give an update on them I have just replaced the rear tyre. So what has been good about them:

The Grip is good. I have ridden them in all conditions and they have always felt secure on the road with no unexpected surprises.

They seem to have been fairly resilient to Punctures. I have had no punctures in the front tyre that I am aware of (and if I have then the sealant has done its job) and the rear has only just started to puncture as it has reached the end of its life.

Decent lifespan. 2500 miles on the rear and I wouldn't be surprised if I got double that out of the front. And that has been all year round in all weather conditions on typical rubbish British Country lanes.

The cons:
They come up smaller than expected size, the 25 is probably more like 24mm. However this may also be a plus if you have tight clearances.

They feel a bit dead. Whilst that don't seem to have been slower riding is use, they do seem to have a bit of a dead feel to them regardless of pressure used. I appreciate that this is subjective.

In addition and possibly connected to the previous point, they feel a little bit harsh. This may be caused in part by the undersizing but I have on occasions stopped to make sure that they weren't flat because of the lack of comfort.

The tread cuts up easily. Whilst this hasn't led to any additional punctures this could just be pure luck. The casing though cuts up really easily which is surprising given their All Weather name.


So in summary not too bad but enough issues for me to try something different out. So I have just fitted a Maxxis Padrone TR to the back wheel and I will see how I get on with this

naylor343

Question on size to those using the maxxis padrones. What are the true mounted sizes on wider rims? I am running SL23 V1 rims on my road bike. As a reference, I have been using Pro4's where the 23mm (25 mounted) has proved perfect, 25mm (28 mounted) too close for real world clearance.

So with the padrones can anyone advice me, 23 or 25's?

bobones

naylor343 wrote:

Question on size to those using the maxxis padrones. What are the true mounted sizes on wider rims? I am running SL23 V1 rims on my road bike. As a reference, I have been using Pro4's where the 23mm (25 mounted) has proved perfect, 25mm (28 mounted) too close for real world clearance.

So with the padrones can anyone advice me, 23 or 25's?

Ugo says they're sized as advertised

posting.php?mode=quote&f=40042&t=13015799&p=20205910#pr20196205

sloppyschleckonds

Padrones come up as sized 25mm on my 23mm rims, if compared to 25mm Pro Ones that come up as 27/28mm on 25mm wide rims.

naylor343

Thanks for the info guys. 25's it is☺

saftlad

Going to build up a Surly LHT for some touring next year, and given the general success I've had with tubeless on the road bike, I think I'll try it for the tourer too. I'll only be in the uk or France so not the middle of no-where. Question is, what tyres would be recommended in a 35+ width?

cycleclinic

schwable marathon supreme tubeless 35mm or 40mm.

WTB horizon gets alot of love too by audax riders. Panracer have something too.

ddraver

Any sign of a Durano Tubeless from Eurobike yet?

cycleclinic

a tyre like that already exists but not as heavy it is called the IRC formula pro Fusion X-guard. They really need to work on the names.

Due to the sealant tubeless tyres dont need the same level of puncture protection as clinchers do.

alh14

How big are the IRC tyres in 28mm on a wide rim, I've currently got pro ones mounted on Hunt aero carbon30wheels and they seem huge, and also a bit fragile, as have had already a puncture which took a while to seal after 500miles.

marin_maniac

alh14 wrote:

How big are the IRC tyres in 28mm on a wide rim, I've currently got pro ones mounted on Hunt aero carbon30wheels and they seem huge, and also a bit fragile, as have had already a puncture which took a while to seal after 500miles.

I would suggest 28mm, as my 25mm come up at 25mm.

cycleclinic

on wide rims (19mm) internal width the formula pro tyres are the size they are meant to be. i.e a 25mm is 25mm wide and a 28mm is 28mm wide.

shortfall

Question re: inflation of tubeless tyres. It seems that some tyre/rim combos are difficult to get inflated, particularly if refitting a used tyre. I know about Airshot devices but the ones I've seen advertised are around fifty quid. Can I achieve the same result with a presta/Schrader adapter for a few quid off eBay and then inflating with a commercial tyre compressor? (I have access to one at work). Failing that I've heard about people using pressurised garden weed sprayers that seem to work out pretty cheap also. Any tips for how to make this work, what size tubing I'd need etc?
Thanks

g00se

An air compressor is the standard way they're done in bike shops. Provided it's not the sort that periodically stop every second and check the pressure automatically.

bobones

Shortfall wrote:

Question re: inflation of tubeless tyres. It seems that some tyre/rim combos are difficult to get inflated, particularly if refitting a used tyre. I know about Airshot devices but the ones I've seen advertised are around fifty quid. Can I achieve the same result with a presta/Schrader adapter for a few quid off eBay and then inflating with a commercial tyre compressor? (I have access to one at work). Failing that I've heard about people using pressurised garden weed sprayers that seem to work out pretty cheap also. Any tips for how to make this work, what size tubing I'd need etc?
Thanks

This £10 sprayer works well and also does a good job rinsing muck or soap after a wash!

All you need to do is unscrew the spray wand and replace with a length of plastic tubing (5mm internal diameter). I blagged a piece from my Karcher's detergent bottle.

I've found that in some cases you need to remove the valve core to get a good blast of air in, and for some tyres/rims they can collapse again before you manage to get the core back in. In these cases, I need to use a CO2 cannister with the value core still in as I have no access to a compressor.

gimpl

ugo.santalucia wrote:

bobones wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Get these

https://www.evanscycles.com/maxxis-padr ... gJnz_D_BwE

What's so good about them?

They tick all the boxes

They're fast, easy to live with, reasonably durable, good grip and they come the expected size... the Roadlites are good too but they are bigger than they claim

Hi Ugo

I'm tempted by these to go on my bike with mudguards, what are they like in the wet please?

Thanks

ugo.santalucia

Gimpl wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

bobones wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Get these

https://www.evanscycles.com/maxxis-padr ... gJnz_D_BwE

What's so good about them?

They tick all the boxes

They're fast, easy to live with, reasonably durable, good grip and they come the expected size... the Roadlites are good too but they are bigger than they claim

Hi Ugo

I'm tempted by these to go on my bike with mudguards, what are they like in the wet please?

Thanks

They are better than the Sector. I ride very conservatively in the wet, so I can't really comment on where the grip limit is. They seem fine to me, but it is down to how aggressively you want to ride.

I am surprised by how durable they are. 3500 km give or take and there is a lot of life left in the front and still a bit in the rear... the rear has squared off a bit, but very few cuts, despite some pretty horrific lanes last weekend in Shropshire.

The 28 don't go under my SKS, but that depends on your frame too

stevie63

Gimpl wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

bobones wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Get these

https://www.evanscycles.com/maxxis-padr ... gJnz_D_BwE

What's so good about them?

They tick all the boxes

They're fast, easy to live with, reasonably durable, good grip and they come the expected size... the Roadlites are good too but they are bigger than they claim

Hi Ugo

I'm tempted by these to go on my bike with mudguards, what are they like in the wet please?

Thanks

The grip on these in the wet is pretty good. However my rear lasted 100 miles before getting a gash in the tread that was too big to seal or be fixed with worms and superglue so I've had to whack a tube in it which kind of defeats the point.

gimpl

Thanks both of you.

I also tend to be very conservative in the wet/winter especially so since fracturing my elbow in 2012! I will be limited to 23mm though as clearance is very tight. Quite expensive, I may just buy one for the back for now and continue on with the GP 4000 that's still ok on the front.

Sanjay

I've had a look over the last few pages but couldn't find a definitive answer, so I apologise if this has already been covered.

Can anyone recommend a decent tubeless tyre for winter? I've always run 25mm Conti 4 Seasons, so would be after something with good protection, reasonably fast rolling and still grippy in the wet. I'm finding the lack of tubeless options and my limited knowledge of other brands a bit of a challenge. Thanks for any help you can provide.

bobones

Sanjay wrote:

I've had a look over the last few pages but couldn't find a definitive answer, so I apologise if this has already been covered.

Can anyone recommend a decent tubeless tyre for winter? I've always run 25mm Conti 4 Seasons, so would be after something with good protection, reasonably fast rolling and still grippy in the wet. I'm finding the lack of tubeless options and my limited knowledge of other brands a bit of a challenge. Thanks for any help you can provide.

I've only done 310 miles on them so far, but I'm currently running these Hutchinson Fusion 5 Performance 25mm on my winter bike, and I impressed with them so far: decent grip, smooth ride, fast and have enough rubber to suggest that they'll last pretty well. Decent price at the moment too. They're much heavier (320g) than the Schwalbe Pro One Evos that I have on my summer bike and also like, but they don't feel heavy on the road.

cycleclinic

I have finally got my hands on 3.5mm worms so for those that have found worms pushing out it maybe because the worm is not inserted properly (done that) or the hole is too big (had that recently as well). Hense the 3.5mms worm they can fill a bigger whole than the 1.5mm worms commonly found.

I use the IRC Formula Pro X-guard on the rear of the commutor which I ride in all weathers. A hard rubber compound that barely cuts, plenty of grip inspite of the hard compound and very long wear life. Expensive but for me they pay for themsleves. the GP 4 seasons are tyres that let me down time after time on the roads I ride on. so it all depends where your ride which tyre works for you best.

ddraver

ddraver wrote:

Any sign of a Durano Tubeless from Eurobike yet?

As i have done semi-regularly, i tweeted Schwalbe UK about this. Their reply this time:-

Yes, ask us again in December and we'll have an update

Promising, first time I've been given any sort of timescale...

Flamme Rouge

Project tubeless – Reflections on an Emotional Experience

Materials :- Rims – Mavic Open Pro UST, rim brake version (self-build)
Tyres – Panaracer A Evo3 (25 mm)
Tape (20.5mm), valves, sealant and syringe – Effetto Mariposa
Tyre levers – Bontrager

Manufacturer’s warnings which were ignored :-

1, Minimum tyre size - 28mm.

2, Use Mavic’s own valves.

3, Use Mavic’s own rim tape.

4. Maximum tyre pressure 6 bars.


Tips to relate following the fitting process:-

1, Remove all crockery and any living creatures you care about beyond a radius of 10kms.

2, Take slow, deep breaths to ensure calm state of mind. It won’t last.

3, The most precious thing in your life is the small channel Mavic have put in the well of the rim. Ensure the tape (two layers which fitted the rim precisely) is pressed down firmly into it with all bubbles and creases removed. You will need every millimetre it offers.

4, Do not insert valve fully. You will need the extra space this gives you in that small channel for the beads to fit.

5, The first bead will slip on with soapy water and a little help from a tyre lever having damaged your thumbs.

6, The second bead will only go on after much effort and language offensive to the ears of the most hardened of south London football fans. Method that worked was to place rim on cloth on floor; kneel on rim to prevent beads slipping off and apply large amounts of pressure with tyre levers. Soapy water a must. Additional tip that might have helped – use zip ties to prevent beads from slipping off as tyre levers are employed. Grippy, thin rubber gloves a help.

5, Do not tighten Effeto Mariposa valves with pliers in an attempt to stop leaking air. They will disappear through the valve hole. Tighten with fingers only. Do not break off said valve when it becomes stuck after using pliers. The broken end will rattle around inside the rim and refuse to come out. Only solution is to undo the tape and shake the end out through the larger holes in the outer part of the rim. Have spare tape, valves and sealant at the ready for cock-ups like this. Try to keep calm.

6, Leaking air at valve can be stopped by ignoring maximum pressure warning on rim and going for it in a this-will-have-to-bloody-work-because-I-don’t-know-what-else-will way with a track pump. This may, if you’re lucky, force sealant into any holes. Suspect best way of sealing leaks is to ride, as this will exert more force on the sealant. Dipping valve in sealant first before inserting might help.

7, Layer of “gum” on tyre will come off with all the efforts of trying to get the damn things on. It is not damage.

8, Damage is the red flecks on the rim scraped off the tyre levers as they struggle to cope.

9, Damage is also the dent in the rim following use of excessive force with tyre levers.

10, Thumbs and fingers will need some soothing balm by the end.

11, A 28mm tyre will, perhaps, be easier to fit on the Open Pro UST rim, given the near-impossibly tight tolerances of this particular rim/tyre combination. (See manufacturer’s warnings ignored above).

12, Tyre measures 25mm wide inflated on rim. Would easily have had enough room for a 28mm.

Pleasant surprises :-

Front inflated easily using track pump and held without sealant. Both tyres popped nicely into the rim.

Even more pleasant surprises :-

1, Ride quality outstanding – hints of Vittoria Corsa 25mm tubular plushness without the fear of a latex inner tube ‘going’ at 45kph on a corner. Absorb “chatter” over uneven surfaces to the same degree and much better than 23mm Prorace clinchers and 25mm Gatorskin tubulars.

2, Tough, high quality rubber. Long life expected.

3, 50kms of fast technical descents suggests they are the most assured rubber I’ve been on. Great control and no need to worry about punctures. Count me impressed.

4, Uphill – don’t feel fast (something to do with how well they absorb road vibration, bumps etc perhaps) but, looking at the speedometer, they are. Nice and quick.

5, 5 days after initial inflation difficult to tell if they’re losing any air at all. Work well at 5 bar.

With thanks to all contributors in this thread for sharing such a wonderful depth of knowledge and experience – especially ugo.santalucia and thecycleclinic – without whom this project simply would never have got on to a rim, let alone stayed inflated.

sloppyschleckonds

TL:DR

But agree with pleasant surprise no.1

There are plenty of video tutorials to help you avoid a lot of your errors

Quality tyre levers, use of Schwalbe Easy Fit etc etc, only using sealant to repair punctures not seal the tyre/ rims