Scott Foil - Westbrook Cycles

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  • duckson
    duckson Posts: 961
    Dunno, not sure if it applies to the Foil but I'd guess so?
    Cheers, Stu
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    Where abouts? You can slam the stem without any problem.
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • markhewitt1978
    markhewitt1978 Posts: 7,614
    pedalbasher wrote:
    Out of interest why do Scott say you need a 5mm spacer minimum?

    Standard thing with carbon steerers.
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    It should be noted that the headset cap counts to that 5mm.
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • duckson
    duckson Posts: 961
    Grill wrote:
    It should be noted that the headset cap counts to that 5mm.

    You reckon? I'd have to read the Scott literature and find where it mentions it again.
    I know it measures circa 6mm.
    Cheers, Stu
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    I don't see why not. I've run it without spacers as have many other owners as well as riders for OGE and IAM.
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • pedalbasher
    pedalbasher Posts: 215
    pedalbasher wrote:
    And one other question:

    If I want to run an internal di2 battery rather than the external one that comes as part of the deal, can I simply buy the internal (seat post) battery (either 6870 or the DA 9070 one)? Presumably I might need to get different cables too, thinking about it, as the lengths might not be the same as required for the external battery.

    Would be grateful if anyone can shed some light on this. Keen to get the battery hidden away if possible.

    Thanks
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    pedalbasher wrote:
    pedalbasher wrote:
    And one other question:

    If I want to run an internal di2 battery rather than the external one that comes as part of the deal, can I simply buy the internal (seat post) battery (either 6870 or the DA 9070 one)? Presumably I might need to get different cables too, thinking about it, as the lengths might not be the same as required for the external battery.

    Would be grateful if anyone can shed some light on this. Keen to get the battery hidden away if possible.

    Thanks

    As long as the front junction box is the EW-90A (or B) then an internal battery is no problem. It will plug right in to the same place as the external battery on the JC41 rear junction box. As the JC41 sits by the bottom bracket, you'll need a cable at least as long as the seat tube if you want to mount the battery inside of the seat post. You'll also need the SM-BCR2 charger which can also be used to update firmware.
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • How Far is too Far
    How Far is too Far Posts: 534
    If you want the internal battery you could get this deal

    http://www.westbrookcycles.co.uk/scott- ... Pack_Offer
  • pedalbasher
    pedalbasher Posts: 215
    How Far is too Far wrote:
    If you want the internal battery you could get this deal

    http://www.westbrookcycles.co.uk/scott- ... Pack_Offer

    Wow! What's the downside??! I think I may have to cancel the existing order and get this. Colour scheme is interesting but it's more bike than I could ever have dreamt of owning.
  • simonj
    simonj Posts: 346
    It is a good deal, but not the same as the other as no crank / brakes etc, still very good and tempting!!! :)
  • pedalbasher
    pedalbasher Posts: 215
    What exactly else do I need to buy? Chainset and cranks separately? Plus brakes, cassette and chain?

    Any recommendations for chainset / cranks?
  • meanredspider
    meanredspider Posts: 12,337
    edited June 2014
    pedalbasher wrote:
    What exactly else do I need to buy? Chainset and cranks separately? Plus brakes, cassette and chain?

    Any recommendations for chainset / cranks?

    Yup - one option (which might be economic) is to buy an entire groupset from the likes of Merlin and sell on the DRs and shifters. I've got Ultegra on my version of this bike when it was sold with the full groupset for £2k.

    You also need wheels, bars, stem, saddle :wink:
    ROAD < Scott Foil HMX Di2, Volagi Liscio Di2, Jamis Renegade Elite Di2, Cube Reaction Race > ROUGH
  • pedalbasher
    pedalbasher Posts: 215
    Thanks. I've already got wheelse, saddle, stem and bars :)

    Realistically it's going to cost c. £500 to buy a decent crankset inc. BB, calipers, brake cables, cassette and chain. That makes the whole package £2k, whereas the Foil 15 is £1400 with everything I need... worth the extra? I'm not sure, for 200g and a dodgy paint job(!) it seems a lot. Grateful for thoughts though.
  • meanredspider
    meanredspider Posts: 12,337
    pedalbasher wrote:
    Thanks. I've already got wheelse, saddle, stem and bars :)

    Realistically it's going to cost c. £500 to buy a decent crankset inc. BB, calipers, brake cables, cassette and chain. That makes the whole package £2k, whereas the Foil 15 is £1400 with everything I need... worth the extra? I'm not sure, for 200g and a dodgy paint job(!) it seems a lot. Grateful for thoughts though.

    Is the Foil 15 Di2?

    The Ultegra 6800 GROUPSET is only £524 at Merlin (I think the frame comes with BB - mine did) - you ought be able to get £200 for the shifters and DRs Then you're looking at £400 for what is effectively a pro-grade frame. And it's nowhere near a nasty in the flesh as maybe the pics make it look.
    ROAD < Scott Foil HMX Di2, Volagi Liscio Di2, Jamis Renegade Elite Di2, Cube Reaction Race > ROUGH
  • pedalbasher
    pedalbasher Posts: 215
    Yeah the Foil 15 is full Di2 (albeit external rather than internal battery) for £1399.

    So it's £1399 all-in for the Foil 15, or £1499 plus chainset, brakes, cassette and chain for the Team Issue. To be honest if I went down the Team Issue route I'd probably go for a fancy 3rd party chainset and Ultegra 6800 brakes, so doesn't make sense buying another full groupset even at discount I don't think.

    Any chainset recommendations?

    And I don't suppose anyone has any experience of comparison between the 15 and the Team Issue (really just a comparison between Scott's HMX and HMF carbon, right?) As I understand it the HMX is a touch lighter (150g?) and a toucher stiffer [harsher?]
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    The HMF and HMX frames are tuned to ride identically. The HMX is stiffer so they're able to use less of it thus the lighter weight.
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • pedalbasher
    pedalbasher Posts: 215
    Grill wrote:
    pedalbasher wrote:
    pedalbasher wrote:
    And one other question:

    If I want to run an internal di2 battery rather than the external one that comes as part of the deal, can I simply buy the internal (seat post) battery (either 6870 or the DA 9070 one)? Presumably I might need to get different cables too, thinking about it, as the lengths might not be the same as required for the external battery.

    Would be grateful if anyone can shed some light on this. Keen to get the battery hidden away if possible.

    Thanks

    As long as the front junction box is the EW-90A (or B) then an internal battery is no problem. It will plug right in to the same place as the external battery on the JC41 rear junction box. As the JC41 sits by the bottom bracket, you'll need a cable at least as long as the seat tube if you want to mount the battery inside of the seat post. You'll also need the SM-BCR2 charger which can also be used to update firmware.

    I might be being dumb here, but how does the SM-BTR2 battery fit in Scott's aero seat post?! Or does it go in the seat TUBE?

    So the battery is about £100, and I'd need some more cabling (can anyone send a link to the relevant cable please?)
  • simonj
    simonj Posts: 346
    Need a few bits, £272 on my quick calculator to give you internal battery, you also get the ability to program and upgrade firmware as the charger can also do that :-

    You'd need battery to put in seat tube or seat post - £100 :-

    http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/sp/road-t ... wwodX28Ahw

    New front junction, else you can't charge it £68 :-

    http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/shim ... lsrc=aw.ds

    A couple of 350mm cables - £32:-

    http://www.wiggle.co.uk/shimano-dura-ac ... 5360449284

    And a charger - £72:-

    http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/shim ... lsrc=aw.ds

    The team one, I reckon £222 on top of the price for crank (ultegra) (£142), cassette (£42), BB (£16) & chain (£22).
  • simonj
    simonj Posts: 346
    Sorry, you don't need the BB as it comes with a PF86, which is fine for a 6800 crank.
  • neeb
    neeb Posts: 4,471
    pedalbasher wrote:
    worth the extra? I'm not sure, for 200g and a dodgy paint job(!) it seems a lot. Grateful for thoughts though.
    The paint job is lovely! No accounting for taste.. :wink:

    If it's the green you are worried about, it's not nearly so apparent in the flesh because you only really see it from the back. Personally I wish there was more green. :) I love the contrast of white and black at the head tube accentuating the aero curves.

    However, the shiny paint does add a few grams. The HMX with the Team Issue paint job is still lighter than the HMF with matt black paint, but not by much.
  • Grill
    Grill Posts: 5,610
    neeb wrote:
    The HMX with the Team Issue paint job is still lighter than the HMF with matt black paint, but not by much.

    40g according to Epic. You also get the HMX seat post so you';; save a couple more on that.
    English Cycles V3 | Cervelo P5 | Cervelo T4 | Trek Domane Koppenberg
  • neeb
    neeb Posts: 4,471
    Grill wrote:
    neeb wrote:
    The HMX with the Team Issue paint job is still lighter than the HMF with matt black paint, but not by much.

    40g according to Epic. You also get the HMX seat post so you';; save a couple more on that.
    Also the HMX fork is lighter (assuming that's not included in the 40g difference).
  • pippi_langsamer-2
    pippi_langsamer-2 Posts: 1,470
    It's not the green n yellow colour fade that would bother me, but the string of OGE sponsors littering the seat stays. Sponsors all of which you probably have none of on your bike. For me, that cheapens the frame and makes it look a little crass...

    You can't really see them on the WB website pics, but Google it and you'll see....

    http://www.imgbox.de/users/gotcha911/eBay/Foil_2.JPG
  • neeb
    neeb Posts: 4,471
    Pippi Langsamer wrote:
    It's not the green n yellow colour fade that would bother me, but the string of OGE sponsors littering the seat stays. Sponsors all of which you probably have none of on your bike. For me, that cheapens the frame and makes it look a little crass...

    You can't really see them on the WB website pics, but Google it and you'll see....

    http://www.imgbox.de/users/gotcha911/eBay/Foil_2.JPG
    With my mechanical Team Issue frame, the seat stay decals as well as the Shimano ones on the chainstays came as optional additions (all of the other decals were under the lacquer though). I think the earlier versions of the same frame came with all of the decals pre-applied.

    I applied them anyway, I especially liked the irony of the Shimano logos next to the Campagnolo SR crankset.. :wink:
  • cgrenn
    cgrenn Posts: 206
    Got a quick question, did anybody use the little Carbon Divider what was cabled tied to the Braze on on the front mech, or did you just use the standard metal spacer what comes with the Mech?
  • pippi_langsamer-2
    pippi_langsamer-2 Posts: 1,470
    Considering this...

    Foil15 with more components, or Team Issue with better carbon, internal battery option (nice), but less components.

    Same price ~

    Hmmmm..... what to do.
  • How Far is too Far
    How Far is too Far Posts: 534
    Chain is £25
    Cassette is £42
    Chainset is £140

    So £207 more, but you get internal battery and a lighter stiffer frame, seem to be both very good value to me.

    Rich...
  • neeb
    neeb Posts: 4,471
    CGRenn wrote:
    Got a quick question, did anybody use the little Carbon Divider what was cabled tied to the Braze on on the front mech, or did you just use the standard metal spacer what comes with the Mech?
    I used it when fitting my front Campagnolo mech on my mechanical frame. I had to replace the Campagnolo fixing bolt (as well as the washer) with a longer one due to the extra thickness of the carbon washer/divider, but I think it's worth the hassle. Apart from avoiding possible damage to the hanger it seems to increase friction, so the mech is less likely to go out of alignment at the relatively low recommended torque of the fixing bolt.
  • pedalbasher
    pedalbasher Posts: 215
    Pippi Langsamer wrote:
    Considering this...

    Foil15 with more components, or Team Issue with better carbon, internal battery option (nice), but less components.

    Same price ~

    Hmmmm..... what to do.

    I've stuck with the 15. Your comment about the seat stays logos is valid - they're terrible. I never ever wear team kit when out riding and wou;dn't want all the branding over my bike, it screams "look at me, I think I'm a pro".

    I'm slightly miffed about the external battery that comes with the 15 but if I really don't like it in the flesh, I'll either get the internal kit for a couple of hundred or (if I don't like the ride in addition to the battery issue) I'll just sell the complete bike a few months down the line, probably get close to Westbrook price anyway or even make a profit!

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