Has anyone got the NEW 2013 Canyon Ultimate CF SLX yet?

Doty

Cheers Dave and Crozza.
Wheels are true and clamped tightly.
Yes the rear triangle will flex with no wheel in, but no more than my other bikes.
I think given the Shamals rub exactly the same as the SLRs I think it's almost certainly the frame. I've also tried some really heavy winter wheels- same thing. None of the wheels rub on the Basso.
By slightly 'off centreing' the brakes to give 3mm clearance on the right and 2mm on the left it almost eliminates the problem, unless I really lean the bike while climbing standing on the pedals in a high gear - in which case it still rubs! Although it is only very slight (made more noticeable by the sound the exalith rims make when a brake comes anywhere near them). Maybe I have to amend my riding style...
I've also realised that on most photos I've seen of the SLX you can see carbon weave around the BB. I can only just about make it out on mine. Find that a bit odd. Everyone else see it clearer on theirs?
Canyon have suggested I send the bike back for inspection... but doubt there's anything wrong with the frame. But I'm undecided what to do. I may well just be being paranoid. I'm just concerned that I'm not a heavy rider, and no one else has had the same issue and I didn't have this issue with the Basso no matter how close I had the brake blocks. And there's very little flex when similarly applying pressure to the right pedal.
And all the reviews rave about how stiff it is! Including this new one - http://cycletechreview.com/2013/reviews ... lx-review/

Bar Shaker

I suspect you can flex the rear wheel clamp points together on any bike as the the rear triangles are weak in this direction without the wheel clamped in place. The seat stays are incredibly thin of the SLX, it may be these that are flexing, with the chain stays twisting as they do. The Bianchi Oltre has a bit of this when climbing out of the saddle, probably for the same reason. It makes for a comfortable ride but isn't optimum for climbing.

Can you just open the rear brakes out a bit more? Your Exalith coating won't last long if the pads are rubbing.

Doty

Ok, so might have had the brake blocks slightly closer than I thought due to having more toe-in on one side than the other... still got 2.5 gap and did a 'less hilly' ride yesterday with 10% max gradients and had no rub at all. I'm going to go out later on some steeper climbs to re-test.

I've also tried the SLRs in the Basso frame - when standing on the left crank (at 45 degrees) leaning against a wall applying the front brake I can see flex on the Basso too... not as much as the SLX, but then the seat stays are huge by comparison!

I'd still like to know if others can observe this flex with their SLXs (regardless of wheel type) when trying the above?
This might save me from having to send it back to Canyon UK for them to compare to a bike they have there.

I'm starting to think it's a combination of the frame, wheels and brake set-up that's causing this - as well as me being ultra-sensitive about such things!

And worth re-iterating that I am only talking about the brake rub happening about very steep climbs with a hard 'standing' effort (doesn't happen when seated!)

cheers

homercles

@doty - interesting situation. I don't have much technical knowledge bring to the situation but I can tell you, having finally taken my SLX out for a big ride yesterday, I didn't notice any flex at all. In fact, it felt rock solid at all times, including out of saddle sprints and on the climbs (including a good mix of steady and standing effort, plus one full on 18% grade out of the saddle effort). There were a few occasions where I put in really big digs just to see how it responded and I was really impressed with the lack of flex compared to my old bike (admittedly alu but still a decent quality race frame and fairly stiff with it).

And I should add, I'm a BIG guy - 6ft, 93kgs, so a lot of stress would probably be going through that frame.

Doty

Cheers Homercles
I must stress that there is no detectable flex other than the rub on the right block (when 2mm or less from the rim) and every climb I attack on it I seem to get a PB on Strava, so can't be too flexy! How close do you have your brake blocks out of interest? (I used allen keys to estimate my distances)

Canyon mentioned that when carrying out a similar 'standing on pedal with front brake on' test the deflection on their bike is around the same at about 1mm. Although it might be slightly more on mine I realise we're talking very small numbers here.

I didn't manage to test the new brake set up for long tonight, but took it up a 17% climb and experienced no brake rub now I have essentially removed the toe-in on the pad (obviously having the effect of increasing the clearance - but only to about 2.5mm). I'll have to see how I get on with the extra 'squealing' from the Exalith rims as the pad wears - some further adjustment to add back in some toe-in may be needed!

I'd still be interested to hear others observations re rim/brake clearance, flex, and rub when climbing steeply out of the saddle.
cheers
Doty

mfin

Doty wrote:

Anyone else found the Mavics to provide a harsh ride - even at 100psi? (I’m only 63kg)

If you are 63 kgs, you don't need 100psi, knock it down to 85-90psi and that will improve things and be plenty enough pressure for your weight. Try it. (that's if you are on clinchers, if you're on tubs ignore this)

sloppyschleckonds

Just had an email from Canyon regarding innovations for their 2014 bikes, get your orders in first! lol

jezzpalmer

From experience I can tell you it's better not to order now, but wait for while as you'll end up getting it before everyone that ordered early.
It's the Canyon way.

Over 10 months now and still waiting for a serviceable bike to be shipped.

Was philosophical, now pissed off.

drlodge

Over 10 months?! That's just taking the pi$$.

jezzpalmer

drlodge wrote:

Over 10 months?! That's just taking the pi$$.

They managed to get one with a broken frame to me in 9 months, but that's not much use to anyone.

bobbydazzla

For those of you talking about back brake rub when climbing and applying pressure to the left crank, I think I might have a similar issue with my Ultimate CF 9.0

It's been making a loud noise (like a seal barking !) when I'm out of the saddle and going uphill, it only happens when the left crank is at the bottom of my pedal stroke.

I've had the bike for 6 months and it's only been doing it in the last couple of weeks. I'd presumed it was coming from the BB, so took it down to see the mechanic at my LBS who's stripped the BB down, tightened everything up and applied plenty of grease etc.

But reading the earlier posts makes me think I should be fettling with the brakes, rather than the BB....

Other than that I'm delighted with the bike !

Doty

Bobbydazzla, best way to tell would be to slacken off the brake and see if the noise stops. I'm not sure I'd of noticed my brake rub with standard rims as easily, but the exaliths make it known when the pad touches!

Skerryman

bobbydazzla wrote:

For those of you talking about back brake rub when climbing and applying pressure to the left crank, I think I might have a similar issue with my Ultimate CF 9.0

It's been making a loud noise (like a seal barking !) when I'm out of the saddle and going uphill, it only happens when the left crank is at the bottom of my pedal stroke.

I've had the bike for 6 months and it's only been doing it in the last couple of weeks. I'd presumed it was coming from the BB, so took it down to see the mechanic at my LBS who's stripped the BB down, tightened everything up and applied plenty of grease etc.

But reading the earlier posts makes me think I should be fettling with the brakes, rather than the BB....

Other than that I'm delighted with the bike !

I was getting a creaking noise when the left crank was in the 6 o clock position, especially when out of the saddle climbing. Thought it was the pedal not being tight enough so took off the pedal and re-greased, thought that fixed it but it was there again the next day. Eventually found out it was due to my cleats being worn and the plastic in the middle of the cleat was rubbing off the contact plate on my pedal, put on new cleats and all sorted. Might be worth a try.

giant_man

lots of mysterious noises can be tracked down to pedal/cleats noise imo, and the lack of a touch of oil/grease, it's just not the obvious thing you think of, glad you got your noise sorted.

bobbydazzla

Thanks for the suggestions above, whatever the problem was has now gone.

Stripping the BB and fettling with the brakes has done the trick. No idea which of those actions got the result, but am happy to have got rid of a noise that was doing my head in !

Low-fi

Doty wrote:

<review bit snipped>
HOWEVER, I am experiencing some worrying back brake block rub on the right hand side of the rim when climbing out of the saddle with pressure applied to the left crank. At first I thought it was a brake centering issue. Then assumed it was the Ksyrium SLRs flexing. I’d never had issues with the super stiff Campy Shamals on the Astra. But everything I read suggested the SLRs are also super stiff! So I popped the Shamal rear wheel in – same problem. Even when just indoors, if I stand to apply pressure on the left pedal while stationary leaning against a wall (with the front brake on) flex occurs that causes the right brake block to touch the rim (with a 2.5mm ish gap between block and rim). I’m now convinced (and very concerned) this is the frame flexing. Odd for a supposedly super stiff bike. I’m contacting Canyon about it, but just wondered if anyone else’s SLX does the same?
Gonna try increasing brake block clearance, but feel I shouldn't have to.. and I’ve got a bad feeling about this!

+1 for the same thing happening here on the Mavic R-SYS SLs. Hmmm.

Doty

Hi Low-fi
I was all set to return it to Canyon (they helpfully pick it up when you notify them it's back in its box). However, increasing the brake clearance has more or less sorted it. I've decided against sending it back, at least for the moment, as Canyon UK said they have also observed a similar amount of 'deflection' with the SLX they have there and that it took very careful brake set up to sort out. I guessed all they'd do would be to increase the brake block clearance and send it back!
I'm trying to forget about it and just enjoy the bike... but it's still niggling me. If someone of my weight can flex things, not sure why typically heavier testers are raving about the stiffness so much! Maybe there's a lack of steep hills where they tested the bikes!

Low-fi

Doty wrote:

Hi Low-fi
I was all set to return it to Canyon (they helpfully pick it up when you notify them it's back in its box). However, increasing the brake clearance has more or less sorted it. I've decided against sending it back, at least for the moment, as Canyon UK said they have also observed a similar amount of 'deflection' with the SLX they have there and that it took very careful brake set up to sort out. I guessed all they'd do would be to increase the brake block clearance and send it back!
I'm trying to forget about it and just enjoy the bike... but it's still niggling me. If someone of my weight can flex things, not sure why typically heavier testers are raving about the stiffness so much! Maybe there's a lack of steep hills where they tested the bikes!

Cheers Doty. Ironically, mine went back to Canyon due to a squeaky BB on the left hand side, which they fixed (although might it have been the brakes all along?!). I noticed the rear brake rub in exactly the same position a you mentioned at the weekend. I'm guessing other bikes deflect as much, but the Exaliath coating makes the sound more pronounced. Will do that deflection test later...

Doty

Let me know how you get on Low-fi.
Yeh, I think you're right about other bikes and the exalith rims highlighting any slight contact. I thought the noise was my pedal at first. On my club ride on Sunday I noted that most people had a larger amount of clearance between brakes and rim than I was using in order to eliminate rubbing.
I guess my Basso Astra is just super-duper stiff!

Low-fi

Doty wrote:

Let me know how you get on Low-fi.
Yeh, I think you're right about other bikes and the exalith rims highlighting any slight contact. I thought the noise was my pedal at first. On my club ride on Sunday I noted that most people had a larger amount of clearance between brakes and rim than I was using in order to eliminate rubbing.
I guess my Basso Astra is just super-duper stiff!

Yeah, I guess I just find it funny it's just on one side. I recall a test showing the Canyon to have one of the highest frame stiffnesses, so I can't believe it's a massive problem.

drlodge

Low-fi wrote:

Doty wrote:

Let me know how you get on Low-fi.
Yeh, I think you're right about other bikes and the exalith rims highlighting any slight contact. I thought the noise was my pedal at first. On my club ride on Sunday I noted that most people had a larger amount of clearance between brakes and rim than I was using in order to eliminate rubbing.
I guess my Basso Astra is just super-duper stiff!

Yeah, I guess I just find it funny it's just on one side. I recall a test showing the Canyon to have one of the highest frame stiffnesses, so I can't believe it's a massive problem.

I think its got bugger all to do with frame stiffness. The frame will be stiff, the rims will be stiff, but the lack of spoke stiffness is likely to be causing the issue. Think about how the spokes are different on each side of the rear wheel - stronger on the NDS than on the drive side due to the angle they're at.

jezzpalmer

I have the bike, with intact frame!

It came with the wrong saddle (SLS instead of SLR) in the wrong colour, the saddle and the bar tape are white instead of black; it looks shockingly grim. There's also some minor damage to one of the rims and the front caliper.

Waiting for a response from Canyon.

neeb

Following this thread with interest and would be interested to hear about subjective impressions of how the CF SLX rides compared with other frames. I'm never quite sure to what extent reviewers are really objective and how much they are influenced by commercial pressure, especially from big outfits like Canyon who very much rely on online and magazine publicity because they don't have a retail network as such....

Every review of this bike says that the frame is mega stiff, so it's weird if people are finding otherwise when comparing with other frames using the same wheels. I wonder if any brake rubbing could actually be because the frame is very stiff - if the frame isn't flexing at all, perhaps the wheels are flexing more because none of the lateral forces are being absorbed before they get to the wheel?

mechanism

Just speculating, or possibly talking nonsense, but could it be that frame stiffness is measured by reviewers at the bottom bracket or head tube, whereas this flex (if indeed it is movement in the frame that is causing the brake rub, rather than movement in the wheel) is at the rear dropout, possibly due to the compliance built in to the thin seat stays?

I have Ksyrium Elite wheels on mine and haven't noticed any brake rub, but that doesn't mean it isn't happening.

Low-fi

Mechanism wrote:

Just speculating, or possibly talking nonsense, but could it be that frame stiffness is measured by reviewers at the bottom bracket or head tube, whereas this flex (if indeed it is movement in the frame that is causing the brake rub, rather than movement in the wheel) is at the rear dropout, possibly due to the compliance built in to the thin seat stays?

I have Ksyrium Elite wheels on mine and haven't noticed any brake rub, but that doesn't mean it isn't happening.

yeah, the R-SYS SLs are really noise when braking, so any movement onto the pads is heard. Other wheels probably don't make so much of a noise.

the_prophet

Just to add to this, I've got last years SLX with mavic slr wheels and get exactly the same thing. standing up, putting the power down the wheel will rub the pads slightly and give the noise your all getting.

As said, its likely down to the exalith coating it's being noticed more than on other wheels. not something that's bothered me I have to say, but have noticed the same.

itsnotarace

Try tightening the preload of the SLR bearings a little. Do this with the wheel in place and the skewer tightened to normal tightening levels. Tighten the preload until the wheel no longer spins really freely and then back off 1/8th of a turn until it spins normally again

Doty

neeb wrote:

Every review of this bike says that the frame is mega stiff, so it's weird if people are finding otherwise when comparing with other frames using the same wheels. I wonder if any brake rubbing could actually be because the frame is very stiff - if the frame isn't flexing at all, perhaps the wheels are flexing more because none of the lateral forces are being absorbed before they get to the wheel?

I wondered the same.

It's also definitely right that the exalith coating draws your attention to it (it's not severe enough to be able to feel it slowing you down, so if it was silent we'd be none the wiser I dare say).
I'm less concerned than I was, but it's interesting others are finding the same thing. At the end of the day it's a joy to ride and my Strava results suggest it's as quick as it feels!

Crozza

Details about canyons 2014 range starting to come in. Ultimate cf sl looks interesting

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/CANYON-Eurobike-2014.html

Stumpupthing

Hey guys, just returned a slx cf 9.0 - am btw on a 2xl and weigh 90kgs - few issues were internal rattling of cables in frame, creaking from rear wheel whilst climbing out of saddle. i also had the brake rub as some of you guys have experienced, and just opened the gap a bit, but is annoying to know there is still this resistance essentially working against your climbing efforts. The trigger for returning whole bike was a broken rear spoke, which has to be repaired by mavic under warranty so not a DIY or LBS job. Canyon have agreed to replace. Apart from these niggles, the bike has been a dream to ride, fast, smooth (I used 25c 4000s tyres and big difference in comfort for no real loss in speed) great uphill, superb breaking performance from exealith system. So strava times consistently better than my 2013 alu trek domane which am riding again now whilst I wait. The weight difference between them of about 2kgs is not enough to explain the better performance is see on the canyon, which I estimate around 3-8% quicker on average across similar routes ridden, depending on how hilly the route is.