Energy thread

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  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    edited August 2022
    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    I really really loathe being cold. I have had the thermostat set at 22.5 for the past 3 years.

    I refuse to believe people can actually be comfortable under 19 degrees indoors. I guess I'll find out.
    _
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 22,730
    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    15C?
    Are you in training for an assault on the South Pole?
    That’s 59F in old money.
    Not sure how you get your house that cold in the Summer.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,482
    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    I really really loathe being cold. I have had the thermostat set at 22.5 for the past 3 years.

    I refuse to believe people can actually be comfortable under 19 degrees indoors. I guess I'll find out.
    I am happy to accept that others are less tolerant of temperature either way.
    I'd suggest that you need to accept that others have different opinions to yours.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • JimD666
    JimD666 Posts: 2,293
    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    I really really loathe being cold. I have had the thermostat set at 22.5 for the past 3 years.

    I refuse to believe people can actually be comfortable under 19 degrees indoors. I guess I'll find out.
    I'd melt. Never set a thermostat above 20 in my life. Usually set to 18.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    edited August 2022
    JimD666 said:

    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    I really really loathe being cold. I have had the thermostat set at 22.5 for the past 3 years.

    I refuse to believe people can actually be comfortable under 19 degrees indoors. I guess I'll find out.
    I'd melt. Never set a thermostat above 20 in my life. Usually set to 18.
    It's been between 28 and 24 in the house all summer (without any heating on). Glorious.

    26-28 is pretty warm but tolerable. I really hate anything under 20. Hate it. Neck seized up, muscles get sore, all of it. Awful. Has got worse since my bike accident - neck hasn't been the same since the whiplash and it get so sore it gives me migraines.

    I'm stocking up on thermals and will probably end up doing a bunch of workouts throughout the day as well as a bike ride at lunch to keep myself warm. No bad thing, probably.
    _
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 22,024
    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    I really really loathe being cold. I have had the thermostat set at 22.5 for the past 3 years.

    I refuse to believe people can actually be comfortable under 19 degrees indoors. I guess I'll find out.
    Have you tried the jumper thing?
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    I really really loathe being cold. I have had the thermostat set at 22.5 for the past 3 years.

    I refuse to believe people can actually be comfortable under 19 degrees indoors. I guess I'll find out.
    Have you tried the jumper thing?
    I wear a jumper indoors in winter yes. That's at 22.5.
    _
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 22,024
    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    I really really loathe being cold. I have had the thermostat set at 22.5 for the past 3 years.

    I refuse to believe people can actually be comfortable under 19 degrees indoors. I guess I'll find out.
    Have you tried the jumper thing?
    I wear a jumper indoors in winter yes. That's at 22.5.
    Have you tried a thicker one?
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    edited August 2022
    Yeah but then your legs get cold so you need thicker trousers, but that never really works, so you then need long johns which are inherently not comfortable,, then your feet get cold so you need to walk around with thick socks, and then your neck gets cold and so you're a w*nker because you need to walk around with a scarf and then I'm bald so my head gets cold so I then have to wear a hat indoors.

    At that point I'm dressed for the outdoors, which seems ludicrous in a house with central heating.

    Clearly this year will be different.
    _
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 22,730
    rick_chasey said:

    JimD666 said:

    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    I really really loathe being cold. I have had the thermostat set at 22.5 for the past 3 years.

    I refuse to believe people can actually be comfortable under 19 degrees indoors. I guess I'll find out.
    I'd melt. Never set a thermostat above 20 in my life. Usually set to 18.
    It's been between 28 and 24 in the house all summer (without any heating on). Glorious.

    26-28 is pretty warm but tolerable. I really hate anything under 20. Hate it. Neck seized up, muscles get sore, all of it. Awful. Has got worse since my bike accident - neck hasn't been the same since the whiplash and it get so sore it gives me migraines.

    I'm stocking up on thermals and will probably end up doing a bunch of workouts throughout the day as well as a bike ride at lunch to keep myself warm. No bad thing, probably.
    I am with you, Rick but I am older.
    Not quite as bad, as I can just about tolerate 21C
    I prefer 22-23C though
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 8,154
    Forget the jumpers, eat some bloody Mars bars and cake. Lots of cake.


  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 8,154
    I bet there is a bit of a correlation with body fat ratio and how warm people feel relative to the temperature.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    Less flippantly, I suspect because I spent the first 4 years of my life Muscat (which, as it's got water on 2 sides of it, hovers around the 30 for much of the year with a good 80% humidity) I am pretty tolerant of the heat and not so much of the cold...
    _
  • pangolin
    pangolin Posts: 6,660
    Maybe this is why the grads are less concerned about prices than you Rick.

    Our house is rarely above 20 in winter.
    - Genesis Croix de Fer
    - Dolan Tuono
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    This house certainly won't be above 20 this winter, for sure, and I'll still be paying vastly more for it. Same as everyone.

    I'm just not looking forward to it.
    _
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,588
    I see pubs are now pushing for support towards energy costs in order to keep open having been heavily supported during the Covid lockdowns. Maybe it is just time to accept that the pub business model isn’t able to support the amount of pubs out there rather than expect the Government to bail them out all the time.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    It would be good to have some rules about shops keeping doors shut, relaxation on minimum temperatures etc.
    _
  • pangolin
    pangolin Posts: 6,660
    edited August 2022
    Pross said:

    I see pubs are now pushing for support towards energy costs in order to keep open having been heavily supported during the Covid lockdowns. Maybe it is just time to accept that the pub business model isn’t able to support the amount of pubs out there rather than expect the Government to bail them out all the time.

    People got a lot of support during covid and are getting lots (so far, more to come probably) towards energy costs. Maybe it is just time to accept that it is too expensive to live if we expect the Government to bail us out all the time.
    - Genesis Croix de Fer
    - Dolan Tuono
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 22,024
    edited August 2022
    rick_chasey said:

    Yeah but then your legs get cold so you need thicker trousers, but that never really works, so you then need long johns which are inherently not comfortable,, then your feet get cold so you need to walk around with thick socks, and then your neck gets cold and so you're a w*nker because you need to walk around with a scarf and then I'm bald so my head gets cold so I then have to wear a hat indoors.

    At that point I'm dressed for the outdoors, which seems ludicrous in a house with central heating.

    Clearly this year will be different.

    I suppose I'm lucky that I only really need to keep my chest warm and everything else is fine. Never bothered with long johns even when -30 though I did wear ski trousers on top which are far more comfortable.
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,588
    pangolin said:

    Pross said:

    I see pubs are now pushing for support towards energy costs in order to keep open having been heavily supported during the Covid lockdowns. Maybe it is just time to accept that the pub business model isn’t able to support the amount of pubs out there rather than expect the Government to bail them out all the time.

    People got a lot of support during covid and are getting lots (so far, more to come probably) towards energy costs. Maybe it is just time to accept that it is too expensive to live if we expect the Government to bail us out all the time.
    I think there’s a difference between supporting individuals in genuine need and propping up a non-essential business sector. FWIW I would try to target support to individuals so that more of it goes to those who need it but unfortunately the country seems to rely on various outdated computer systems that prevent that being viable / efficient.

    Besides, I keep seeing the usual low grade street interviews on news items with people seemingly genuinely proposing spending more time in pubs as a way to reduce their energy costs so the sector should be on a boom.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,799
    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    Good point, some of the enthusiasm for working at home may reduce when people see their energy bills this winter.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,799
    blazing_saddles said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    15C?
    Are you in training for an assault on the South Pole?
    That’s 59F in old money.
    Not sure how you get your house that cold in the Summer.
    He lives in Scotand.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,379
    Stevo_666 said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    Good point, some of the enthusiasm for working at home may reduce when people see their energy bills this winter.
    Depends on mode of travel, but I still thinknit will be cheaper for many people to stay at home.

    Still getting my head around how both a warm summer day and a freezing cold office can both be 18 degrees.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,799
    edited August 2022
    First.Aspect said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    Good point, some of the enthusiasm for working at home may reduce when people see their energy bills this winter.
    Depends on mode of travel, but I still thinknit will be cheaper for many people to stay at home.

    Still getting my head around how both a warm summer day and a freezing cold office can both be 18 degrees.
    Also depends on home arrangements and how much it costs, but if you have a household where everyone is normally out on weekdays vs home all the time it could be a big difference. I got a shocker of an electric bill for mid Dec to mid Jan period - twice what it is now and that was before any of the big hikes this year. We were at home for most of that and it didn't help that I was working from a converted garage which is separate from the house.

    I think you're right, it would probably be cheaper for mosy to stay home that go in on any given winter day, though in my case maybe not by that much.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 22,730
    Stevo_666 said:

    blazing_saddles said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    15C?
    Are you in training for an assault on the South Pole?
    That’s 59F in old money.
    Not sure how you get your house that cold in the Summer.
    He lives in Scotand.
    I live up a mountain in Wales. It’s been an exceptionally warm Summer so I have rarely had to use the heating.
    During a standard Summer I usually have to put the heating on for an hour or two most days.
    Without it I reckon I would probably get down to about 17-18C.
    15C is impressive in an unpleasant way.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    Nursing one pint as they cost £7 and they spent the rest on heating
    _
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    edited August 2022
    First.Aspect said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    Good point, some of the enthusiasm for working at home may reduce when people see their energy bills this winter.
    Depends on mode of travel, but I still thinknit will be cheaper for many people to stay at home.

    Still getting my head around how both a warm summer day and a freezing cold office can both be 18 degrees.
    Warm summer’s day at 18? Come off it. I wear arm warmers on the bike for anything under 20.

    What are you doing when it gets over 30?!
    _
  • morstar
    morstar Posts: 6,190
    Having lived in houses with no central heating on two occasions, I am maybe more aware of what it is like than many.
    But we always had a gas fire. Living without at least the gas fire (or alternative) seems unimaginable.
    If it’s a really cold winter like a couple of years back, you simply can’t live through winter without some form of heat.
  • webboo
    webboo Posts: 6,087
    rick_chasey said:

    Nursing one pint as they cost £7 and they spent the rest on heating

    Where do pints cost £7. Even in our village pub with its airs and graces to be something other than a pub for locals, you can a pint for a fiver.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,482
    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Sure. I have no clue what I'm using other than the snapshot metre readings which I then have to convert and it's a faff.

    Curious. What do you have to convert?
    well the reading into what I've used in kilowatts and then the price per kilowatt.

    I run the house pretty hot so I have quite a bit of savings to be made this winter, but it'd be nice to know how much ahead of time.
    I can see the point in that but a smart meter won't do that for you either.
    (Mine didn't anyway and as smart meters don't know future costs...)
    Sure but it does tell you real time what you've spent that day
    Is it really going to be that bad for you? I guess I'm already used to keeping the house at 15-18C, and my cut backs will be less use of the electric oil heaters. This might even force me into the office.
    Good point, some of the enthusiasm for working at home may reduce when people see their energy bills this winter.
    Depends on mode of travel, but I still thinknit will be cheaper for many people to stay at home.

    Still getting my head around how both a warm summer day and a freezing cold office can both be 18 degrees.
    Warm summer’s day at 18? Come off it. I wear arm warmers on the bike for anything under 20.

    What are you doing when it gets over 30?!
    What did I tell you about allowing for others to have different subjective opinions?
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.

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