The big Coronavirus thread
Comments
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Sure, I really don't understand the logic in the decision. I was just intrigued why Chester were saying it was a complex situation, it really isn't as their ground is in Wales so it should have been obvious the Welsh restrictions applied to them. They should find a ground the other side of the border that meets league rules and play there for a few weeks like a mini version of the WRUs plans.mully79 said:
Who really gives a hoot ?Surely no one in Wales actually cares if an English football team has a crowd. If they do its only because that pillock banned Welsh crowds in Welsh stadiums.Pross said:Whilst I think the Welsh rules are ridiculous for outdoor events I'm not sure why Chester FC are saying it's a complex situation that they are being told they're breaching Covid restrictions by not playing behind closed doors. Their pitch and stands are entirely within Wales, they're arguing that as most of their supporters live in England the English rules should apply.
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briantrumpet said:
France have now officially added the <24h transit-through-France to their exemptions.
Now just that other little matter... fingers crossed that that happens next week.</p>
A good step in the right direction. He’s got 4 weeks to make the next step so my trip can happen.....1 -
It will be complexed (expensive) when the lawyers get involved.Pross said:
Sure, I really don't understand the logic in the decision. I was just intrigued why Chester were saying it was a complex situation, it really isn't as their ground is in Wales so it should have been obvious the Welsh restrictions applied to them. They should find a ground the other side of the border that meets league rules and play there for a few weeks like a mini version of the WRUs plans.mully79 said:
Who really gives a hoot ?Surely no one in Wales actually cares if an English football team has a crowd. If they do its only because that pillock banned Welsh crowds in Welsh stadiums.Pross said:Whilst I think the Welsh rules are ridiculous for outdoor events I'm not sure why Chester FC are saying it's a complex situation that they are being told they're breaching Covid restrictions by not playing behind closed doors. Their pitch and stands are entirely within Wales, they're arguing that as most of their supporters live in England the English rules should apply.
Has anyone actually been punished and paid the penalty so far for Covid rule breaking ?0 -
Yup. Cinema closed and £15k fine.mully79 said:
It will be complexed (expensive) when the lawyers get involved.Pross said:
Sure, I really don't understand the logic in the decision. I was just intrigued why Chester were saying it was a complex situation, it really isn't as their ground is in Wales so it should have been obvious the Welsh restrictions applied to them. They should find a ground the other side of the border that meets league rules and play there for a few weeks like a mini version of the WRUs plans.mully79 said:
Who really gives a hoot ?Surely no one in Wales actually cares if an English football team has a crowd. If they do its only because that pillock banned Welsh crowds in Welsh stadiums.Pross said:Whilst I think the Welsh rules are ridiculous for outdoor events I'm not sure why Chester FC are saying it's a complex situation that they are being told they're breaching Covid restrictions by not playing behind closed doors. Their pitch and stands are entirely within Wales, they're arguing that as most of their supporters live in England the English rules should apply.
Has anyone actually been punished and paid the penalty so far for Covid rule breaking ?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-59853848The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Technically they were fined for breaking the court order they ignored after being ordered to close due to breaking the covid laws.pblakeney said:
Yup. Cinema closed and £15k fine.mully79 said:
It will be complexed (expensive) when the lawyers get involved.Pross said:
Sure, I really don't understand the logic in the decision. I was just intrigued why Chester were saying it was a complex situation, it really isn't as their ground is in Wales so it should have been obvious the Welsh restrictions applied to them. They should find a ground the other side of the border that meets league rules and play there for a few weeks like a mini version of the WRUs plans.mully79 said:
Who really gives a hoot ?Surely no one in Wales actually cares if an English football team has a crowd. If they do its only because that pillock banned Welsh crowds in Welsh stadiums.Pross said:Whilst I think the Welsh rules are ridiculous for outdoor events I'm not sure why Chester FC are saying it's a complex situation that they are being told they're breaching Covid restrictions by not playing behind closed doors. Their pitch and stands are entirely within Wales, they're arguing that as most of their supporters live in England the English rules should apply.
Has anyone actually been punished and paid the penalty so far for Covid rule breaking ?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-59853848
Taking into account Chester FC aren't really trying to be antagonistic im sure they'll just get a telling off.
Maybe the Welsh government will tell the Welsh FA to ask the English FA to punish them.0 -
Technically she was fined for being a dick.mully79 said:
Technically they were fined for breaking the court order they ignored after being ordered to close due to breaking the covid laws.pblakeney said:
Yup. Cinema closed and £15k fine.mully79 said:
It will be complexed (expensive) when the lawyers get involved.Pross said:
Sure, I really don't understand the logic in the decision. I was just intrigued why Chester were saying it was a complex situation, it really isn't as their ground is in Wales so it should have been obvious the Welsh restrictions applied to them. They should find a ground the other side of the border that meets league rules and play there for a few weeks like a mini version of the WRUs plans.mully79 said:
Who really gives a hoot ?Surely no one in Wales actually cares if an English football team has a crowd. If they do its only because that pillock banned Welsh crowds in Welsh stadiums.Pross said:Whilst I think the Welsh rules are ridiculous for outdoor events I'm not sure why Chester FC are saying it's a complex situation that they are being told they're breaching Covid restrictions by not playing behind closed doors. Their pitch and stands are entirely within Wales, they're arguing that as most of their supporters live in England the English rules should apply.
Has anyone actually been punished and paid the penalty so far for Covid rule breaking ?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-59853848
The issue was still covid.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
It does seem like an open and shut case that Chester are in the wrong.
I wonder which police force usually provides support to games though, given the gate and address of the stadium is in England.
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Lovely graphic illustrating vax power
Data are replotted from here https://www.icnarc.org/DataServices/Attachments/Download/5d46be46-e36f-ec11-913a-00505601089b
I might quibble with the populations being compared (essentially 2020 unvaxxed, prob including more vulnerable oldies, with 2021 14+ day vaxxed). Almost all the vaxxed will be within 6 months of a jab, diff variants around.
But still...0 -
I also liked this illustration of infection and immunity time-course:
Ig is antibody, IgG being the major persisting antibody type, with a half life of around 3 months0 -
Actually, I'm now using KF94s. I think they are probably better for me because they create a really tight seal on my face despite being 1% less effective.kingstongraham said:
I've read a couple of articles that say it's fine to reuse then as long as you aren't in a medical setting.TheBigBean said:
I've only ever used those, but I do reuse them, so that probably isn't the best.kingstongraham said:Something that might have helped would have been this: https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021/12/why-you-should-upgrade-your-face-mask-to-an-n95.html
I've been using an FFP2 mask - more than anything, if I get a decent fit across the nose, it actually doesn't steam up my glasses.
That link says it's fine, but not for how long because nobody has researched it.
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Soft play feels like an omicron party.0
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It's always felt like a virus and germ breeding ground.TheBigBean said:Soft play feels like an omicron party.
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Pross said:
It's always felt like a virus and germ breeding ground.TheBigBean said:Soft play feels like an omicron party.
Yeah, I remember when my kids used to go to them and you just knew they’d catch something.0 -
Case numbers appear to be declining - 146K announced today. That’s the lowest since 28th Dec.0
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kingstonian said:
Case numbers appear to be declining - 146K announced today. That’s the lowest since 28th Dec.
Although it's rising elsewhere, the decline in numbers in London and that the NHS has (just about) managed to cope there is real cause for hope. There's still little movement in numbers of patients in ICUs, on ventilation, or deaths, despite the enormous rate of infection. These are quite the graphs. If they talk about percentage increases in deaths, it needs to be put in this context.
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UK has today become the 7th country to record 150,000 deaths with covid.
The UK was the 5th country to pass 100,000 deaths in January 2021.0 -
I saw that Peru is one of the other countries. Covid must have hit them really hard as their population is less than half of the UKs.0
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Case numbers are pretty irrelevant now - test shortages, reporting, second infection....kingstonian said:Case numbers appear to be declining - 146K announced today. That’s the lowest since 28th Dec.
But the graphics BrianT shows are indeed encouraging. Mostly due to vax, but also the 'let it rip in the summer' strategy, looks to be paying off. I was very sceptical at the time because the govt's motive was all about popularity rather than health, but they may have done the right thing here, for the wrong reasons.
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Mad_Malx said:
Case numbers are pretty irrelevant now - test shortages, reporting, second infection....kingstonian said:Case numbers appear to be declining - 146K announced today. That’s the lowest since 28th Dec.
But the graphics BrianT shows are indeed encouraging. Mostly due to vax, but also the 'let it rip in the summer' strategy, looks to be paying off. I was very sceptical at the time because the govt's motive was all about popularity rather than health, but they may have done the right thing here, for the wrong reasons.
Well, though the large numbers in themselves might not be as crucial as they were, their trajectory, I'd argue, is important & relevant, as if they do turn a sharp corner, it's really good news indeed, and suggests that there's quite a high degree of resultant hybrid immunity, at least for now.0 -
The health motive was clearly stated in July by the expert advisors to the government (e.g. Whitty). I found it quite persuasive at the time. Due to omicron, there has still ended up being a winter peak, so it is harder to assess whether it was the right move with hindsight.Mad_Malx said:
Case numbers are pretty irrelevant now - test shortages, reporting, second infection....kingstonian said:Case numbers appear to be declining - 146K announced today. That’s the lowest since 28th Dec.
But the graphics BrianT shows are indeed encouraging. Mostly due to vax, but also the 'let it rip in the summer' strategy, looks to be paying off. I was very sceptical at the time because the govt's motive was all about popularity rather than health, but they may have done the right thing here, for the wrong reasons.0 -
Australia managed 115k cases yesterday. They seem to be getting omicroned.0
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Blame tennis. 😉TheBigBean said:Australia managed 115k cases yesterday. They seem to be getting omicroned.
The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Sure Whitty said it, but the govt was looking at “freedom”/popularity rather than health. Economic risk/benefit might have gone either way depending on whether non-leisure businesses could continue while lots of people sick. Agree regarding omicron.TheBigBean said:
The health motive was clearly stated in July by the expert advisors to the government (e.g. Whitty). I found it quite persuasive at the time. Due to omicron, there has still ended up being a winter peak, so it is harder to assess whether it was the right move with hindsight.Mad_Malx said:
Case numbers are pretty irrelevant now - test shortages, reporting, second infection....kingstonian said:Case numbers appear to be declining - 146K announced today. That’s the lowest since 28th Dec.
But the graphics BrianT shows are indeed encouraging. Mostly due to vax, but also the 'let it rip in the summer' strategy, looks to be paying off. I was very sceptical at the time because the govt's motive was all about popularity rather than health, but they may have done the right thing here, for the wrong reasons.
The problem with having a lying, corrupt, populist govt is that it becomes difficult to believe any of their recommendations might actually turn out to be for the greater good.
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Remember when excess deaths were a political excuse to lock us down. These are the graphs now. Quite interesting to go through the various options and show numbers with perspective.
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/excess-mortality-in-england-weekly-reports
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No. I remember when lockdowns were a pre- emptive measure (as they still are in some countries) to reduce deaths.mully79 said:Remember when excess deaths were a political excuse to lock us down.
What is the political benefit to ‘locking down’ a population?0 -
What is the benefit of locking down an entire population ?pinkbikini said:
No. I remember when lockdowns were a pre- emptive measure (as they still are in some countries) to reduce deaths.mully79 said:Remember when excess deaths were a political excuse to lock us down.
What is the political benefit to ‘locking down’ a population?
We still have pretty much the worst numbers across Europe despite lockdowns.0 -
To reduce excess deaths - I’ve already said that. What’s your solution?mully79 said:
What is the benefit of locking down an entire population ?.pinkbikini said:
No. I remember when lockdowns were a pre- emptive measure (as they still are in some countries) to reduce deaths.mully79 said:Remember when excess deaths were a political excuse to lock us down.
What is the political benefit to ‘locking down’ a population?0 -
Theres not any data to prove the actions taken reduced excess deaths.pinkbikini said:
To reduce excess deaths - I’ve already said that. What’s your solution?mully79 said:
What is the benefit of locking down an entire population ?.pinkbikini said:
No. I remember when lockdowns were a pre- emptive measure (as they still are in some countries) to reduce deaths.mully79 said:Remember when excess deaths were a political excuse to lock us down.
What is the political benefit to ‘locking down’ a population?
The government would just say that they took the best decision that they could with the information available at the time.0 -
Maybe yes, maybe no. What's your solution?mully79 said:
Theres not any data to prove the actions taken reduced excess deaths.pinkbikini said:
To reduce excess deaths - I’ve already said that. What’s your solution?mully79 said:
What is the benefit of locking down an entire population ?.pinkbikini said:
No. I remember when lockdowns were a pre- emptive measure (as they still are in some countries) to reduce deaths.mully79 said:Remember when excess deaths were a political excuse to lock us down.
What is the political benefit to ‘locking down’ a population?
The government would just say that they took the best decision that they could with the information available at the time.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
I dont need a solution. Pinkbikini took exception that I said there is a political benefit in locking down.
Politicians dont make decisions without there being a benefit even if that benefit is playing it safe so they cant be blamed later.0
