The big Coronavirus thread
Comments
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I have. Should keep me busy and in demand for the foreseeable futurepblakeney said:Great news!
On the other hand, anyone considered the tax hikes at the end of this?
Probably best to stick your head in the sand.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHbriantrumpet said:I thought that this would cheer Rick up.
Gotta be fake, surely?!?0 -
Grim milestone. Over 5,000 uk deaths from corona; more than U.K. military deaths in combat since ‘45.0
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I'm expecting the UK will have reported 20k deaths by 25th April.0
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I noticed again today on the BBC news that they mentioned the "1 hour" limit on exercise, it was the chap from Cornwall talking about locals being able to go to the beach for a walk.
I know it's been mentioned before on here, but this 1 hour thing seems to be made up. The only reference to it I can find is an interview between Andrew Marr and Michael Gove.......(taken from The Sun, as it was the one 'sure hit' my brief search found)
Andrew Marr : "We know you’re only allowed to go out once to take a piece of daily exercise, is there any suggestion about how long you should be out for?"
Gove "Well, obviously it depends on each individual’s fitness, but I would have thought that for most people a walk of up to an hour
or a run of 30 minutes or a cycle ride, depending on their level of fitness is appropriate."
It's sad because I heard some people can't get anywhere decent with their kids in an hours walk when using this limit.
The older I get, the better I was.0 -
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0
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Can confirm it's actually real.rick_chasey said:
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHbriantrumpet said:I thought that this would cheer Rick up.
Gotta be fake, surely?!?
Not exactly a shame that it's behind a pay wall.
My assumption would be that it's more bog standard right wing contrarian musings presented as an honest cost benefit analysis.
Articles such as this and the various stories of 5g Towers being set alight do show humanity was probably ready for a reality check.
I wonder if gove regrets what he said about experts.0 -
I don’t think you can do the job of cabinet minister if you spend much time regretting stuff.
Your day-to-day decisions affect people constantly so if you spend time regretting stuff you’d never get out of bed.0 -
I think there's a problem here that people haven't got their heads in the right place.capt_slog said:It's sad because I heard some people can't get anywhere decent with their kids in an hours walk when using this limit.
The time for exercise is just to get out of the house for a bit and keep a basic level of activity both mentally and physically.
It's not a question of going somewhere nice, it's being out for a period of time in the day.
It's our half hour in the prison yard.
Not a dig at you btw.
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
I agree from the headline that it is most likely a pretty contentious article and at least badly titled.Jeremy.89 said:
Can confirm it's actually real.rick_chasey said:
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHbriantrumpet said:I thought that this would cheer Rick up.
Gotta be fake, surely?!?
Not exactly a shame that it's behind a pay wall.
My assumption would be that it's more bog standard right wing contrarian musings presented as an honest cost benefit analysis.
Articles such as this and the various stories of 5g Towers being set alight do show humanity was probably ready for a reality check.
I wonder if gove regrets what he said about experts.
However, for balance, I think it is important to distinguish between receiving expert advice and letting experts make decisions.
Experts should be used to facilitate informed decision making. But ultimately from a purist perspective, a health expert could suggest an absolutist path of the way to minimise the death toll is simply to lock down completely until a cure / vaccine is found.
This is not practical. Therefore the decision needs to be made by somebody who takes all the conflicting opinions and devises a ‘best’ course of action. Those are our politicians.
The real problem with this type of headline is that there is the continued idea of undermining experts.
It’s the populist bollocks continued about everything being somebody else fault and stopping us being successful.0 -
morstar said:
I agree from the headline that it is most likely a pretty contentious article and at least badly titled.Jeremy.89 said:
Can confirm it's actually real.rick_chasey said:
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHbriantrumpet said:I thought that this would cheer Rick up.
Gotta be fake, surely?!?
Not exactly a shame that it's behind a pay wall.
My assumption would be that it's more bog standard right wing contrarian musings presented as an honest cost benefit analysis.
Articles such as this and the various stories of 5g Towers being set alight do show humanity was probably ready for a reality check.
I wonder if gove regrets what he said about experts.
However, for balance, I think it is important to distinguish between receiving expert advice and letting experts make decisions.
Experts should be used to facilitate informed decision making. But ultimately from a purist perspective, a health expert could suggest an absolutist path of the way to minimise the death toll is simply to lock down completely until a cure / vaccine is found.
This is not practical. Therefore the decision needs to be made by somebody who takes all the conflicting opinions and devises a ‘best’ course of action. Those are our politicians.
The real problem with this type of headline is that there is the continued idea of undermining experts.
It’s the populist bollocks continued about everything being somebody else fault and stopping us being successful.
To be fair, the article isn't as stupid as the headline, and there is some pushback in the comments (which is unusual, since much of the readership makes Lilico look like a moderate), but the fact that the Telegraph doesn't even put "expert" in inverted commas does suggest a drive to undermine that value of expertise, so that politicians can make decisions unshackled from advice based on trustworthy data and analysis.0 -
Says who? We aren't being punished - if we can go somewhere nice while socially isolating why not?tailwindhome said:
I think there's a problem here that people haven't got their heads in the right place.capt_slog said:It's sad because I heard some people can't get anywhere decent with their kids in an hours walk when using this limit.
The time for exercise is just to get out of the house for a bit and keep a basic level of activity both mentally and physically.
It's not a question of going somewhere nice, it's being out for a period of time in the day.
It's our half hour in the prison yard.
Not a dig at you btw.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]1 -
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Agreed. Pretty much in line with Italy plus 15 days still.coopster_the_1st said:I'm expecting the UK will have reported 20k deaths by 25th April.
Unfortunately the reported number is certainly an understatement.0 -
Says who, what?DeVlaeminck said:
Says who? We aren't being punished - if we can go somewhere nice while socially isolating why not?tailwindhome said:
I think there's a problem here that people haven't got their heads in the right place.capt_slog said:It's sad because I heard some people can't get anywhere decent with their kids in an hours walk when using this limit.
The time for exercise is just to get out of the house for a bit and keep a basic level of activity both mentally and physically.
It's not a question of going somewhere nice, it's being out for a period of time in the day.
It's our half hour in the prison yard.
Not a dig at you btw.
I think your statement 'we aren't being punished' illustrates what I mean about peoples heads not being in the right place.
If 1000 deaths a day doesn't override the desire to 'go somewhere nice' you have to ask, what would?“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
The ONS stats will correct that but also give some indication of the actual C19 deaths compared to the average mortality rate.kingstongraham said:
Agreed. Pretty much in line with Italy plus 15 days still.coopster_the_1st said:I'm expecting the UK will have reported 20k deaths by 25th April.
Unfortunately the reported number is certainly an understatement.
I still think the long term mortality data (over the year) will be less than a 10% increase over the average0 -
IMO the article isn't particularly contentious, but the title was badly thought out and bound to get a reaction.briantrumpet said:morstar said:
I agree from the headline that it is most likely a pretty contentious article and at least badly titled.Jeremy.89 said:
Can confirm it's actually real.rick_chasey said:
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHbriantrumpet said:I thought that this would cheer Rick up.
Gotta be fake, surely?!?
Not exactly a shame that it's behind a pay wall.
My assumption would be that it's more bog standard right wing contrarian musings presented as an honest cost benefit analysis.
Articles such as this and the various stories of 5g Towers being set alight do show humanity was probably ready for a reality check.
I wonder if gove regrets what he said about experts.
However, for balance, I think it is important to distinguish between receiving expert advice and letting experts make decisions.
Experts should be used to facilitate informed decision making. But ultimately from a purist perspective, a health expert could suggest an absolutist path of the way to minimise the death toll is simply to lock down completely until a cure / vaccine is found.
This is not practical. Therefore the decision needs to be made by somebody who takes all the conflicting opinions and devises a ‘best’ course of action. Those are our politicians.
The real problem with this type of headline is that there is the continued idea of undermining experts.
It’s the populist bollocks continued about everything being somebody else fault and stopping us being successful.
To be fair, the article isn't as stupid as the headline, and there is some pushback in the comments (which is unusual, since much of the readership makes Lilico look like a moderate), but the fact that the Telegraph doesn't even put "expert" in inverted commas does suggest a drive to undermine that value of expertise, so that politicians can make decisions unshackled from advice based on trustworthy data and analysis."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Driving somewhere nice to exercise is the new driving to the gym.“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0
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An increase of up to 10% would imply additional deaths of up approx 60,000 based on last years UK death stats of around 600,000.coopster_the_1st said:
The ONS stats will correct that but also give some indication of the actual C19 deaths compared to the average mortality rate.kingstongraham said:
Agreed. Pretty much in line with Italy plus 15 days still.coopster_the_1st said:I'm expecting the UK will have reported 20k deaths by 25th April.
Unfortunately the reported number is certainly an understatement.
I still think the long term mortality data (over the year) will be less than a 10% increase over the average
Here are the ONS stats YTD:
https://ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending20march2020"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]1 -
Relieved to say Mrs TWH has made a full recovery.
If it was C19 then her main and longest lasting symptom was fatigue.
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
Yes. A number of them will be where the virus kills a fit, healthy person however a number will be deaths brought forward a year or two.Stevo_666 said:
An increase of up to 10% would imply additional deaths of up approx 60,000 based on last years UK death stats of around 600,000.coopster_the_1st said:
The ONS stats will correct that but also give some indication of the actual C19 deaths compared to the average mortality rate.kingstongraham said:
Agreed. Pretty much in line with Italy plus 15 days still.coopster_the_1st said:I'm expecting the UK will have reported 20k deaths by 25th April.
Unfortunately the reported number is certainly an understatement.
I still think the long term mortality data (over the year) will be less than a 10% increase over the average
Here are the ONS stats YTD:
https://ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending20march2020
It's not nice to think or accept but this happens. There are many illnesses that will take young, fit and healthy people way before their time. This is another one to add to that list.0 -
Surely the key point was "whilst socially isolating"tailwindhome said:
Says who, what?DeVlaeminck said:
Says who? We aren't being punished - if we can go somewhere nice while socially isolating why not?tailwindhome said:
I think there's a problem here that people haven't got their heads in the right place.capt_slog said:It's sad because I heard some people can't get anywhere decent with their kids in an hours walk when using this limit.
The time for exercise is just to get out of the house for a bit and keep a basic level of activity both mentally and physically.
It's not a question of going somewhere nice, it's being out for a period of time in the day.
It's our half hour in the prison yard.
Not a dig at you btw.
I think your statement 'we aren't being punished' illustrates what I mean about peoples heads not being in the right place.
If 1000 deaths a day doesn't override the desire to 'go somewhere nice' you have to ask, what would?
Ultimately the goal needs to be to make this process as bearable as possible. Rigorously enforcing measures that have very little practical effect on the risk of spreading the virus is a waste of police resource and will rapidly use up goodwill.
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If driving somewhere nice contributed to the death toll - otherwise at best it's just an empty gesture.tailwindhome said:
Says who, what?DeVlaeminck said:
Says who? We aren't being punished - if we can go somewhere nice while socially isolating why not?tailwindhome said:
I think there's a problem here that people haven't got their heads in the right place.capt_slog said:It's sad because I heard some people can't get anywhere decent with their kids in an hours walk when using this limit.
The time for exercise is just to get out of the house for a bit and keep a basic level of activity both mentally and physically.
It's not a question of going somewhere nice, it's being out for a period of time in the day.
It's our half hour in the prison yard.
Not a dig at you btw.
I think your statement 'we aren't being punished' illustrates what I mean about peoples heads not being in the right place.
If 1000 deaths a day doesn't override the desire to 'go somewhere nice' you have to ask, what would?
Say my chosen exercise was to kick a ball about with my daughter for an hour - the park next to me isn't suitable (the only flat bit is too busy) - so I might drive 1-2 miles to somewhere that is. Zero increased risk to anyone in terms of spreading the virus - in fact as the park next to me is very busy probably less risk.
[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
I agree on the enforcement.Jeremy.89 said:
Surely the key point was "whilst socially isolating"tailwindhome said:
Says who, what?DeVlaeminck said:
Says who? We aren't being punished - if we can go somewhere nice while socially isolating why not?tailwindhome said:
I think there's a problem here that people haven't got their heads in the right place.capt_slog said:It's sad because I heard some people can't get anywhere decent with their kids in an hours walk when using this limit.
The time for exercise is just to get out of the house for a bit and keep a basic level of activity both mentally and physically.
It's not a question of going somewhere nice, it's being out for a period of time in the day.
It's our half hour in the prison yard.
Not a dig at you btw.
I think your statement 'we aren't being punished' illustrates what I mean about peoples heads not being in the right place.
If 1000 deaths a day doesn't override the desire to 'go somewhere nice' you have to ask, what would?
Ultimately the goal needs to be to make this process as bearable as possible. Rigorously enforcing measures that have very little practical effect on the risk of spreading the virus is a waste of police resource and will rapidly use up goodwill.
This can only be done with the buy in of the population, which is why everyone needs to get their head on straight as quickly as possible.
The 'while socially isolating' is a bit of self justification in my view.
Police in Ireland and NI currently setting up checkpoints to turn back the people who *all* decided to self isolate in their holiday homes in Donegal and on the North Coast.
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
Nice one. That is good news.tailwindhome said:Relieved to say Mrs TWH has made a full recovery.
If it was C19 then her main and longest lasting symptom was fatigue.
Re my comment about "somewhere nice". Yes I understand your point, just getting out for a walk is all that's really needed.
However, It's easier if you live somewhere that's okay to start with.
I've mentioned before about perceptions colouring the advice and how it's received. A lady on the TV was saying that she really wanted to take her kids out to a green space, but the nearest was 30 mins walk away, and so she felt she couldn't do that because of the 'hour rule'. She said she had to settle for 'a walk around the block'.
Mrs Slog on hearing that, said "Whats wrong with a walk around the block?" which just happens to be our term for walking out of the avenue and doing a circuit across the fields.
The older I get, the better I was.0 -
https://metro.co.uk/2020/04/10/police-officer-tells-man-cannot-sit-front-garden-12537093/
More covid nazis. This won't help with "buy in" of the population.0 -
DeVlaeminck said:
If driving somewhere nice contributed to the death toll - otherwise at best it's just an empty gesture.tailwindhome said:
Says who, what?DeVlaeminck said:
Says who? We aren't being punished - if we can go somewhere nice while socially isolating why not?tailwindhome said:
I think there's a problem here that people haven't got their heads in the right place.capt_slog said:It's sad because I heard some people can't get anywhere decent with their kids in an hours walk when using this limit.
The time for exercise is just to get out of the house for a bit and keep a basic level of activity both mentally and physically.
It's not a question of going somewhere nice, it's being out for a period of time in the day.
It's our half hour in the prison yard.
Not a dig at you btw.
I think your statement 'we aren't being punished' illustrates what I mean about peoples heads not being in the right place.
If 1000 deaths a day doesn't override the desire to 'go somewhere nice' you have to ask, what would?
Say my chosen exercise was to kick a ball about with my daughter for an hour - the park next to me isn't suitable (the only flat bit is too busy) - so I might drive 1-2 miles to somewhere that is. Zero increased risk to anyone in terms of spreading the virus - in fact as the park next to me is very busy probably less risk.
The park is now a risk because everyone else has decided to 'socially distance' there.
Each one justifying to themselves their reason for doing it
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
Article on the news now about postal workers not having enough PPE and being 'terrified' for their health due to crowded conditions in the sorting office. Fair enough, they can't keep the recommended distance whilst working so they have a point.
They then showed the canteen with 'not much social distancing taking place here in the staff canteen either' and images of staff crowded around the same tables. However, the camera then panned out slightly and you could see a lot of the canteen was half empty and the staff were choosing to sit together for a chat. So much for being terrified.
No doubt the postal Union at some point will suggest a pay rise to compensate their staff for working in such dangerous conditions.0 -
"The park is now a risk because everyone else has decided to 'socially distance' there.
Each one justifying to themselves their reason for doing it"
Clearly if you want to kick a ball about you need a bit of space - if a park is busy with people walking and running it's not somewhere you get a football out so you drive to the closest place that is. If you can explain to me why I shouldn't I'd appreciate it - it's both within the laws as they stand and not contributing to spreading the virus.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0
