Lizzie

carbonclem

Slowbike wrote:

Re family emergency - sorry - but if I get a call to say that a member of my immeadiate family has been in a serious crash and taken into hospital or has had a heart attack or whatever it happened to be of similar seriousness then the last thing I'm going to be doing - whislt trying to drive wherever - is text or phone the UKAD squad. Mind you, if it was my family then I'd be asking my wife to drive - if it was hers then I'd drive - I doubt she'd do the texting though.

I see your point, but, as an example. If I got a call to say my wife was involved in something bad, then I'd get to her asap obviously, but I would also immediately consider other immediate things ... my daughters care in such an instance would immediately have to be taken care of. I'd say if I were a world champion in an Olympic year, on a couple of strikes, then my ADAMS whereabouts would be of similar importance, if not, then it flipping well should be.

Funny to hear the Cycling Podcast today, first half was praising Lizzie for not riding La Course as she was so focussed on Rio and bigging her up for such dedication and planning. The latter part was recorded yesterday and reflected how they had been sold a bit of a pup!

I'm still inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt. I'm not sure how I'll feel if she scores Gold on Sunday though. Maybe a bit like I will if Mo wins again? Not quite so happy as 2012 ....

Richmond Racer 2

I will be sardonically amused if she wins and smashes Ferrand-Prevot in the process

markwb79

gsk82 wrote:

If you can update the info three months in advance why are people assuming that it's part of a daily routine?

Because as I understand it, you have access to a App that you update.

A friend missed a test and his reasoning was that he was locked out of the app and could change his plans to say he was on a training camp in Spain instead of at home where he originally said he would be.

wallace_and_gromit

Slowbike wrote:

Re family emergency - sorry - but if I get a call to say that a member of my immeadiate family has been in a serious crash and taken into hospital or has had a heart attack or whatever it happened to be of similar seriousness then the last thing I'm going to be doing - whislt trying to drive wherever - is text or phone the UKAD squad. Mind you, if it was my family then I'd be asking my wife to drive - if it was hers then I'd drive - I doubt she'd do the texting though.
Depends on the exact circumstances that we don't really need to know - other than there's a disagreement over it.

Oh - and perhaps she didn't have a signal at the time of the emergency - our mobile network at the office has gone out today - I couldn't make a call or text - but I wouldn't know that a text wasn't sent unless I waited around to see it go ...

Perhaps it's not an excuse - but it is a reason.

I guess I'm coming at it from the viewpoint of "My reputation / career is at stake here so can I find 60 seconds some time soon to send an update text?" not "Can I find a reasonable excuse not to do the update?"

If you're downing tools to deal with a family emergency at the very least you've got to locate purse/wallet, keys, shoes etc. Maybe even a phone! So to even make it to where you want to be you've got to have your wits about you. If you're travelling by train you'd need to buy a ticket and if you're driving you'd need to be prepared to fill up with petrol. None of these issues appeared to derail Lizzie, so sending a career-saving text doesn't seem an insurmountable task!

Maybe I expect too much of athletes these days.

TheBigBean

RichN95 wrote:

I forget to put the bins out at least three times a year.

Are you competing in the bin putting out competition at the Olympics? If so, I would suggest that the UK sends a professional with a better track record.

slowbike

Markwb79 wrote:

DeVlaeminck wrote:

Markwb79 wrote:

lastly...the long story about the third test. All about the family member, the emergency. She makes it sound like it was very very bad. Then she went and won a race 6 days later?

Well about 7 years ago I was rushed to hospital and told by a doctor I had probably had a heart attack - the next day I was sent home having been told I hadn't had a heart attack. Emergencies aren't always long lasting.

100% agree. But I would think that the days of stress and extra travel days would throw the prep for a race winning performance out of the window. Thats more what I was thinking.

I am sure the stress of all this could be cited as a reason for not winning in the Olympics RR.

Or it might provide the motivation required to get out there and just smash it ... works both ways

Vino'sGhost

Lizzie seems to be tested quite a lot. The statement from UKAD about "intelligence based testing" makes me wonder about her three strikes.

Im sure its simple to screw up.

kingstongraham

Vino'sGhost wrote:

Lizzie seems to be tested quite a lot. The statement from UKAD about "intelligence based testing" makes me wonder about her three strikes.

Im sure its simple to screw up.

She wins quite a lot. I haven't seen how many of the tests are out of competition.

fat daddy

Wallace and Gromit wrote:

Maybe I expect too much of athletes these days.

without meaning to be disrespectful to atheletes ... but then no more disrespectful then they would be to me if they compared my sporting ability to theirs, they are not exactly renown for there intellectual prowess .... most of them seemed to have taken up sport to get out of going to school

slowbike

CarbonClem wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

Re family emergency - sorry - but if I get a call to say that a member of my immeadiate family has been in a serious crash and taken into hospital or has had a heart attack or whatever it happened to be of similar seriousness then the last thing I'm going to be doing - whislt trying to drive wherever - is text or phone the UKAD squad. Mind you, if it was my family then I'd be asking my wife to drive - if it was hers then I'd drive - I doubt she'd do the texting though.

I see your point, but, as an example. If I got a call to say my wife was involved in something bad, then I'd get to her asap obviously, but I would also immediately consider other immediate things ... my daughters care in such an instance would immediately have to be taken care of. I'd say if I were a world champion in an Olympic year, on a couple of strikes, then my ADAMS whereabouts would be of similar importance, if not, then it flipping well should be.

yup - I don't disagree - ensuring my son (13 months old) is taken care of would still be of higher priority to me than my wife - although if he was at his Grandparents or even nursery and I didn't call them they would still look after him until he was picked up - I'd just get an earful for not calling ...

But it's not quite that is it ... it's more like having an estranged wife with child who may or may not call on you at the time & place you've previously specified - but you've buggered off because your mother has been taken seriously ill in hospital ... updating her on where you'll be for that potential hour slot has moved down your priority list .. perhaps it shouldn't ..

CarbonClem wrote:

I'm still inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt. I'm not sure how I'll feel if she scores Gold on Sunday though

I'd give her the benefit of the doubt too - hopefully she'll sort herself out and ensure the Whereabouts system gets higher priority now and perhaps BC should look at it and see if there is room for improvement to reduce the administrative burden on the athlete.

dish_dash

She says 16 tests in 2016

22 race days
6 podiums

So if you assume she got tested for every podium (plus another for winning the ToB) then that's potentially up to 9 tests OOC.

And FWIW she top 10-ed 9 times...

wallace_and_gromit

Slowbike wrote:

But it's not quite that is it ... it's more like having an estranged wife with child who may or may not call on you at the time & place you've previously specified - but you've buggered off because your mother has been taken seriously ill in hospital ... updating her on where you'll be for that potential hour slot has moved down your priority list .. perhaps it shouldn't ...

If estranged wife was likely to use such non-notification as a means to get sole custody then how high up your list of priorities would updating her be? Losing access to your kids must rank alongside losing your reputation/career as a sportsman I'd have thought.

If the worst you'll get is a b*llocking then I could see that wouldn't be a top priority. For doping matters, the minimum penalty is way higher than a b*llocking.

fenix

fat daddy wrote:

Wallace and Gromit wrote:

Maybe I expect too much of athletes these days.

without meaning to be disrespectful to atheletes ... but then no more disrespectful then they would be to me if they compared my sporting ability to theirs, they are not exactly renown for there intellectual prowess .... most of them seemed to have taken up sport to get out of going to school

Huge amount of spelling mistakes there for someone saying that athletes are dumb....

I don't think they are likely to be any less intelligent than the average person ?

slowbike

Wallace and Gromit wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

But it's not quite that is it ... it's more like having an estranged wife with child who may or may not call on you at the time & place you've previously specified - but you've buggered off because your mother has been taken seriously ill in hospital ... updating her on where you'll be for that potential hour slot has moved down your priority list .. perhaps it shouldn't ...

If estranged wife was likely to use such non-notification as a means to get sole custody then how high up your list of priorities would updating her be? Losing access to your kids must rank alongside losing your reputation/career as a sportsman I'd have thought.

If the worst you'll get is a b*llocking then I could see that wouldn't be a top priority. For doping matters, the minimum penalty is way higher than a b*llocking.

yup - fair point

[edit] although if you thought the judge would not take it as a point against you then perhaps you wouldn't[/edit]

yorkshireraw

Richmond Racer 2 wrote:

I will be sardonically amused if she wins and smashes Ferrand-Prevot in the process

Getting into Richard Keys territory here....

"Did you smash her Lizzie, eh, did you?.... course she did, could watch them race any day of the week and see Armitstead coming off her back wheel"

tailwindhome

TailWindHome's Law.

All threads on controversial topics should autolock on page 13

Richmond Racer 2

YorkshireRaw wrote:

Richmond Racer 2 wrote:

I will be sardonically amused if she wins and smashes Ferrand-Prevot in the process

Getting into Richard Keys territory here....

"Did you smash her Lizzie, eh, did you?.... course she did, could watch them race any day of the week and see Armitstead coming off her back wheel"

How very dare, Rawman!!

iainf72

Fenix wrote:

Exactly. And she's only on two.

The first strike was not her fault as they ruled.

Im sure there are a lot of athletes on two strikes but we don't hear about them until a third happens in the year.

Someone posted the numbers on twitter yesterday for athletes under UKAD. Not sure how true it was but very small number on 2. Low single digits if I remember correctly.

RichN95.

iainf72 wrote:

Fenix wrote:

Exactly. And she's only on two.

The first strike was not her fault as they ruled.

Im sure there are a lot of athletes on two strikes but we don't hear about them until a third happens in the year.

Someone posted the numbers on twitter yesterday for athletes under UKAD. Not sure how true it was but very small number on 2. Low single digits if I remember correctly.

It was 6 out of about 350. But as I pondered up thread, what is the typical number of times they are tested. Missing two of twenty visits is easier than missing two of three.

pinno

The sceptics are perfectly organised and never miss a pill, appointment, bus or putting the bin out. Sanctimonious.
'She misses a test and then goes and wins her next race'! So she should have deliberately thrown it so as not to appear suspicious?

Lizzie has never tested positive. Will it take another 40+ victories and 75 blood tests before she has a clean reputation?
I'm sure from this point forward, she will be more diligent but for now, she remains human.

joe2008

Pinno wrote:

The sceptics are perfectly organised and never miss a pill, appointment, bus or putting the bin out. Sanctimonious.
'She misses a test and then goes and wins her next race'! So she should have deliberately thrown it so as not to appear suspicious?

Lizzie has never tested positive. Will it take another 40+ victories and 75 blood tests before she has a clean reputation?
I'm sure from this point forward, she will be more diligent but for now, she remains human.

But, the point is it's not a pill, appointment, bus or bin, it's something that her whole career depends on, I reckon you'd be pretty diligent about that.

Like Mo now, forever tainted.

Richmond Racer 2

joe2008 wrote:

Pinno wrote:

The sceptics are perfectly organised and never miss a pill, appointment, bus or putting the bin out. Sanctimonious.
'She misses a test and then goes and wins her next race'! So she should have deliberately thrown it so as not to appear suspicious?

Lizzie has never tested positive. Will it take another 40+ victories and 75 blood tests before she has a clean reputation?
I'm sure from this point forward, she will be more diligent but for now, she remains human.

But, the point is it's not a pill, appointment, bus or bin, it's something that her whole career depends on, I reckon you'd be pretty diligent about that.

Like Mo now, forever tainted.

Hang on a Mo. Tell me more about 'Tainted Mo'

joe2008

Richmond Racer 2 wrote:

joe2008 wrote:

Pinno wrote:

The sceptics are perfectly organised and never miss a pill, appointment, bus or putting the bin out. Sanctimonious.
'She misses a test and then goes and wins her next race'! So she should have deliberately thrown it so as not to appear suspicious?

Lizzie has never tested positive. Will it take another 40+ victories and 75 blood tests before she has a clean reputation?
I'm sure from this point forward, she will be more diligent but for now, she remains human.

But, the point is it's not a pill, appointment, bus or bin, it's something that her whole career depends on, I reckon you'd be pretty diligent about that.

Like Mo now, forever tainted.

Hang on a Mo. Tell me more about 'Tainted Mo'

Seriously, you believe he's clean; his association with Alberto Salazar and Galen Rupp, plus training camps in Kenya... really.

No_Ta_Doctor

Last time I had a family emergency (of an extremely mild nature) I didn't just get a message about it and then have to go somewhere. I had to ring and text round a load of people, getting and passing on new information, acting as middleman, trying to contact those that nobody could get hold of - all while the situation changed the whole time. It's not "something bad has happened, can you come over" "yes, be right there". It's "have you told John?" "Where's Sally" "Who's ringing the doctor?" " what did the doctor say" etc. etc. etc..

If I were a professional athlete I'd be perma-banned. But then I can't get it together to book a holiday until a week before I'm off work. I forget to check my oystercard out, even though I make the same journey to work every day. Actually, I don't forget it anymore. Except when a slight change in routine means I'm thinking about something else. And whether I can come out for a beer next Tuesday is just a complete mystery to me, until maybe Tuesday afternoon. I can focus only on one thing at a time (though I do this pretty well) and loads of small details to remember that aren't related completely screws me. Some people are good at this stuff, others less so. Even when it is important.

cougie

Steady on there. Wasn't mo good before he hooked up with Salazar? What's dodgy about Kenya training? Are you saying Radcliffe and Froome are dodgy too?

I think you need a bit more evidence.

pinno

Are the detractors and sceptics expecting sports men and women to be super human and fault free?
Do they want the high achievers to fall foul? Does it make them feel better?

pinno

cougie wrote:

What's dodgy about Kenya training?

The Kenyan athletics federation s about as dodgy as it gets but it doesn't necessarily implicate Mo F.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/athletics/36275649

awavey

Markwb79 wrote:

100% agree. But I would think that the days of stress and extra travel days would throw the prep for a race winning performance out of the window. Thats more what I was thinking.

I am sure the stress of all this could be cited as a reason for not winning in the Olympics RR.

well if that photo Jo Rowsell posted yesterday is an indication of how Lizzie is holding up with all the extra media attention,and that was before a 12 hr flight and 5hr time & climate difference kicked in, frankly Id be amazed if she even completed the course, she looked absolutely drained

joe2008

cougie wrote:

Steady on there. Wasn't mo good before he hooked up with Salazar? What's dodgy about Kenya training? Are you saying Radcliffe and Froome are dodgy too?

I think you need a bit more evidence.

I'm pretty sure he wasn't a dead cert world beater.

I definitely have my doubts on Radcliffe and her 2003 'unbreakable' marathon WR, 3 minutes faster than anyone.

As for training in Kenya: "Kenya has not been able to provide the assurances that the World Anti-Doping Agency (Wada) is seeking and will be placed on a 'watch-list' of nations at risk of breaching the agency's code."

Looks a good place to train to me.

le_patron

Pinno wrote:

Lizzie has never tested positive.

Are people still saying those words in that order ? It's such a loaded sentence you might as well say she is geared up to the eyeballs. Really doesn't help her.