Lizzie

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  • Daz555
    Daz555 Posts: 3,976
    Glad this worked out.
    You only need two tools: WD40 and Duck Tape.
    If it doesn't move and should, use the WD40.
    If it shouldn't move and does, use the tape.
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    Dinyull wrote:
    Correct, was just pointing out that it's easy for the pro's to do this themselves if they feel the need.
    It is easy to overlook a routine task when your routine is changed.
    Dinyull wrote:
    Things are made far too easy for top athlete's, to the point in some sports (see football) they aren't prepared for the real world after they finish their careers. Relying on someone to fill out the whereabouts system for you or relying on someone to say what you can and can't put in your body is just asking for trouble.
    I disagree - I think there's enough for them to be doing in getting themselves ready for whatever they've got coming up to be dogged by daily routine admin - this isn't like your routine at work - 5 days a week between the hours of 9-5 - this is 24/7/365.
    When I go home I can choose if I extend my commute home (on my bike) and not worry about it - when I wake up in the morning I can choose to get straight up and get out to put a few more miles in - all I have to worry about is being at work on time - and 2 days a week I get to not do that too - then I get holiday away from having to commute.

    being available for testing at an alloted time/place 365 days a year is a significant tie - so it's easy to make a mistake. It's also easy to overlook it when other things happen - like emergencies - perhaps it wasn't overlooked so much as didn't have time to update?
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,176
    I wonder how many people on the whereabouts system aren't even tested OOC three times in a year. It's a lot easier not to miss tests if they only visit you four times rather than twenty something.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    Markwb79 wrote:
    All the missed tests were around the time of wins.

    Yep. The 'family emergency' thingy is straight out of the 'missing twin' book for me... but then I'm a cynical old b*gger who's heard a lot of 'it's not my fault' sob stories
  • dinyull
    dinyull Posts: 2,979
    As part of your routine do you manage to go to work most days?

    That routine is equivalent to the whereabouts system for a professional cyclist.
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,176
    Markwb79 wrote:
    All the missed tests were around the time of wins.
    One was a week after the season had finished - why would she have been doping then?
    And for the disputed one she was at a race and present at the hotel.The testers were entitled to wait and test her when she came for breakfast. So she was hardly hiding.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • MikeWW
    MikeWW Posts: 723
    From her facebook page

    Lizzie Armitstead
    2 hrs ·
    I am writing this statement in my own words, something I have wanted to do from the very beginning. Understandably people have questions which I want to answer as openly and honest as I can. I hope people understand that speaking with journalists is a necessary part of my job, speaking directly to the public in a statement like this, which has not been ghost written or moulded by somebody else is un heard of. I want to take responsibility for this message, this is my life and not a game of headlines. I want to state the facts but also try to explain my situation further. I believe I owe this statement to sports fans, people who love sport like I do.

    As an 18 year old school girl I was introduced to the whereabouts system. 9 years ago. Since then the system has evolved and developed, post October 2015 I recognised this and requested further education from UKAD, I will come back to this later.

    By submitting my whereabouts I am consenting to people coming into my house or hotel and taking blood and urine samples. This is a part of my sport that I accept and whole heartedly support.

    To add some background before I explain the specific details of my 3 'strikes'.
    I have been tested 16 times in 2016.
    I have a clear and valid blood passport (a more detailed use of looking for doping violations by looking for trends vs anomalies in my blood values)
    I have been tested after every victory this season.
    I am on the road for around 250 days a year, with around 60 race days.
    I have never tested positive for a banned substance.
    I have never taken a band substance.

    I will present the facts of my 3 'strikes'

    Sweden 20th August 2015

    UKAD are allowed a maximum of 2 weeks to inform you of a 'strike'. When I received the letter from UKAD I immediately contested it with a written explanation, this was not accepted on the eve of me travelling to America for my world championships. I had no legal advise or external support at the time.

    Last week:
    CAS ruled quickly and unanimously in my favour and cleared me of any wrong doing, because:
    I was at the hotel I stated.
    The DCO didn't do what was reasonable or necessary to find me.
    I was tested the next day, this test was negative.
    Calling an athletes mobile phone is not a method approved by UKAD to try and locate an athlete, as such it is not an argument against me that I slept with my phone on silent in order not to disturb a room mate.

    Put simply I was available and willing to provide a sample for UKAD.

    2nd 'strike' October 2015

    Despite being reported as a 'missed test' this was in fact a 'filing failure'
    UKAD did not try to test me, instead this was an administrative spot check. They found an inconsistency between an overnight accommodation and a morning time slot.
    A busy post world championship period meant I had no firm plans and as such was changing address and plans very quickly. I made a mistake. This was an honest mistake rather than trying to deceive anybody. A mistake that many athletes who are honest with themselves will admit to having made themselves. I was Tested by UKAD later that week and produced a negative result.

    In December 2015 I met with UKAD and British cycling to discuss a support plan in order to avoid a 3rd potential 'strike'
    Simon Thornton from British Cycling was put in place to check my whereabouts on a bi weekly basis. We had regular contact and he would help me with any problems, effectively he was a fail safe mechanism. Since meeting with UKAD my whereabouts updates have been as detailed and specific as they can possibly be. Going as far as I can in describing my locations to avoid any further issues.

    Unfortunately this system fell apart on the 9th of June when UKAD tried to test me in my hour slot and I was not where I had stated I would be. Simon Thornton had left BC 3 weeks prior to my strike without anybody informing me. We worked under a policy of 'no news was good news' as outlined in my support plan with UKAD. If Simon was still in place the following oversight could have been prevented. My over night accommodation ( the bed in which I was sleeping the morning of the test) was correct, but I had failed to change the one hour testing slot, it was clearly impossible to be in both locations.
    This is where I believe I have the right to privacy. My personal family circumstances at the time of the test were incredibly difficult, the medical evidence provided in my case was not contested by UKAD, they accepted the circumstances I was in. UKAD did not perceive my situation to be 'extreme' enough to alleviate me of a negligence charge. A physiatrist assessment of my state of mind at the time was contrary. In my defence I was dealing with a traumatic time and i forgot to change a box on a form. I am not a robot, I am a member of a family, my commitment to them comes over and above my commitment to cycling. This will not change and as a result I will not discuss this further, our suffering does not need to be part of a public trial. I hope I have made it clear that family comes before cycling, I am not obsessively driven to success in cycling, I love my sport, but I would never cheat for it.

    To conclude:
    I currently have 1 filing failure and 1 missed test.
    The reason this hasn't been discussed publicly until now is because I had the right to a fair trial at CAS, it is clear sensationalised headlines have a detrimental effect to any legal case.

    In the days following the revelations in the press my family and I have been the victim of some incredibly painful comments. I ask people to take a moment to put themselves in my shoes, I am an athlete trying to do my best, I am a clean athlete. I am the female road race world champion, I operate in a completely different environment to the majority of athletes in the testing pool. I am self coached, I work outside British cycling and its systems, I race for a women's team that doesn't have a budget to match a world tour men's team who have staff specifically in place to supports riders with whereabouts. I don't wish to make excuses, i made one mistake which was noticed in a 'spot check' my second strike came at a time when anybody who lives for and loves their family would understand my oversight. It's as simple as ticking the wrong box on a form.

    I love sport and the values it represents, it hurts me to consider anybody questioning my performances. Integrity is something I strive for in every part of my life. I will hold my head high in Rio and do my best for Great Britain, I am sorry for causing anyone to lose faith in sport, I am an example of what hard work and dedication can achieve. I hate dopers and what they have done to sport.

    To any of the 'Twitter army' reading this, do yourself a favour and go for a bike ride. It's the most beautiful thing you can do to clear your mind.
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    Dinyull wrote:
    As part of your routine do you manage to go to work most days?

    That routine is equivalent to the whereabouts system for a professional cyclist.
    Bolx
    most people's work routines are getting to work in a specific location for 9am and leaving at 5pm, monday to friday - for between 46 and 48 weeks a year - outside that time, they're free - don't need to think about reporting their whereabouts. If you're late for work you can make your excuse and make up time if required - similarly, if you need to rush off because of a family emergency and your boss isn't readily available then you can bugger off and make your excuses later - I know I have done.

    Whilst a pro cyclist may have a routine it's not quite the 9-5/5 day week and in reality Lizzie made a mistake that was picked up on once in 9 years. Once was a testers fault and once was what she considered a family emergency that UKAD disagreed with.

    Perhaps you don't deal with the results of human->computer interfaces - I do, daily - and there are plenty of opportunities for errors - and there are a few errors, despite the apparent attention to detail - nobody is perfect.
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    Slowbike wrote:
    Dinyull wrote:
    As part of your routine do you manage to go to work most days?

    That routine is equivalent to the whereabouts system for a professional cyclist.
    Bolx
    most people's work routines are getting to work in a specific location for 9am and leaving at 5pm, monday to friday - for between 46 and 48 weeks a year - outside that time, they're free - don't need to think about reporting their whereabouts. If you're late for work you can make your excuse and make up time if required - similarly, if you need to rush off because of a family emergency and your boss isn't readily available then you can bugger off and make your excuses later - I know I have done.

    Whilst a pro cyclist may have a routine it's not quite the 9-5/5 day week and in reality Lizzie made a mistake that was picked up on once in 9 years. Once was a testers fault and once was what she considered a family emergency that UKAD disagreed with.

    Perhaps you don't deal with the results of human->computer interfaces - I do, daily - and there are plenty of opportunities for errors - and there are a few errors, despite the apparent attention to detail - nobody is perfect.

    So, no missed tests (or balls ups), in 8 years, then 3 on the trot (whoever's fault) when she is winning just doesn't look right.
  • Slowbike wrote:
    Perhaps you don't deal with the results of human->computer interfaces - I do, daily - and there are plenty of opportunities for errors - and there are a few errors, despite the apparent attention to detail - nobody is perfect.

    Isn't this why the athletes are allowed two missed tests in the last year? Three is just too many when there are some "dog ate homework" stories involved.

    Re the family emergency, I accept that Lizzie would have to down tools, but I don't think this should realistically prevent her from spending less than a minute sending a text message to update her Whereabouts.
  • fenix
    fenix Posts: 5,437
    Exactly. And she's only on two.

    The first strike was not her fault as they ruled.

    Im sure there are a lot of athletes on two strikes but we don't hear about them until a third happens in the year.
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    joe2008 wrote:
    So, no missed tests (or balls ups), in 8 years, then 3 on the trot (whoever's fault) when she is winning just doesn't look right.
    Oh come on - the first wasn't her fault - CAS agreed.
    the second was - she admits that
    the third - I don't think it's been ruled upon by CAS - but UKAD and she disagree as to the validity of the exception.

    If all 3 were because of testers not following procedure would that be all her fault?!
  • gsk82
    gsk82 Posts: 3,475
    If you can update the info three months in advance why are people assuming that it's part of a daily routine?
    "Unfortunately these days a lot of people don’t understand the real quality of a bike" Ernesto Colnago
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    gsk82 wrote:
    If you can update the info three months in advance why are people assuming that it's part of a daily routine?
    Me? - only because plans change - I can tell you where I'll be in 3 months time between the hours of 9-5 and I can have a pretty good stab at where I'll be outside those times - but it might change.
  • fenix
    fenix Posts: 5,437
    Doesnt it say to fill in the details of room numbers etc...

    Kudos to you if you know what number hotel room you're gonna be in in 90 days time... I doubt she'd even know the hotel that far out - and probably not even know which country she's going to be in with 100% certainty,
  • dinyull
    dinyull Posts: 2,979
    Being someone at a set time each and every day is part of a routine, no matter if the form was filled out 3 months prior or not.
  • dinyull
    dinyull Posts: 2,979
    Fenix wrote:
    Doesnt it say to fill in the details of room numbers etc...

    Kudos to you if you know what number hotel room you're gonna be in in 90 days time... I doubt she'd even know the hotel that far out - and probably not even know which country she's going to be in with 100% certainty,

    You can of course update the system within that 3 months though. And ring or txt up to 1 minute before the 1 hour window opens to change it.
  • smithy21
    smithy21 Posts: 2,204
    gsk82 wrote:
    If you can update the info three months in advance why are people assuming that it's part of a daily routine?

    Because you constantly need to check what you said 3 months ago is correct.

    Other athletes generally manage it.
  • fenix
    fenix Posts: 5,437
    You can do that - but if it were me - i'd find 90 days ahead too much - you'd put the stuff in and then have to redo it.

    I don't know how clumsy the system is to use or how time consuming.

    I'm sure we are all familiar with work systems that should be easy but it takes you 5 minutes just to book a bloody conference room.....
  • smithy21
    smithy21 Posts: 2,204
    Fenix wrote:
    Exactly. And she's only on two.

    The first strike was not her fault as they ruled.

    Im sure there are a lot of athletes on two strikes but we don't hear about them until a third happens in the year.

    She is now but she was, in her mind, already on two and still managed to pick up a third.

    I assume the family emergency excuse is not going to fly or she would have challenged that instead of strike one?

    It's all a bit odd.
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    Fenix wrote:
    You can do that - but if it were me - i'd find 90 days ahead too much - you'd put the stuff in and then have to redo it.

    I don't know how clumsy the system is to use or how time consuming.

    I'm sure we are all familiar with work systems that should be easy but it takes you 5 minutes just to book a bloody conference room.....

    Looks like she gets tested at least once a month. I'd be pretty certain that each day one of my priorities would be to make sure that the info of where I was going to be between 6am and 7am the next day was correct... that's not really much of a ball ache is it?
  • bflk
    bflk Posts: 240
    Fenix wrote:
    Doesnt it say to fill in the details of room numbers etc...

    Kudos to you if you know what number hotel room you're gonna be in in 90 days time... I doubt she'd even know the hotel that far out - and probably not even know which country she's going to be in with 100% certainty,

    You update ADAMS with the room number when you arrive and get the room keys. By text or email.

    The only issue I can see is if the tester can't get access to the room corridors as that might need a room key/swipe card. If you forgot to update the system with the room number than tough luck.
  • bobmcstuff
    bobmcstuff Posts: 11,196
    https://rouleur.cc/journal/racing/chris ... ctor-calls

    Quite interesting article about ADAMS and testing.
    Fenix wrote:
    You can do that - but if it were me - i'd find 90 days ahead too much - you'd put the stuff in and then have to redo it.

    I don't know how clumsy the system is to use or how time consuming.

    I'm sure we are all familiar with work systems that should be easy but it takes you 5 minutes just to book a bloody conference room.....

    Yeah I am supposed to keep my Outlook calendar up to date and I travel a fair bit for work, but nowhere near as much as a pro cyclist, and I still end up double booked quite frequently. Admittedly I don't get the sack and a 2 year ban from working when that happens, however, so my incentives aren't quite the same as hers.

    It's more serious when I double book social engagements, I've had to start putting those into my Outlook as well now because I'm definitely down to my last strike now...
  • She said she wasn't in the 'bed' she expected to sleep in that night and ended up sleeping somewhere else...that right?

    Who's bed was it then? ;-) aye aye!!
  • The_Boy
    The_Boy Posts: 3,099
    She said she wasn't in the 'bed' she expected to sleep in that night and ended up sleeping somewhere else...that right?

    Who's bed was it then? ;-) aye aye!!

    And there was me thinking deignan's tweet was aimed at PFP...
    Team My Man 2018: David gaudu, Pierre Latour, Romain Bardet, Thibaut pinot, Alexandre Geniez, Florian Senechal, Warren Barguil, Benoit Cosnefroy
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    Slowbike wrote:
    Perhaps you don't deal with the results of human->computer interfaces - I do, daily - and there are plenty of opportunities for errors - and there are a few errors, despite the apparent attention to detail - nobody is perfect.

    Isn't this why the athletes are allowed two missed tests in the last year? Three is just too many when there are some "dog ate homework" stories involved.

    Re the family emergency, I accept that Lizzie would have to down tools, but I don't think this should realistically prevent her from spending less than a minute sending a text message to update her Whereabouts.

    is 3 too many? or is 2 too many? Perhaps it should be 4? It's an arbitary number that will catch someone out.

    Re family emergency - sorry - but if I get a call to say that a member of my immeadiate family has been in a serious crash and taken into hospital or has had a heart attack or whatever it happened to be of similar seriousness then the last thing I'm going to be doing - whislt trying to drive wherever - is text or phone the UKAD squad. Mind you, if it was my family then I'd be asking my wife to drive - if it was hers then I'd drive - I doubt she'd do the texting though.
    Depends on the exact circumstances that we don't really need to know - other than there's a disagreement over it.

    Oh - and perhaps she didn't have a signal at the time of the emergency - our mobile network at the office has gone out today - I couldn't make a call or text - but I wouldn't know that a text wasn't sent unless I waited around to see it go ...

    Perhaps it's not an excuse - but it is a reason.

    It would be interesting to get some stats on how many whereabouts errors there are ...
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,176
    I forget to put the bins out at least three times a year.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    RichN95 wrote:
    I forget to put the bins out at least three times a year.

    Did it tarnish you career?
  • markwb79
    markwb79 Posts: 937
    RichN95 wrote:
    Markwb79 wrote:
    All the missed tests were around the time of wins.
    One was a week after the season had finished - why would she have been doping then?
    And for the disputed one she was at a race and present at the hotel.The testers were entitled to wait and test her when she came for breakfast. So she was hardly hiding.


    the cynic in me....

    Because it would have shown an abnormality for the blood passport compared to the test the minute after her win?
    Scott Addict 2011
    Giant TCR 2012
  • markwb79
    markwb79 Posts: 937
    Markwb79 wrote:

    lastly...the long story about the third test. All about the family member, the emergency. She makes it sound like it was very very bad. Then she went and won a race 6 days later?


    Well about 7 years ago I was rushed to hospital and told by a doctor I had probably had a heart attack - the next day I was sent home having been told I hadn't had a heart attack. Emergencies aren't always long lasting.


    100% agree. But I would think that the days of stress and extra travel days would throw the prep for a race winning performance out of the window. Thats more what I was thinking.

    I am sure the stress of all this could be cited as a reason for not winning in the Olympics RR.
    Scott Addict 2011
    Giant TCR 2012