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  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    its an odd dynamic when the same folk who slag the young off for being politically unengaged, yet when they make a political point they don’t like they get all huffy and sneery.

    It just sounds like some of you don’t like young people and some of you don’t think climate change is something worth bothering Parliament about??
    No issues with them protesting but that was not my point. Read my first post on this. It was about when they chose to protest, not whether. Bother parliament by all means, but dont do it on a school day - clear enough for you?

    Sounds like you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder about anyone who isn't young - and of course those nasty Tories.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    Shirley Basso wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Shirley Basso wrote:
    Very many in your mind is the very distinct minority.

    Also you can make a point without considerably.impacting your own future by not attending exams
    Based on what travel stats? Ignoring the point that the majority will need to travel somehow to go on holiday. It all adds up.

    Re: your second point. Same principle with not bunking off school, isn't it. Just a question of degree.

    I'd be surprised if that 'many' flew on holidays. Mostly stay local, staycation or don't go on holiday. Id say it's a minority of children in general who fly on holiday Vs drive to a UK based sport or northern France / europe by car - if you can think outside of your regional 4x4 infested bubble in SE London.

    As for obesity and diet - rarely the child's choice is it? Good parenting includes a rounded diet, some exercise and motivation to take up sport. A fat Macdonald's eating brat hardly came out the womb with the keys to an Audi Q7 and a preference for Macdonald's chicken nuggets over burger king, did it?

    Bunking off a days school has very little impact. Missing an exam does put yourself into a fairy tight corner unless you can do resits which hardly looks great on your record and means you don't have the fallback of a resit if you fail.
    Plenty do fly, here are the stats. Never mind stereotypes of where I live.
    https://www.statista.com/statistics/480184/average-number-of-abroad-holidays-per-person-in-the-uk/

    As mentioned above, it really isn't hard to go protest on a weekend or half term so that's what they should do unless they are bit thick. But if they really want to, fair enough as it might give my kid the edge in exams. She isn't daft enough to go on one of these protests, which was probably organised by virtue signalling parents anyway.

    Not sure why your second para is relevant to me - that was someone else's point.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • tangled_metal
    tangled_metal Posts: 4,021
    Marx's grave has been vandalised again. Architect of hate and other things written in red paint. It's a grade 1 listed monument apparently.
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,551
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    ...which was probably organised by virtue signalling parents anyway.

    If there were virtue-signalling parents involved, we'd have heard about them, no? - otherwise they wouldn't be signalling. The UK marches were coordinated by Anna Taylor, age 17, and 4 other students, who also set up the UK Student Climate Network

    https://ukscn.org/

    Looks like exactly the sort of extra-curricular, self-initiated thing an admissions tutor might be looking for. I'm still not convinced that you really believe one missed school day has any measurable impact, though.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,551
    Tangled Metal wrote:
    Marx's grave has been vandalised again. Architect of hate and other things written in red paint. It's a grade 1 listed monument apparently.

    Bomp had better delete that post a couple of pages back ;)
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    rjsterry wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    ...which was probably organised by virtue signalling parents anyway.

    If there were virtue-signalling parents involved, we'd have heard about them, no? - otherwise they wouldn't be signalling. The UK marches were coordinated by Anna Taylor, age 17, and 4 other students, who also set up the UK Student Climate Network

    https://ukscn.org/

    Looks like exactly the sort of extra-curricular, self-initiated thing an admissions tutor might be looking for. I'm still not convinced that you really believe one missed school day has any measurable impact, though.
    Depends if the day they miss is the day the lesson covers something that comes up in the exam.

    Why not do the protest on a weekend or half term?
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,551
    rjsterry wrote:
    Talk of a breakaway from both Labour and the Conservatives seems to be becoming a bit more than just a rumour.

    Latest Opinion poll shows the two main parties level on 37% but significant dissatisfaction with both.
    Almost half (41%) think that both Labour and the Conservatives have become extreme, with 39% of Tory voters and 37% of Labour voters agreeing with this. A similar number (42%) think neither party stands for anything.

    And this bit will encourage those trying to put something together with disaffected MPs from both parties.
    Two-fifths (40%) think a new political party would be the best way for people like them to be represented, while 59% would consider voting for a new centre-ground party.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... inion-poll
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • Jez mon
    Jez mon Posts: 3,809
    Surrey Commuter wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    its an odd dynamic when the same folk who slag the young off for being politically unengaged, yet when they make a political point they don’t like they get all huffy and sneery.

    It just sounds like some of you don’t like young people and some of you don’t think climate change is something worth bothering Parliament about??

    Nope it just seems very easy and pointless.

    It is like Coopster protesting by spending an extra hour in Wetherspoons

    It has received a fair amount of comment on here though, and considering that (by the sounds of it) the numbers weren't massive, more attention than a weekend or a school holiday would have done.
    You live and learn. At any rate, you live
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    Talk of a breakaway from both Labour and the Conservatives seems to be becoming a bit more than just a rumour.

    Latest Opinion poll shows the two main parties level on 37% but significant dissatisfaction with both.
    Almost half (41%) think that both Labour and the Conservatives have become extreme, with 39% of Tory voters and 37% of Labour voters agreeing with this. A similar number (42%) think neither party stands for anything.

    And this bit will encourage those trying to put something together with disaffected MPs from both parties.
    Two-fifths (40%) think a new political party would be the best way for people like them to be represented, while 59% would consider voting for a new centre-ground party.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... inion-poll
    Well if Labour does split it will be a big vindication of my cunning plan (see thread title) :)

    Message to Labour supporters: your party is standing on the edge of the abyss. Be brave and take that big step forward.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,867
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    Talk of a breakaway from both Labour and the Conservatives seems to be becoming a bit more than just a rumour.

    Latest Opinion poll shows the two main parties level on 37% but significant dissatisfaction with both.
    Almost half (41%) think that both Labour and the Conservatives have become extreme, with 39% of Tory voters and 37% of Labour voters agreeing with this. A similar number (42%) think neither party stands for anything.

    And this bit will encourage those trying to put something together with disaffected MPs from both parties.
    Two-fifths (40%) think a new political party would be the best way for people like them to be represented, while 59% would consider voting for a new centre-ground party.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... inion-poll
    Well if Labour does split it will be a big vindication of my cunning plan (see thread title) :)

    Message to Labour supporters: your party is standing on the edge of the abyss. Be brave and take that big step forward.

    Not great for business is it
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,551
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    Talk of a breakaway from both Labour and the Conservatives seems to be becoming a bit more than just a rumour.

    Latest Opinion poll shows the two main parties level on 37% but significant dissatisfaction with both.
    Almost half (41%) think that both Labour and the Conservatives have become extreme, with 39% of Tory voters and 37% of Labour voters agreeing with this. A similar number (42%) think neither party stands for anything.

    And this bit will encourage those trying to put something together with disaffected MPs from both parties.
    Two-fifths (40%) think a new political party would be the best way for people like them to be represented, while 59% would consider voting for a new centre-ground party.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... inion-poll
    Well if Labour does split it will be a big vindication of my cunning plan (see thread title) :)

    Message to Labour supporters: your party is standing on the edge of the abyss. Be brave and take that big step forward.

    This is a poll of voters, not party members. On those figures the Tories are losing slightly more support than Labour from the divergence. Labour also have a lot more members to lose than the Tories.

    I'm starting to agree with that Soros article you posted a while back - the whole party system is no longer fit for purpose.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    Surrey Commuter wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    Talk of a breakaway from both Labour and the Conservatives seems to be becoming a bit more than just a rumour.

    Latest Opinion poll shows the two main parties level on 37% but significant dissatisfaction with both.
    Almost half (41%) think that both Labour and the Conservatives have become extreme, with 39% of Tory voters and 37% of Labour voters agreeing with this. A similar number (42%) think neither party stands for anything.

    And this bit will encourage those trying to put something together with disaffected MPs from both parties.
    Two-fifths (40%) think a new political party would be the best way for people like them to be represented, while 59% would consider voting for a new centre-ground party.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... inion-poll
    Well if Labour does split it will be a big vindication of my cunning plan (see thread title) :)

    Message to Labour supporters: your party is standing on the edge of the abyss. Be brave and take that big step forward.

    Not great for business is it
    What, Labour splintering? Not sure I follow you.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,551
    Oh, look.
    Jeremy Hosking, the multimillionaire financier who backed a series of pro-Brexit Tory candidates at the last election, said he had submitted the paperwork to form his new party, Brexit Express, which would welcome Tory MPs wanting to protest should the prime minister “botch Brexit”.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -new-party
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    rjsterry wrote:
    Oh, look.
    Jeremy Hosking, the multimillionaire financier who backed a series of pro-Brexit Tory candidates at the last election, said he had submitted the paperwork to form his new party, Brexit Express, which would welcome Tory MPs wanting to protest should the prime minister “botch Brexit”.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -new-party

    Not from me:
    The UK's largest accountancy firm is helping the UK's richest man, who was knighted last year, avoid hundreds of millions, if not billions, of pounds in tax after consulting with the UK's former top civil servant, who is now a Lord

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/sir- ... -35x6jphxn

    Brexiter too, natch.
    _
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    Shock exclusive: very rich person moves abroad to reduce tax bill.

    Although this latest one relates to his personal tax situation, it's not the first time he has done something like this: Tory tax policy persuaded him to relocate the company HQ back to the UK after he had moved it to Switzerland due to Labour tax policy:
    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/aug/09/britains-richest-man-to-leave-uk-for-tax-free-monaco

    "Ratcliffe has quit Britain before. He moved Ineos to Switzerland in 2010 in protest against the then Labour government’s tax regime. The relocation saved an estimated €450m (£405m) in tax. He then moved the company back to the UK in 2016 after the Conservatives returned to power and cut corporation tax from 28% to 20%. At the time of the return, Ratcliffe said: “Our new base in London reflects our British roots. The future for Ineos is very bright and much of this optimism comes from our UK-based operations.”
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    So what in that quote was wrong, and which bit don’t you find problematic?
    _
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    I'm just stating the facts. I believe it's your job to pass moral judgment on it, based on past experience of tax related discussions :)
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Decent thread here:

    https://twitter.com/tfoale/status/10256 ... 26272?s=21
    _
  • bompington
    bompington Posts: 7,674
    Shirley Basso wrote:
    I'd be surprised if that 'many' flew on holidays. Mostly stay local, staycation or don't go on holiday. Id say it's a minority of children in general who fly on holiday Vs drive to a UK based sport or northern France / europe by car - if you can think outside of your regional 4x4 infested bubble in SE London.

    As for obesity and diet - rarely the child's choice is it? Good parenting includes a rounded diet, some exercise and motivation to take up sport. A fat Macdonald's eating brat hardly came out the womb with the keys to an Audi Q7 and a preference for Macdonald's chicken nuggets over burger king, did it?

    Bunking off a days school has very little impact. Missing an exam does put yourself into a fairy tight corner unless you can do resits which hardly looks great on your record and means you don't have the fallback of a resit if you fail.
    I'll tell you what, I'll do a straw poll with my classes today. School with a pretty average demographic for Scotland, so should be pretty representative.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    I'm just stating the facts. I believe it's your job to pass moral judgment on it, based on past experience of tax related discussions :)

    So further to the story, the guy had the chutzpah to advocate Brexit and accept a knighthood, then choose Antwerp over Scotland for a new 3bn euro plant, move to Monaco, and write an open letter to the European Commission complaining about EU green taxes.
    _
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,551
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    I'm just stating the facts. I believe it's your job to pass moral judgment on it, based on past experience of tax related discussions :)

    So further to the story, the guy had the chutzpah to advocate Brexit and accept a knighthood, then choose Antwerp over Scotland for a new 3bn euro plant, move to Monaco, and write an open letter to the European Commission complaining about EU green taxes.

    Given that the lovely Mr Chope has a knighthood, I think that honour has long since lost its shine. More the fool HMG for thinking a gong would make the difference.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,463
    Expectation that several MPs are going to announce they are leaving the party today.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    Pross wrote:
    Expectation that several MPs are going to announce they are leaving the party today.
    I love when a plan comes together :D
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • bianchimoon
    bianchimoon Posts: 3,942
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Expectation that several MPs are going to announce they are leaving the party today.
    I love when a plan comes together :D
    Serious question, why do you think it’s so good to have a one party state?
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • robert88
    robert88 Posts: 2,696
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Expectation that several MPs are going to announce they are leaving the party today.
    I love when a plan comes together :D

    What I don't understand Steve is why you are merely an accountant. Given your talents you'd be a shoe-in as a politician! In today's climate, of course.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Expectation that several MPs are going to announce they are leaving the party today.
    I love when a plan comes together :D
    Serious question, why do you think it’s so good to have a one party state?
    I don't. Labour wont go away. Also there are quite a few other parties, they just aren't very successful.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • tangled_metal
    tangled_metal Posts: 4,021
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Expectation that several MPs are going to announce they are leaving the party today.
    I love when a plan comes together :D
    Serious question, why do you think it’s so good to have a one party state?
    Because he's still doing alright out of it. He's 80s London, sure he's not driving 911s and dropping lots in a boozy lunch but that's only because he's got a family. :wink::D

    Seriously though I am only joking with that stereotype. Plus you're not a trader from the 80s but something more to do with being an employee juggling company's money around to keep it safe from governments as much as possible. You can tell I'm interested can't you?
  • bianchimoon
    bianchimoon Posts: 3,942
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Expectation that several MPs are going to announce they are leaving the party today.
    I love when a plan comes together :D
    Serious question, why do you think it’s so good to have a one party state?
    I don't. Labour wont go away. Also there are quite a few other parties, they just aren't very successful.
    No they won't go away, but Toby Young and his followers have made it difficult for 'bog standard middle of the road voters' to have a choice, the aim to make labour unelectable, a de facto one party state. Just wondered why you wouldn't want people to have a choice.
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,436
    Thing is. The lunatics have taken over both asylums.

    Not good.
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,398
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Expectation that several MPs are going to announce they are leaving the party today.
    I love when a plan comes together :D
    Serious question, why do you think it’s so good to have a one party state?
    I don't. Labour wont go away. Also there are quite a few other parties, they just aren't very successful.
    No they won't go away, but Toby Young and his followers have made it difficult for 'bog standard middle of the road voters' to have a choice, the aim to make labour unelectable, a de facto one party state. Just wondered why you wouldn't want people to have a choice.
    They do have a choice; it's not my problem if not enough people vote for the 'middle of the road' parties.

    All I'm doing is helping tilt the tables away from the most damaging bunch, who are most definitely not middle of any road unless it's the trans Venezuelan highway - hence the thread title.

    Today could be interesting. Go rebels!
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]

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