BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
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We have a milk and more branch fairly locally, but I've heard they are quite unreliable?0
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surely that is down to refrigeration?elbowloh said:
This speaks to the wider point, that we're much more reliant on a smaller number of larger herd dairy farmers rather than lots of small herds across the whole country.surrey_commuter said:
my street was built in the 1930s and there is an old man who moved in 1967 when there were people who bought from new, one of whom told him outside the local shop that she used to buy her milk from the farm opposite. That farm is now a residential area, I wonder how much it would cost to buy the houses, demolish them and clean up the land so they can lease it to a dairy farmer so that I can pop round and buy milk from the farm gate.TheBigBean said:
Aside from the fact that milk is already sold by self service vending machines in villages, what is so comically bad about this? The amount of miles each item of food does isn't currently great for the environment.kingstongraham said:
Chris Loder MP yesterday:pangolin said:
It's the latest in a long line of "this is what you were really voting for when you voted to leave the EU"rjsterry said:
I'm not sure they do want to. They've just managed to kid a lot of people that their prospects haven't looked up for the last 10 years solely because of cheap foreign labour. It's now apparent how much the country relied on that labour (which really wasn't that cheap for the most part) and the only way they can polish this particular censored is to pretend it'll all magically come right in the new year.rick_chasey said:I just don't understand why you want to solve pay and conditions problems without just legislating for pay and conditions, and instead making legislation about foreigners.
Joining such hits as:
Seasonal fruit and veg is better for us anyway
and
We don't want to be in the single market reallyI know it might not feel like it in the immediate term. But it is in our mid and long-term interest that these logistics chains do break.
It will mean that the farmer down the street will be able to sell their milk in the village shop like they did decades ago. It is because these commercial predators – that is the supermarkets – have wiped that out and I’d like to see that come back.0 -
Does it matter what caused it? Are people going to start small dairy herds now?surrey_commuter said:
surely that is down to refrigeration?elbowloh said:
This speaks to the wider point, that we're much more reliant on a smaller number of larger herd dairy farmers rather than lots of small herds across the whole country.surrey_commuter said:
my street was built in the 1930s and there is an old man who moved in 1967 when there were people who bought from new, one of whom told him outside the local shop that she used to buy her milk from the farm opposite. That farm is now a residential area, I wonder how much it would cost to buy the houses, demolish them and clean up the land so they can lease it to a dairy farmer so that I can pop round and buy milk from the farm gate.TheBigBean said:
Aside from the fact that milk is already sold by self service vending machines in villages, what is so comically bad about this? The amount of miles each item of food does isn't currently great for the environment.kingstongraham said:
Chris Loder MP yesterday:pangolin said:
It's the latest in a long line of "this is what you were really voting for when you voted to leave the EU"rjsterry said:
I'm not sure they do want to. They've just managed to kid a lot of people that their prospects haven't looked up for the last 10 years solely because of cheap foreign labour. It's now apparent how much the country relied on that labour (which really wasn't that cheap for the most part) and the only way they can polish this particular censored is to pretend it'll all magically come right in the new year.rick_chasey said:I just don't understand why you want to solve pay and conditions problems without just legislating for pay and conditions, and instead making legislation about foreigners.
Joining such hits as:
Seasonal fruit and veg is better for us anyway
and
We don't want to be in the single market reallyI know it might not feel like it in the immediate term. But it is in our mid and long-term interest that these logistics chains do break.
It will mean that the farmer down the street will be able to sell their milk in the village shop like they did decades ago. It is because these commercial predators – that is the supermarkets – have wiped that out and I’d like to see that come back.0 -
I had pretty much that exact thought earlier, his words just sounded like the crazy ramblings of someone who personally knows someone else who has been butthurt in dealings with supermarkets. What a surprise it is true. No-one is changing the way they buy milk anytime soon because of this clown.pblakeney said:
Chris Loder MP - "He grew up near Folke in Dorset on his parents' family farm, ..."kingstongraham said:
Chris Loder MP yesterday:pangolin said:
It's the latest in a long line of "this is what you were really voting for when you voted to leave the EU"rjsterry said:
I'm not sure they do want to. They've just managed to kid a lot of people that their prospects haven't looked up for the last 10 years solely because of cheap foreign labour. It's now apparent how much the country relied on that labour (which really wasn't that cheap for the most part) and the only way they can polish this particular censored is to pretend it'll all magically come right in the new year.rick_chasey said:I just don't understand why you want to solve pay and conditions problems without just legislating for pay and conditions, and instead making legislation about foreigners.
Joining such hits as:
Seasonal fruit and veg is better for us anyway
and
We don't want to be in the single market reallyI know it might not feel like it in the immediate term. But it is in our mid and long-term interest that these logistics chains do break.
It will mean that the farmer down the street will be able to sell their milk in the village shop like they did decades ago. It is because these commercial predators – that is the supermarkets – have wiped that out and I’d like to see that come back.
Easy to see his thinking.0 -
elbowloh said:
Does it matter what caused it? Are people going to start small dairy herds now?surrey_commuter said:
surely that is down to refrigeration?elbowloh said:
This speaks to the wider point, that we're much more reliant on a smaller number of larger herd dairy farmers rather than lots of small herds across the whole country.surrey_commuter said:
my street was built in the 1930s and there is an old man who moved in 1967 when there were people who bought from new, one of whom told him outside the local shop that she used to buy her milk from the farm opposite. That farm is now a residential area, I wonder how much it would cost to buy the houses, demolish them and clean up the land so they can lease it to a dairy farmer so that I can pop round and buy milk from the farm gate.TheBigBean said:
Aside from the fact that milk is already sold by self service vending machines in villages, what is so comically bad about this? The amount of miles each item of food does isn't currently great for the environment.kingstongraham said:
Chris Loder MP yesterday:pangolin said:
It's the latest in a long line of "this is what you were really voting for when you voted to leave the EU"rjsterry said:
I'm not sure they do want to. They've just managed to kid a lot of people that their prospects haven't looked up for the last 10 years solely because of cheap foreign labour. It's now apparent how much the country relied on that labour (which really wasn't that cheap for the most part) and the only way they can polish this particular censored is to pretend it'll all magically come right in the new year.rick_chasey said:I just don't understand why you want to solve pay and conditions problems without just legislating for pay and conditions, and instead making legislation about foreigners.
Joining such hits as:
Seasonal fruit and veg is better for us anyway
and
We don't want to be in the single market reallyI know it might not feel like it in the immediate term. But it is in our mid and long-term interest that these logistics chains do break.
It will mean that the farmer down the street will be able to sell their milk in the village shop like they did decades ago. It is because these commercial predators – that is the supermarkets – have wiped that out and I’d like to see that come back.
Large herds are pretty much a direct result of the supermarkets' drive for cheaper milk (it's not an unreasonable aim, but it has an effect: to drive out pretty much all smaller producers). There are some extraordinary figures in this publication:
https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN02721/SN02721.pdf
Since 1995, the number of dairy holdings has reduced by about two thirds, the number of cows has reduced by a quarter, but the amount of milk produced has gone up slightly, with the average cow producing *twice* as much milk as in 1975.
That's the effect of an efficiency drive.
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And, if you are interested in why American diary farms are, on average, more 'efficient':The average herd size in the U.S. is about one hundred cows per farm but the median size is 900 cows with 49% of all cows residing on farms of 1000 or more cows
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dairy_industry_in_the_United_States
Pretty much all the labour is cheap immigrant labour on the big farms. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jul/25/its-five-years-since-a-white-worker-applied-the-immigrants-milking-americas-cows
As I mentioned elsewhere, it would ironic if by doing a trade deal with the US we undermined the UK dairy industry by importing dairy products kept cheap by immigrant labour.0 -
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I'm struggling with the maths there.briantrumpet said:And, if you are interested in why American diary farms are, on average, more 'efficient':
The average herd size in the U.S. is about one hundred cows per farm but the median size is 900 cows with 49% of all cows residing on farms of 1000 or more cows
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dairy_industry_in_the_United_States
Pretty much all the labour is cheap immigrant labour on the big farms. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jul/25/its-five-years-since-a-white-worker-applied-the-immigrants-milking-americas-cows
As I mentioned elsewhere, it would ironic if by doing a trade deal with the US we undermined the UK dairy industry by importing dairy products kept cheap by immigrant labour.0 -
rick_chasey said:
That sounds like a good emissions outcome
Nah, they'll just fart twice as much.0 -
Milk production has required a lot of food miles for years. My dad worked for Craven diaries which became Associated diaries(ASDA) in the 1960’s. He used to set off from Leeds pick up milk churns from various Dales farms and back to Leeds for it to be processed.0
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webboo said:
Milk production has required a lot of food miles for years. My dad worked for Craven diaries which became Associated diaries(ASDA) in the 1960’s. He used to set off from Leeds pick up milk churns from various Dales farms and back to Leeds for it to be processed.
It didn't help when the MMB was abolished: once upon a time, all milk collection was centrally organised by a unified fleet of tankers; afterwards, you had a myriad of tankers from the different dairies all whizzing along the lanes to collect from farms spread all over the place, the tankers crisscrossing each other.
One development in efficiency terms was that farms had to double their storage capacity for every-other-day collection. Obviously that was at the farmers' expense. But it did, in theory, halve the amount that tankers had to travel.0 -
Assume the cows are corn fed too? Think that makes them even fartier.briantrumpet said:And, if you are interested in why American diary farms are, on average, more 'efficient':
The average herd size in the U.S. is about one hundred cows per farm but the median size is 900 cows with 49% of all cows residing on farms of 1000 or more cows
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dairy_industry_in_the_United_States
Pretty much all the labour is cheap immigrant labour on the big farms. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jul/25/its-five-years-since-a-white-worker-applied-the-immigrants-milking-americas-cows
As I mentioned elsewhere, it would ironic if by doing a trade deal with the US we undermined the UK dairy industry by importing dairy products kept cheap by immigrant labour.0 -
Jezyboy said:
Assume the cows are corn fed too? Think that makes them even fartier.briantrumpet said:And, if you are interested in why American diary farms are, on average, more 'efficient':
The average herd size in the U.S. is about one hundred cows per farm but the median size is 900 cows with 49% of all cows residing on farms of 1000 or more cows
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dairy_industry_in_the_United_States
Pretty much all the labour is cheap immigrant labour on the big farms. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jul/25/its-five-years-since-a-white-worker-applied-the-immigrants-milking-americas-cows
As I mentioned elsewhere, it would ironic if by doing a trade deal with the US we undermined the UK dairy industry by importing dairy products kept cheap by immigrant labour.
That, and alfalfa, I think.0 -
TBB was suggesting taking raw milk straight to vending machine. Obviously that's different from filling the machine up with pasteurised milk.briantrumpet said:rjsterry said:
Because it would be a matter of time before there'd be a major Campylobacter poisoning incident.TheBigBean said:
Why doesn't a milk tanker pick up the milk from the farm and then drive 50 miles filling up 10 village milk vending machines along the way? You walk to the vending machine.Jezyboy said:If I drive 10 miles to the farm to get my milk, maybe that's a food miles saving of 90 miles over buying some after walking to a supermarket.
But if 15 people all stop walking to the supermarket and drive individually to the farm?
If I'm worried about the greenhouse gas emissions of milk, I'm likely not drinking cows milk anyway.
Modern farming and food distribution is quite a marvel, yes supermarkets have got very rich and probably have too much influence over the market. It doesn't seem that clear to me what the vision is for the replacement of the current logistics chain is, unless the plan is we all live in villages.
In contrast, the same milk tanker could drive 200 miles to the milk processing centre where the milk would be processed. Then another truck could drive the bottled milk another 200 miles to the supermarket distribution centre. Then, it can be moved onto another truck and driven 200 miles to your nearest supermarket. You can then drive to the supermarket.
Distances obviously made up.
I'm not sure exactly how vending machines are currently filled, but I am sure that it involves stringent protocols to avoid any contamination. I can't see any reason (at least, in theory) why those protocols couldn't be extended to filling multiple vending machines.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
rjsterry said:
TBB was suggesting taking raw milk straight to vending machine. Obviously that's different from filling the machine up with pasteurised milk.briantrumpet said:rjsterry said:
Because it would be a matter of time before there'd be a major Campylobacter poisoning incident.TheBigBean said:
Why doesn't a milk tanker pick up the milk from the farm and then drive 50 miles filling up 10 village milk vending machines along the way? You walk to the vending machine.Jezyboy said:If I drive 10 miles to the farm to get my milk, maybe that's a food miles saving of 90 miles over buying some after walking to a supermarket.
But if 15 people all stop walking to the supermarket and drive individually to the farm?
If I'm worried about the greenhouse gas emissions of milk, I'm likely not drinking cows milk anyway.
Modern farming and food distribution is quite a marvel, yes supermarkets have got very rich and probably have too much influence over the market. It doesn't seem that clear to me what the vision is for the replacement of the current logistics chain is, unless the plan is we all live in villages.
In contrast, the same milk tanker could drive 200 miles to the milk processing centre where the milk would be processed. Then another truck could drive the bottled milk another 200 miles to the supermarket distribution centre. Then, it can be moved onto another truck and driven 200 miles to your nearest supermarket. You can then drive to the supermarket.
Distances obviously made up.
I'm not sure exactly how vending machines are currently filled, but I am sure that it involves stringent protocols to avoid any contamination. I can't see any reason (at least, in theory) why those protocols couldn't be extended to filling multiple vending machines.
I didn't think he was - most of the farms selling direct to the public via vending machines or farm shops pasteurise their milk on-farm. There is just one I know of near Exeter who sells raw milk, but they can't sell via a shop.
From the Government website:The sale of raw drinking milk is legal in England, Wales and Northern Ireland. It can only be sold directly to the consumer by:
registered milk production farms at the farm gate or farmhouse catering operation
farmers at registered farmers’ markets
distributors using a vehicle as a shop such as a milk round
direct online sales
vending machines at the farm
It’s illegal to sell raw milk in any other setting.
Sales of raw milk and cream are completely banned in Scotland.
https://www.food.gov.uk/safety-hygiene/raw-drinking-milk
FWIW, if you've never tasted it, you don't know what milk is. And these days you've be really unlucky to catch anything from it, given all the testing going on. I drank it for 15 years, while I had access to it.0 -
Ah, that makes more sense.briantrumpet said:rjsterry said:
TBB was suggesting taking raw milk straight to vending machine. Obviously that's different from filling the machine up with pasteurised milk.briantrumpet said:rjsterry said:
Because it would be a matter of time before there'd be a major Campylobacter poisoning incident.TheBigBean said:
Why doesn't a milk tanker pick up the milk from the farm and then drive 50 miles filling up 10 village milk vending machines along the way? You walk to the vending machine.Jezyboy said:If I drive 10 miles to the farm to get my milk, maybe that's a food miles saving of 90 miles over buying some after walking to a supermarket.
But if 15 people all stop walking to the supermarket and drive individually to the farm?
If I'm worried about the greenhouse gas emissions of milk, I'm likely not drinking cows milk anyway.
Modern farming and food distribution is quite a marvel, yes supermarkets have got very rich and probably have too much influence over the market. It doesn't seem that clear to me what the vision is for the replacement of the current logistics chain is, unless the plan is we all live in villages.
In contrast, the same milk tanker could drive 200 miles to the milk processing centre where the milk would be processed. Then another truck could drive the bottled milk another 200 miles to the supermarket distribution centre. Then, it can be moved onto another truck and driven 200 miles to your nearest supermarket. You can then drive to the supermarket.
Distances obviously made up.
I'm not sure exactly how vending machines are currently filled, but I am sure that it involves stringent protocols to avoid any contamination. I can't see any reason (at least, in theory) why those protocols couldn't be extended to filling multiple vending machines.
I didn't think he was - most of the farms selling direct to the public via vending machines or farm shops pasteurise their milk on-farm. There is just one I know of near Exeter who sells raw milk, but they can't sell via a shop.
From the Government website:The sale of raw drinking milk is legal in England, Wales and Northern Ireland. It can only be sold directly to the consumer by:
registered milk production farms at the farm gate or farmhouse catering operation
farmers at registered farmers’ markets
distributors using a vehicle as a shop such as a milk round
direct online sales
vending machines at the farm
It’s illegal to sell raw milk in any other setting.
Sales of raw milk and cream are completely banned in Scotland.
https://www.food.gov.uk/safety-hygiene/raw-drinking-milk
FWIW, if you've never tasted it, you don't know what milk is. And these days you've be really unlucky to catch anything from it, given all the testing going on. I drank it for 15 years, while I had access to it.
Surely your immune to most bovine pathogens anyway from your previous career?
One of the downsides of veterinary parents with a second career in meat hygiene is you end up knowing too much about all the things that can live in raw meat and dairy.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
The reason the MP's suggestion was ridiculed by some is that it already happens. I believe, it either gets pasteurised at source or it is sold raw under licence. I'm really not the right person to be providing this information though.rjsterry said:
TBB was suggesting taking raw milk straight to vending machine. Obviously that's different from filling the machine up with pasteurised milk.briantrumpet said:rjsterry said:
Because it would be a matter of time before there'd be a major Campylobacter poisoning incident.TheBigBean said:
Why doesn't a milk tanker pick up the milk from the farm and then drive 50 miles filling up 10 village milk vending machines along the way? You walk to the vending machine.Jezyboy said:If I drive 10 miles to the farm to get my milk, maybe that's a food miles saving of 90 miles over buying some after walking to a supermarket.
But if 15 people all stop walking to the supermarket and drive individually to the farm?
If I'm worried about the greenhouse gas emissions of milk, I'm likely not drinking cows milk anyway.
Modern farming and food distribution is quite a marvel, yes supermarkets have got very rich and probably have too much influence over the market. It doesn't seem that clear to me what the vision is for the replacement of the current logistics chain is, unless the plan is we all live in villages.
In contrast, the same milk tanker could drive 200 miles to the milk processing centre where the milk would be processed. Then another truck could drive the bottled milk another 200 miles to the supermarket distribution centre. Then, it can be moved onto another truck and driven 200 miles to your nearest supermarket. You can then drive to the supermarket.
Distances obviously made up.
I'm not sure exactly how vending machines are currently filled, but I am sure that it involves stringent protocols to avoid any contamination. I can't see any reason (at least, in theory) why those protocols couldn't be extended to filling multiple vending machines.
Edit - Brian has provided some direct evidence from the countryside.0 -
Why did you need to bring bread into it?pangolin said:
That's less than 20 miles from where the West Dorset MP's parents farm is btw.0 -
Don't they use growth hormone for cows too or is that just beef cattle?briantrumpet said:Jezyboy said:
Assume the cows are corn fed too? Think that makes them even fartier.briantrumpet said:And, if you are interested in why American diary farms are, on average, more 'efficient':
The average herd size in the U.S. is about one hundred cows per farm but the median size is 900 cows with 49% of all cows residing on farms of 1000 or more cows
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dairy_industry_in_the_United_States
Pretty much all the labour is cheap immigrant labour on the big farms. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jul/25/its-five-years-since-a-white-worker-applied-the-immigrants-milking-americas-cows
As I mentioned elsewhere, it would ironic if by doing a trade deal with the US we undermined the UK dairy industry by importing dairy products kept cheap by immigrant labour.
That, and alfalfa, I think.0 -
I bet that delivery boy was going for a Strava segment.Dorset_Boy said:
Why did you need to bring bread into it?pangolin said:
That's less than 20 miles from where the West Dorset MP's parents farm is btw.0 -
There will be cleanliness issues with your approach why this is not done.TheBigBean said:
Why doesn't a milk tanker pick up the milk from the farm and then drive 50 miles filling up 10 village milk vending machines along the way? You walk to the vending machine.Jezyboy said:If I drive 10 miles to the farm to get my milk, maybe that's a food miles saving of 90 miles over buying some after walking to a supermarket.
But if 15 people all stop walking to the supermarket and drive individually to the farm?
If I'm worried about the greenhouse gas emissions of milk, I'm likely not drinking cows milk anyway.
Modern farming and food distribution is quite a marvel, yes supermarkets have got very rich and probably have too much influence over the market. It doesn't seem that clear to me what the vision is for the replacement of the current logistics chain is, unless the plan is we all live in villages.
In contrast, the same milk tanker could drive 200 miles to the milk processing centre where the milk would be processed. Then another truck could drive the bottled milk another 200 miles to the supermarket distribution centre. Then, it can be moved onto another truck and driven 200 miles to your nearest supermarket. You can then drive to the supermarket.
Distances obviously made up.0 -
Fair enough, my misunderstanding.TheBigBean said:
The reason the MP's suggestion was ridiculed by some is that it already happens. I believe, it either gets pasteurised at source or it is sold raw under licence. I'm really not the right person to be providing this information though.rjsterry said:
TBB was suggesting taking raw milk straight to vending machine. Obviously that's different from filling the machine up with pasteurised milk.briantrumpet said:rjsterry said:
Because it would be a matter of time before there'd be a major Campylobacter poisoning incident.TheBigBean said:
Why doesn't a milk tanker pick up the milk from the farm and then drive 50 miles filling up 10 village milk vending machines along the way? You walk to the vending machine.Jezyboy said:If I drive 10 miles to the farm to get my milk, maybe that's a food miles saving of 90 miles over buying some after walking to a supermarket.
But if 15 people all stop walking to the supermarket and drive individually to the farm?
If I'm worried about the greenhouse gas emissions of milk, I'm likely not drinking cows milk anyway.
Modern farming and food distribution is quite a marvel, yes supermarkets have got very rich and probably have too much influence over the market. It doesn't seem that clear to me what the vision is for the replacement of the current logistics chain is, unless the plan is we all live in villages.
In contrast, the same milk tanker could drive 200 miles to the milk processing centre where the milk would be processed. Then another truck could drive the bottled milk another 200 miles to the supermarket distribution centre. Then, it can be moved onto another truck and driven 200 miles to your nearest supermarket. You can then drive to the supermarket.
Distances obviously made up.
I'm not sure exactly how vending machines are currently filled, but I am sure that it involves stringent protocols to avoid any contamination. I can't see any reason (at least, in theory) why those protocols couldn't be extended to filling multiple vending machines.
Edit - Brian has provided some direct evidence from the countryside.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Here's one solution:
https://thedorsetdairyco.com/fresh-milk/We launched our first 50L refills in 2020 and they are now making their way into independent businesses across Southern England. Designed and built by Dan himself, these sleek machines do not use any single-use plastic, unlike small pergal machines, and give smaller shops the opportunity to be pioneers in the refill revolution. We are all about innovation so watch this space for our next invention!
Though I can't see why suitable equipment and cleaning regimes should prevent vending machines being refilled from one 'tanker'. If you knew the lengths farmers go to produce hyper-clean milk, despite the challenge of its sources not holding back their s**t and p*ss while they are milked, you'd know that pretty much anything is possible.0 -
I think a DH segment on Gold Hill would rightly be flagged as suicidal!briantrumpet said:
I bet that delivery boy was going for a Strava segment.Dorset_Boy said:
Why did you need to bring bread into it?pangolin said:
That's less than 20 miles from where the West Dorset MP's parents farm is btw.0 -
You have to admire the marketing in suggesting you can 'gently' pasteurise anything. Good luck to them though. To get even more nerdy about it, there's a small exhibition at the Colyton end of the Seaton Tramway about the big dairy rail depot thing at Seaton Junction. It would upset the MP for West Dorset but even in the early 20th century milk was being moved in high volume to London.briantrumpet said:Here's one solution:
https://thedorsetdairyco.com/fresh-milk/We launched our first 50L refills in 2020 and they are now making their way into independent businesses across Southern England. Designed and built by Dan himself, these sleek machines do not use any single-use plastic, unlike small pergal machines, and give smaller shops the opportunity to be pioneers in the refill revolution. We are all about innovation so watch this space for our next invention!
Though I can't see why suitable equipment and cleaning regimes should prevent vending machines being refilled from one 'tanker'. If you knew the lengths farmers go to produce hyper-clean milk, despite the challenge of its sources not holding back their s**t and p*ss while they are milked, you'd know that pretty much anything is possible.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
rjsterry said:
You have to admire the marketing in suggesting you can 'gently' pasteurise anything. Good luck to them though. To get even more nerdy about it, there's a small exhibition at the Colyton end of the Seaton Tramway about the big dairy rail depot thing at Seaton Junction. It would upset the MP for West Dorset but even in the early 20th century milk was being moved in high volume to London.briantrumpet said:Here's one solution:
https://thedorsetdairyco.com/fresh-milk/We launched our first 50L refills in 2020 and they are now making their way into independent businesses across Southern England. Designed and built by Dan himself, these sleek machines do not use any single-use plastic, unlike small pergal machines, and give smaller shops the opportunity to be pioneers in the refill revolution. We are all about innovation so watch this space for our next invention!
Though I can't see why suitable equipment and cleaning regimes should prevent vending machines being refilled from one 'tanker'. If you knew the lengths farmers go to produce hyper-clean milk, despite the challenge of its sources not holding back their s**t and p*ss while they are milked, you'd know that pretty much anything is possible.
Ha - glad you noticed that too. Though, to be fair, pasteurisation isn't exactly brutal, and the results are impressive for such minor treatment... especially at the time when it was introduced, when raw milk was anything but clean and free of disease.
Incidentally, since you occasionally 'do Devon', it's worth reading up on the Culm Valley Light Railway: it was an experiment in creating a very cheap railway for a sparsely-populated rural area, which hit lucky with the dairy at Hemyock, which pretty much single-handedly kept the line profitable until the dairy's demise in the 1980's. It was the home of St Ivel Gold and Utterly Butterly for many of its later years. These days, you'd struggle to find a single remnant of the line - you have to know where it was, and look closely even then. It really came into its own from the 1880s when they started sending butter in bulk up to London.
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Did it get traded in London and then sent back to Dorset for the consumers to drink?rjsterry said:
You have to admire the marketing in suggesting you can 'gently' pasteurise anything. Good luck to them though. To get even more nerdy about it, there's a small exhibition at the Colyton end of the Seaton Tramway about the big dairy rail depot thing at Seaton Junction. It would upset the MP for West Dorset but even in the early 20th century milk was being moved in high volume to London.briantrumpet said:Here's one solution:
https://thedorsetdairyco.com/fresh-milk/We launched our first 50L refills in 2020 and they are now making their way into independent businesses across Southern England. Designed and built by Dan himself, these sleek machines do not use any single-use plastic, unlike small pergal machines, and give smaller shops the opportunity to be pioneers in the refill revolution. We are all about innovation so watch this space for our next invention!
Though I can't see why suitable equipment and cleaning regimes should prevent vending machines being refilled from one 'tanker'. If you knew the lengths farmers go to produce hyper-clean milk, despite the challenge of its sources not holding back their s**t and p*ss while they are milked, you'd know that pretty much anything is possible.0 -
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TheBigBean said:
Did it get traded in London and then sent back to Dorset for the consumers to drink?rjsterry said:
You have to admire the marketing in suggesting you can 'gently' pasteurise anything. Good luck to them though. To get even more nerdy about it, there's a small exhibition at the Colyton end of the Seaton Tramway about the big dairy rail depot thing at Seaton Junction. It would upset the MP for West Dorset but even in the early 20th century milk was being moved in high volume to London.briantrumpet said:Here's one solution:
https://thedorsetdairyco.com/fresh-milk/We launched our first 50L refills in 2020 and they are now making their way into independent businesses across Southern England. Designed and built by Dan himself, these sleek machines do not use any single-use plastic, unlike small pergal machines, and give smaller shops the opportunity to be pioneers in the refill revolution. We are all about innovation so watch this space for our next invention!
Though I can't see why suitable equipment and cleaning regimes should prevent vending machines being refilled from one 'tanker'. If you knew the lengths farmers go to produce hyper-clean milk, despite the challenge of its sources not holding back their s**t and p*ss while they are milked, you'd know that pretty much anything is possible.
http://umborne.org/2011/07/seaton-junction/
There was an Express Dairy there, so I assume the raw milk arrived there from Devon farms, was treated and bottled, then sent 'to town' for Londoners to drink, or make their porridge or junket, or swim in it, whatever you Londoners do with milk.
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