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Road tubeless tyres, where and how much?

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  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,864
    Wotnos... try more sealant and if that fails I sert my favourite tyre plug.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,864
    edited August 2019
    Francis fi bianco I use kinlin rims for the majority of my builds and have set up hundred of tubeless tyres in the xr22t and 31t rims. Theres has never been a problem rim.

    Your issues smacks of something overlooked. It wont or is very unlikely to be the rim. Soapy water is your friend, pour a dilute solution all over the rim. The Hutchinson tyres on kinlin rims are a tight fit. This a good thing for tubeless and they inflate with a floor pump, no compressed air needed. Definitely not hand fit. If you can mount your tyres easily by hand then you may have a one off. However hunt rims may or may not be kinlin.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • zefszefs Posts: 484
    So 5 miles from the end of an audax yesterday my rear Mavic punctured - it seemed to be a bit of a slice and eventually the sealant managed to seal the slice. I then re-inflated with a travel pump and probably got about 50 psi in it and limped home.

    I went out this morning to the garage and put the track pump on - re-inflated and then when it got to ~60/70 psi, the dreaded hiss started. Looking at the tyre, where the air is escaping, there seems to be very little evidence of a hole, slice or gouge? In other words it seems like very minor damage.

    Question is though can I just add more sealant through the valve core and then spin it and re-inflate to fix it? Or is there something more involved I need to do?

    Maybe patch it from inside just to be sure and add more sealant.
  • I re-inflated yesterday evening and when it got to about 80 psi the sealant began bubbling and coming out again. So I took off the tyre, washed out all of the sealant then popped the tyre back on and re-inflated (as I couldn't find the slice again). It went to 80 psi so I left it overnight. This morning it was still inflated, although I didn't check the pressure (bear in mind there is no sealant in the tyre now).

    I'll probably take out the valve core this evening, if it still at pressure. Then I'll insert more sealant, and then re-inflate to 80 psi or so and spin it for distribution. I have to say I was quite surprised at how relatively easy it was to get the tyre off, re-install it, and re-inflate it.

    Thanks for the advice.
  • I re-inflated yesterday evening and when it got to about 80 psi the sealant began bubbling and coming out again. So I took off the tyre, washed out all of the sealant then popped the tyre back on and re-inflated (as I couldn't find the slice again). It went to 80 psi so I left it overnight. This morning it was still inflated, although I didn't check the pressure (bear in mind there is no sealant in the tyre now).

    I'll probably take out the valve core this evening, if it still at pressure. Then I'll insert more sealant, and then re-inflate to 80 psi or so and spin it for distribution. I have to say I was quite surprised at how relatively easy it was to get the tyre off, re-install it, and re-inflate it.

    Thanks for the advice.

    Well that was a mistake - I took the tyre off again yesterday evening, skinned knuckle/finger in the process, applied a patch on the inside of the tube, then refitted the tyre and re-inflated it.

    Had a bit of a nightmare getting the tube to seat, but eventually it did - I also added more sealant, which I think helped it to seal.
    But guess what - yes there's still a leak.

    So it looks like tyres off tonight, and put into the bin and replaced with some tyres and tubes.
  • I re-inflated yesterday evening and when it got to about 80 psi the sealant began bubbling and coming out again. So I took off the tyre, washed out all of the sealant then popped the tyre back on and re-inflated (as I couldn't find the slice again). It went to 80 psi so I left it overnight. This morning it was still inflated, although I didn't check the pressure (bear in mind there is no sealant in the tyre now).

    I'll probably take out the valve core this evening, if it still at pressure. Then I'll insert more sealant, and then re-inflate to 80 psi or so and spin it for distribution. I have to say I was quite surprised at how relatively easy it was to get the tyre off, re-install it, and re-inflate it.

    Thanks for the advice.

    Well that was a mistake - I took the tyre off again yesterday evening, skinned knuckle/finger in the process, applied a patch on the inside of the tube, then refitted the tyre and re-inflated it.

    Had a bit of a nightmare getting the tube to seat, but eventually it did - I also added more sealant, which I think helped it to seat.
    But guess what?? Yes there's still a leak.

    So it looks like tubeless tyres off tonight, and put into the bin and replaced with some clincher tyres and tubes.
  • zefszefs Posts: 484
    Might be a defective tire and it leaks from the bead, had one as well and had to use it with a tube.
  • andyh01andyh01 Posts: 570
    Well I'm now in the market for a replacement tubeless tyre. After running over ahalf a Spam can and put a big rip 8n the tyre and not repairable.

    I'm on an Adventure bike most of my riding is road with weekly club ride. I do also go over the fields and parks with the kids.

    Hunt wheels with 35mm G Ones allroad and tbf they seem.ok. I just can't decide whether to stick with 35mm with slight tread or go narrower and slicks like gp5s or pro ones, although I guess means changing rear tyre too?
    Rear had one puncture that sealant fixed in 6 months at approx 400km per week.
    I'm now 9n Orange sealant (previously Peaty)
    What to do?
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,864
    Wotnos.. why not do as I suggested and stick a good sticky plyre plug in it. You don't remove the tyre yo fix a puncture. That last resort. Read by guides on this.

    You have done everything to make the situation more complicated.

    Sealant is not primarily there to seal punctures. It is there to seal any porosity in tyres seal the tyre rim interface and slow down any air loss from punctures. It sometimes seals punctures. When it does not use a sticky tyre plugs. If it's not tacky as some are don't expect it to stay in the tyre.

    Andy

    Pro ones and the conti on your mileage will be worn out in a month maybe two if your light.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,864
    Reading your post I wonder if removing all the old sealant was the problem. Your true might have developed porosity. I have had this with a continental mtb tyre. A race king. I foolishly when it was off to fit an insert I picked off all the latex of the tyre. Now the tyre wont seal. I have to spend time with caffe latex getting all that latex all over this non tubeless tyre to get it seal again. I cant fit a tubeless IRC mythos or tubeless schwalbe because the ryde tubeless rim is sized so only a rubbed mtb tyre fits. Semi tubeless setups are a PITA.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • Wotnos.. why not do as I suggested and stick a good sticky plyre plug in it. You don't remove the tyre yo fix a puncture. That last resort. Read by guides on this.
    I didn't have any tyre plugs, and buoyed by how simple it was to remove it the last time, and having a puncture kit and patches available, I thought why not.
    You have done everything to make the situation more complicated.

    Sealant is not primarily there to seal punctures. It is there to seal any porosity in tyres seal the tyre rim interface and slow down any air loss from punctures. It sometimes seals punctures. When it does not use a sticky tyre plugs. If it's not tacky as some are don't expect it to stay in the tyre.

    Andy

    Pro ones and the conti on your mileage will be worn out in a month maybe two if your light.
    I'm not light.....So £70-80 for two tyres to have to replace them in a couple of months seems a bit much.

    To go back to tubeless I think I need to have a higher level of confidence in the technology, and possibly being able to fix punctures on the roadside.
    I'll have a look at Malcolm's website
  • bradsbeardbradsbeard Posts: 210
    Managed to break the tyre bead on my Pro Ones. Hit a deep pot hole and the tyre bottomed out. Rim must have broken the bead.
  • Holy f%$k,

    What an abomination - trying to get tubed tyres onto these UST wheels. I have two brand new tyres- a Pro3 in 23mm. and a Conti Ultra Sport in a 25. I can't get other of them onto the rim with a tube in them.

    I've never seen anything so tight!!

    Anyone up for a pair of UST Mavic wheels? Ksyrium Elite??

    Or can anyone provide some insight as to how to get these to fit??

    Or does anyone know if Hutchinson Fusion 11 Performance in a 28 would fit on an Aithein (calliper braked frameset) with Ksyrium UST?
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,864
    edited September 2019
    I take it your still using tubeless tape on the rims. Putting rim strip in there will tyre fitting difficult. Soapy water will help with tubes tyre fitting as it does with tu less. Just make it a dilute solution. Conti ultra sports are a tight fit dont bother. Conti gp 5000 fit well as will Victoria corsa controls. I do consider the ust wheels from mavic as tubeless only.

    Tubeless tyres last me more than a couple of months. Depending on the tyre I generally wear them out. Several Tyre plugs are filling the holes though by the end of its life.

    You wont learnt giving up. Get a decent pair of tyres and yes they cost money.
    There is a reason why I irc tyres myself as £ per mile they are the best. Hutchinson tyres are a close second as they are alot cheaper but still do sensible miles. They also have good road manors. The hutchinson fusion 5 all season tyre is serving me quite well.

    Then get some dynaplugs (expensive) or tacky tyre plugs like maxalami and just remember a road side repair does not have to go to 80 psi immediately. Often a plug will take 24 hrs before it can hold high pressures well the big hole require that time. Just inflate witha handpump till you can ride it or the plug tries to push out. If the later happen let some air out and after 24hrs try a higher pressure. That normally works.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • I take it your still using tubeless tape on the rims. Putting rim strip in there will tyre fitting difficult. Soapy water will help with tubes tyre fitting as it does with tu less. Just make it a dilute solution. Conti ultra sports are a tight fit dont bother. Conti gp 5000 fit well as will Victoria corsa controls. I do consider the ust wheels from mavic as tubeless only.

    Tubeless tyres last me more than a couple of months. Depending on the tyre I generally wear them out. Several Tyre plugs are filling the holes though by the end of its life.

    You wont learnt giving up. Get a decent pair of tyres and yes they cost money.
    There is a reason why I irc tyres myself as £ per mile they are the best. Hutchinson tyres are a close second as they are alot cheaper but still do sensible miles. They also have good road majors. The hutchinson fusion 5 all season tyre is serving quite well.

    Then get so dynaplugs (expensive) or burly tyre plugs like maxalami and just remember a road side repair does not have to go to 80 psi immediately. Often a plug will take 24 hrs before it can hold high pressures well the big hole require that time. Just inflate witha handpump till you can ride it or the plug tries to push out. If the later happen let some air out and after 24hrs try a higher pressure. That normally works.
    Cheers Malc.
    No tubeless tape though

    Gonna give it another go
  • asprillaasprilla Posts: 8,440
    Anyone got any feedback on Pirelli Cinturato Velos? I'm considering them on the commuter for winter.
    Mud - Genesis Vapour CCX
    Race - Fuji Norcom Straight
    Sun - Cervelo R3
    Winter / Commute - Dolan ADX
  • I only one person running them. He said they felt a bit slow but then again it has a 5mm thick thread sowhat it looses innpace it may gain in wear life and puncture resistance.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • asprillaasprilla Posts: 8,440
    I only one person running them. He said they felt a bit slow but then again it has a 5mm thick thread sowhat it looses innpace it may gain in wear life and puncture resistance.

    That's the plan. It's for winter commuting, not for racing so the loss of 5-10w over a Schwalbe Pro One isn't going to make any difference whatsoever.

    Not really had any issues with Pro Ones, just a couple of punctures in the last year or so and they were self sealed. I do find that if you lock-up the read wheel, as I did the other day, then they don't last very long after that, hence the 3.6mm thick tread on these appeals.
    Mud - Genesis Vapour CCX
    Race - Fuji Norcom Straight
    Sun - Cervelo R3
    Winter / Commute - Dolan ADX
  • Or does anyone know if Hutchinson Fusion 11 Performance in a 28 would fit on an Aithein (calliper braked frameset) with Ksyrium UST?

    The answer is yes. A gift to put on and inflate too. Running 85 psi in the rear and it's like a magic carpet.....
  • arseyarsey Posts: 171
    asprilla wrote:
    I only one person running them. He said they felt a bit slow but then again it has a 5mm thick thread sowhat it looses innpace it may gain in wear life and puncture resistance.

    That's the plan. It's for winter commuting, not for racing so the loss of 5-10w over a Schwalbe Pro One isn't going to make any difference whatsoever.

    Not really had any issues with Pro Ones, just a couple of punctures in the last year or so and they were self sealed. I do find that if you lock-up the read wheel, as I did the other day, then they don't last very long after that, hence the 3.6mm thick tread on these appeals.
    Also looking for a 28mm winter commuter tyre. Looking at these or the IRC Formula pro x guard. Malcolm, are you getting any more of the 28mm x guard in stock?
    Canyon Ultimate CF Disc
    Vitus Energie Disc
  • asprillaasprilla Posts: 8,440
    arsey wrote:
    asprilla wrote:
    I only one person running them. He said they felt a bit slow but then again it has a 5mm thick thread sowhat it looses innpace it may gain in wear life and puncture resistance.

    That's the plan. It's for winter commuting, not for racing so the loss of 5-10w over a Schwalbe Pro One isn't going to make any difference whatsoever.

    Not really had any issues with Pro Ones, just a couple of punctures in the last year or so and they were self sealed. I do find that if you lock-up the read wheel, as I did the other day, then they don't last very long after that, hence the 3.6mm thick tread on these appeals.
    Also looking for a 28mm winter commuter tyre. Looking at these or the IRC Formula pro x guard. Malcolm, are you getting any more of the 28mm x guard in stock?

    I've tried the X Guards and I must say I've not been impressed. The rear lasted less than a month before it had multiple punctures that wouldn't seal. The front is still on the bike, but it's cut up really badly. I've replaced the rear with a Schwalbe Pro One but I want to move that onto the good bike after it's rear was wrecked by an emergency brake the other day.
    Mud - Genesis Vapour CCX
    Race - Fuji Norcom Straight
    Sun - Cervelo R3
    Winter / Commute - Dolan ADX
  • arseyarsey Posts: 171
    asprilla wrote:
    arsey wrote:
    asprilla wrote:
    I only one person running them. He said they felt a bit slow but then again it has a 5mm thick thread sowhat it looses innpace it may gain in wear life and puncture resistance.

    That's the plan. It's for winter commuting, not for racing so the loss of 5-10w over a Schwalbe Pro One isn't going to make any difference whatsoever.

    Not really had any issues with Pro Ones, just a couple of punctures in the last year or so and they were self sealed. I do find that if you lock-up the read wheel, as I did the other day, then they don't last very long after that, hence the 3.6mm thick tread on these appeals.
    Also looking for a 28mm winter commuter tyre. Looking at these or the IRC Formula pro x guard. Malcolm, are you getting any more of the 28mm x guard in stock?

    I've tried the X Guards and I must say I've not been impressed. The rear lasted less than a month before it had multiple punctures that wouldn't seal. The front is still on the bike, but it's cut up really badly. I've replaced the rear with a Schwalbe Pro One but I want to move that onto the good bike after it's rear was wrecked by an emergency brake the other day.
    Interesting, I've had the 25mm version on my bike throughout last winter and this summer and they've been bombproof. Guess it shows it's sometimes just a bit random!
    Canyon Ultimate CF Disc
    Vitus Energie Disc
  • Every tyre can get punctures. The fact they are not sealing is not the tyres fault. That why I carry plugs. Swapping tyres normally changes the bad luck. Also why people expect rubber not to cut is beyond me. Yhe roads were I live cut all tyres badly. I still get excellent life from them.

    I have a conti gatorskin tub whose surface looks like swiss cheese and yet it soliders on to my dismay.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • asprillaasprilla Posts: 8,440
    I don't expect them not to cut up, and I so carry plugs. However, riding the same roads, day in day out, on a variety of different tyre / bike / weather combinations, my anecdotal evidence is that these have performed poorly compared to the other tyres I've been using. It may be anecdotal, but it's the only data I have and so it's all I can use to make a decision.
    Mud - Genesis Vapour CCX
    Race - Fuji Norcom Straight
    Sun - Cervelo R3
    Winter / Commute - Dolan ADX
  • Apologies if this has been posted before but what's the best thing to do / buy when your Mavic UST valves get bunged up? I think that's whats happened as it's got really hard getting air into the tyre.

    Not specific to Mavic but I've seen some comment about taking out the inner and cleaning it but other people saying they're so cheap that they buy them in bulk and that's it not worth cleaning them.

    If the latter is the way forward, where can you get compatible inners for the latest Mavic Ksyrium wheels? Don't want a whole near valve, just replace the inner and the idea of getting a few is a good one.

    Many thanks.
  • arseyarsey Posts: 171
    Every tyre can get punctures. The fact they are not sealing is not the tyres fault. That why I carry plugs. Swapping tyres normally changes the bad luck. Also why people expect rubber not to cut is beyond me. Yhe roads were I live cut all tyres badly. I still get excellent life from them.

    I have a conti gatorskin tub whose surface looks like swiss cheese and yet it soliders on to my dismay.
    Are you getting the formula pro X guard 28s back in stock?
    Canyon Ultimate CF Disc
    Vitus Energie Disc
  • arseyarsey Posts: 171
    Punctured last night in the rain. It was a slow puncture so I got home by stopping every 5 minutes to pump up with more air. A bit disappointed in the sealant but I guess it was better than having an inner tube puncture. I topped up the sealant when I got home with some more and it did seal so I guess I was just running low. Overall, I think a slight win for tubeless but a bit of a faff.
    Canyon Ultimate CF Disc
    Vitus Energie Disc
  • bobonesbobones Posts: 1,029
    arsey wrote:
    Punctured last night in the rain. It was a slow puncture so I got home by stopping every 5 minutes to pump up with more air. A bit disappointed in the sealant but I guess it was better than having an inner tube puncture. I topped up the sealant when I got home with some more and it did seal so I guess I was just running low. Overall, I think a slight win for tubeless but a bit of a faff.
    What sealant? Experience has taught me that you should just plug anything that doesn't seal right away with a worm or Dynaplug.
  • skeetamskeetam Posts: 143
    Apologies if this has been posted before but what's the best thing to do / buy when your Mavic UST valves get bunged up? I think that's whats happened as it's got really hard getting air into the tyre.

    Not specific to Mavic but I've seen some comment about taking out the inner and cleaning it but other people saying they're so cheap that they buy them in bulk and that's it not worth cleaning them.

    If the latter is the way forward, where can you get compatible inners for the latest Mavic Ksyrium wheels? Don't want a whole near valve, just replace the inner and the idea of getting a few is a good one.

    Many thanks.

    Just remove the core and clean it up with a little bit of WD40.
  • arseyarsey Posts: 171
    bobones wrote:
    arsey wrote:
    Punctured last night in the rain. It was a slow puncture so I got home by stopping every 5 minutes to pump up with more air. A bit disappointed in the sealant but I guess it was better than having an inner tube puncture. I topped up the sealant when I got home with some more and it did seal so I guess I was just running low. Overall, I think a slight win for tubeless but a bit of a faff.
    What sealant? Experience has taught me that you should just plug anything that doesn't seal right away with a worm or Dynaplug.
    Effetto Mariposa (in 25mm IRC Formula pro x-guards). I've also just realised the tyre has done 6000km so it's probably getting a little worn. I was going to plug but it was pouring down with rain and I figured I could just top up the air every 5 mins until I get home which was easier.
    Canyon Ultimate CF Disc
    Vitus Energie Disc
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