Road tubeless tyres, where and how much?

timothyw

I'd very happily run 28s if my good bikes could accommodate them. Unfortunately my 2015 vintage TCR is a tight squeeze with 25s, and my Merckx AXM has pretty tight clearance even on 23s....

And don't want to throw tubeless money at bikes which aren't Sunday best.

Solution is obviously N+1 but I can't see that happening without killing a frame first.

cycleclinic

drop the pressures. 120 psi is too high. Some tyres feel better at low pressures. regardless I would say a failure that that should be reported to windwave. they may want to send the tyre to hutchinson. They may replace it. tyres should not fail at the bead and the bead hook on the kinlin is not the problem.

ugo.santalucia

Another day, another puncture... I managed three full days without punctures... pressure has dropped to something like 20 PSI before it sealed, so I suspect I will have to patch this one as well...

I think, after 4 years, my experience with tubeless is coming to an end... the technology hasn't improved, prices haven't come down and I can't find a reasonably priced and reliable tyre for commuting

arsey

Tubeless worked for me yesterday!

Was cycling home and heard a clank on every wheel rotation, I initially thought it was the gears as they have been playing up recently (turns out it's a snapped cable) but I looked at the tyre and saw this


Thought it might be like a 5mm head of a nail or something and was thankful that it either hadn't penetrated the tyre fully or the sealant had sealed around it. Anyway, I got home and pulled it out to find this


I was amazed that I rode about 10km with that in the tyre! That would have definitely finished a tube. Unfortunately the tyre didn't seal once I pulled it out (I think due to lack of sealant in the tyre) so I took it off, rubbed off the dry sealant where the hole was and patched it with a park tool patch.

Got a few questions about this:

1. Is it fine to leave dry sealant in the tyre? It took a while to get the sealant off that patch area so would take about 2 hours to do the whole tyre!
2. The patch wouldn't stick without superglue, is this normal (tyre is an IRC Roadlite)

ugo.santalucia

yeah, those patches never stick... I don't see any problem in using superglue

sloppyschleckonds

Clean all that sealant off, let us know how long it takes

johnsonmoog

I did indeed clean two tubeless tyres of dried out sealant a while ago. Ah that was a fun time.....

drlodge

Those patches won't stick properly, bit of a bodge IMO. Use Rema tip top patches here with the adhesive, proper job.

shortfall

johnsonmoog wrote:

I did indeed clean two tubeless tyres of dried out sealant a while ago. Ah that was a fun time.....

Is there any point? It surely can't weigh much and whatever it does weigh is most likely offset by the tyre itself losing rubber as it wears.

shortfall

I've been running the IRC Formula Pro tubeless tyres on my best bike and they are without doubt the best tyres I've ridden on in terms of comfort, speed and grip. They are my first tubeless tyres though so I have no experience of any other brands to compare them with. They didn't cut up at all in 2k miles and indeed the front still looks almost new. The rear however had started to square off quite badly and after a couple of punctures (which sealed ok) I decided to replace it with an IRC Roadlite which I had heard similarly good things about. Here are my first thoughts after a couple of 50 mile rides.

Getting the tyres onto the rim was a pretty easy affair and only required a lever for the last bit, unlike the Formula pros which I found to be an absolute bitch to mount. However, I couldn't get the tyre inflated with a track pump or a compressor despite adding some sealant in and brushing soap solution on the beads. Even a blast with a co2 cartridge didn't do it and air was rushing out everywhere. I resorted to popping the beads on by putting a tube in and inflating with the track pump. I then pushed the tyre of one side of the rim, reconnected the tubeless valve and smeard the bead liberally with more soapy water. This time with one side already mounted the co2 popped it on a treat. I deflated it to purge the co2 before adding 30 MLS of Cafe Latex sealant and inflating to 90 psi (I'm 17 stone). I'm sure Malcolm will groan when he reads this because he makes it look effortless on his videos but for me it was quite a hassle. I'm reluctant to spend upwards of 50 quid on an airshot but maybe I'll have to bite the bullet if it's going to avoid the problems I endured.

The tyre (a 25mm) looks way bigger than the Formula Pro once mounted, more like a 28mm I would say. It also rides like it was a bigger size in that it's extremely comfortable even with 90 psi. I haven't had the opportunity to really push it in terms of cornering etc but dry grip appears to be fine. My Strava also suggests that the extra comfort hasn't come at the expense of any speed, but two 50 milers on good roads isn't really a scientific sample so I'll reserve judgement. First impressions however are really positive and hopefully the difficulties with inflating were a one off (the Pros went up easily with the track pump). For anyone who might be deterred from trying tubeless out after reading this please don't be. The ride (on IRC tyres at least) is absolutely sublime. I have no experience of riding tubs but I am told that a good tubeless tyre compares favorably and let's face it, the mythical ride quality of tubulars doesn't come without it's own challenges; rim prep, pre stretching the tyre and all that gluing which doesn't look like a lot of fun to me .

drlodge

Shortfall wrote:

I couldn't get the tyre inflated with a track pump or a compressor despite adding some sealant in and brushing soap solution on the beads. Even a blast with a co2 cartridge didn't do it and air was rushing out everywhere.

That's probably because the rim tape has become depressed in the spoke holes - solution for me is to remove the rim tape and add some new.

shortfall

drlodge wrote:

Shortfall wrote:

I couldn't get the tyre inflated with a track pump or a compressor despite adding some sealant in and brushing soap solution on the beads. Even a blast with a co2 cartridge didn't do it and air was rushing out everywhere.

That's probably because the rim tape has become depressed in the spoke holes - solution for me is to remove the rim tape and add some new.

Think you may be right. For the sake of a few quid I think I'll just re tape the rim next time I swap a tyre. All part of the learning curve!

drlodge

I've got 2 layers of rim tape - the first original layer which stays put, and a second layer which I replace when I change a tyre.

Its somewhat a ball ache but doesn't take that long. Using Tesa tape.

tonysj

Thought I would give folks an update. I've had Pro Ones since February this year and done about 1500 miles on them. The rear has squared off so today I decided to take them both off and swap them around. The front was dry with no caff latex, I know I've had at least 1 big puncture that sealed but took a while losing the fluid before it sealed and I rode home ok. The rear still had a small amount less than 10ml in the tyre.
I've got to say they ride great are easy to live with and todate have not let me down.
Would I buy them again? Yes if they were discounted and cheaper as they wear quicker than my usual conti gp 4000sii's and cost a bit more.
Defo will stick with tubeless at least on my summer bike.

cycleclinic

what sealant are you using ugo. try caffe latex or oko hi-fibre sealant they seem the best for road tubeless tyres. why not use a tyre plug to fill the holes ugo. they do help.

how come you get more punctures than me? also given tubeless tyres do cost more to make the prices won't come down much without corner cutting.

Tubeless tyres should be hard to fit. every time I find one easy to fit I find them hard to go up unless it is a big tyre (cross, gravel or MTB) these can be a looser fit and inflate easily. So Tony you may have a one off looser fit tyre but since it up now it not an issue anymore.

the listing for the Roadlite tony states the tyre width and height for the rim you have and yes the 25mm Roadlite is a 28mm tyre on a wider rim (19mm internal width). I think selling tyres with real widths and heights on a stated rim width should be standard practice as whats on the sidewall is totally meaningless as there is no standard for bead to bead distances for a stated width.

Tony SJ top up your sealant every 3 months if using caffe latex. I have yet to find a sealant that seals better and last longer at the same time. In fact there is a recent review on bike radar about sealants.

MisterMuncher

Quick question for Malcolm, if it's no trouble.

Currently running 25mm Pro-One on HED Ardennes+ rims, and they're only just clearing the chainstays on my SuperSix. They're not rubbing or anything, but it's very close indeed. I'll likely use them until they're done, but I was going to try IRC as a replacement.

So, what's racy but blows up just a smidge smaller?

cycleclinic

the formula pro tyres come up true to size well on the hed they maybe 1mm wider than stated. The Mavic yskion are sized similarly to the IRC formula pro tyre's but a tad taller.

this is what I mean by whats on the sidewall is meaningless.

MisterMuncher

Thanks, sir. Have never thrown the calipers on the tyres at the minute, but they're definitely bigger than the same tyre on Pacenti SL23s.

Now, just to time it right that my tyres are knackered as my bottle of Rock 'n' Roll gold runs out...

drlodge

MisterMuncher wrote:

Now, just to time it right that my tyres are knackered as my bottle of Rock 'n' Roll gold runs out...

Change to the Absolute Dry, much better, less mess.

cycleclinic

absolute dry is fine in the dry. show it rain and you have a squeeky chain. I use gold but the dry is cleaner.

MisterMuncher

Never had much problem with Gold myself. I used Blue for years because CRC were clearing it out of their Belfast shop at a fiver a big bottle, and it did gather more dirt, and would accumulate on the drivetrain, but never had that bother with the gold.

cycleclinic

The blue is for wet muddy conditions we digress.

zefs

One and a half month ago I added caffelatex on the back wheel, few days ago I saw loss of pressure on the tire. No visible punctures or sealant so I guess it dried already and added 20ml which fixed it.
Been riding on 30C though and might be normal? either way didn't check if it has indeed dried out, but Bontrager TLR sealant seems to last longer, can't comment on either for puncture protection though as I haven't had any, 3000km with tubeless setup so far.

joe_totale-2

Rode Dunwich Dynamo on Hutchinson Sector 28's with 65/70 psi. Total convert now, the ride quality was fantastic at those pressures and with no discernible loss of speed. The nature of the ride means that you'll hit a couple of potholes that you don't see in time but again the low pressures smoothed them all out.

The tyres were a piece of cake to get on the rims with my hands and seated with some sealent and CO2.

Now having thoughts of converting the commuter bike to tubeless, does anyone know of any tubeless ready single speed wheels out there or would it be best to go to a wheelbuilder?

cycleclinic

Caffe latex does not dry out that quickly. try 3 months if you put 40ml in. 20 ml is a bit stingy. compressed air also dries the stuff out. there are reasons why sealant sometimes does not last its not always the sealants fault.

arsey

Still having issues with getting my cross bike to seal. I put on some new rim tape (Tesa) and it is still leaking air through the nipples.

When I was applying the rim tape, I wasn't sure whether I was supposed to firmly push it right down inside the rim cavity, should I have?

Anything else that could be causing air loss in the spokes? Should I just add sealant and hope?

cycleclinic

there should be no air gap underneath the tape. retape or get a bike shop to do it. Tesa is what i use now. it like stans but cheaper.

20ml of caffe latex just coats the tyres that why there was nothing left. 40ml for decent sized road tyres. brotrager sealant wont last longer it just may not coat the tyre as well giving you the illusion it lasts longer.

shortfall

https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/prod ... ure-270668

Does anyone have any thoughts on the tyre pressure recommendations in the above article? I run my tubeless significantly lower than those suggested in the Schwalbe guide.

zefs

Use what works for you, I find that I use 15-20psi less since going tubeless on same tire width.

joe_totale-2

I'm running 28's at 65 on the front and 70 at the back. Lovely comfy ride and I don't really feel there's any loss of speed.
Someone I know is currently running 28's at 55/60 and he's no slouch.