Road tubeless tyres, where and how much?

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Comments

  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    It's the rim. You possibly have a rim without the lip next to dip in the rim. Without this lip the tyre will unseat at zero pressure. There is not you can do about it either.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • kingstonian
    kingstonian Posts: 2,847
    Is there a way to tell whether sealant needs to be topped up? I've been riding tubeless for the past 4 months or so on the commute and I'm having to top up the air pressure in my back tyre every 3-4 days or so. I've checked the tyre itself and there are no obvious sharp objects etc. The front tyre which has done the same mileage is absolutely fine.
  • jollygiant
    jollygiant Posts: 117
    edited June 2018
    Been using Schwable Pro One tubeless for 2 months or 1,300 miles and the rear is completely worn out, front is about 1/2- 3/4 worn.
    Had to put a tube in the front about 500 miles ago as I got a puncture that worm couldn't fix and spent 2 hours trying to get it seated back on the rim (and yes I went to the local car garage and used there big compressor), gave up in the end and put a tube in and not had a puncture or had to add air since.

    Every single ride I'd get a small puncture in the rear so sealant would go everywhere, 2 proper punctures but worms fixed them.

    I love the ride ride quality of tubeless but not the hassle cost and mess.

    So I've gone back to a tubed Michelin Power Endurance on the rear, feels more buzzy again but worth it for clean bike and not having to pump them up before every ride.

    I may go back to them in future if I see them on offer..
  • drlodge
    drlodge Posts: 4,826
    I found the Schwable Pro One tubeless rather delicate and the back tyre cut up and wore out quite quickly. I also had the issue of air escaping between tyre wall and rim (immersed in water and could see air trickling out), so I decided to change them.

    Moved to IRC roadlites and very happy with them. It is a pain if you have to take the tyre off/on as it won't seat unless the rim tape is replaced. Although I'd rather take the tyre off and repair with a patch on the inside rather than use a worm if the hole is one of those that won't quite seal.

    As to when sealant needs to be topped up, probably every 4-6 months or so if you've not had any punctures. Some sealant like the Orange endurance lasts longer than others, which is what I've moved to (was Stans).
    WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
    Find me on Strava
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    I think I will stick to reasonably priced tubeless for my commuter, for the practicality of not having to fix punctures on the road, but revert to clinchers on my "weekend" bike
    left the forum March 2023
  • deswahriff
    deswahriff Posts: 310
    Thought I’d share my recent experience of going tubeless....I’ve liked the idea for a while but was always put off by maybe having to insert a tube if I had a puncture that sealant wouldn’t fix, knowing how tricky this could be “in the field”...the excellent common sense stuff on the Cycle Clinic site have convinced me otherwise...
    ...anyways, rims are HED Belgium Plus ( bike is a 2016 Roubaix) ...tyres are Roadlite 25mm, Var 17mm rim tape...first effort, front wheel, my rim-taping was less than perfect and couldn’t get a decent seal on the valve. ( I chose Cafelatex purely because of the nicely coloured dust cap, and while they’re fine now, next time I’d choose a valve with a more prominent rubber sleeve where the shaft goes through the rim hole). However, after a blast of CO2, I got it to seat properly and hold some pressure. Back wheel was better, got the knack of the rim taping, so much neater job, and made a better job of seating the valve with a splash of sealent, and got tyre seated perfectly with the track pump. It held its pressure perfectly (without sealant) while the front was slowly deflating so realised I had to start again with the front... had to get more rim tape, tried Stan’s 21mm which is actually a much better fit for these rims ( at some point I’ll redo the back one) and this time got the tyre seated nicely with the track pump.... sealant inserted, and 500 miles later, nothing to report!
    ...well apart from being a total convert, more comfortable, grippier , confidence-inspiring ( my chums tell me I’m descending like never before..!) ... a few surface cuts, especially on the rear (crappy section of Danube cycle path!) but no punctures, dramas, .. nothing..... almost tempted to drill a hole so I can practise using the worm things!
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    If you want to check if you have sealant. Get a pin and shove it in. If it seals you have sealant if it takes its time you don't and need more.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    Jolly giant, try a different tubeless tyre as now you need to carry tubes and tubeless repair kits. The pro one is not the only tubeless tyre out there.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • pgmabley
    pgmabley Posts: 107
    Update on my IRC Roadlites.

    Following a 235 mile club ride a couple of weeks ago and the C2C in a day on Saturday together with a few hundred commuting miles I'm pleased to say they still look like new.

    Really impressed with dry and wet grip, can't tell any difference in rolling between my previous pro ones and these. The pro ones were more prone to cuts in our flinty area (chilterns).

    Given the ease of fitting them and going tubeless I'd recommend.

    Do I have the confidence to go without a spare tube on the Buzzard 600km Audax in two weeks time? I'm not sure!
  • sloppyschleckonds
    sloppyschleckonds Posts: 8,019
    pgmabley wrote:

    Do I have the confidence to go without a spare tube on the Buzzard 600km Audax in two weeks time? I'm not sure!

    Just take a spare tube
    I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    pgmabley wrote:

    Do I have the confidence to go without a spare tube on the Buzzard 600km Audax in two weeks time? I'm not sure!

    Normally on a 600 you would carry a large seat pack of some sort... surely you can fit an inner tube. If you do need an inner tube then you need a tyre boot too...
    left the forum March 2023
  • sloppyschleckonds
    sloppyschleckonds Posts: 8,019
    To hell with it, take a spare tyre.
    I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles
  • lincolndave
    lincolndave Posts: 9,441
    pgmabley wrote:
    Update on my IRC Roadlites.

    Following a 235 mile club ride a couple of weeks ago and the C2C in a day on Saturday together with a few hundred commuting miles I'm pleased to say they still look like new.

    I also rate the road lites very highly it’s a pity they don’t come in 28 mm
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    on a wide rim they are already a 28mm tyre. For bigger IRC do some road friendly CX/gravel tyres as your into gravel widths.

    600km audax without a tube I would but I dont fancy carrying pliers to remove the valve stem collar (after 500km I doubt you can remove it by hand) a small hammer to knock the valve out, tyre levers... and swearing.

    I think my IRC formula pro lights are past 5000km now. 3x 12hr TT's 1x 24hr a years road/circuit racing (unsuccessful I would add), training rides of varying length including winter rides with one tiny puncture I think. I'll keep them on for the next 12hr this weekend and the 24hr in july and the following 12hr in august. Then I'll retire them as they are starting to square off now.

    So you'll probably manage a 600km audax.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • shortfall
    shortfall Posts: 3,288
    After a couple of punctures which the sealant plugged, it's time to retire my rear IRC Formula Pro which has squared off and is looking on it's last legs. Before fitting a new tyre do I need to apply new rim tape? If so do I just put a layer over the existing stuff or do I have to remove the old and start afresh?

    Thanks.
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    unless the tape has lifted you can leave the tape alone.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • shortfall
    shortfall Posts: 3,288
    thecycleclinic wrote:
    unless the tape has lifted you can leave the tape alone.

    Thanks Malcolm. Rear has done about 2k miles which is about what I used to get out of clinchers. The front is unmarked and looks like it has at least another 1000 miles in it. Do you think I would get a bit more wear out of a Roadlite on the rear? The Formula Pro has been a fabulous tyre don't get me wrong but the economics of replacing rears at 2k isn't great.
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    Run it for longer. Why replace a tyre that is rounding off a bit. I'd replace it when it starts to fail me. Unless of course the handling has been affected. Have a rear tyre squared off but the handling seems unchanged so it stay on for the time being.

    Your probably replacing the tyre early in which case why would any tyre last longer.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • shortfall
    shortfall Posts: 3,288
    thecycleclinic wrote:
    Run it for longer. Why replace a tyre that is rounding off a bit. I'd replace it when it starts to fail me. Unless of course the handling has been affected. Have a rear tyre squared off but the handling seems unchanged so it stay on for the time being.

    Your probably replacing the tyre early in which case why would any tyre last longer.

    The handling is ok but the wear indicators have worn away, it's squared off and it's punctured twice in different parts of the tyre which is why I want to replace it. I weigh 17 stone and I figured my extra weight won't help trying to avoid further punctures on a tyre with not much rubber left on it. I know it depends on use etc but all things being equal would you expect a Roadlite to outlast a Formula Pro?
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    if the wear indicators are gone then that the tyre done. the roadlites have the same thread thickness near enough. I have not worn one out yet as i use them less so i cant tell if they last as long or not. wear rate is not fast though. I do know on 18stone rider who pushed a rear formula pro tyre to 5000km.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    MAvic Yksion Elite tubeless 30 mm...

    Luckily I only paid 20 quid a pop for these, otherwise I would be pretty annoyed. After 1,000 miles or thereabout, I have had 6-7 punctures... they all sealed, but one required a boot to seal permanently. The annoying thing is that it has been so dry and the last thing you expect is to puncture on a tyre sold as "all road and gravel". Compare with a pair of flimsy Vittoria Corsa, same mileage, similar roads and only one puncture (on a wet day).

    The other annoying trend is that of punctures popping up one after the other in hot weather... this had happened last year as well on a pair of Sector... not sure why, but it has to do with tubeless.

    Anyway... don't buy them
    left the forum March 2023
  • shortfall
    shortfall Posts: 3,288
    thecycleclinic wrote:
    if the wear indicators are gone then that the tyre done. the roadlites have the same thread thickness near enough. I have not worn one out yet as i use them less so i cant tell if they last as long or not. wear rate is not fast though. I do know on 18stone rider who pushed a rear formula pro tyre to 5000km.

    I've been running mine (25mm) at around 85 psi which seems to give me good comfort and rolling resistance (based on feel and Strava data). Maybe that's an issue affecting wear rate? There's also a lot of hills in the Yorkshire Dales where I do my cycling so maybe the tyre gets a harder time than if I were doing flattish routes? Dunno. I'm going to order a Roadlite next week when I get paid and see how I go with that because apart from the lowish mileage I've got from the rear I am definitely a fan of IRC tyres.
  • jdee84
    jdee84 Posts: 291
    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    MAvic Yksion Elite tubeless 30 mm...

    Luckily I only paid 20 quid a pop for these, otherwise I would be pretty annoyed. After 1,000 miles or thereabout, I have had 6-7 punctures... they all sealed, but one required a boot to seal permanently. The annoying thing is that it has been so dry and the last thing you expect is to puncture on a tyre sold as "all road and gravel". Compare with a pair of flimsy Vittoria Corsa, same mileage, similar roads and only one puncture (on a wet day).

    The other annoying trend is that of punctures popping up one after the other in hot weather... this had happened last year as well on a pair of Sector... not sure why, but it has to do with tubeless.

    Anyway... don't buy them

    I'm somewhere between 700 and 1000 miles into a pair of 28mm maxxis padrones had no issues at all until Sunday going down a road with quite a bit of melted far heard the hiss of a puncture but it had sealed before I stopped haven't been able to find the hole. Noticed a few nicks on the tyre but nothing that looks like a proper hole so had been thinking it was something to do with the hot weather.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    More latex spray on the way home yesterday... I think I need to take the tyre off and inspect it... getting a bit frustrated, today I have commuted with the "best bike" on clinchers
    left the forum March 2023
  • drlodge
    drlodge Posts: 4,826
    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    More latex spray on the way home yesterday... I think I need to take the tyre off and inspect it... getting a bit frustrated, today I have commuted with the "best bike" on clinchers

    It is a pain when tubeless don't seal or you need to take the tyre off, as putting it back on will likely need a new layer of rim tape.

    Do you know if this is another puncture or an existing hole that hasn't sealed?
    WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
    Find me on Strava
  • Gavinus
    Gavinus Posts: 14
    Does anyone have any ideas why the valve on the rear wheel would suddenly start leaking? (Effeto Mariposa valve)

    I got to the bike shed at work yesterday to find a completely flat tyre. Unfortunately the tyre only holds air for about 20-25 minutes before I start bottoming out and my commute lasts 50 minutes.

    I added more sealant at home and pumped it up to the maximum pressure of the tyre (Hutchinson Sector) and left it overnight after spinning the tyre and leaving the valve at the bottom (I could hear & feel the leak around the valve). The tyre had some air left this morning so I thought that the leak had stopped or slowed but alas it only lasted 40 minutes this morning.

    The wheels and tyres have been used for months and I don't remember any issues with getting a seal originally using this valve, tyre and rim combo (Hope 20FIVE).

    Does anyone have any possible solutions? Ideally without removing the valve or rim tape.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    drlodge wrote:
    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    More latex spray on the way home yesterday... I think I need to take the tyre off and inspect it... getting a bit frustrated, today I have commuted with the "best bike" on clinchers

    It is a pain when tubeless don't seal or you need to take the tyre off, as putting it back on will likely need a new layer of rim tape.

    Do you know if this is another puncture or an existing hole that hasn't sealed?

    It is the second time that I have to take the same tyre off... my impression is that it's not the same hole that I patched the first time.
    The tyre will go back on fine, these rims have no holes and no rim tape (Mavic XM 819) and they are tight enough... problem is I need to remove the sealant, wash the tyre, dry the tyre, patch the tyre, refit the tyre, re-seal the tyre and keep spending money on sealant, which is not cheap... I might not even have enough left... so add "order the sealant"... what a freaking hassle with these tyres!
    left the forum March 2023
  • drlodge
    drlodge Posts: 4,826
    Ah stop bitchin Paolo, you know you love fettling :lol:

    Moved to Orange endurance sealant here, supposed to last a long time and seems to work well.
    WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
    Find me on Strava
  • drlodge
    drlodge Posts: 4,826
    Gavinus wrote:
    Does anyone have any possible solutions? Ideally without removing the valve or rim tape.

    Nope. Take it all off and see whats going on. Sounds like something is amiss. Are you sure the leak is from within the tyre around the valve, not the valve itself leaking?
    WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
    Find me on Strava
  • staffo
    staffo Posts: 82
    drlodge wrote:
    Gavinus wrote:
    Does anyone have any possible solutions? Ideally without removing the valve or rim tape.

    Nope. Take it all off and see whats going on. Sounds like something is amiss. Are you sure the leak is from within the tyre around the valve, not the valve itself leaking?

    This. Leaks that appear to be coming from the valve are often caused by a hole in the rim tape.

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