Tour de France Stage 5 Ypres-Arenberg *Spoiler*

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Comments

  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    dsoutar wrote:
    frenchfighter wrote:
    Lets get some perspective here...the gaps are quite large but to take back a minute or three over the next two weeks is more than manageable.

    Think of it like a mountain stage in terms of differences...if it happened then you wouldn't write them off.

    Ask yourself whether you thought Contador would beat the others in this race by 2-4 mins at the beginning of the Tour...im sure many would say yes.

    If Contador is anything like he has been all year so far he will dominate everyone. Dominate. From everything I can tell he is even better than earlier this year.

    Take a look at the profiles to come. Many opportunities for 30 odd secs a clip and a few opportunities for carnage.

    Astana are good but 100% they are not going to boss the hell out of the mountains.

    You can be sure that if Contador is still not in yellow by the 2nd to last mountain stage he will attack from multi mountains out.

    Lets not forget that based on past performances, of which there are many, Contador will beat Nibali quite well in the TT.

    All valid points, however you missed out Nibali's far superior descending which will counteract attacking from several mountains out
    Untill he crashes. Which he does. More than most.

    He's totally fearless which works great but you crash more.
    _
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    Joelsim wrote:
    He ended up Ytting on his ars* in a field

    OK add Joel to the list for best post of the Tour.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • Turfle
    Turfle Posts: 3,762
    Above The Cows wrote:
    Turfle wrote:
    What a weird day for Belkin; win the stage, but sacrifice Mollema. Worth it? Probably.

    Especially when Belkin are looking for a new sponsor and this is as FJS points out the first Dutch win for 9 years!

    Support Mollema for a possible top 10 or go for broke for a stage win in a stage designed to get the media all excited?

    Yeah, getting the win made it worthwhile. If Boom had come 2nd or 3rd I think my view would be different.

    I forgot to say what an awesome performance from Boom. He was a level above everyone else today.
  • dolan_driver
    dolan_driver Posts: 831
    “It’s a tough day. I never like to see a great racer go down but Chris will be back. Today has showed how hard it is to win the Tour de France, but the team will have prepared for this and they’ll deal with it.”

    Quote from Bradley Wiggins.
  • ocdupalais
    ocdupalais Posts: 4,317
    Above The Cows wrote:
    mfin wrote:
    RichN95 wrote:
    mfin wrote:
    I don't like Froome either, probably because I can imagine him appearing on songs of praise.
    Are you Travis Tygart?

    (Apparently the think that most appalled him about Armstrong was that he was an atheist)

    Really? Didn't know that. It's a bit different in the USA isn't it! :shock: ...what I meant is that he's dull as a person, he's like a less charismatic Aled Jones to me. I think grannies would like Chris Froome.

    I don't think Aled Jones would feed life bunnies stolen from the kindergarten to a snake... But having said that he did let his snowman melt so maybe you're on to something.

    Having spent a week working in close proximity to Aled Jones, I can assure you that while he can charm the church coffee group of old dears, his "off the clock" humour is pure filth. Crying with laughter over an episode of Roger Mellie and a pint with him is one of the more surreal moments of my working life.
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    FJS wrote:
    Good day for the first Dutch stage win in 9 (!!!!!) years, by the way


    Now let's win the f*cking football

    I can't watch it. Too much drama for one day for me, my nerves won't cope.

    Although I have an added incentive for an Oranje victory, my very loud Argentinian neighbours.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • ocdupalais
    ocdupalais Posts: 4,317
    What odds on Nibali having a crack at some cobbled classics next year? He rode them roads like beauty today...
  • mfin
    mfin Posts: 6,729
    dsoutar wrote:
    All valid points, however you missed out Nibali's far superior descending which will counteract attacking from several mountains out

    Nibali is a good descender but he earned that reputation mostly on one display of it, he doesn't gain time every time he goes downhill.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Above The Cows wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    FJS wrote:
    Good day for the first Dutch stage win in 9 (!!!!!) years, by the way


    Now let's win the f*cking football

    I can't watch it. Too much drama for one day for me, my nerves won't cope.

    Although I have an added incentive for an Oranje victory, my very loud Argentinian neighbours.

    F*ck'em
    _
  • type:epyt
    type:epyt Posts: 766
    Above The Cows wrote:
    type:epyt wrote:
    The only thing I could think when Boom crossed the line was 'Belkin (the sponsor) don't deserve this'.

    Well quite. Maybe it was a ride for a sponsor?

    Belkin are a strong group of riders who are usually always visible in the breaks/attacks that matter. They're not as good at winning as OPQS but have that same 'racing' mentality. I hope they get a sponsor before the team gets broken up too much because they seem a reasonably harmonious bunch (compared to say Giant who always look like they are working rather than racing).
    Life is unfair, kill yourself or get over it.
  • joelsim
    joelsim Posts: 7,552
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:
    FJS wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:
    Looks like Mollema is out of it now. I'll be surprised if he finishes better than about 8th.
    Out of it??? He lost 40 seconds on most of the other contenders for 3rd podium place, a full 16 seconds behind the Van Garderen/Valverde group. The mountains haven't even started. Apart from Nibs and Kwia the gaps were tiny in the end

    I just can't see him troubling the best climbers. He's a good climber but not a great climber. I hold Mollema in the same regard as someone like Uran. Good but never going to be a great in a GT.

    Can TT better than most.

    Hmmm, the jury is out on that one to my mind.
  • Jez mon
    Jez mon Posts: 3,809
    Joelsim wrote:
    FJS wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:
    Looks like Mollema is out of it now. I'll be surprised if he finishes better than about 8th.
    Out of it??? He lost 40 seconds on most of the other contenders for 3rd podium place, a full 16 seconds behind the Van Garderen/Valverde group. The mountains haven't even started. Apart from Nibs and Kwia the gaps were tiny in the end

    I just can't see him troubling the best climbers. He's a good climber but not a great climber. I hold Mollema in the same regard as someone like Uran. Good but never going to be a great in a GT.



    Does second place not count as being great in a GT?
    You live and learn. At any rate, you live
  • Turfle
    Turfle Posts: 3,762
    A Nibali that doesn't need to attack and take time is a different animal too. If Fuglsang and Westra are stronger than Cancellara on the cobbles, god knows how strong they're going to be in the mountains.
  • mfin
    mfin Posts: 6,729
    Don't worry Holland will win/lose easily at 5-1 (don't quote me on that) :)
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    mfin wrote:

    Really? Didn't know that. It's a bit different in the USA isn't it! :shock: ...what I meant is that he's dull as a person, he's like a less charismatic Aled Jones to me. I think grannies would like Chris Froome.

    The few folks I know who've met Froome say he's not dull in person.

    My perception of him changed after reading the book but it's hard to tell what someone is actually like via the media, or what you see on telly.
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • The_Boy
    The_Boy Posts: 3,099
    iainf72 wrote:
    Just had a look at Digger.

    Christ, he really need some help.
    Froome staged the crash to avoid a doping control?
    Team My Man 2018: David gaudu, Pierre Latour, Romain Bardet, Thibaut pinot, Alexandre Geniez, Florian Senechal, Warren Barguil, Benoit Cosnefroy
  • mfin
    mfin Posts: 6,729
    Joel, do you do kid's parties?
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Joelsim wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:
    FJS wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:
    Looks like Mollema is out of it now. I'll be surprised if he finishes better than about 8th.
    Out of it??? He lost 40 seconds on most of the other contenders for 3rd podium place, a full 16 seconds behind the Van Garderen/Valverde group. The mountains haven't even started. Apart from Nibs and Kwia the gaps were tiny in the end

    I just can't see him troubling the best climbers. He's a good climber but not a great climber. I hold Mollema in the same regard as someone like Uran. Good but never going to be a great in a GT.

    Can TT better than most.

    Hmmm, the jury is out on that one to my mind.

    It's not. You just don't know his TT record.
    _
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Above The Cows wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    FJS wrote:
    Good day for the first Dutch stage win in 9 (!!!!!) years, by the way


    Now let's win the f*cking football

    I can't watch it. Too much drama for one day for me, my nerves won't cope.

    Although I have an added incentive for an Oranje victory, my very loud Argentinian neighbours.

    F*ck'em

    They had a party after the quarter final victory until 4 in the goddam morning. It made me want to run into the garden and proclaim undying British sovereignty over the Falklands.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • Turfle
    Turfle Posts: 3,762
    The_Boy wrote:
    iainf72 wrote:
    Just had a look at Digger.

    Christ, he really need some help.
    Froome staged the crash to avoid a doping control?

    I haven't seen Digger's posts, but there were twitter suggestions that he's hiding from the new aicar test. But then people are mental.
  • mm1
    mm1 Posts: 1,063
    OCDuPalais wrote:
    What odds on Nibali having a crack at some cobbled classics next year? He rode them roads like beauty today...

    Don't know, he has complained (for example at San Remo this year) about others unwillingness to race in one day races. Clearly excellent at the end of a selective day (e.g. Sunday and today), but these aren't guranteed in the classics. One thing I really miss from the 80s is Giro and Tour contenders riding the classics to win. Fond memories of Kelly complementing Lemond for his courage and fighting spirit - it would be great to see the current generation take this on again, but I suspect that the stakes are too high for many GT riders to risk their season for a classic win
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Turfle wrote:
    The_Boy wrote:
    iainf72 wrote:
    Just had a look at Digger.

    Christ, he really need some help.
    Froome staged the crash to avoid a doping control?

    I haven't seen Digger's posts, but there were twitter suggestions that he's hiding from the new aicar test. But then people are mental.

    Seems to be obsessed with Froome as the embodiment all all evil on 2 wheels with pedals.
    _
  • joelsim
    joelsim Posts: 7,552
    mfin wrote:
    Joel, do you do kid's parties?

    Did a Dr Who party last Sunday as it happens.
  • mm1
    mm1 Posts: 1,063
    Turfle wrote:
    The_Boy wrote:
    iainf72 wrote:
    Just had a look at Digger.

    Christ, he really need some help.
    Froome staged the crash to avoid a doping control?

    Really? I saw the snarky one about Froom having learned to ride from Julich. Nuts, nuts, nuts.
  • joelsim
    joelsim Posts: 7,552
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:
    FJS wrote:
    Joelsim wrote:
    Looks like Mollema is out of it now. I'll be surprised if he finishes better than about 8th.
    Out of it??? He lost 40 seconds on most of the other contenders for 3rd podium place, a full 16 seconds behind the Van Garderen/Valverde group. The mountains haven't even started. Apart from Nibs and Kwia the gaps were tiny in the end

    I just can't see him troubling the best climbers. He's a good climber but not a great climber. I hold Mollema in the same regard as someone like Uran. Good but never going to be a great in a GT.

    Can TT better than most.

    Hmmm, the jury is out on that one to my mind.

    It's not. You just don't know his TT record.

    I do.

    Which is why I think he is just ok. He is never going to gain time on his GC rivals in a TT. He may limit his losses by being a decent TTer, but that is it. Yes he will beat the majority, but the majority only ride TTs at 90% unless they are a specialist or they are up top. Mollema is usually up top but he still loses time against the majority of his main GC rivals.
  • TMR
    TMR Posts: 3,986
    If SKY are now riding for Porte, what do you think his chances are for GC? I think top 10, but not top 5.
  • joelsim
    joelsim Posts: 7,552
    TMR wrote:
    If SKY are now riding for Porte, what do you think his chances are for GC? I think top 10, but not top 5.

    +1
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,253
    Joelsim wrote:
    Which is why I think he is just ok. He is never going to gain time on his GC rivals in a TT. He may limit his losses by being a decent TTer, but that is it. Yes he will beat the majority, but the majority only ride TTs at 90% unless they are a specialist or they are up top. Mollema is usually up top but he still loses time against the majority of his main GC rivals.
    Barring injury/illness, Mollema will finish ahead of Kwiatkowski in this Tour.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    If I knew you in person I'd slap £50 right now on Mollema gaining more time in the TT on the eventual top 10 on GC than he loses.
    _
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    Mollema's pretty consistent and a tough old fighter. Kwiatkowski as much as I think he's awesome, has yet to show that kind of consistency over 3 weeks.
    Correlation is not causation.

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