The Scott CR1 SL Thread

patrickf

itboffin wrote:

God I love my scott, I think it needs to be upgraded though, i'm really not enjoying Shimano 105 5700 groupset, its pants.

I might even SRAM it ................... :roll:

Do it

I love SRAM Force on mine. Just not the chain or cassette - they're pants.

itboffin

I only use KMC chains but love the SRAM cassettes i have

frazered

105 5800 11spd gruppo will be awesome if you can wait

tincaman

Just replaced my worn out RS80's with Campag Zondas. Feels about the same. The 25mm GP4000's now measure 27mm wide so clearance is s bit tight.

fat_tail

patrickf wrote:

fat_tail wrote:

patrickf wrote:

fat_tail wrote:

no - it is labelled press fit 41.0 and 15 mm... at least these boxes are checked...

PRD 12153/09099

Well press fit is correct - that'll be the semi integrated (or zero stack) version. 41mm is the bearing size, which also appears to be correct.

now that I have a brand new headset I am tempted to install it... except I will need to get a press fit tool and headset removal tool !

If it's the same as the one you have already then keep the cups that are already in there. Not only do you need to press in the new cups but you also need to knock out the old ones. I also don't think normal headset remover springs work here, so you'll have to tap them out with a screwdriver or similar.

Sadly the cups are not the same. Also the old bearings were not cartridge - I can actually see the bearings balls. Looks like a visit to my local Lbs tomorrow.

markhewitt1978

6700 is way better than 5700 not sure why people rate 105 so highly I wasn't impressed with it.

If you can afford it go 6800 heard nothing but good things.

markhewitt1978

tincaman wrote:

Just replaced my worn out RS80's with Campag Zondas. Feels about the same. The 25mm GP4000's now measure 27mm wide so clearance is s bit tight.

So the Zonda is a wider rim?

I've been of the feeling that RS80 is at the bend of the dimishing returns graph as in you can get better but only if you spend a lot more.

daniel_b

Gents,

we are finally getting around to building our 2 CR1's - my gf's Contessa first, and then my SL.

We've started assembling this morning, and have put the cups into the headset, but are struggling with installing the crown race (?) onto the forks.
I am using some plastic pipe and a rubber mallet - so am debating either purchasing a proper fitting tool or to take it to the LBS - this is as far as we have got:


I am loathe to start trying to tap it down with a screwdriver, as am worried about damaging it.

I do have another one to fit, so if it is a proper tool I need and that will enable me to fit it, that would seem to make more sense that a trip to the LBS - opinions appreciated!

meanredspider

This is pretty common TBH. It needs to be tight else it will move and fret. If the tube you have is long enough, put one end against the race and tap the other end on the floor (moving the tube and the fork together). Being tight, it needs to stay very square. You're right not to use a screwdriver (they're for putting screws in ;-)

daniel_b

Thanks for the reply MRS - just tried than ingenious idea (Why did that not occur to me?!) and gave it a good 20 or so thwacks upside down, all be it on a carpeted floor, but could not see any progress :-(

Am hoping it is not too small and could perhaps now be jammed on, but I would think unlikely, as it came with the frame.

I have seen this well reviewed tool on Wiggle that looks tempting:
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/lifeline-crown-race-setting-tool/?lang=en&curr=GBP&dest=1&utm_source=pla&utm_medium=base&utm_campaign=uk&kpid=5360510137


That 'should' do the job if the crown race is correct?

Should i have greased the steerer at all......?

meanredspider

Mine was very tight and I wondered if I might be in trouble but persevered.

Carpeted floor isn't ideal - kitchen tiled floor or concrete garage floor would be better as plastic pipe already "gives" quite a bit. A bit of lube (Vaseline might be best) won't hurt.

daniel_b

Thanks MRS, will give it another go - fyi my digital callipers tell me that the width of the steerer is 29.4mm above where the crown race current is, and right at the bottom it is 30.0, so a full 0.6mm wider :shock:

daniel_b

Just went and chopped my piece of plastic pipe down so it's only about an inch longer than the steerer tube, and knocked it upside down on the concrete garage floor, progressively harder and harder, and while it has moved a bit, I don't feel like I can give it any more beans without breaking something.
It's about 4mm off, think it was about 6 in the pic.

There is also a possibility that the steerer tube is slightly wider right down at the base, than the plastic pipe - it does feel feel pretty tight once it gets down that far.

So I have ordered the part I linked to up above, and if that does not make the difference, I will try it on the other SL forks, and if neither are manageable I will take both down the LBS and chuck some cash at them
When the tool arrives, I don't have access to a vice or suitable clamp, so assume I would be best to try the same upside down method on the concrete floor?
I do have a friend with a vice some 5 miles away, so I could pay him a visit if it was crucial.

I am almost certainly missing something, but I can't see why they bother to make it quite this difficult to fit this part - it's not like it can go anywhere once it is pulled tight, and the stem is clamped on top.....

Disappointed to be honest, was hoping to get both bikes well underway, but the Contessa is hogging the space in the bike stand until we can get the forks and front wheel on.
Still it's been over a year, so a few days won't make much difference

Does anyone bother with one of these remover tools?

meanredspider

I'd continue with the same approach with the crown race fitting tool too - but protect it from the floor with a thin sheet of wood or something. You could add a bit of very hot water from a kettle on the race to expand it slightly too. It's really important the race is square to the steerer.

itboffin

LBS mate its just not worth the time and effort

rolf_f

itboffin wrote:

LBS mate its just not worth the time and effort

Plus 1. I took mine to a very experienced local frame builder (Chris Marshall in Keighley) and even he commented that fitting the crown race was a bit of a job.

I like to do all my own maintenance as much as possible but I can't see a great need to develop skills in fitting crown races to Scott steerer tubes........

itboffin

Just cleaned the Scott after yesterdays pootle around the local counties 128 miles and not one issue 8)

fat_tail

Rolf F wrote:

itboffin wrote:

LBS mate its just not worth the time and effort

Plus 1. I took mine to a very experienced local frame builder (Chris Marshall in Keighley) and even he commented that fitting the crown race was a bit of a job.

I like to do all my own maintenance as much as possible but I can't see a great need to develop skills in fitting crown races to Scott steerer tubes........

My attempt at changing the headset on my Scott CR1 has been highly educational. I ordered what I thought were the correct replacement bearings from Wiggle and they sent me the complete headset. Of course, it turned out that the bearings from the new headset wouldn't fit into the cups in the old headset. So, I took the frame with new headset to one of my LBS. The mechanic replaced the headset but neglected to tell me that I needed to get the crown race off the steerer. So went back home and tried to install the steerer and it wouldn't fit flush. So I stupidly assumed that the crown race in the new headset was too small and needed a bigger one and went off to another LBS who kindly informed me that I needed to get the old crown race off the steerer. The steerer is now with them together with the new crown race. I am hoping to get it back this evening.

The good news is that I now will have a much better headset with integrated bearings but the bad news is that it might end up costing me a lot more than I anticipated.

Lefthook

itboffin wrote:

Just cleaned the Scott after yesterdays pootle around the local counties 128 miles and not one issue 8)

Well that made 2 CR1's making it round the EPIC route. And agree about 105. Not been impressed with it to be honest. Glad you made it round despite the recent injury!

pollys_bott

Daniel B wrote:

There is also a possibility that the steerer tube is slightly wider right down at the base, than the plastic pipe - it does feel feel pretty tight once it gets down that far.

Mine was, it visibly flared slightly as it met the top of the fork; thus my crown race is a couple of mm off the top of the fork - not sure if that's right or ideal but it sure isn't going to go any lower...

itboffin wrote:

God I love my scott, I think it needs to be upgraded though, i'm really not enjoying Shimano 105 5700 groupset, its pants.

I might even SRAM it ................... :roll:

Ultegra shifting isn't the best either - I quite fancy this... http://www.merlincycles.com/sram-force- ... 64161.html Would take mine down to about 7kg, but I have a TT frame waiting to be built up as well, so...

itboffin

I've noticed it before but yesterday whilst riding a lot of that hard packed stone road surface they now pass for tarmac my Scott was bouncing a lot, i know wheelset and tyres also contribute to ride smoothness but i have to say the Scott is a harsh ride compared with my Alu Trek or Ribble carbon.

patrickf

My CR1 SL made Tour de Yorkshire's 120 miles yesterday without a problem.

I'd agree, it's not massively forgiving of poor road surfaces but I was as comfy as I'd expect to be. And my god, this bike loves to climb!

It looks an absolute disgrace now though after a very wet start!

fat_tail

finally re-assembled the fork with new headset. except that the cover nut that came with the new headset has a star nut which doesn't fit into the top of the old steerer. I am forced to use the old cover nut. Hope this is ok.

patrickf

fat_tail wrote:

finally re-assembled the fork with new headset. except that the cover nut that came with the new headset has a star nut which doesn't fit into the top of the old steerer. I am forced to use the old cover nut. Hope this is ok.

If by cover nut you mean the expander bung and/or top cap then yes, no problem. I'm using the original ones instead of the Hope Hed Doctor that came with my headset. The original bung sits flush to the top whereas the hed doctor needs to sit a centimetre in the steerer.

daniel_b

A question on the expander bung thingamy.

I don't yet know how much steerer I will leave above the headtube, so plan to leave it at the maximum I can, and then cut it down once I have decided (By putting spacers on top) where I want the bars.

I assume that once I fit the expander for maximum length, I will then be able to loosen and reposition it further down the steerer tube once i decide where to cut it?

Sorry if that is a dumb question, just wasn't sure if it was a one shot deal with the expanders.

fat_tail

patrickf wrote:

fat_tail wrote:

finally re-assembled the fork with new headset. except that the cover nut that came with the new headset has a star nut which doesn't fit into the top of the old steerer. I am forced to use the old cover nut. Hope this is ok.

If by cover nut you mean the expander bung and/or top cap then yes, no problem. I'm using the original ones instead of the Hope Hed Doctor that came with my headset. The original bung sits flush to the top whereas the hed doctor needs to sit a centimetre in the steerer.

that's the sucker. For what it is worth the Ritchey WCS Zero Press Fit is a good replacement headset for the Scott. Test ride tomorrow

patrickf

fat_tail wrote:

patrickf wrote:

fat_tail wrote:

finally re-assembled the fork with new headset. except that the cover nut that came with the new headset has a star nut which doesn't fit into the top of the old steerer. I am forced to use the old cover nut. Hope this is ok.

If by cover nut you mean the expander bung and/or top cap then yes, no problem. I'm using the original ones instead of the Hope Hed Doctor that came with my headset. The original bung sits flush to the top whereas the hed doctor needs to sit a centimetre in the steerer.

that's the sucker. For what it is worth the Ritchey WCS Zero Press Fit is a good replacement headset for the Scott. Test ride tomorrow

That's the headset that came with my frame! What did you have originally?

patrickf

Daniel B wrote:

A question on the expander bung thingamy.

I don't yet know how much steerer I will leave above the headtube, so plan to leave it at the maximum I can, and then cut it down once I have decided (By putting spacers on top) where I want the bars.

I assume that once I fit the expander for maximum length, I will then be able to loosen and reposition it further down the steerer tube once i decide where to cut it?

Sorry if that is a dumb question, just wasn't sure if it was a one shot deal with the expanders.

Yes you can remove it again. It's a bit of a pain, but it does come out. Unscrew it a bit (not too much though!) and tap it down. That should loosen it.

fat_tail

patrickf wrote:

fat_tail wrote:

patrickf wrote:

fat_tail wrote:

finally re-assembled the fork with new headset. except that the cover nut that came with the new headset has a star nut which doesn't fit into the top of the old steerer. I am forced to use the old cover nut. Hope this is ok.

If by cover nut you mean the expander bung and/or top cap then yes, no problem. I'm using the original ones instead of the Hope Hed Doctor that came with my headset. The original bung sits flush to the top whereas the hed doctor needs to sit a centimetre in the steerer.

that's the sucker. For what it is worth the Ritchey WCS Zero Press Fit is a good replacement headset for the Scott. Test ride tomorrow

That's the headset that came with my frame! What did you have originally?

some Ritchey thing with bearings in a retainer.

Well the new headset is a beauty. It is funny how you get used to worn parts and accept them and then you put in a new component and the bike feels completely different. Thanks for your help with this btw. If you hadn't "encouraged" me I would still be riding with the old headset.

daniel_b

fat_tail wrote:

Well the new headset is a beauty. It is funny how you get used to worn parts and accept them and then you put in a new component and the bike feels completely different. Thanks for your help with this btw. If you hadn't "encouraged" me I would still be riding with the old headset.

Is this of the same ilk as the headset you have just bought?
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/ritchey-wcs-carbon-3k-press-fit-headset/?lang=en&curr=GBP&dest=1&utm_source=pla&utm_medium=base&utm_campaign=uk&kpid=5360284578
I am just about to build mine, so was curious why you had issues with your stock headset, and how much of an improvement your replacement has made - is it that much smoother - did the original one start out fine and then deteriorate?