Sagan's antics and podium girls
Comments
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The sexual deviancy was brought up as a result of mididoctors frankly laughable summation of the situation in agreeing with you. And there is nothing to 'get'. Once the demographic of cycling viewing changes then the customs that surround it will change. And if a 30 second segment of a six hour event showing a couple of pretty girls is alienating then you need to grow some thicker skin.No tA Doctor wrote:Slim Boy Fat wrote:
Which is your right and your fully entitled to it. However, when its not illegal and the women involved are doing it of their own free will why should they take your opinion into account? I could take them or leave them, wouldn't miss them if they weren't there but they are and I think ' she's a pretty lady', a bit like I do if I pass one on the street. No harm in it, all this talk of sexual deviancy for finding women attractive is laughable.No tA Doctor wrote:Slim Boy Fat wrote:
So your four options are out, however, a couple of pretty women in nice dresses giving the winner a peck on the cheek can't surely be sexist or objectionable? Especially if they are fully ok with it?No tA Doctor wrote:Slim Boy Fat wrote:
Surely the answer is, as long as its legal, appropriate to the audience and the women have no problem with it then its ok?No tA Doctor wrote:For those defending having podiums girls, at what point would it become sexist or objectionable?
1) Podium girls clad only in lingerie
2) Topless podium girls
3) Full frontal nude podium girls
4) Nude podium girls performing sex acts on the winner
Their only purpose is to provide a little titillation to male fans, they have no connection with cycling. The only question is how far you think they should go to provide that.
The audience is anyone with access to a TV or a computer.
Well why don't we have a men-only podium presentation afterwards then, where we can hire some strippers?
Using "pretty women" as eye-candy is sexist, and I find it objectionable.
And if the target audience was a bunch of twenty something women I'm sure we would have a men only podium
You're close to getting it now, if we throw away the straw man of "sexual deviancy", I'm not sure where you dragged that up from. Putting "pretty women" on the podium underlines that cycling is a sport for blokes that women shouldn't worry their pretty little heads about. It's antiquated and alienating for women and girls. You can't see Vos winning the Women's Ronde, but hey, there's some pretty chicks kissing Spartacus...0 -
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Slim Boy Fat wrote:The sexual deviancy was brought up as a result of mididoctors frankly laughable summation of the situation in agreeing with you. And there is nothing to 'get'. Once the demographic of cycling viewing changes then the customs that surround it will change. And if a 30 second segment of a six hour event showing a couple of pretty girls is alienating then you need to grow some thicker skin.
if its only 30 secs then why not lose it to encourage the changing demographic
you see the contradiction.... if its something you have to grow thick skin too and too be honest a lot of us [male and female] have had to wear all along anyway..... isn't it really the turn of those in favour of the podium honeys to get thicker skin and sacrifice 30 secs of titillation.
If it is so small a thing how difficult can it be to say.."ok this stuff is out because some people object to it".
or is the entire race ruined if there is no podium girl at the end?"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0 -
because if the race is ruined for some by the lack of podium girl you really do need to get a life"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0
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Roll on Paris Roubaix
It was a turd of a race where nothing interesting happened, so there's a storm in a tea cup over a stupid incident on the podium.
As for being assaulted, was I assaulted today when someone called me a w*nker in the queue in Tescos?
Motor racing has podium girls, grid girls, that's not an outdated sport is it? Again, should we run De Ronde on dual carriageways as all this cobbled roads and hills is a bit outdated isn't it?
This thread has made me angry at the way some people see the world, and I'm surprised they don't bump into walls due to the blinkers they're wearing0 -
If I post a wee joke am I allowed to then continue with the serious discussion?“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0
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At least Chris Boardman now knows what the 2nd step on the podium is for.
I'll see myself out. :roll:“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
Because if we got rid of stuff 'because some people object to it' what would we be left with? We'd have no racing for a start because some people object to roads being closed so they can take place. Surely the most important thing in all of this is what the women themselves think?mididoctors wrote:Slim Boy Fat wrote:The sexual deviancy was brought up as a result of mididoctors frankly laughable summation of the situation in agreeing with you. And there is nothing to 'get'. Once the demographic of cycling viewing changes then the customs that surround it will change. And if a 30 second segment of a six hour event showing a couple of pretty girls is alienating then you need to grow some thicker skin.
if its only 30 secs then why not lose it to encourage the changing demographic
you see the contradiction.... if its something you have to grow thick skin too and too be honest a lot of us [male and female] have had to wear all along anyway..... isn't it really the turn of those in favour of the podium honeys to get thicker skin and sacrifice 30 secs of titillation.
If it is so small a thing how difficult can it be to say.."ok this stuff is out because some people object to it".
or is the entire race ruined if there is no podium girl at the end?
And like I said, I could take them or leave them, no thick skin required because they add nothing to the racing for me, in fact I rarely watch the podium, once the riders cross the line I'm usually looking for something else to do, but I also think they are completely harmless. They are earning a living off the back of their good looks, just like anybody uses what they have to earn theirs, who are you or I to take that away from them? As long as they don't feel, harassed, exploited or assaulted then we should allow them to make a living.0 -
Slim Boy Fat wrote:who are you or I to take that away from them?
who else.... this point is no point
you can argue pro or against a position but ATEOTD there are only people left to past judgement on what is permissable or desirable. we do that all the time
you are saying its harmless yet point out the viewer demographic has some relationship to the existence of the role.
therefore there is an issue to be addressed...otherwise why enter the thread?
its a paradox isn't it and really points to a much deeper complexity"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0 -
mididoctors, your general writing style is very odd. It is almost impossible to understand what you are saying even if I read it several times.Contador is the Greatest0
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The podium girls have only come about as a result of that demographic. The demographic is not as a result of the podium girls. You would have a much stronger argument if that was the case.mididoctors wrote:Slim Boy Fat wrote:who are you or I to take that away from them?
who else.... this point is no point
you can argue pro or against a position but ATEOTD there are only people left to past judgement on what is permissable or desirable. we do that all the time
you are saying its harmless yet point out the viewer demographic has some relationship to the existence of the role.
therefore there is an issue to be addressed...otherwise why enter the thread?
its a paradox isn't it and really points to a much deeper complexity0 -
It is true that for most of us mortals grabbing a woman's ass like that would get us fired. It probably got Sagan her phone number! Sagan's lucky he's not old enough to be classed as an old perv.
I remember Armstrong did his 2nd Tour de France one year where he allegedly went and did some of the podium girls he'd met during the tour. Some of the podium girls who've been interviewed openly admit it is a chance to cop off with top athletes or other powerful figures.BASI Nordic Ski Instructor
Instagramme0 -
I reckon he could still be classed as a young perv though. What Sagan and the podium girls get upto is their own business but he shouldn't be grabbing her backside on the podium.davidof wrote:It is true that for most of us mortals grabbing a woman's ass like that would get us fired. It probably got Sagan her phone number! Sagan's lucky he's not old enough to be classed as an old perv.
I remember Armstrong did his 2nd Tour de France one year where he allegedly went and did some of the podium girls he'd met during the tour. Some of the podium girls who've been interviewed openly admit it is a chance to cop off with top athletes or other powerful figures.0 -
Slim Boy Fat wrote:
The podium girls have only come about as a result of that demographic. The demographic is not as a result of the podium girls. You would have a much stronger argument if that was the case.mididoctors wrote:Slim Boy Fat wrote:who are you or I to take that away from them?
who else.... this point is no point
you can argue pro or against a position but ATEOTD there are only people left to past judgement on what is permissable or desirable. we do that all the time
you are saying its harmless yet point out the viewer demographic has some relationship to the existence of the role.
therefore there is an issue to be addressed...otherwise why enter the thread?
its a paradox isn't it and really points to a much deeper complexity
makes no odds unless you are suggesting no effort is required to change the demographic?
and if your argument really is it will change when the demographic changes first what sort of indicator would you expect to see?
the sorts or positions you see posted on this thread perhaps
so what is the problem again?"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0 -
I remember before the Giro d’Italia started in Holland in 2010, a member of Amsterdam’s Green Party said that podium girls were old-fashioned and sexist, and in a modern and tolerant society like the Netherlands it would be fitting to have ‘podium men’, including ones who were just as prepared as podium girls to kiss the winners of the prologue and the 2 stages which took place in the Netherlands that year. He wasn’t joking.No tA Doctor wrote:Well why don't we have a men-only podium presentation afterwards then, where we can hire some strippers?
Wiggins won the prologue and Evans and Vino the stages. Pity the idea wasn’t tried out on them three to see how (a) they and (b) the public reacted. If then generally adopted, it might have detered Sagan yesterday.0 -
is anyone else shocked by this picture? Personally I cant believe what I'm seeing
is that a Suzuki Baleno?Crafted in Italy apparantly0 -
^That is appalling and I have refrained from posting it before now. You should link it rather than post it up as there are many people that would not want to see it. I am hoping it is photoshopped...
Fabian retweeted this...
_Anne_Loes Anne Loes Uding 2h
@Vannieuwkerke wat dacht u van deze dan?
Fabian kijkt er niet heel blij bij. pic.twitter.com/NjLwexzzet
Contador is the Greatest0 -
there is no podium hotties at the olympics or biathlon or a rake of other sports.
Would it be fair to say the girls turn up at sports with a heavy commercial presence. sponsored trade teams, motor racing, road cycling, some extreme sports?"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0 -
frenchfighter wrote:^That is appalling and I have refrained from posting it before now. You should link it rather than post it up as there are many people that would not want to see it. I am hoping it is photoshopped...
Are you sure you really work in investment banking FF? That would be lightweight on any trading floor I've ever worked on.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
And he's driven to the wrong side of the petrol pump. Schoolboy error.acidstrato wrote:
is that a Suzuki Baleno?Twitter: @RichN950 -
mididoctors wrote:Would it be fair to say the girls turn up at sports with a heavy commercial presence. sponsored trade teams, motor racing, road cycling, some extreme sports?
I'd ask my neighbour - He drives trucks for the Moto GP circuit but I think he'd only be able to offer that he really likes having his photo taken with hot girls in tiny shorts.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
There were plenty of good looking women at the 2012 medal ceremonies. In fact their makeup was designed and sponsored by Max Factor. Did they alienate women as well?mididoctors wrote:there is no podium hotties at the olympics or biathlon or a rake of other sports.
Would it be fair to say the girls turn up at sports with a heavy commercial presence. sponsored trade teams, motor racing, road cycling, some extreme sports?0 -
iainf72 wrote:frenchfighter wrote:^That is appalling and I have refrained from posting it before now. You should link it rather than post it up as there are many people that would not want to see it. I am hoping it is photoshopped...
Are you sure you really work in investment banking FF? That would be lightweight on any trading floor I've ever worked on.
Why would I want to work for an IB? I work for a prop trading house.
That part of trading stereotypes is simply not true in the majority of places. The days of big swinging neanderthals is long gone.Contador is the Greatest0 -
RichN95 wrote:
And he's driven to the wrong side of the petrol pump. Schoolboy error.acidstrato wrote:
is that a Suzuki Baleno?
Oh very funny Rich. Here is a gold star
Contador is the Greatest0 -
frenchfighter wrote:
That part of trading stereotypes is simply not true in the majority of places. The days of big swinging neanderthals is long gone.
I know that, of course, but you still find one or two being mouthy. And prop trading is like rocking horse poop!
Anyhoo,
http://cyclocosm.tumblr.com/post/468674 ... t-said#_=_Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
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Slim Boy Fat wrote:
There were plenty of good looking women at the 2012 medal ceremonies. In fact their makeup was designed and sponsored by Max Factor. Did they alienate women as well?mididoctors wrote:there is no podium hotties at the olympics or biathlon or a rake of other sports.
Would it be fair to say the girls turn up at sports with a heavy commercial presence. sponsored trade teams, motor racing, road cycling, some extreme sports?
well it alienates me to a very small degree and I am a polyamorous sex fiend. [less these days I'm getting long in the tooth]
but you raise the interesting specter of where is the threshold. A lot of people/ women enjoy attention and feeling attractive.
its the fact its a ritualised/commercial role that is odd in my affect. It's like Iains post, why would I desire the trophy of being photographed with hot podium women in shorts as some affirmation of sporting prowess. As thou the two were the same
thats the implied message.... seems a very poor second to f****g hot women in no shorts if you ask me.
the whole thing of surrounding the event with "to the victor goes the spoils" and by association you too if you wear xxxx brand clothing/watches.
do we really want a world where we negotiate sexual relations via branding dictated by a crowd of asshats with a spare copy of hierarchy of needs?"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0 -
No tA Doctor wrote:powerbookboy wrote:No tA Doctor wrote:For those defending having podiums girls, at what point would it become sexist or objectionable?
1) Podium girls clad only in lingerie
2) Topless podium girls
3) Full frontal nude podium girls
4) Nude podium girls performing sex acts on the winner
Their only purpose is to provide a little titillation to male fans, they have no connection with cycling. The only question is how far you think they should go to provide that.
Er, I don't want to get too involved, but do you actually think men are titillated by podium girls? They're window dressing, clothes horses so the sponsers logos can be presented well and get into the newspapers. You might as well rail against dummies in shop windows giving passing members (no pun intended) of the public a jolly.
So essentially they may as well be blokes?
I'm assuming this BR thread, with nearly 300 replies and over 100K views is primarily for the discussion of sponsor's logos then? viewtopic.php?f=40002&t=12698710&p=16134674&hilit=podium+girls#p16134674
I personally wouldn't give a hoot if it was blokes. Why not? Rather kicks against the predominately hetero world, but I can't see myself getting particularly upset about a bit of Spartacus vs male model kissing.
And that thread's a bit sad, but most men like to look at pretty women, so it's not like a great surprise to find it. You'll find much much worse win short order if you'd care to look.
If essentially the argument is 'Sagan's a bit of a prick who needs a lesson in manners' I'm on your side. If it's podium girls are antiquated and naff, I'm also on your side. If it's we should ban the use of pretty women from all publicity roles as it's demeaning, then I personally don't have a huge issue with you holding that opinion, but I do think you should perhaps try to focus on some of the more obvious sexual exploitation of women that you can find on the internet. I also think you should ask the podium girls what they think about their work being taken away, however demeaning you think it is, they may hold a differing opinion.
Can I be blunt? Women's sport is always going to play 2nd fiddle to men's. Why? Because men are more likely to end up spending money to slavishly support it. Not exclusively, but predominantly. It's got sod all to do with trivial issues like whether or not dolly girls are snogging the winner at the end of the race and hence not providing good role models for young women.
You want parity and equal billing to male athletes? Get women to support their gender with their money and their support. That will provide the sort of role models that will empower a younger generation of riders.0 -
I fear we already live in a world like that but I say more fool the people who fall for that guff. I see through it and don't let it affect my choices in any way.mididoctors wrote:Slim Boy Fat wrote:
There were plenty of good looking women at the 2012 medal ceremonies. In fact their makeup was designed and sponsored by Max Factor. Did they alienate women as well?mididoctors wrote:there is no podium hotties at the olympics or biathlon or a rake of other sports.
Would it be fair to say the girls turn up at sports with a heavy commercial presence. sponsored trade teams, motor racing, road cycling, some extreme sports?
well it alienates me to a very small degree and I am a polyamorous sex fiend. [less these days I'm getting long in the tooth]
but you raise the interesting specter of where is the threshold. A lot of people/ women enjoy attention and feeling attractive.
its the fact its a ritualised/commercial role that is odd in my affect. It's like Iains post, why would I desire the trophy of being photographed with hot podium women in shorts as some affirmation of sporting prowess. As thou the two were the same
thats the implied message.... seems a very poor second to f****g hot women in no shorts if you ask me.
the whole thing of surrounding the event with "to the victor goes the spoils" and by association you too if you wear xxxx brand clothing/watches.
do we really want a world where we negotiate sexual relations via branding dictated by a crowd of asshats with a spare copy of hierarchy of needs?0 -
No tA Doctor wrote:I'm assuming this BR thread, with nearly 300 replies and over 100K views is primarily for the discussion of sponsor's logos then? viewtopic.php?f=40002&t=12698710&p=16134674&hilit=podium+girls#p16134674
That thread makes me sad.
Sad because I miss Kleber and his amazing insights.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0
