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  • Warwickshire Whizzer
    Warwickshire Whizzer Posts: 218
    Caller wrote:
    Just a quick TR question, are their training plans any good?

    I'm thinking of starting off with six week intermediate base plan then moving on to one of the others, probably the intermediate base II.

    Has anyone done them and were they any good?

    Believe there are a few people working through who can comment fully, but for my part, I'm mid way through Base 1 and have been enjoying it, though must admit I'm getting a little bored with the various Sweet Spot intervals and looking forward to some higher intensity stuff (which starts this week for me - Hurrah).

    I'm planning on following on with Base 2, and then Intermediate Build 1 and 2, finishing off with the FTP booster.

    ...And then destroying everyone next summer. :shock:
  • sunburntknees
    sunburntknees Posts: 272
    I've just finished Base 1 and just about to start on Base 2. I will test tonight to confirm this, but I think my FTP has increased by a few watts. There is probably only a small gain but this plan is just about building base and I've missed a few sessions due to social commitments and being tired. My Sunday long riding has also been sporadic of late due to the weather and other factors.

    Base 1 is mostly sweetspot workouts which can get a bit boring. You can always swap a couple for a Sufferfest video or something else if you want to spice things up. You don't have to stick to the plan religiously.

    There is also a lot of discussion on various other threads about whether SS training is of any benefit at all...but I'll leave that to the experts.

    Personally, I've been happy with the SS stuff as I've been working long hours of late and also have a long commute (not on the bike sadly), so have been tired a lot. Also, there is no point going crazy in November/December and being bored of training or exhausted come the spring.

    I'm following Base 2 now and will decide what I'm going to do after that, as I'm not entirely sure on my objectives for next year (other that destroying everyone next summer(!).
  • robklancs
    robklancs Posts: 498
    I attempted the 8 minute test yesterday and blew up in the first interval, managed to get a bit back on the second but by then the damage was done, I'm not too worried about the value of the numbers as I don't race and just using it to keep fit and motivated with something to stick to, I'm just wondering will the FTP be set at a different numver for my next workout, seeing as it was 200 for the test and I managed 156.

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/118122
  • Garryboy
    Garryboy Posts: 344
    I'm a couple of weeks into Base II, which involves a bit more work at or above FTP.

    During Base I I had been doing some additional Sufferfest sessions, but not so much with Base II as intensity is higher and therefore I'm pretty knackered!

    Did Huffaker the other night and it was v v hard, lost it on last couple of intervals;
    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/117061
    (Ignore the spkiey graph, duration was 1hr, not 1hr 30 - known bug in TR made it continue from prev ride)

    Gonna do Donner tonight, 3x12mins at 95-99% of FTP, not as attractive as it's kebab related namesake.
  • Simmotino
    Simmotino Posts: 295
    robklancs wrote:
    I attempted the 8 minute test yesterday and blew up in the first interval, managed to get a bit back on the second but by then the damage was done, I'm not too worried about the value of the numbers as I don't race and just using it to keep fit and motivated with something to stick to, I'm just wondering will the FTP be set at a different numver for my next workout, seeing as it was 200 for the test and I managed 156.

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/118122

    Your FTP will sty at 200 unless you:

    a) accepted the proposed change TrainerRoad will have offered you at the end of that test, or

    b) manually changed it in your profile.

    Looking at your current profile on TrainerRoad, the answer must be yes to one of those, as your FTP is currently set to 152.
  • wardieboy
    wardieboy Posts: 230
    robklancs wrote:
    I attempted the 8 minute test yesterday and blew up in the first interval, managed to get a bit back on the second but by then the damage was done, I'm not too worried about the value of the numbers as I don't race and just using it to keep fit and motivated with something to stick to, I'm just wondering will the FTP be set at a different numver for my next workout, seeing as it was 200 for the test and I managed 156.

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/118122

    You should be able to check on your profile if the setting has changed to 156, if it hasn't you can change it manually.

    I wouldn't get too hung up on the numbers. The first time I attempted the FTP test at 200 I blew up early into the session. My turbo has a knackered resistance cable (I have to push the resistance changer against the corner of a wall to get it to budge and then tape it into position). Therefore I'm not convinced my numbers are anyway near accurate. I have left the trainer at a set resistance and retested with the base wattage lowered to 150, ended the test with 164 suggestion.

    The numbers do appear consistent though from workout to workout, it would be nice to have a more accurate reading, but I suppose in the end that would only be another number to use as a yardstick to measure personal improvement.

    I am due a retest tonight after completing base 1 and feel confident I have increased my FTP.
  • robklancs
    robklancs Posts: 498
    Simmotin, i said yes to change it when it proposed I should so i loaded my next session and it has changed the set ftp for the session.

    Wardiboy,,,,, you don't happen to have a tacx Sirius by any chance do you. Mine is exactly the same so I leave it at level 5 .

    Yes sorry I said it was 156, it is in fact 152!
  • wardieboy
    wardieboy Posts: 230
    It's a Tacx Cycletrack but has the same brake and cable as the Sirius. I've seen that you can buy replacement cables but have no idea on how tricky it is to fit them. I suspect the cable was trodden on near the brake unit which has caused the issue.

    I've posted the question re fixing it a few times on the boards and the closest I came to any advice was a guy saying he'd fixed his but couldn't remember how!!??!!

    I am tempted to upgrade to a rock and roll, not only for better readings and road feel but also comfort. 3 - 4 hours a week on the turbo is starting to nag my arse crackers a tad
  • springtide9
    springtide9 Posts: 1,731
    wardieboy wrote:
    ..
    I am tempted to upgrade to a rock and roll, not only for better readings and road feel but also comfort. 3 - 4 hours a week on the turbo is starting to nag my ars* crackers a tad
    I can highly recommend the rock and roll for both ride feel and comfort. Power is much smoother compared to the Satori, which required effort to get it up to speed, but then the power tailed off (and you'd need to drop another gear and spin up again)


    At last, finally broke the 300w NP barrier (just!)

    Gayley
    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/118477
    Simon
  • napoleond
    napoleond Posts: 5,992
    I'm rally starting to feel the benefit of this TR malarkey. I keep saying, I've always been a masher and I find high cadence efforts a mare, yet in races/chaingangs, my cadence is higher...
    Seeing what I'm doing on the screen and knowing it's going to be for all to see I managed another workout with the targets met and cadence over 10rpm more than normal. Happy days! Soon my training will closely mimic my group riding...
    Insta: ATEnduranceCoaching
    ABCC Cycling Coach
  • markp80
    markp80 Posts: 444
    robklancs wrote:
    I attempted the 8 minute test yesterday and blew up in the first interval, managed to get a bit back on the second but by then the damage was done, I'm not too worried about the value of the numbers as I don't race and just using it to keep fit and motivated with something to stick to, I'm just wondering will the FTP be set at a different numver for my next workout, seeing as it was 200 for the test and I managed 156.

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/118122
    I found my first test a tough one as well, as like you, my power ended up being well below 200 - hence trying to keep to the default 200w FTP target (229W) results in FAIL pretty quickly! Been there a couple of times!
    The important thing is you have a baseline now to set your workouts at. I would recommend you do a retest in about 4 weeks, by which time you'll be much more adjusted to riding on the turbo and using TrainerRoad (technique does improve, although I'm assuming you're a turbo novice like I am, apologies if you're not).

    Cheers,
    MarkP
    Boardman Road Comp - OK, I went to Halfords
    Tibia plateau fracture - the rehab continues!
  • markp80
    markp80 Posts: 444
    Angels for me last night. This is the second Sufferfest I've tried, and again, it was blummin' hard. That was with FTP set at 95% again as well.
    I actually thought Angels was a good workout in terms of structure, with 10 mins of over/unders (or "just overs", when set at 95%!), followed by 3 x 8 min intervals at or around FTP, with each of the intervals having slight variations rather than being a constant level. I like Fight Club for the same reason, I think it's also a good workout in its structure.
    My next challenge is to HTFU and try them at 100%. I think that will be a real challenge though, as I was really blowing at the end of the final interval - which I thought was the toughest of the three "climbs" as well. Still, if I want to hit that 200w FTP target I set a couple of months back..... :twisted:

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/118573

    Cheers,
    MarkP
    Boardman Road Comp - OK, I went to Halfords
    Tibia plateau fracture - the rehab continues!
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    Just to sharethe info I have just had in from Reid
    This ride http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/119081 shows abnormally high TSS and IF values...
    I had retested FTP last week but decided not to use the new number .. it has skewed the values, so have had to use my new higher FTP for subsequent rides.
    TSS and IF in the 90s means a VERY hard ride.. this wasnt... check the HR trace to know all was in full control with a abit of drift towards the end.
    I had to reduce tss down to 60 for Golden Cheetah purposes.
    So the moral is... if you retest, use the new number, even if you are loathe to do so - I didnt expect such a rise in my FTP in all honesty.
  • Wrath Rob
    Wrath Rob Posts: 2,918
    Just retested myself, though as I'd commuted home I did it outside of TR. Very happy with a 22w improvement in a calendar month. Safe to say that TR works for me. I've updated my TR profile with the new FTP value, so the next 2 weeks workouts are going to hurt
    FCN3: Titanium Qoroz.
  • robklancs
    robklancs Posts: 498
    Will trainerroad not recommend an FTP change until I do another test? i did gayley today as my second workout and was able to produce better results than the initial test, I just blew up on the test and couldn't recover, so I think my ftp is probably now set too low, either that or gayley is an easier ride than the8 minute test, all condition were the same for both rides.
  • Garryboy
    Garryboy Posts: 344
    You can manually update your FTP but TR wont change it automatically unless you do a test. I think Gayley did feel 'easier' than the test as its 4 intervals at FTP rather than over it.
  • markp80
    markp80 Posts: 444
    robklancs wrote:
    Will trainerroad not recommend an FTP change until I do another test? i did gayley today as my second workout and was able to produce better results than the initial test, I just blew up on the test and couldn't recover, so I think my ftp is probably now set too low, either that or gayley is an easier ride than the8 minute test, all condition were the same for both rides.
    No, as previous post, it only recommends a new FTP based on a test result. Are you following a plan? If you think your FTP is too low, try your next couple of rides at 105% - you can adjust this for each ride without changing actual FTP, you'll see the option when you have the workout open. Try this for a week, if you find it easy then do a retest.

    Bot don't forget, the test is supposed to be the maximum you can do, the workouts are designed to have you working in particular training zones etc - not to have you puking every time.

    MarkP
    Boardman Road Comp - OK, I went to Halfords
    Tibia plateau fracture - the rehab continues!
  • markp80
    markp80 Posts: 444
    JGSI wrote:
    Just to sharethe info I have just had in from Reid
    This ride http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/119081 shows abnormally high TSS and IF values...
    I had retested FTP last week but decided not to use the new number .. it has skewed the values, so have had to use my new higher FTP for subsequent rides.
    TSS and IF in the 90s means a VERY hard ride.. this wasnt... check the HR trace to know all was in full control with a abit of drift towards the end.
    I had to reduce tss down to 60 for Golden Cheetah purposes.
    So the moral is... if you retest, use the new number, even if you are loathe to do so - I didnt expect such a rise in my FTP in all honesty.
    So are you saying if you do a test but don't accept the new FTP, a bug means that TR uses the revised figure regardless to calculate TSS and IF?
    Boardman Road Comp - OK, I went to Halfords
    Tibia plateau fracture - the rehab continues!
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    Not a bug as such or Reid would have said... I skewed the figures because I exceeded the old target by quite a bit.
    Putting a new figure in and lowering intensity by using % button on the workout window should give a correct figure... I will keep an eye on my next workouts - I am not doing that much over threshold work anyways simply because I havent the enrgy at the moment to burn.
  • markp80
    markp80 Posts: 444
    JGSI wrote:
    Not a bug as such or Reid would have said... I skewed the figures because I exceeded the old target by quite a bit.
    Putting a new figure in and lowering intensity by using % button on the workout window should give a correct figure... I will keep an eye on my next workouts - I am not doing that much over threshold work anyways simply because I havent the enrgy at the moment to burn.
    Ah, I'm with you now. You're riding at your old FTP, so what should feel like a hard ride doesn't.
    Boardman Road Comp - OK, I went to Halfords
    Tibia plateau fracture - the rehab continues!
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    Its a good indicator of a need to retest when those seemingly high IF and TSS happen for no good reason, but it was good to get Reid to confirm it anyways.
  • napoleond
    napoleond Posts: 5,992
    New Sufferfest The Wretched (Freaking hard as evidenced last week!) is on Trainer Road now...
    Insta: ATEnduranceCoaching
    ABCC Cycling Coach
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    NapoleonD wrote:
    New Sufferfest The Wretched (Freaking hard as evidenced last week!) is on Trainer Road now...
    Buying it and leaving on the bookshelf for 2 months, you lunatic. :wink:
  • Garryboy
    Garryboy Posts: 344
    Did hell hath no fury today at 90%, still bleedin torture. Fan stopped working midway through first interval and got cramp in left foot midway through second. ... Still good fun!

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/120083

    Not been outside since start of November, but fully expecting to blast some pb's when I do :-)
  • markp80
    markp80 Posts: 444
    Garryboy wrote:
    Not been outside since start of November, but fully expecting to blast some pb's when I do :-)
    - Same here, I only have access to my bike Monday to Friday, when it's pitch black outside, so I think last time I was out was probably early October. So yes, I'd like to think I'd improved in the meantime!

    I did Fight Club last night. This was my third Sufferfest ride, second attempt at Fight Club, and first attempt at 100%.
    Crikey, I found it tough! To be honest, by the final interval I was really struggling, and couldn't make the short sprints. By the end I was barely hanging on. Anyway, I'll take it as "job done"!

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/120332

    So, I completed Base I a couple of weeks ago, then got hit with a nasty cold plus a few days away, so I've spent a couple of unstructured weeks with the Sufferfest. Next week I'll be starting Base II

    Cheers,
    MarkP
    Boardman Road Comp - OK, I went to Halfords
    Tibia plateau fracture - the rehab continues!
  • springtide9
    springtide9 Posts: 1,731
    With all this talk of Sufferfest, I thought I'd have a go, but as it was the end of the week thought 95% would be a safer option... well after 20 mins, I turned it down to 90% but it was still a struggle.

    A Very Dark Place
    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/120964

    I also think I've lost a bit of fitness since the summer and need to retest to get a lower FTP figure... but that feels like admitting defeat! Will struggle on for a few more weeks with the hope TR will get a little easier.
    Simon
  • markp80
    markp80 Posts: 444
    springtide9 wrote:
    With all this talk of Sufferfest, I thought I'd have a go, but as it was the end of the week thought 95% would be a safer option... well after 20 mins, I turned it down to 90% but it was still a struggle.
    We share your pain!
    :D
    Boardman Road Comp - OK, I went to Halfords
    Tibia plateau fracture - the rehab continues!
  • mattshrops
    mattshrops Posts: 1,134
    This week real life poked its dirty little nose in.I knew Tuesday would not be available so..

    Mon http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/117747-FAIL :evil: Still too tired from sunday.

    Wed http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/119490

    Thurs http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/120262

    Fri http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/121150

    Not been watching vids this week , music instead. The motivational power of which was highlighted when i had a brief power surge when this song came on the ipod http://youtu.be/-nlX7P0nhaI :D
    Death or Glory- Just another Story
  • Simmotino
    Simmotino Posts: 295
    It was Antelope for me this morning. More sweet spot work but without the gradual power shifts (which I don't particularly enjoy) so a much nicer workout IMO.

    It's still not scientific, but my legs are definitely feeling stronger than they have for a very long time. I'm not sure if that's more to do with regular rides of similar lengths or whether it's because those rides are structured in a particular way. Either way, it's the best £6 a month I've ever spent! :mrgreen:
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    Was almost tempted for a road ride today, but 1 serious disadvantage of running a single bike is that , too much of a faff swapping things over for the road and not an indoor trainer.. so until I summon up resources to get another bike for next year/season, I am taking full advantage of my monthly £6 - feeling guilty about missing a turbo ride on Tuesday now.. but as there is http://sport.be.msn.com/cyclocrossclass ... werpen/nl/ this afternoon,an excuse for a lazy' 90 minutes.

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