Cancellara Caught??
Comments
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RichN95 wrote:If making the motor quiet and hiding the battery is easily done - why has no-one actually done it.
Because it's not worth it to do that to sell, you need lots of power and no-one cares if the battery is hidden or not if you're selling to regular folk who just want a little extra help on club runs. And the noise - why spend the money to make it quieter, there's not much value to it?
It's only worth it if you were wanting to cheat, when you don't need 45 minutues of extra power, a few minutes worth to actually drop your companions is all you need, so fewer batteries and the return on spending the money to make it quieter is there.
So, why has no-one done it? Well doing it for public sales isn't cost effective, doing it to win bike races might be.Jibbering Sports Stuff: http://jibbering.com/sports/0 -
unbelievable! coming soon the jet propelled tennis ball and self inflating goalie gloves?'dont forget lads, one evertonian is worth twenty kopites'0
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RichN95 wrote:No they haven't. There are no patents.
Who patents devices they're building to cheat? especially if they violate other peoples patents so would carry even less value in the market place.RichN95 wrote:And if you think there is no commercial purpose in a quieter and more aesthetic bike, then you're beyond reasoning with.
If the compromise of hiding the battery means you only get 5 minutes or 10 minutes and quadruple the cost, then the legit sales would disappear. And there are plenty of quiet motors, no technological barriers, just cost ones.Jibbering Sports Stuff: http://jibbering.com/sports/0 -
Next thing you know, Cancellara will be giving a large "donation" for the UCI to buy an X-ray machine to check the inside of bikes at the start line...0
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italiafirenze wrote:I must have missed the enormous saddlebag Spartacus was using at Paris-Roubaix and Flanders.
In the racing version I understand that the batteries are moved to a butt-plug housing, so doing away with the need for the saddlebag.
If you look carefully at the race footage, you can see the metallic contact patches on the base of his shorts on those occasions when he's out of the saddle. These contacts marry up with corresponding ones on the saddle top.
That's also why in the instances where he powers away, it's all done fully seated, as there'd be no power assist otherwise.0 -
He used stabilisers during his famous Tour descent. You're so enthralled with the scenery that you don't notice them.0
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jibberjim wrote:
If the compromise of hiding the battery means you only get 5 minutes or 10 minutes and quadruple the cost, then the legit sales would disappear. And there are plenty of quiet motors, no technological barriers, just cost ones.
That's not how batteries work. If you make them smaller then they become less powerful. Their longevity is largely uneffected.Twitter: @RichN950 -
You dont need to make them smaller, just a different shape.0
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I can't help thinking that specialized might be prepared to turn a blind eye to doping if it will win a few races and hence sell a few bikes, however if Fab (for example) was found to have won with the help of an electric motor fitted to one of their bikes it would be very dificult to plead ignorance....0
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How will this have passed the scrutineers? I think Cassani will be having a great laugh at this.
On the video have a it says the motor is attached with two 4mm screws in the seat tube. Now take a look at this: http://www.bikeradar.com/road/news/arti ... bike-25691 and have a look at the 5th picture. No screws...0 -
RichN95 wrote:jibberjim wrote:
If the compromise of hiding the battery means you only get 5 minutes or 10 minutes and quadruple the cost, then the legit sales would disappear. And there are plenty of quiet motors, no technological barriers, just cost ones.
That's not how batteries work. If you make them smaller then they become less powerful. Their longevity is largely uneffected.
Power and longevity are linked. A smaller battery will gave a smaller capacity and will therefore have less power for the same length of time, or the same power for a shorter length of time than a larger battery.0 -
BenWatson89 wrote:How will this have passed the scrutineers? I think Cassani will be having a great laugh at this.
On the video have a it says the motor is attached with two 4mm screws in the seat tube. Now take a look at this: http://www.bikeradar.com/road/news/arti ... bike-25691 and have a look at the 5th picture. No screws...
Watch the video, he changed bikes mid race.
After the race was finished the new bike was taken away quickly......0 -
This is such a crock of sh*t, Why would you take a state-of-the-art, light weight bike and then add 2-3kg of extra weight. I reckon the extra weight would actually be more of a hindrance over an entire race than for the small gain it might achieve over a small distance.0
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ProBiker wrote:BenWatson89 wrote:How will this have passed the scrutineers? I think Cassani will be having a great laugh at this.
On the video have a it says the motor is attached with two 4mm screws in the seat tube. Now take a look at this: http://www.bikeradar.com/road/news/arti ... bike-25691 and have a look at the 5th picture. No screws...
Watch the video, he changed bikes mid race.
After the race was finished the new bike was taken away quickly......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T25fqnRb-mU0 -
sfichele wrote:This is such a crock of sh*t, Why would you take a state-of-the-art, light weight bike and then add 2-3kg of extra weight. I reckon the extra weight would actually be more of a hindrance over an entire race than for the small gain it might achieve over a small distance.
Actually most pro bikes are well under the uci weight limit and need weights in the bottom bracket or chains in the downtube to bring the weight up.
(Half way down article)
http://www.bikeradar.com/road/news/arti ... rame-26360
The whole bike and the extra motor might just be a few hundred grams over 6.8kg limit.0 -
Bikes for the cobbles tend not to be, they want strength over light weight and so adding 2-3 kgs would bring the weight up to the 10kg mark.
In response to the bike change. The bikes that are used as spares must also be checked.0 -
Irrationality at its finest.0
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Let me recap some people's arguments here
A motorized bike has been made which has two technological breakthroughs. Firstly there is a silent motor. It's either silent because it has somehow been soundproofed and still fitted inside the frame or a motor which makes hardly any noise while still producing the necessary torque, the sort of motor not seen in any other field of technology. The motor turns the pedals so Cancellara has to turn it off every time he freewheels.
Secondly there's a battery which is far smaller and a different shape than any other electric bike battery, but still produces enough power. The battery is hidden in the downtube, so it must have been put there when the frame was made.
Of course the inventors haven't taken out any patents as these breakthroughs have absolutely no commercial value. Especially as quietness and aesthetics are of no interest to any cyclists.
The bike gets quickly taken away at the end of races (from places such as Roubaix velodrome) so that no-one can get a glimpse of the bike that has been on worldwide TV for the last two hours. Despite this secrecy the inventor allows it to be shown on Italian TV, but only in close up, where the bike has mysteriously acquired two suspicious looking bidons with electrical connectors and wires attached to them. Despite uncovering one of the worst cases of cheating in the history of sport the presenters clearly seem to be on the verge on laughing half the time.
And all this has been done so that the world's best time triallist can ride a bike at 38kph and win Paris-Roubaix in the roughly same way as he did in 2006 (on a different bike).
The counter argument is that Cancellara is a really good bike rider.Twitter: @RichN950 -
I'm with RichN95 on this. Even assuming the battery and noise issues had been solved, I don't think you could be sure enough that nobody else would get near the bike to make it worth the risk, or that carting all the extra kit around when you're not using the motor wouldn't cancel out the advantage. It'd be easier and safer to dope. And I can't imagine for a second that any bike manufacturer would be complicit in it.
It would be truly bizarre if this turned out to be true.0 -
ProBiker wrote:...
"It's all true, there’s a suspicion that there are teams and riders who used a 'pedal-assisted' bike,” he told L'Avvenire. “We were first told about it last July, during the Tour de France. We first heard about it from the USA and it set alarm bells ringing."
Aren't all bikes pedal-assisted?
Are you sure its not 1 April...0 -
robbiedont wrote:ProBiker wrote:...
"It's all true, there’s a suspicion that there are teams and riders who used a 'pedal-assisted' bike,” he told L'Avvenire. “We were first told about it last July, during the Tour de France. We first heard about it from the USA and it set alarm bells ringing."
Aren't all bikes pedal-assisted?
Are you sure its not 1 April...
Maybe the UCI are retrospectively going to ban pedals???0 -
Very nicely put Rich.Contador is the Greatest0
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RichN95 wrote:The bike gets quickly taken away at the end of races (from places such as Roubaix velodrome) so that no-one can get a glimpse of the bike that has been on worldwide TV for the last two hours.
And the video footage shows why if you'd cared to look: the wheel & pedals are still turning as it's quickly taken away - hence the hurry to get it out of sight. Clearly, the throttle's jammed.
:roll: FFS lighten up :roll:0 -
According to the website it uses a 30v 4500mah li-ion battery, meaning it likely uses 16x18650 li-ion cells of 2250mah capacity - cells in a 8 series 2 parallel configuration.
Its perfectly feasible to hide the batteries within the frame, i know people who have batteries placed inside there handlebars for powering mtb lights. Even If you couldn't find space to hide 16 cells you could go for 8 higher capacity cells, and get a 2600mah battery that is half the size and weight but near 60% capacity.
ps.
18650 cells 18mm x 650mm 45-50 grams0 -
RichN95 - Great post.0
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Whether or not any of this will ever be properly proven to have assisted a professional cyclist, isn't it likely to be worse for the fact that the whole team are likely to be complicit in such a deception? I'm no expert but a rider would not be able to do this on his own would he?
If mechanical doping is "real" in the Peleton, isn't it going to be seen as an even worse deception to chemical doping? I guess my question is, wouldn't there have to be more people helping to commit mechanical doping in comparison to chemical doping? And if so, is it a worse "crime" compared to what happens up until now with chemical doping.
Dex.0 -
rdt wrote:RichN95 wrote:The bike gets quickly taken away at the end of races (from places such as Roubaix velodrome) so that no-one can get a glimpse of the bike that has been on worldwide TV for the last two hours.
And the video footage shows why if you'd cared to look: the wheel & pedals are still turning as it's quickly taken away - hence the hurry to get it out of sight. Clearly, the throttle's jammed.
What video footage would that be then? It can't be Roubaix where he slowly freewheels to a halt and then stands hunched over his bike. It's can't be Flanders where he can be seen still on his bike a full 90 seconds after finishing. Or is it yet another piece of the puzzle which doesn't actually exist?Twitter: @RichN950 -
There are some smart people on this site and I'm sure there are engineers amongst them. So we have to have a tiny but powerful electric motor that turns the pedals by a gear wheel/belt drive.induction motor and fit into the bb area? It's powered by batteries unseen that are somehow fitted into the frame either permanantly or removable. the bike could have a concealed charger socket. So really Shimano/Campagnolo have wasted their time developing electric gearing and haven't even bought into the battery technology? Instead they feature batteries that somehow have to be frame/saddle mounted. And this .secret bike' isfor a market that altho' popular is not really moneyspinning compared to developing electromotive power for larger transport vehicles?
Any elec/mech engineers care to comment? Might as well get someone who is qualified to talk about motors etc to tell us the feasibility of such a device.M.Rushton0
