The Big 'Let's sell our cars and take buses/ebikes instead' thread (warning: probably very dull)

Stevo_666

masjer said:

^Those batteries won't get you very far and are single use disposable. Lithium-ion batteries were invented in 2004, so a modern invention compared to the internal combustion engine (1860s).

Well obviously. But I'm sure you know I m talking about battery technology generally. The current ones in EV are just modern variants of that 200+ year old invention.

Stevo_666

More good stuff on efuels, which seem to make a lot of sense and is similar to an EV in terms of carbon emissions, which was the main driver of the rush to EVs. What's not to like?
https://evo.co.uk/fuels/203323/efuels-sustainability-and-sports-cars-is-it-the-key-to-saving-the-combustion-engine

rick_chasey

So Cambridge is still looking to introduce a car use zone which I think is £5er a day you use your car in the city limits.

Having a nosey on the campaign against the change.

They are utterly convinced that they are in the majority despite that there has been a load of consultations and surveys and sure enough there is a majority in favour.

Labour has said they’ll not introduce it till they beef up the bus services, which seems sensible. Obvious exceptions for people with disabled badges etc.

Just interesting the no campaign is so set on them being right and they’re just slating all the data.

rjsterry

Stevo_666 said:

ugo.santalucia said:

Stevo_666 said:

I'm not sure that EV enthusiasts exist as there's not much to get enthused about, but I guess the equivalent would be

EVs have in principle better performance than thermic engines. The acceleration is superior and the torque is immense.
I guess with some decent software you can waste some battery to replicate your favourite engine tune and vibrations...

They make no proper noise and have no soul. And they are very heavy so their handling, braking and dynamics are inferior.

Hence the joke. These are almost exactly the arguments that steam enthusiasts use about diesel and electric locomotives.

FWIW, I will concede that a really big diesel sounds quite impressive 😀.

rick_chasey

rick_chasey said:

So Cambridge is still looking to introduce a car use zone which I think is £5er a day you use your car in the city limits.

Having a nosey on the campaign against the change.

They are utterly convinced that they are in the majority despite that there has been a load of consultations and surveys and sure enough there is a majority in favour.

Labour has said they’ll not introduce it till they beef up the bus services, which seems sensible. Obvious exceptions for people with disabled badges etc.

Just interesting the no campaign is so set on them being right and they’re just slating all the data.

I should add, some of the complaints are that uni students were asked

ugo.santalucia

rick_chasey said:

rick_chasey said:

So Cambridge is still looking to introduce a car use zone which I think is £5er a day you use your car in the city limits.

Having a nosey on the campaign against the change.

They are utterly convinced that they are in the majority despite that there has been a load of consultations and surveys and sure enough there is a majority in favour.

Labour has said they’ll not introduce it till they beef up the bus services, which seems sensible. Obvious exceptions for people with disabled badges etc.

Just interesting the no campaign is so set on them being right and they’re just slating all the data.

I should add, some of the complaints are that uni students were asked

well, they are residents and although they only stay three years, they are then replaced by likeminded equivalent, so there is a population of students, living there more than 50% of the year, which is entitled to a voice

kingstongraham

rjsterry said:

Stevo_666 said:

ugo.santalucia said:

Stevo_666 said:

I'm not sure that EV enthusiasts exist as there's not much to get enthused about, but I guess the equivalent would be

EVs have in principle better performance than thermic engines. The acceleration is superior and the torque is immense.
I guess with some decent software you can waste some battery to replicate your favourite engine tune and vibrations...

They make no proper noise and have no soul. And they are very heavy so their handling, braking and dynamics are inferior.

Hence the joke. These are almost exactly the arguments that steam enthusiasts use about diesel and electric locomotives.

FWIW, I will concede that a really big diesel sounds quite impressive 😀.

So does a really big fart, but equally not in a good way.

Pross

rick_chasey said:

So Cambridge is still looking to introduce a car use zone which I think is £5er a day you use your car in the city limits.

Having a nosey on the campaign against the change.

They are utterly convinced that they are in the majority despite that there has been a load of consultations and surveys and sure enough there is a majority in favour.

Labour has said they’ll not introduce it till they beef up the bus services, which seems sensible. Obvious exceptions for people with disabled badges etc.

Just interesting the no campaign is so set on them being right and they’re just slating all the data.

Sounds like a pretty standard protest to be honest. They always claim stuff like they are “speaking for the silent minority”.

mully79

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

drhaggis

Stevo_666 said:

EVs are based on technology that was invented in the 19th century

Wait until you check the history of crankshafts...

ugo.santalucia

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

normally chrges are brought in cities that have some very good reason to go to… Cambridge might be one of them… maybe Coventry would find it harder

rjsterry

kingstongraham said:

rjsterry said:

Stevo_666 said:

ugo.santalucia said:

Stevo_666 said:

I'm not sure that EV enthusiasts exist as there's not much to get enthused about, but I guess the equivalent would be

EVs have in principle better performance than thermic engines. The acceleration is superior and the torque is immense.
I guess with some decent software you can waste some battery to replicate your favourite engine tune and vibrations...

They make no proper noise and have no soul. And they are very heavy so their handling, braking and dynamics are inferior.

Hence the joke. These are almost exactly the arguments that steam enthusiasts use about diesel and electric locomotives.

FWIW, I will concede that a really big diesel sounds quite impressive 😀.

So does a really big fart, but equally not in a good way.

I stumbled down a YouTube rabbit hole of videos of diesel locomotives accelerating. 😳

mully79

ugo.santalucia said:

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

normally chrges are brought in cities that have some very good reason to go to… Cambridge might be one of them… maybe Coventry would find it harder

Ok, fair point. I will add Cambridge to other similar charging cities that might be worth going to but i'll never find out like Bradford and Sheffield 😂

kingstongraham

You don't have to pay a charge to go in the city, only to drive in the city.

rick_chasey

kingstongraham said:

You don't have to pay a charge to go in the city, only to drive in the city.

Yeah. Where are people expecting to park for free anyway? Apart from in front of my house, anyway.

For those of us who already live here it’s still £5er every time we go anywhere in the car.

I’m largely ok with it. If you’re gonna raise tax it seems a sensible way to do it. It’ll be what, £200-400 more a year and it incentives better decision making.

rick_chasey

Stevo_666 said:

More good stuff on efuels, which seem to make a lot of sense and is similar to an EV in terms of carbon emissions, which was the main driver of the rush to EVs. What's not to like?
https://evo.co.uk/fuels/203323/efuels-sustainability-and-sports-cars-is-it-the-key-to-saving-the-combustion-engine

FT’s view:

https://twitter.com/adam_tooze/status/1632396800295419905?s=46&t=Q7O5dnx-0MXQv9qE3vz1vg

mully79

kingstongraham said:

You don't have to pay a charge to go in the city, only to drive in the city.

I don't live anywhere near any of these cities so how else am I supposed to visit ? Or is that the point ?

briantrumpet

mully79 said:

kingstongraham said:

You don't have to pay a charge to go in the city, only to drive in the city.

I don't live anywhere near any of these cities so how else am I supposed to visit ? Or is that the point ?

Park & Ride?

pangolin

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

Some routes go through the ULEZ and some don't... I mean yeah isn't that the point of a ULEZ? To discourage you from certain routes?

mully79

pangolin said:

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

Some routes go through the ULEZ and some don't... I mean yeah isn't that the point of a ULEZ? To discourage you from certain routes?

It's only a discouragement if I know which route goes through the CAZ, otherwise it's a stealth tax.

briantrumpet

mully79 said:

pangolin said:

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

Some routes go through the ULEZ and some don't... I mean yeah isn't that the point of a ULEZ? To discourage you from certain routes?

It's only a discouragement if I know which route goes through the CAZ, otherwise it's a stealth tax.

Does Google Maps tell you where Ulez zones are?

Pross

mully79 said:

pangolin said:

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

Some routes go through the ULEZ and some don't... I mean yeah isn't that the point of a ULEZ? To discourage you from certain routes?

It's only a discouragement if I know which route goes through the CAZ, otherwise it's a stealth tax.

The big signs on the approaches aren’t very stealthy to be honest.

Stevo_666

rjsterry said:

Stevo_666 said:

ugo.santalucia said:

Stevo_666 said:

I'm not sure that EV enthusiasts exist as there's not much to get enthused about, but I guess the equivalent would be

EVs have in principle better performance than thermic engines. The acceleration is superior and the torque is immense.
I guess with some decent software you can waste some battery to replicate your favourite engine tune and vibrations...

They make no proper noise and have no soul. And they are very heavy so their handling, braking and dynamics are inferior.

Hence the joke. These are almost exactly the arguments that steam enthusiasts use about diesel and electric locomotives.

FWIW, I will concede that a really big diesel sounds quite impressive 😀.

It's no more antiquated than using batteries, which were originally invented in 1800.

My car puts a smile on my face every time I drive it. And that's what counts, beyond the mundane point getting getting me from a to b. I honestly think you would never understand.

pblakeney

Pross said:

mully79 said:

pangolin said:

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

Some routes go through the ULEZ and some don't... I mean yeah isn't that the point of a ULEZ? To discourage you from certain routes?

It's only a discouragement if I know which route goes through the CAZ, otherwise it's a stealth tax.

The big signs on the approaches aren’t very stealthy to be honest.

So you have to choose whether to cough up or do a u-turn?
Just asking as I'm likely to get caught out at some point since I'm not a local.

pblakeney

briantrumpet said:

mully79 said:

pangolin said:

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

Some routes go through the ULEZ and some don't... I mean yeah isn't that the point of a ULEZ? To discourage you from certain routes?

It's only a discouragement if I know which route goes through the CAZ, otherwise it's a stealth tax.

Does Google Maps tell you where Ulez zones are?

Just had a look and Google maps routing gives no warning.

Stevo_666

mully79 said:

ugo.santalucia said:

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

normally chrges are brought in cities that have some very good reason to go to… Cambridge might be one of them… maybe Coventry would find it harder

Ok, fair point. I will add Cambridge to other similar charging cities that might be worth going to but i'll never find out like Bradford and Sheffield 😂

Let's face, councils are out to get as much money as they can and this must look like an easy win.

I'm not so sure everyone would have quite the same view on schemes like this if they had a business in such a city that relied on people coming to them.

mully79

Pross said:

mully79 said:

pangolin said:

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

Some routes go through the ULEZ and some don't... I mean yeah isn't that the point of a ULEZ? To discourage you from certain routes?

It's only a discouragement if I know which route goes through the CAZ, otherwise it's a stealth tax.

The big signs on the approaches aren’t very stealthy to be honest.

I don't need the sign to tell me it's too late. I want the sign that tells me how to get to the airport without going through the CAZ. After all that's the point, to reduce air pollution.

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/drivers-bristol-airport-feel-mugged-7947410

TheBigBean

Avoiding random fines is another upside of not driving.

briantrumpet

pblakeney said:

briantrumpet said:

mully79 said:

pangolin said:

mully79 said:

If I have to pay a charge to go into a city then I simply won't go at all. (Especially if I have to create yet another account online) The faff and confusion is the biggest problem.
I'm flying from Bristol airport in July but some road routes go through the CAZ and some don't. For people with non compliant cars it's utter bs.

Some routes go through the ULEZ and some don't... I mean yeah isn't that the point of a ULEZ? To discourage you from certain routes?

It's only a discouragement if I know which route goes through the CAZ, otherwise it's a stealth tax.

Does Google Maps tell you where Ulez zones are?

Just had a look and Google maps routing gives no warning.

Hmm, not helpful on Google's part, given they warn about motorway tolls.

focuszing723

I wonder if the novelty of EV's will wear off a bit now considering the increasing in electric prices?