Tennis G.O.A.T?

seanoconn

Nobody watched the Australian Open final? Before the match I was leaning towards the current ATP finals champion Danil Medvedev. 20 games unbeaten, great record against other top ten players recently including Djokovic and full of confidence. But Djokovic was a different class.

Moving to 18 grand slams and closing the gap on the other big two, where do we stand on the G.O.A.T debate?

Roger Federer: A Brilliant shot maker, famed for his exciting attacking tennis, a gentleman on and off the court and the best grass court player in history. Unlikely to add to his tally of 20 grand slams due to his age and recent injuries. Losing the head to head battle against the other two but is 4 years older.

Rafa Nadal: The king of clay. Famed for his left handed top spin forehand and ability to get the ball back in play when all seems lost. Extremely awkward to play against with a determination and will to win like no other. Plays every game like a final.

Novak Djokovic: The best service returner in history and an incredible athlete seemingly able to contort and stretch his athletic frame into any shape to get racket on ball. A complete player with no discernible weakness. Least exciting of the big three and possibly the least likeable but winning the head to head against Nadal and Federer.

So who’s the G.O.A.T?

pblakeney

Was Federer, but he is fading. As is Nadal, Paris aside.
I had a heated debate a couple of years ago about this and I maintain that Djokovic will surpass Federer. He has to get a move on though. 😉

abishek_l

For me, it is Roger Federer. I'm not a big tennis at all but I love to watch him move around the court and the effortless nature of his play is beauty in motion. He has the records and the other two are truly awesome athletes but, Roger for me will forever be the greatest. His economy of motion is what sets him apart from others and puts him in a category that I admire the most in ally favourite sports persons.

daniel_b

It has to be Nadal for me - although initially I didn't like his style of play, he't changed my pov over the years.

The thing I like about him the most is his never give up attitude, even if he is way down in a set, I see him still giving it his all - he seems to take it as a personal insult whenever he loses a point.

The spin he puts on a ball - I forget the rpm, but it's circa double or a LOT more than any of the other top players, or was at least.
His technique is amazing to watch in slow motion - breathtaking.

I do agree though that Federer is probably the 'purest' player to watch, as mentioned above, his seemingly effortless motion around the court is majestic, which isn't something you can level at Nadal.

I have never warmed to Djokovic - I don't like his gamesmanship he sometimes employs, and I recall an interview when Murray was in the ascendency and he was asked about his challengers, and his reply (IIRC) was basically a rebuttal, and 'who has the higher ranking?' - I believe he was 3, and Murray was 4 at the time.
Just seemed a bit childish and not very pleasant.

Don't think I have ever seen or heard Federer or Nadal say a bad word about anyone, but I could well be wrong there - they seem to be good friends as well.

Of the 3, I much prefer watching Nadal and Federer, despite their styles being drastically different, for some reason (Or maybe because I have not warmed to him) I don't enjoy watching Djokovic's style of play, though I can't dispute it's effectiveness, and his ability to get balls back into play is as good as anyone.

I've been an avid tennis fan since the early 80s.

Interesting topic @seanoconn.

Wheelspinner

Rod Laver.

elbowloh

Fred Perry...

kingstongraham

Martina (multiple wins at all four grand slam tournaments in singles and doubles plus at all four in mixed doubles) or Serena (multiple wins at all four grand slam wins in both singles and doubles, plus Olympic gold in singles and doubles).

Of the three men, probably Federer from June to Jan. Nadal obviously on clay.

Ben6899

Bobby Riggs

rick_chasey

kingstongraham said:

Martina (multiple wins at all four grand slam tournaments in singles and doubles plus at all four in mixed doubles) or Serena (multiple wins at all four grand slam wins in both singles and doubles, plus Olympic gold in singles and doubles).

Of the three men, probably Federer from June to Jan. Nadal obviously on clay.

The Williams sisters properly changed the women's game. Before them it was a game of technique (hence people like Henin and Hingis) and turned it into a power game.

From memory I think they had the same coach as Sharapova but it was just a different pace and that whole genre of women's players just couldn't keep up.

Serena especially is just so strong and on top of that she's got the technique to beat anyone and that combo is just unplayable.

Can't say I'm a fan of the development, I honestly think it's really ruined the women's game, but you can't argue about the success of it.

I do think pre Federer etc the men's game was heading that way anyway and back then women's was a much better watch.

Not so much now, tbh.

rick_chasey

As for Nadal, I find him a really painful watch.

The aggressive OCD, the feeling that it's all hustle over technique (it obviously isn't), the over-reliance on one shot (mega topsin) etc.

Watching him is like watching the opponent being bludgeoned to death. Sometimes it's so heavy and swings so hard it's instant, but it's still a bludgeon.

seanoconn

daniel_b said:

It has to be Nadal for me - although initially I didn't like his style of play, he't changed my pov over the years.

The thing I like about him the most is his never give up attitude, even if he is way down in a set, I see him still giving it his all - he seems to take it as a personal insult whenever he loses a point.

The spin he puts on a ball - I forget the rpm, but it's circa double or a LOT more than any of the other top players, or was at least.
His technique is amazing to watch in slow motion - breathtaking.

I do agree though that Federer is probably the 'purest' player to watch, as mentioned above, his seemingly effortless motion around the court is majestic, which isn't something you can level at Nadal.

I have never warmed to Djokovic - I don't like his gamesmanship he sometimes employs, and I recall an interview when Murray was in the ascendency and he was asked about his challengers, and his reply (IIRC) was basically a rebuttal, and 'who has the higher ranking?' - I believe he was 3, and Murray was 4 at the time.
Just seemed a bit childish and not very pleasant.

Don't think I have ever seen or heard Federer or Nadal say a bad word about anyone, but I could well be wrong there - they seem to be good friends as well.

Of the 3, I much prefer watching Nadal and Federer, despite their styles being drastically different, for some reason (Or maybe because I have not warmed to him) I don't enjoy watching Djokovic's style of play, though I can't dispute it's effectiveness, and his ability to get balls back into play is as good as anyone.

I've been an avid tennis fan since the early 80s.

Interesting topic @seanoconn.

Agree with most you’ve written. I didn’t warm to Nadal at first with his bullish aggressive attitude on the court but now every time I watch him play I realise I’m watching something truly remarkable. To be honest I thought his career would have long been over by now with the stress he puts his body through every match. How the man, after all his achievements can motivate himself for every point the way he does is nothing short of phenomenal. When you look up the word ‘winner’ in the dictionary there should be a picture of Nadal. He is the epitome of a champion and a great sport, like you say, I’ve never heard him say a bad word about anyone even when provoked to the extreme by the likes of Kyrgios.

My heart however learns towards Federer, the man Oozes class on and off the court, maybe I’m sentimental about his age or the fact he’s a genuinely nice guy and family man. I would like him to be the goat but deep down I know he probably isn’t.

My head, all bias set aside says Djokovic. Try as he might he can’t disguise his arrogance. His support team/family haven’t been likeable in the past and he’s not as enjoyable to watch as the other two but all things being equal I would back him to beat Federer and Nadal. He is or will end up the G.O.A.T.

Like you, an avid fan since 1985.

seanoconn

rick_chasey said:

kingstongraham said:

Martina (multiple wins at all four grand slam tournaments in singles and doubles plus at all four in mixed doubles) or Serena (multiple wins at all four grand slam wins in both singles and doubles, plus Olympic gold in singles and doubles).

Of the three men, probably Federer from June to Jan. Nadal obviously on clay.

The Williams sisters properly changed the women's game. Before them it was a game of technique (hence people like Henin and Hingis) and turned it into a power game.

From memory I think they had the same coach as Sharapova but it was just a different pace and that whole genre of women's players just couldn't keep up.

Serena especially is just so strong and on top of that she's got the technique to beat anyone and that combo is just unplayable.

Can't say I'm a fan of the development, I honestly think it's really ruined the women's game, but you can't argue about the success of it.

I do think pre Federer etc the men's game was heading that way anyway and back then women's was a much better watch.

Not so much now, tbh.

May not have been your point, pre Federer the Boom Boom era of serve and Volley on fast surfaces was spoiling the game but it wasn’t the likes of Federer that ‘saved’ men’s tennis, it was the introduction of slower tennis balls. It’s gone the other way now with baseline rallies dominating but the game is better to watch.

Interestingly the men’s and women’s tours use different felt on the balls. The women’s balls being faster.

rick_chasey

Ah didn't know the ball change.

You wonder if they had those balls earlier on if we'd view some other men differently.

I know they made the grass at Wimbeldon longer to slow it down too, which I always felt was a bit of a shame because now clay is a massive outlier versus the others but I guess grass is still the fastest surface.

daniel_b

seanoconn said:

daniel_b said:

It has to be Nadal for me - although initially I didn't like his style of play, he't changed my pov over the years.

The thing I like about him the most is his never give up attitude, even if he is way down in a set, I see him still giving it his all - he seems to take it as a personal insult whenever he loses a point.

The spin he puts on a ball - I forget the rpm, but it's circa double or a LOT more than any of the other top players, or was at least.
His technique is amazing to watch in slow motion - breathtaking.

I do agree though that Federer is probably the 'purest' player to watch, as mentioned above, his seemingly effortless motion around the court is majestic, which isn't something you can level at Nadal.

I have never warmed to Djokovic - I don't like his gamesmanship he sometimes employs, and I recall an interview when Murray was in the ascendency and he was asked about his challengers, and his reply (IIRC) was basically a rebuttal, and 'who has the higher ranking?' - I believe he was 3, and Murray was 4 at the time.
Just seemed a bit childish and not very pleasant.

Don't think I have ever seen or heard Federer or Nadal say a bad word about anyone, but I could well be wrong there - they seem to be good friends as well.

Of the 3, I much prefer watching Nadal and Federer, despite their styles being drastically different, for some reason (Or maybe because I have not warmed to him) I don't enjoy watching Djokovic's style of play, though I can't dispute it's effectiveness, and his ability to get balls back into play is as good as anyone.

I've been an avid tennis fan since the early 80s.

Interesting topic @seanoconn.

Agree with most you’ve written. I didn’t warm to Nadal at first with his bullish aggressive attitude on the court but now every time I watch him play I realise I’m watching something truly remarkable. To be honest I thought his career would have long been over by now with the stress he puts his body through every match. How the man, after all his achievements can motivate himself for every point the way he does is nothing short of phenomenal. When you look up the word ‘winner’ in the dictionary there should be a picture of Nadal. He is the epitome of a champion and a great sport, like you say, I’ve never heard him say a bad word about anyone even when provoked to the extreme by the likes of Kyrgios.

My heart however learns towards Federer, the man Oozes class on and off the court, maybe I’m sentimental about his age or the fact he’s a genuinely nice guy and family man. I would like him to be the goat but deep down I know he probably isn’t.

My head, all bias set aside says Djokovic. Try as he might he can’t disguise his arrogance. His support team/family haven’t been likeable in the past and he’s not as enjoyable to watch as the other two but all things being equal I would back him to beat Federer and Nadal. He is or will end up the G.O.A.T.

Like you, an avid fan since 1985.

Good call on the injuries, more than once i have thought Nadal was done, his method of playing is so punishing to his body, it's a miracle he manages to keep going, and as you say has the motivation.

I thikn Federer has had a load of back issues as well, and Djokovic as well has had several complications - and yet still they ALL come back!

I think as we have a fairly unusual pinnacle of the three of them having been at the top of the game all at the same time for such a lenght of time, they have pushed each other and their bodies to the extremes, and the day when none of them are around playing competitively sadly cannot be too far away - to be honest, I thought it would have happened by now - it will leave a prettybig vacuum when they go I suspect.

Federer is 40 this year, Nadal will be 35 and Djokovic will be 34 - I appreciate they are all hyper fit, and as I type this, I realise in theory that if Federer can play on until he is 40, maybe Nadal and Djokovic will want to, and be able to as well.

Perhaps if they pick and choose their events carefully, if they are allowed to, maybe that will be an option for them - IF they have the motivation, and if younger players do not surpass them.

pinkbikini

I feel it will end up being Djokovic - amazing player with seemingly no weaknesses to his game.

Style - I'd definitely go for Federer, he's so classy, but once Nadal's amazing power started to fade a little and he developed more guile I really enjoyed watching him too. Djokovic always great to watch.

Quibbles - Djokovic's ball-bouncing pre-serve gets really annoying. Nadal's balls-bum-ears-nose routine equally irritating!

For an alternate view, my daughter used to ball-girl at Wimbledon and has been on court with all of them. She's a big Djokovic fan for his style and competitiveness, less so for his anti-vax views and marital issues. Nadal is difficult to ball-girl for as he has so many OCD tendencies and she got fed up with getting soaked by his sweaty towels! Federer used to be a ball-boy and is the easiest to work for on court. From her very limited interactions with them off-court, both Nadal and Federer are really friendly and generous with compliments.

seanoconn

pinkbikini said:

I feel it will end up being Djokovic - amazing player with seemingly no weaknesses to his game.

Style - I'd definitely go for Federer, he's so classy, but once Nadal's amazing power started to fade a little and he developed more guile I really enjoyed watching him too. Djokovic always great to watch.

Quibbles - Djokovic's ball-bouncing pre-serve gets really annoying. Nadal's balls-bum-ears-nose routine equally irritating!

For an alternate view, my daughter used to ball-girl at Wimbledon and has been on court with all of them. She's a big Djokovic fan for his style and competitiveness, less so for his anti-vax views and marital issues. Nadal is difficult to ball-girl for as he has so many OCD tendencies and she got fed up with getting soaked by his sweaty towels! Federer used to be a ball-boy and is the easiest to work for on court. From her very limited interactions with them off-court, both Nadal and Federer are really friendly and generous with compliments.

I was a ball boy at Wimbledon 😃 Wasn’t athletic enough for the show courts though 😕

pinkbikini

seanoconn said:

pinkbikini said:

I feel it will end up being Djokovic - amazing player with seemingly no weaknesses to his game.

Style - I'd definitely go for Federer, he's so classy, but once Nadal's amazing power started to fade a little and he developed more guile I really enjoyed watching him too. Djokovic always great to watch.

Quibbles - Djokovic's ball-bouncing pre-serve gets really annoying. Nadal's balls-bum-ears-nose routine equally irritating!

For an alternate view, my daughter used to ball-girl at Wimbledon and has been on court with all of them. She's a big Djokovic fan for his style and competitiveness, less so for his anti-vax views and marital issues. Nadal is difficult to ball-girl for as he has so many OCD tendencies and she got fed up with getting soaked by his sweaty towels! Federer used to be a ball-boy and is the easiest to work for on court. From her very limited interactions with them off-court, both Nadal and Federer are really friendly and generous with compliments.

I was a ball boy at Wimbledon 😃 Wasn’t athletic enough for the show courts though 😕

I never did it, looks like an amazing experience. Just getting through selection is a great achievement!

seanoconn

daniel_b said:

seanoconn said:

daniel_b said:

It has to be Nadal for me - although initially I didn't like his style of play, he't changed my pov over the years.

The thing I like about him the most is his never give up attitude, even if he is way down in a set, I see him still giving it his all - he seems to take it as a personal insult whenever he loses a point.

The spin he puts on a ball - I forget the rpm, but it's circa double or a LOT more than any of the other top players, or was at least.
His technique is amazing to watch in slow motion - breathtaking.

I do agree though that Federer is probably the 'purest' player to watch, as mentioned above, his seemingly effortless motion around the court is majestic, which isn't something you can level at Nadal.

I have never warmed to Djokovic - I don't like his gamesmanship he sometimes employs, and I recall an interview when Murray was in the ascendency and he was asked about his challengers, and his reply (IIRC) was basically a rebuttal, and 'who has the higher ranking?' - I believe he was 3, and Murray was 4 at the time.
Just seemed a bit childish and not very pleasant.

Don't think I have ever seen or heard Federer or Nadal say a bad word about anyone, but I could well be wrong there - they seem to be good friends as well.

Of the 3, I much prefer watching Nadal and Federer, despite their styles being drastically different, for some reason (Or maybe because I have not warmed to him) I don't enjoy watching Djokovic's style of play, though I can't dispute it's effectiveness, and his ability to get balls back into play is as good as anyone.

I've been an avid tennis fan since the early 80s.

Interesting topic @seanoconn.

Agree with most you’ve written. I didn’t warm to Nadal at first with his bullish aggressive attitude on the court but now every time I watch him play I realise I’m watching something truly remarkable. To be honest I thought his career would have long been over by now with the stress he puts his body through every match. How the man, after all his achievements can motivate himself for every point the way he does is nothing short of phenomenal. When you look up the word ‘winner’ in the dictionary there should be a picture of Nadal. He is the epitome of a champion and a great sport, like you say, I’ve never heard him say a bad word about anyone even when provoked to the extreme by the likes of Kyrgios.

My heart however learns towards Federer, the man Oozes class on and off the court, maybe I’m sentimental about his age or the fact he’s a genuinely nice guy and family man. I would like him to be the goat but deep down I know he probably isn’t.

My head, all bias set aside says Djokovic. Try as he might he can’t disguise his arrogance. His support team/family haven’t been likeable in the past and he’s not as enjoyable to watch as the other two but all things being equal I would back him to beat Federer and Nadal. He is or will end up the G.O.A.T.

Like you, an avid fan since 1985.

Good call on the injuries, more than once i have thought Nadal was done, his method of playing is so punishing to his body, it's a miracle he manages to keep going, and as you say has the motivation.

I thikn Federer has had a load of back issues as well, and Djokovic as well has had several complications - and yet still they ALL come back!

I think as we have a fairly unusual pinnacle of the three of them having been at the top of the game all at the same time for such a lenght of time, they have pushed each other and their bodies to the extremes, and the day when none of them are around playing competitively sadly cannot be too far away - to be honest, I thought it would have happened by now - it will leave a prettybig vacuum when they go I suspect.

Federer is 40 this year, Nadal will be 35 and Djokovic will be 34 - I appreciate they are all hyper fit, and as I type this, I realise in theory that if Federer can play on until he is 40, maybe Nadal and Djokovic will want to, and be able to as well.

Perhaps if they pick and choose their events carefully, if they are allowed to, maybe that will be an option for them - IF they have the motivation, and if younger players do not surpass them.

It would be a miracle if Federer could win another slam. Age an injuries are catching up and over the last three years, whilst showing flashes of brilliance has been lacking the consistency to win the 7 rounds of a slam. How Nadal keeps going is beyond me but is certainly strong enough for at least one more French Open and possibly a US open, you just can’t write the guy off! If Djokovic stays healthy I could see him winning two slams a year for the next three and as you say, when these three are done this will leave a massive vacuum in the sport. To have three off greatest in any sport playing at the same time is something we’ll never witness again. The current wannabes Medvedev, Thiem, Tsitsipas etc are all in their prime and none are even close to the physical and mental ability of the big three.

At least with the stats available in tennis you can quantify greatness. It will be pretty difficult to argue against whoever ends with the best tally.

seanoconn

pinkbikini said:

seanoconn said:

pinkbikini said:

I feel it will end up being Djokovic - amazing player with seemingly no weaknesses to his game.

Style - I'd definitely go for Federer, he's so classy, but once Nadal's amazing power started to fade a little and he developed more guile I really enjoyed watching him too. Djokovic always great to watch.

Quibbles - Djokovic's ball-bouncing pre-serve gets really annoying. Nadal's balls-bum-ears-nose routine equally irritating!

For an alternate view, my daughter used to ball-girl at Wimbledon and has been on court with all of them. She's a big Djokovic fan for his style and competitiveness, less so for his anti-vax views and marital issues. Nadal is difficult to ball-girl for as he has so many OCD tendencies and she got fed up with getting soaked by his sweaty towels! Federer used to be a ball-boy and is the easiest to work for on court. From her very limited interactions with them off-court, both Nadal and Federer are really friendly and generous with compliments.

I was a ball boy at Wimbledon 😃 Wasn’t athletic enough for the show courts though 😕

I never did it, looks like an amazing experience. Just getting through selection is a great achievement!

😊

Your daughter is obviously very athletic 👍

Wheelspinner

Been a player and watcher for 55 years. I switched off the final last night because I'd rather watch paint dry than see Djokovic and his clone Medvedev play. Frankly, staring at an old Pong video game screen for three hours would be as exciting.

And I was serious about Laver. Only two men have ever won the official Grand Slam of all 4 majors in a calendar year: Don Budge, and Laver, who did it TWICE, and effectively in succession. He had 6 years off the amateur circuit in between, which means skipping 24 opportunities to add to his total of 11 Slams. He won 200 tournaments overall or something. He won multiple doubles and mixed doubles GS titles as well. None of the current crop of male players come close to that record.

Remember, Bjorn Borg won 11 Slams and retired at age 26.

For sheer talent to watch, see Becker as a kid winning Wimbledon. Unbe-freaking-lievable.

Djoko may well end up with the most Slam titles, which would be a shame as he's the least appealing in style of any of the contenders.

seanoconn

Laver was the greatest amateur and undoubtedly the best at dinky tennis with wooden rackets. How would 5 foot 8 Laver fair in the modern game 🤷‍♂️

Becker was awesome, the most charismatic and intimidating player of his era.

Pross

Of those it's Federer for me. Nadal is a bit of a one trick pony (slightly harsh as he has other tricks but just doesn't do them as well as the other two), Djokovic for me is just not quite as good / consistent. Federer is a pleasure to watch and seems to keep coming back everytime I think he is done.

seanoconn

Pross said:

Of those it's Federer for me. Nadal is a bit of a one trick pony (slightly harsh as he has other tricks but just doesn't do them as well as the other two), Djokovic for me is just not quite as good / consistent. Federer is a pleasure to watch and seems to keep coming back everytime I think he is done.

Djokovic is about to over take Federer for weeks spent at number 1 and holds the joint record for year ending number 1 (Pete Sampras) with 6. So soon to be the most consistent of all time. 👍

Pross

seanoconn said:

Pross said:

Of those it's Federer for me. Nadal is a bit of a one trick pony (slightly harsh as he has other tricks but just doesn't do them as well as the other two), Djokovic for me is just not quite as good / consistent. Federer is a pleasure to watch and seems to keep coming back everytime I think he is done.

Djokovic is about to over take Federer for weeks spent at number 1 and holds the joint record for year ending number 1 (Pete Sampras) with 6. So soon to be the most consistent of all time. 👍

But that's just a reflection of the rivalry Nadal and Federer had when they were both at their absolute peak - they have overlapped for most of their career. Would you class Sampras as GOAT on the basis that he had been no. 1 at the end of most seasons?

focuszing723

I think Roger Federer is the most naturally gifted and Nadal is one of the biggest fighters in sport, who never gives up.

I think it's great achievement by Murray as well, having won two Wimbledon titles and the US Open in such a competitive period. Oh, and two Olympic Golds in 2012 and 2016. I still think he should have bloody turned up to SPOTY though. Won in 2013,2015,2016.

seanoconn

Pross said:

seanoconn said:

Pross said:

Of those it's Federer for me. Nadal is a bit of a one trick pony (slightly harsh as he has other tricks but just doesn't do them as well as the other two), Djokovic for me is just not quite as good / consistent. Federer is a pleasure to watch and seems to keep coming back everytime I think he is done.

Djokovic is about to over take Federer for weeks spent at number 1 and holds the joint record for year ending number 1 (Pete Sampras) with 6. So soon to be the most consistent of all time. 👍

But that's just a reflection of the rivalry Nadal and Federer had when they were both at their absolute peak - they have overlapped for most of their career. Would you class Sampras as GOAT on the basis that he had been no. 1 at the end of most seasons?

I don’t understand what you mean by not as consistent then? Sampras dominated his era and Djokovic is dominating his era with regards to consistency, as there can be no better judge of consistency than rankings, which is what they are designed for.

pblakeney

Pross said:

seanoconn said:

Pross said:

Of those it's Federer for me. Nadal is a bit of a one trick pony (slightly harsh as he has other tricks but just doesn't do them as well as the other two), Djokovic for me is just not quite as good / consistent. Federer is a pleasure to watch and seems to keep coming back everytime I think he is done.

Djokovic is about to over take Federer for weeks spent at number 1 and holds the joint record for year ending number 1 (Pete Sampras) with 6. So soon to be the most consistent of all time. 👍

But that's just a reflection of the rivalry Nadal and Federer had when they were both at their absolute peak - they have overlapped for most of their career. Would you class Sampras as GOAT on the basis that he had been no. 1 at the end of most seasons?

In the 90s? Yes.
You can’t compare different generations.

seanoconn

focuszing723 said:

I think Roger Federer is the most naturally gifted and Nadal is one of the biggest fighters in sport, who never gives up.

I think it's great achievement by Murray as well, having won two Wimbledon titles and the US Open in such a competitive period. Oh, and two Olympic Golds in 2012 and 2016. I still think he should have bloody turned up to SPOTY though. Won in 2013,2015,2016.

I grew up in an era when Jeremy Bates reaching the last 16 of Wimbledon was a big deal. Thank God for Andy Murray. People can moan all they want, he was a great British tennis player. Shame the Scot is past in now 😂

focuszing723

seanoconn said:

focuszing723 said:

I think Roger Federer is the most naturally gifted and Nadal is one of the biggest fighters in sport, who never gives up.

I think it's great achievement by Murray as well, having won two Wimbledon titles and the US Open in such a competitive period. Oh, and two Olympic Golds in 2012 and 2016. I still think he should have bloody turned up to SPOTY though. Won in 2013,2015,2016.

I grew up in an era when Jeremy Bates reaching the last 16 of Wimbledon was a big deal. Thank God for Andy Murray. People can moan all they want, he was a great British tennis player. Shame the Scot is past in now 😂

Ha yeah. Tim Henman was always a disappointment too, so Murray did damn well. Not to forget his brother too in the doubles.

Pross

seanoconn said:

Pross said:

seanoconn said:

Pross said:

Of those it's Federer for me. Nadal is a bit of a one trick pony (slightly harsh as he has other tricks but just doesn't do them as well as the other two), Djokovic for me is just not quite as good / consistent. Federer is a pleasure to watch and seems to keep coming back everytime I think he is done.

Djokovic is about to over take Federer for weeks spent at number 1 and holds the joint record for year ending number 1 (Pete Sampras) with 6. So soon to be the most consistent of all time. 👍

But that's just a reflection of the rivalry Nadal and Federer had when they were both at their absolute peak - they have overlapped for most of their career. Would you class Sampras as GOAT on the basis that he had been no. 1 at the end of most seasons?

I don’t understand what you mean by not as consistent then? Sampras dominated his era and Djokovic is dominating his era with regards to consistency, as there can be no better judge of consistency than rankings, which is what they are designed for.

Longevity would have probably been a better word than consistency maybe? It feels like the other two have been around a lot longer although in Nadal's case it is only two seasons (5 for Federer). This is possibly as Federer had already won 12 Grand Slam titles and Nadal 3 before Djokovic got his first but then Djokovic has won 7 titles in the 5 season up to 2020 plus obviously the Australian this year against only 3 in the timescale for Federer and 6 for Nadal so Federer does seem to be much more on the wane.

ballysmate

seanoconn said:

Laver was the greatest amateur and undoubtedly the best at dinky tennis with wooden rackets. How would 5 foot 8 Laver fair in the modern game 🤷‍♂️

Becker was awesome, the most charismatic and intimidating player of his era.

How would the power hitters of today fare with the dinky rackets that I played with as a kid pretending to be Rod Laver? When the qualities of touch and finesse were more to the fore.

An example of what technology can do for performance, albeit in another sport.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2021/feb/22/super-spikes-seismic-shift-athletics-track-nike-air-zoom-victory-tokyo-olympics