2021 Transfer rumours and facts

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  • phreak
    phreak Posts: 2,953
    Pross said:

    phreak said:

    Is Bernal set to ride this year or is he having a year off to recover?

    Presumably they'd still have to have him under contract even if he won't be riding?
    Wasn't sure if he'd count as one of the 32 if he was largely "benched" for the year.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,697
    Hang on is UAE not confirmed then..?!?
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,253
    ddraver said:

    Hang on is UAE not confirmed then..?!?


    Not yet. Reported by a reasonable source in the Netherlands
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • roscoe
    roscoe Posts: 526
    yorkshireraw said:

    neonriver said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    I thought INEOS as well, they could easily outbid anyone and buy him out of his current contract with loose change. Would be a decent long term successor to Kwiatkowski.
    According to PCS they already have 31 riders for 2021 though.

    Ineos website has 30 riders for the coming season

    add Pidcock from 1/3/21.

    Thought WT teams were restricted to 30 riders (unless that's been relaxed due to Covid etc), unless Moscon or someone else departs before then.
    I may be wrong, however, I thought it had been increased to 32? Something to do with the uncertainty over races and having races in at the same time
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,253
    edited January 2021
    roscoe said:



    I may be wrong, however, I thought it had been increased to 32? Something to do with the uncertainty over races and having races in at the same time


    32 for 2021, 31 for 2022 then back to 30 for 2023
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • yorkshireraw
    yorkshireraw Posts: 1,632
    Herschi beat Kwiato at the Worlds, Fleche and LBL .
    GvA had a very average year by his standards - hope he can come good again but is getting on now.
  • 50x11
    50x11 Posts: 408
    yorkshireraw said:

    Herschi beat Kwiato at the Worlds, Fleche and LBL .
    GvA had a very average year by his standards - hope he can come good again but is getting on now.

    Wow can't believe he finished ahead of him! God he's better than Merckx. What absolute nonsense logic. If Hirschi ends up with half the palmares of Kwiato he'll have had a successful career.
  • joe_totale-2
    joe_totale-2 Posts: 1,333
    edited January 2021
    yorkshireraw said:

    Herschi beat Kwiato at the Worlds, Fleche and LBL .
    GvA had a very average year by his standards - hope he can come good again but is getting on now.

    I don't think anyone is saying that Hirschi isn't very good. I just feel that he needs to prove that he wasn't a flash in the pan in a very strange season. If he wins some more races this year I don't think anyone will deny he's one of the best 1 day racers currently around.

    Currently the other riders named are ahead of him as they have a track record of proven success over many years even if some of them are starting to get older. Some of Gilbert's best wins were when he was 35 or over so there's no reason why GvA couldn't bounce back, especially as he's moved to a new team.
  • yorkshireraw
    yorkshireraw Posts: 1,632
    joe_totale-2 said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    Herschi beat Kwiato at the Worlds, Fleche and LBL .
    GvA had a very average year by his standards - hope he can come good again but is getting on now.

    I don't think anyone is saying that Hirschi isn't very good. I just feel that he needs to prove that he wasn't a flash in the pan in a very strange season. If he wins some more races this year I don't think anyone will deny he's one of the best 1 day racers currently around.

    Currently the other riders named are ahead of him as they have a track record of proven success over many years even if some of them are starting to get older. Some of Gilbert's best wins were when he was 35 or over so there's no reason why GvA couldn't bounce back, especially as he's moved to a new team.
    I'm a big GvA fan as I always feel he tries to make something happen or drive a race along - often to his detriment.
    In terms of actually winning often tho he only really had that 2017 Spring when he had the measure of everyone else (it took a ride for the ages by Gilbert to deny him the RVV / PR double) - the rest of the time he's 'one of' rather than 'the' favourites.
    I struggle to see him being able to beat WVA and / or MvdP at Flanders now. Hopefully I'll be proved wrong.
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 22,725
    50x11 said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    Herschi beat Kwiato at the Worlds, Fleche and LBL .
    GvA had a very average year by his standards - hope he can come good again but is getting on now.

    Wow can't believe he finished ahead of him! God he's better than Merckx. What absolute nonsense logic. If Hirschi ends up with half the palmares of Kwiato he'll have had a successful career.
    Jeez, take the rose tinted glasses off, lighten up for a moment and give the lad a break.
    In the space of a week and aged 21, Hirschi went 3rd in the worlds, 2nd in LBL and won Fleche Wallone. Plus he'd bagged a Tour stage.

    Here's Kwiato's results at the same age:

    https://www.procyclingstats.com/rider/michal-kwiatkowski/2011

    Best results aged 21: 3rd in the De Panne ITT and 2nd in the Tour of Pitou Charentes ITT.

    True, he way not end up with half the palmares, but at this stage he's way ahead.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 22,725
    edited January 2021
    joe_totale-2 said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    Herschi beat Kwiato at the Worlds, Fleche and LBL .
    GvA had a very average year by his standards - hope he can come good again but is getting on now.

    I don't think anyone is saying that Hirschi isn't very good. I just feel that he needs to prove that he wasn't a flash in the pan in a very strange season. If he wins some more races this year I don't think anyone will deny he's one of the best 1 day racers currently around.

    Currently the other riders named are ahead of him as they have a track record of proven success over many years even if some of them are starting to get older. Some of Gilbert's best wins were when he was 35 or over so there's no reason why GvA couldn't bounce back, especially as he's moved to a new team.
    He had some great results straight from the start in 2019.
    Podium in San Sebastian, 5th overall in Binckbank and some really strong performances in the cobbled classics, just to complete the all rounder criteria.
    World Champ the year before that.
    Flash in the pan is.............................unlikely.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • 50x11
    50x11 Posts: 408
    blazing_saddles said:

    50x11 said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    Herschi beat Kwiato at the Worlds, Fleche and LBL .
    GvA had a very average year by his standards - hope he can come good again but is getting on now.

    Wow can't believe he finished ahead of him! God he's better than Merckx. What absolute nonsense logic. If Hirschi ends up with half the palmares of Kwiato he'll have had a successful career.
    Jeez, take the rose tinted glasses off, lighten up for a moment and give the lad a break.
    In the space of a week and aged 21, Hirschi went 3rd in the worlds, 2nd in LBL and won Fleche Wallone. Plus he'd bagged a Tour stage.

    Here's Kwiato's results at the same age:

    https://www.procyclingstats.com/rider/michal-kwiatkowski/2011

    Best results aged 21: 3rd in the De Panne ITT and 2nd in the Tour of Pitou Charentes ITT.

    True, he way not end up with half the palmares, but at this stage he's way ahead.
    that'd be a great comparison if Kwiato was 21, and not a former World champion with far more wins.

    He's no where near Van Der Pol, WVA, JA, or even Roglic in one day events and a couple of podiums doesn't change that. Once he starts winning he can stake his claim to the title.

    Theres only one here with rose tinted glasses and it's the person suggesting Hirschi is the best 1 day rider in the world with 1 one day win.
  • gweeds
    gweeds Posts: 2,613
    Hirschi reportedly went from a base salary of €30k to €1m.

    That explains that then.
    Napoleon, don't be jealous that I've been chatting online with babes all day. Besides, we both know that I'm training to be a cage fighter.
  • neonriver
    neonriver Posts: 228
    Van Aert rumoured to extend with Jumbo in next couple of days
  • yorkshireraw
    yorkshireraw Posts: 1,632
    edited January 2021
    Kwiato has 10 1 day wins in his career, 8 excluding 2 x Polish Champs. Hasn't won a 1 day race since 2017 San Sebastian (excl. 2018 Polish champs) which was arguably his best year.
    I'd say he's shifted to become an all round rider including a super-dom for GTs.

    His range is decent tho:
    2 x Strade B, 1 x MSR, 1 x E3, 1 x WC, 1 x San Seb, 1 x Amstel
  • joe_totale-2
    joe_totale-2 Posts: 1,333
    There's that overriding feeling with Kwiato that if he was still focused on one day races and not on being a super domestique then his palmares would be even better then it current is and he'd still be winning.
  • yorkshireraw
    yorkshireraw Posts: 1,632
    joe_totale-2 said:

    There's that overriding feeling with Kwiato that if he was still focused on one day races and not on being a super domestique then his palmares would be even better then it current is and he'd still be winning.

    quite possibly. Probably also be paid considerably less though.
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,463
    50x11 said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    Herschi beat Kwiato at the Worlds, Fleche and LBL .
    GvA had a very average year by his standards - hope he can come good again but is getting on now.

    Wow can't believe he finished ahead of him! God he's better than Merckx. What absolute nonsense logic. If Hirschi ends up with half the palmares of Kwiato he'll have had a successful career.
    That's a ridiculous strawman argument. Following that rationale Cavendish is a better sprinter than any of the current crop as his historic palmares is better. Just because Kwiato has been a better rider historically doesn't mean he still is. I'm a big fan but he is no longer the rider he was between 2014 and 2018 (possibly as his role has changed). Judging who is currently the best rider based on historic form is plainly flawed reasoning. Based on last season I would say Hirschi was the better one day rider and potentially one of the top 5. I don't think GVA has been a top 5 one day rider for the last couple of seasons either.
  • yorkshireraw
    yorkshireraw Posts: 1,632
    Quiz question, based on digging around on PCS - who is the current Pro rider with the most 1 day wins (including National champs) on their Palmares?

    (slight disclaimer - I looked at all the likely WT contenders - there could be an obscure Pro-conti rider with a shed load of 1.1 wins in Asia or something).
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 22,725
    yorkshireraw said:

    Quiz question, based on digging around on PCS - who is the current Pro rider with the most 1 day wins (including National champs) on their Palmares?

    (slight disclaimer - I looked at all the likely WT contenders - there could be an obscure Pro-conti rider with a shed load of 1.1 wins in Asia or something).

    Off the top of my head, I would guess Valverde.
    The reason being he races all, year, wins a lot and is extremely............er.........mature.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • joe_totale-2
    joe_totale-2 Posts: 1,333
    yorkshireraw said:

    Quiz question, based on digging around on PCS - who is the current Pro rider with the most 1 day wins (including National champs) on their Palmares?

    (slight disclaimer - I looked at all the likely WT contenders - there could be an obscure Pro-conti rider with a shed load of 1.1 wins in Asia or something).

    Peter Sagan? Having a national championship that's a cakewalk would help him boost his stats.
  • yorkshireraw
    yorkshireraw Posts: 1,632
    joe_totale-2 said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    Quiz question, based on digging around on PCS - who is the current Pro rider with the most 1 day wins (including National champs) on their Palmares?

    (slight disclaimer - I looked at all the likely WT contenders - there could be an obscure Pro-conti rider with a shed load of 1.1 wins in Asia or something).

    Peter Sagan? Having a national championship that's a cakewalk would help him boost his stats.
    Sagan has 23 1 day wins of which 5 are Slovakia Champs.
  • yorkshireraw
    yorkshireraw Posts: 1,632
    blazing_saddles said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    Quiz question, based on digging around on PCS - who is the current Pro rider with the most 1 day wins (including National champs) on their Palmares?

    (slight disclaimer - I looked at all the likely WT contenders - there could be an obscure Pro-conti rider with a shed load of 1.1 wins in Asia or something).

    Off the top of my head, I would guess Valverde.
    The reason being he races all, year, wins a lot and is extremely............er.........mature.
    Good shout and that's who I thought it would be - but its not.
    Valverde has 30 1 day wins (He's no.3 on the total wins list of active riders)

    The top boy has 37 1 day wins.
  • dish_dash
    dish_dash Posts: 5,647
    Pip Gilbert?
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,253
    I would have said Valverde, but I'll have a go with Kristoff instead
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 22,725
    dish_dash said:

    Pip Gilbert?

    Concur.
    If it's not Piti it must surely be Pip.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,463
    I'd go French, lots of smaller one day races to take but can't think of a name.
  • yorkshireraw
    yorkshireraw Posts: 1,632
    dish_dash said:

    Pip Gilbert?

    Points to Dish and Blazing

    Gilbert really is outstanding across the board. He's won at least 1 race per year (at some level / type) going back to 2004 through to 2019.
    07 and his year in rainbow (13) only saw 1 win.
    Even if he never takes MSR (he's got 2 x 3rd) his range, in the modern era, is phenomenal.

    There's only 17 active riders who've finished all 5 monuments - and a few of them (such as I Izaguirre and Rui Costa) no doubt only rode Paris Roubaix early in their careers as they weren't given a choice.

    Sorry have taken the thread off on a slight tangent....
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,697
    gweeds said:

    Hirschi reportedly went from a base salary of €30k to €1m.

    That explains that then.

    Especially if he's negotiated a nice long contract. Take advantage of everyone frantically signing up kids - Nicely done Fab!

    Someone will be offering Albie Kenny a few mill' soon...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • gsk82
    gsk82 Posts: 3,599
    It's amazing how twisted some knickers got at my tongue in cheek comment.

    I'd still take him over anyone else if I owned a team.
    "Unfortunately these days a lot of people don’t understand the real quality of a bike" Ernesto Colnago

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