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Edward Colston/Trans rights/Stamp collecting

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  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 17,492

    Bit of sympathy for the sporting authorities over this. They are obviously under pressure from changing laws and social attitudes but with more people transitioning often at a younger age no doubt we are going to see a bit more of this.

    I suppose sports with a higher skill component are different. Nobody is taking up tennis or golf at 30 and becoming a top pro even with an advantage of having gone through male puberty - maybe a top amateur or existing pro transitioning but those cases are going to be rare enough.

    Medallists are pretty rare as well. It wouldn't take many per sport to completely change top level women's sport.

    If I were an unscrupulous type in charge of (for example) the North Korean Olympic weightlifting team, I would be watching with interest for 2024.
  • JezyboyJezyboy Posts: 924

    Jezyboy said:

    Bit of sympathy for the sporting authorities over this. They are obviously under pressure from changing laws and social attitudes but with more people transitioning often at a younger age no doubt we are going to see a bit more of this.

    I suppose sports with a higher skill component are different. Nobody is taking up tennis or golf at 30 and becoming a top pro even with an advantage of having gone through male puberty - maybe a top amateur or existing pro transitioning but those cases are going to be rare enough.

    How's about cycling? McKinnon/Ivy.

    Sometimes people are that keen to be open minded that their brain falls out.
    I'm not sure saying you have sympathy for the sporting authorities on this means you agree with the final decision.
    But if you look at it from a female point of view, why should the trans community be lumped in with them?

    Before you start conducting laboratory tests to see if somebody can compete in women's events could you not at least ask that they not have a c0ck and [email protected]?
    If you look at it from a particularly loud activist movement point of view, you've just committed a hate crime by seperating the trans community from the female community. Now you can write off those views, but they are increasingly going towards mainstream.

    I have some sympathy for any sports body operating in that environment.
  • surrey_commutersurrey_commuter Posts: 14,387
    Jezyboy said:

    Jezyboy said:

    Bit of sympathy for the sporting authorities over this. They are obviously under pressure from changing laws and social attitudes but with more people transitioning often at a younger age no doubt we are going to see a bit more of this.

    I suppose sports with a higher skill component are different. Nobody is taking up tennis or golf at 30 and becoming a top pro even with an advantage of having gone through male puberty - maybe a top amateur or existing pro transitioning but those cases are going to be rare enough.

    How's about cycling? McKinnon/Ivy.

    Sometimes people are that keen to be open minded that their brain falls out.
    I'm not sure saying you have sympathy for the sporting authorities on this means you agree with the final decision.
    But if you look at it from a female point of view, why should the trans community be lumped in with them?

    Before you start conducting laboratory tests to see if somebody can compete in women's events could you not at least ask that they not have a c0ck and [email protected]?
    If you look at it from a particularly loud activist movement point of view, you've just committed a hate crime by seperating the trans community from the female community. Now you can write off those views, but they are increasingly going towards mainstream.

    I have some sympathy for any sports body operating in that environment.
    The idea of joining another community without their agreement just seems a little strange. I believe this is the debate that is splitting Stonewall, we wish you well but why align with us?
  • DeVlaeminckDeVlaeminck Posts: 7,235
    Jezyboy said:

    Bit of sympathy for the sporting authorities over this. They are obviously under pressure from changing laws and social attitudes but with more people transitioning often at a younger age no doubt we are going to see a bit more of this.

    I suppose sports with a higher skill component are different. Nobody is taking up tennis or golf at 30 and becoming a top pro even with an advantage of having gone through male puberty - maybe a top amateur or existing pro transitioning but those cases are going to be rare enough.

    How's about cycling? McKinnon/Ivy.

    Sometimes people are that keen to be open minded that their brain falls out.
    I'm not sure saying you have sympathy for the sporting authorities on this means you agree with the final decision.

    Yes I don't really think trans women should be competing in elite sport as women - it's one of those questions where there are good arguments on both sides.

    Ultimately why does women's sport exist - it's (at least in large part) because of biological differences between the sexes and transitioning does not entirely eliminate those differences.
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • ballysmateballysmate Posts: 15,628

    Jezyboy said:

    Bit of sympathy for the sporting authorities over this. They are obviously under pressure from changing laws and social attitudes but with more people transitioning often at a younger age no doubt we are going to see a bit more of this.

    I suppose sports with a higher skill component are different. Nobody is taking up tennis or golf at 30 and becoming a top pro even with an advantage of having gone through male puberty - maybe a top amateur or existing pro transitioning but those cases are going to be rare enough.

    How's about cycling? McKinnon/Ivy.

    Sometimes people are that keen to be open minded that their brain falls out.
    I'm not sure saying you have sympathy for the sporting authorities on this means you agree with the final decision.
    But if you look at it from a female point of view, why should the trans community be lumped in with them?

    Before you start conducting laboratory tests to see if somebody can compete in women's events could you not at least ask that they not have a c0ck and [email protected]?


    According to the article I linked from the Guardian, you can still have a c0ck and your bollocks and be able to compete as a woman. Just as long as your testosterone stays below 10.
    As it happens, for the best part of the last 10 years, I would have met that criteria and according to the IOC could compete as a woman.
    If you think that is bad, I have now got to explain to my missus that the IOC consider her to be a lesbian and in fact, I am a lesbian too.

    Tbf the last bit is no great surprise to me as I have often shared the same interests as lesbians.

  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 20,532
    edited 25 June
    Still no idea what Bally's gender confusion has to do with Colston.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 17,492
    rjsterry said:

    Still no idea what this has to do with Colston.

    This is one of the general purpose culture war threads. If you are against statues of slavers, you must also be in favour of self identification for women's sport. Probably mandatory to be for closing down the police as well.
  • TheBigBeanTheBigBean Posts: 13,760
    rjsterry said:

    Still no idea what Bally's gender confusion has to do with Colston.

    This is the thread for those that want to criticise wokeness. The GB news thread is for those that want to criticise anti-wokeness. Does that help?
  • ballysmateballysmate Posts: 15,628
    rjsterry said:

    Still no idea what Bally's gender confusion has to do with Colston.

    Bit strange as you joined in a discussion on trans people in this very thread only 3 pages back.

    https://forum.bikeradar.com/discussion/13111821/edward-colston/p55
  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 20,532
    edited 25 June

    rjsterry said:

    Still no idea what Bally's gender confusion has to do with Colston.

    This is the thread for those that want to criticise wokeness. The GB news thread is for those that want to criticise anti-wokeness. Does that help?
    Sorry, what has any of this got to do with wokeness, either its original definition or the made up definition that a bunch of reactionaries insist on using?
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 20,532

    rjsterry said:

    Still no idea what Bally's gender confusion has to do with Colston.

    Bit strange as you joined in a discussion on trans people in this very thread only 3 pages back.

    https://forum.bikeradar.com/discussion/13111821/edward-colston/p55
    It's an interesting topic, just not related to Colston. I know this place constantly goes off on tangents but the I can't see the link here.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • TheBigBeanTheBigBean Posts: 13,760
    rjsterry said:

    rjsterry said:

    Still no idea what Bally's gender confusion has to do with Colston.

    This is the thread for those that want to criticise wokeness. The GB news thread is for those that want to criticise anti-wokeness. Does that help?
    Sorry, what has any of this got to do with wokeness, either its original definition or the made up definition that a bunch of reactionaries insist on using?
    You are going beyond my area of expertise, but doesn't the awareness that comes with being woke include trans rights? The wikipedia definition includes just about every minority group.
  • ballysmateballysmate Posts: 15,628
    rjsterry said:

    rjsterry said:

    Still no idea what Bally's gender confusion has to do with Colston.

    Bit strange as you joined in a discussion on trans people in this very thread only 3 pages back.

    https://forum.bikeradar.com/discussion/13111821/edward-colston/p55
    It's an interesting topic, just not related to Colston. I know this place constantly goes off on tangents but the I can't see the link here.
    I agree there is no link to Colston, it's just that the thread had already previously veered off onto trans issues so I posted it here.
    You're only picking on me because I'm a woman ;)
  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 20,532
    Not at all. You do what feels right for you, Bally. I'll edit the thread title to be more inclusive.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • Stevo_666Stevo_666 Posts: 46,577
    rjsterry said:

    Not at all. You do what feels right for you, Bally. I'll edit the thread title to be more inclusive.

    This is now truly a thread fit for Cake Stop :)
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • veronese68veronese68 Posts: 24,568 Lives Here


    As it happens, for the best part of the last 10 years, I would have met that criteria and according to the IOC could compete as a woman.

    To be fair I often think you're a bit of an old woman ;)
  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 20,532
    Stevo_666 said:

    rjsterry said:

    Not at all. You do what feels right for you, Bally. I'll edit the thread title to be more inclusive.

    This is now truly a thread fit for Cake Stop :)
    Having given up on staying on topic I'm happy to add other topics to the thread title as required.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • ballysmateballysmate Posts: 15,628


    As it happens, for the best part of the last 10 years, I would have met that criteria and according to the IOC could compete as a woman.

    To be fair I often think you're a bit of an old woman ;)

  • TheBigBeanTheBigBean Posts: 13,760
    rjsterry said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    rjsterry said:

    Not at all. You do what feels right for you, Bally. I'll edit the thread title to be more inclusive.

    This is now truly a thread fit for Cake Stop :)
    Having given up on staying on topic I'm happy to add other topics to the thread title as required.
    Makes for a very inclusive thread.
  • blazing_saddlesblazing_saddles Posts: 18,078
    I wonder what happens if the person in question breaks the women's Olympic/World record in the competition?
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 17,492

    I wonder what happens if the person in question breaks the women's Olympic/World record in the competition?

    They become the record holder. Quite an easy one that.
  • blazing_saddlesblazing_saddles Posts: 18,078

    I wonder what happens if the person in question breaks the women's Olympic/World record in the competition?

    They become the record holder. Quite an easy one that.
    Sorry, I am so clueless. It's just me showing my age.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
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