The big Coronavirus thread

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  • nickice
    nickice Posts: 2,439
    surrey_commuter said:

    We are in a solid 5th place for deaths, I can’t see us chasing down Italy or Spain.

    Anybody have any theories on the countries at the top of the chart. Is the similarity temperate climates or is it being wealthy enough to know what people die of?

    Air pollution in the Po Valley in Italy (apparently only comparable to Southern Poland) has been touted as an explanation for generally poor lung health in that population.

    I used to live in Madrid and it has a high population density (almost everybody lives in flats), high air pollution, children living with parents well into their thirties but also, most importantly, people tend to socialise a lot in cafés and bars (not exclusive to Madrid, mind) more than in any other country I've been to. In reality, it could be something completely different.
  • coopster_the_1st
    coopster_the_1st Posts: 5,158
    edited April 2020
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,925
    surrey_commuter said:

    briantrumpet said:

    focuszing723 said:

    mrfpb said:

    focuszing723 said:

    Jeremy.89 said:

    Out in the USA working at the moment. Feels like the response has gone from 0 to 60 in no time at all...

    I expect as you probably know Trump is about to give a speech, talk of issuing a state of emergency to release funds.
    I'm wickedly hoping he'll announce he has it, after the visit from the Brazilians.
    Ha, nah he sounds great, greater than any other president in the world. Fifty bill on tap now. He seems to be sniffing a bit, ominous!

    My suspicion is that the US is in heading towards a catastrophe, as it seems they've been deliberately restricting testing to keep figures low, and the costs of testing will have added to the effect. I reckon give it a fortnight, and it's going to be a shîtstorm. Trump's shaken hands with more than one person who's been tested positive... not that I'd hope for anyone to become ill, you understand...
    I don’t get why you think the USA or heading for a catastrophe and we aren’t despite our current policy of letting it run. The only difference seems to be us claiming it is a deliberate policy.

    OK, perhaps I should have said three weeks.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • coopster_the_1st
    coopster_the_1st Posts: 5,158
    How the Dutch are dealing with this.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52135814

    Spoiler: Herd immunity
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 8,183
    edited April 2020
    It's making a mockery of the European, dare I say it, Union.
  • john80
    john80 Posts: 2,965
    focuszing723 said:

    DeVlaeminck said:

    capt_slog said:

    bompington said:

    So here in Scotland, the CMO is in a bit of trouble for heading to her holiday home at the weekends...
    Shame, 'cos she's competent and human, but it's hard to justify isn't it. Might be hard for her job to survive as there are a lot of people looking for someone to rage at.

    If she was that competent, she wouldn't have done it.
    I find it hard to criticise what she did other than on the grounds of hypocrisy. I'm assuming she's driven from one house to another without her and her family getting out and hugging people en route.
    She would still have to fill up her car, get food from the local supermarket and as we know MP's and advisers aren't exactly locked down, having to give press conferences.
    Would you go to the local supermarket for an overnight stay at a second house to check on it. Did she fill the fridge then leave the next day.
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 8,183
    john80 said:

    focuszing723 said:

    DeVlaeminck said:

    capt_slog said:

    bompington said:

    So here in Scotland, the CMO is in a bit of trouble for heading to her holiday home at the weekends...
    Shame, 'cos she's competent and human, but it's hard to justify isn't it. Might be hard for her job to survive as there are a lot of people looking for someone to rage at.

    If she was that competent, she wouldn't have done it.
    I find it hard to criticise what she did other than on the grounds of hypocrisy. I'm assuming she's driven from one house to another without her and her family getting out and hugging people en route.
    She would still have to fill up her car, get food from the local supermarket and as we know MP's and advisers aren't exactly locked down, having to give press conferences.
    Would you go to the local supermarket for an overnight stay at a second house to check on it. Did she fill the fridge then leave the next day.
    Yeah, for some milk something for breakfast, at minimum. You didn't make a reference about her having to fill her car up, or being in close proximity to people during the press conferences.

    Why are you defending her hypocrisy?

    "Stay at Home Save Lives, Do as I say, not as I do!"
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,680
    surrey_commuter said:

    Pross said:

    Those who have suggested we could possibly regionalise lockdown and relax it in areas with low infection rates. How do you propose preventing travel between highly affected areas and low affected areas? Surely everyone is going to want to escape to areas where the relaxations are lifted and spread the virus? It would need far more Draconian policing than at present and would be similar to what Italy initially tried to do in restricting lockdown to the worst affected area in the north - that wasn't very successful.

    Firstly anybody who wanted to hibernate and had the resources to do so will have moved already to avoid a painful death rather than wait and to it to avoid some inconvenience.

    Secondly where would they stay?

    Thirdly you don’t understand most urbanites dislike of the sticks.

    Fourthly 99% of the population would not disobey and you can not base legislation around the non-compliance of the 1%
    You can't envisage anyone from the city heading off to their second homes in the Cotswolds, cottage or boat in Devon or just to visit family and friends who live in places where the pubs and restaurants are open? Day trippers going to the beach on a day trip to enjoy the sun?

    People are generally self-obsessed so if they see an opportunity to get away for even a day to enjoy themselves I don't see them sparing too much thought that the virus might be travelling with them.
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 8,183
    Johnson on the advice of his Doctor has been taken to hospital for a checkup. This is sadly becoming very real for him.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    Herd immunity wasn't supposed to include people that went to Eton, eh..?
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • bompington
    bompington Posts: 7,674
    bompington said:

    So here in Scotland, the CMO is in a bit of trouble for heading to her holiday home at the weekends...
    Shame, 'cos she's competent and human, but it's hard to justify isn't it. Might be hard for her job to survive as there are a lot of people looking for someone to rage at.


    I'll work on a translation sometime but you should all, err, get the drift
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 8,183
    To be fair Raver, he took the advice of the Medical experts and stressed from day one of the conferences that a lockdown would be imposed in accordance to the stress put on the NHS.

    This Virus certainly doesn't discriminate.
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 8,183
    Catherine Calderwood has resigned.
  • kingstonian
    kingstonian Posts: 2,847
    focuszing723 said:

    Johnson on the advice of his Doctor has been taken to hospital for a checkup. This is sadly becoming very real for him.


    Just shows how this virus is indiscriminate. Hope he’s ok, I shudder at the thought of who may take over the PM role if he weren’t able to fulfill his duties.
  • coopster_the_1st
    coopster_the_1st Posts: 5,158
    bompington said:

    So here in Scotland, the CMO is in a bit of trouble for heading to her holiday home at the weekends...
    Shame, 'cos she's competent and human, but it's hard to justify isn't it. Might be hard for her job to survive as there are a lot of people looking for someone to rage at.

    She has finally and thankfully resigned.
  • pangolin
    pangolin Posts: 6,666
    Thank goodness, pandemic solved.
    - Genesis Croix de Fer
    - Dolan Tuono
  • crescent
    crescent Posts: 1,201
    focuszing723 said:

    Catherine Calderwood has resigned.

    That looked to be the only outcome, based on the way the story was unfolding. Very disappointing, and beyond naive, that she did what she did, but I think she was a very genuine and competent person and had a lot to offer the Scottish Govt. I'm not one for calling for people to be sacked but, as the Scottish face of the "stay at home" campaign, it just made her position completely untenable.
    Bianchi ImpulsoBMC Teammachine SLR02 01Trek Domane AL3“When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. “ ~H.G. Wells Edit - "Unless it's a BMX"
  • john80
    john80 Posts: 2,965
    focuszing723 said:

    john80 said:

    focuszing723 said:

    DeVlaeminck said:

    capt_slog said:

    bompington said:

    So here in Scotland, the CMO is in a bit of trouble for heading to her holiday home at the weekends...
    Shame, 'cos she's competent and human, but it's hard to justify isn't it. Might be hard for her job to survive as there are a lot of people looking for someone to rage at.

    If she was that competent, she wouldn't have done it.
    I find it hard to criticise what she did other than on the grounds of hypocrisy. I'm assuming she's driven from one house to another without her and her family getting out and hugging people en route.
    She would still have to fill up her car, get food from the local supermarket and as we know MP's and advisers aren't exactly locked down, having to give press conferences.
    Would you go to the local supermarket for an overnight stay at a second house to check on it. Did she fill the fridge then leave the next day.
    Yeah, for some milk something for breakfast, at minimum. You didn't make a reference about her having to fill her car up, or being in close proximity to people during the press conferences.

    Why are you defending her hypocrisy?

    "Stay at Home Save Lives, Do as I say, not as I do!"
    It is sarcasm at your suggestion she went and interacted with countless people. Most people would take their food for that length of stay and most cars do more than two hours of driving before they need filled up. She probably did the trip without interacting with anyone and therefore the only risk was a traffic accident which lets face it everyone accepts every other day of the week. Everyone is a hypocrite and those that claim otherwise are liars. Really the guidance is more about those going to second homes for the duration of the summer in rural areas with poor health facilities. I would take you point if she rocked up on Tiree.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,591
    crescent said:

    focuszing723 said:

    Catherine Calderwood has resigned.

    That looked to be the only outcome, based on the way the story was unfolding. Very disappointing, and beyond naive, that she did what she did, but I think she was a very genuine and competent person and had a lot to offer the Scottish Govt. I'm not one for calling for people to be sacked but, as the Scottish face of the "stay at home" campaign, it just made her position completely untenable.
    All of that is undoubtably true.
    Will her resignation help the situation though?
    Much like BJ, you worry about the competence of the back up.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 8,183
    edited April 2020
    kingstonian said:

    focuszing723 said:

    Johnson on the advice of his Doctor has been taken to hospital for a checkup. This is sadly becoming very real for him.


    Just shows how this virus is indiscriminate. Hope he’s ok, I shudder at the thought of who may take over the PM role if he weren’t able to fulfill his duties.
    Yeah, I'm sure he will be OK. I expect he's been burning the candle at both ends, understandably. It sounds like he needs a proper rest and give his immune system a chance.
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 8,183
    crescent said:

    focuszing723 said:

    Catherine Calderwood has resigned.

    That looked to be the only outcome, based on the way the story was unfolding. Very disappointing, and beyond naive, that she did what she did, but I think she was a very genuine and competent person and had a lot to offer the Scottish Govt. I'm not one for calling for people to be sacked but, as the Scottish face of the "stay at home" campaign, it just made her position completely untenable.
    Yeah, that's how I feel about it.
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,680
    kingstonian said:

    focuszing723 said:

    Johnson on the advice of his Doctor has been taken to hospital for a checkup. This is sadly becoming very real for him.


    Just shows how this virus is indiscriminate. Hope he’s ok, I shudder at the thought of who may take over the PM role if he weren’t able to fulfill his duties.
    Surely Cummings would remain as PM with another sock puppet handling the front of house role?
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    kingstonian said:

    focuszing723 said:

    Johnson on the advice of his Doctor has been taken to hospital for a checkup. This is sadly becoming very real for him.


    Just shows how this virus is indiscriminate. Hope he’s ok, I shudder at the thought of who may take over the PM role if he weren’t able to fulfill his duties.
    Raab...which gives you an idea of quite how poor the quality of the government is...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • morstar
    morstar Posts: 6,190
    Pross said:

    kingstonian said:

    focuszing723 said:

    Johnson on the advice of his Doctor has been taken to hospital for a checkup. This is sadly becoming very real for him.


    Just shows how this virus is indiscriminate. Hope he’s ok, I shudder at the thought of who may take over the PM role if he weren’t able to fulfill his duties.
    Surely Cummings would remain as PM with another sock puppet handling the front of house role?
    Not sure. Cummings is Bojo's man. If it were to come to it (I genuinely can't wish for it despite Bojo's total lack of principles) a new pm could / would appoint their own team. Cummings has no control unless granted it. Currently he has the keys to the kingdom but his grasp is weak.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,287
    coopster_the_1st said:

    Are you sure that those numbers are saying what you think?

    https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/COVID19/index.htm shows you how what you are seeing is an incomplete data set because of the time of reporting. As a percentage of
    reported deaths, pneumonia has been increasing in the US. As time goes on, if you look back at that graph, the 2020 line will move upwards.

  • crescent
    crescent Posts: 1,201
    pblakeney said:

    crescent said:

    focuszing723 said:

    Catherine Calderwood has resigned.

    That looked to be the only outcome, based on the way the story was unfolding. Very disappointing, and beyond naive, that she did what she did, but I think she was a very genuine and competent person and had a lot to offer the Scottish Govt. I'm not one for calling for people to be sacked but, as the Scottish face of the "stay at home" campaign, it just made her position completely untenable.
    All of that is undoubtably true.
    Will her resignation help the situation though?
    Much like BJ, you worry about the competence of the back up.
    NS clearly values her input so I suspect she will still act in an advisory capacity to the govt. Clearly, she will no longer have the role of CMO nor the high profile presence, though.
    Bianchi ImpulsoBMC Teammachine SLR02 01Trek Domane AL3“When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. “ ~H.G. Wells Edit - "Unless it's a BMX"
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,591
    crescent said:

    pblakeney said:

    crescent said:

    focuszing723 said:

    Catherine Calderwood has resigned.

    That looked to be the only outcome, based on the way the story was unfolding. Very disappointing, and beyond naive, that she did what she did, but I think she was a very genuine and competent person and had a lot to offer the Scottish Govt. I'm not one for calling for people to be sacked but, as the Scottish face of the "stay at home" campaign, it just made her position completely untenable.
    All of that is undoubtably true.
    Will her resignation help the situation though?
    Much like BJ, you worry about the competence of the back up.
    NS clearly values her input so I suspect she will still act in an advisory capacity to the govt. Clearly, she will no longer have the role of CMO nor the high profile presence, though.
    That would be a pragmatic approach.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,867
    If you consider how much medical care could be provided in Downing St and the obvious desire to keep him out of hospital you have to wonder how bad he is.
  • mrfpb
    mrfpb Posts: 4,569
    edited April 2020
    Looking at the maths, if we want less than 20,000 deaths we need the peak to happen this week, before we reach 10,000 deaths.

    With cases and deaths doubling every 3 days, we would hit 20,000 deaths next weekend without peaking.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,660
    Article in the FT on Italian attitudes towards the EU during this.

    Quote from one of the most pro-EU parties; "why do we want to stay in the US? It is useless".

    Basically because no-one came to the rescue or even to help.
    _

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