LEAVE the Conservative Party and save your country!

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  • Stevo_666Stevo_666 Posts: 36,212
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Stevo “I’m alright Jack” 666.
    I see the bitter centre leftie generalisations are still alive and kicking. Good to see there's no hint of resentment or jealousy of others :wink:

    What do I have to be resentful of?

    I can think beyond my lot. Ya know, empathy? That thing toddlers learn?
    It's implied in your little dig above.

    No need to lecture me on empathy, thanks.
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  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 7,311
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    I guess the difference would be that this would be to try and get someone who you prefer in, rather than voting to for someone that you think would destroy the country if they got in. That still strikes me as perverse logic.
    We are both trying to help in our own ways - as I explained a few times, my reason was to keep the Labour party out of power for the good of the country's interests - and mine (IMHO). And so far, it's worked.

    I find it hard to believe that you are confident that the country is currently in a better state than it could have been with a different Labour leader during the Brexit vote... Or that the Conservatives wouldn't be better off if they hadn't called an election in 2017 because Labour was "unelectable". So far, he's only been bad for the country and the Conservatives (as well as Labour), but fingers crossed it doesn't get worse, eh?
    and then the next thing you know
  • thegreatdividethegreatdivide Posts: 4,949
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Do you get free gammon with every membership?
    Nearly everyone likes bacon so that could be a good idea to increase membership.

    Just 51.89% of the UK population and some of those have gone vegan now - or died off.
    #f*ckwit
  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 15,239
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    I guess the difference would be that this would be to try and get someone who you prefer in, rather than voting to for someone that you think would destroy the country if they got in. That still strikes me as perverse logic.
    We are both trying to help in our own ways - as I explained a few times, my reason was to keep the Labour party out of power for the good of the country's interests - and mine (IMHO). And so far, it's worked.

    I find it hard to believe that you are confident that the country is currently in a better state than it could have been with a different Labour leader during the Brexit vote... Or that the Conservatives wouldn't be better off if they hadn't called an election in 2017 because Labour was "unelectable". So far, he's only been bad for the country and the Conservatives (as well as Labour), but fingers crossed it doesn't get worse, eh?

    If the question is how bad can a Conservative government be and still be not as bad as a Labour government then we're certainly testing that theory to destruction.

    As for joining to influence the choice of the next leader, why fight over who is captain of a ship after it'censored the iceberg.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    1980s BSA 10sp

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 7,311
    rjsterry wrote:
    As for joining to influence the choice of the next leader, why fight over who is captain of a ship after it'censored the iceberg.

    If you think there is a more likely next prime minister than the leader of either the Conservative or Labour party, I'm open to listening.
    and then the next thing you know
  • Stevo_666Stevo_666 Posts: 36,212
    but fingers crossed it doesn't get worse, eh?
    Don't just cross your fingers then, make sure you don't vote Labour at the next GE.

    And going back on topic, join the tory party for the good of the country...
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  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 15,239
    rjsterry wrote:
    As for joining to influence the choice of the next leader, why fight over who is captain of a ship after it'censored the iceberg.

    If you think there is a more likely next prime minister than the leader of either the Conservative or Labour party, I'm open to listening.

    Labour don't have the numbers to force a GE, and as much as the Brexiters hate May's deal they would rather die than vote with anything tainted by Labour. As the ERG have shot their bolt, May cannot be challenged for another year. She doesn't seem capable of admitting an error so I can't see her resigning. So we are stuck with this void of leadership.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    1980s BSA 10sp

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • bianchimoonbianchimoon Posts: 3,912
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Do you get free gammon with every membership?
    Nearly everyone likes bacon so that could be a good idea to increase membership.

    Just 51.89% of the UK population and some of those have gone vegan now - or died off.
    and bacon contains carcinogens, but hey, let them eat what they want.
    oooops forgot thats not what some conservatives think bacon's for
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • bianchimoonbianchimoon Posts: 3,912
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    but fingers crossed it doesn't get worse, eh?
    Don't just cross your fingers then, make sure you don't vote Labour at the next GE.

    And going back on topic, join the tory party for the good of the country...
    make your mind up?
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • Rolf FRolf F Posts: 16,126
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    With Corbyn and this crop of Tories we’re all losers, mate.
    Speak for yourself, everybody's circumstances are different.

    Depends if you define your absence of loserishness purely on your personal circumstances rather than with regard to the wider impact of the fact that both main parties are currently, under normal circumstances, totally unelectable.

    I'll be fine whatever Brexit comes our way if indeed there is one. But I'll still be a loser along with everyone else because of it.
    Faster than a tent.......
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 7,311
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    but fingers crossed it doesn't get worse, eh?
    Don't just cross your fingers then, make sure you don't vote Labour at the next GE.

    I don't share your faith in my influence over the wider voting public.
    and then the next thing you know
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 7,311
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    As for joining to influence the choice of the next leader, why fight over who is captain of a ship after it'censored the iceberg.

    If you think there is a more likely next prime minister than the leader of either the Conservative or Labour party, I'm open to listening.

    Labour don't have the numbers to force a GE, and as much as the Brexiters hate May's deal they would rather die than vote with anything tainted by Labour. As the ERG have shot their bolt, May cannot be challenged for another year. She doesn't seem capable of admitting an error so I can't see her resigning. So we are stuck with this void of leadership.

    She has said she will not be leader at the next general election. Surely worth trying to get a reasonable leader whenever that happens.
    and then the next thing you know
  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 15,239
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    As for joining to influence the choice of the next leader, why fight over who is captain of a ship after it'censored the iceberg.

    If you think there is a more likely next prime minister than the leader of either the Conservative or Labour party, I'm open to listening.

    Labour don't have the numbers to force a GE, and as much as the Brexiters hate May's deal they would rather die than vote with anything tainted by Labour. As the ERG have shot their bolt, May cannot be challenged for another year. She doesn't seem capable of admitting an error so I can't see her resigning. So we are stuck with this void of leadership.

    She has said she will not be leader at the next general election. Surely worth trying to get a reasonable leader whenever that happens.

    Who do you have in mind? The current frontrunners do not seem like an improvement; there is so little collective responsibility that surely we would have seen some evidence of leadership qualities from whoever it was by now. There are clearly a few decent people in the party but I can't see any of them ever being leader. And even if enough people joined to get one of the grown-ups elected leader, there would still be a large chunk of the party biding their time before they can pull the European wound open again.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    1980s BSA 10sp

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • surrey_commutersurrey_commuter Posts: 8,419
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    I guess the difference would be that this would be to try and get someone who you prefer in, rather than voting to for someone that you think would destroy the country if they got in. That still strikes me as perverse logic.
    We are both trying to help in our own ways - as I explained a few times, my reason was to keep the Labour party out of power for the good of the country's interests - and mine (IMHO). And so far, it's worked.

    I find it hard to believe that you are confident that the country is currently in a better state than it could have been with a different Labour leader during the Brexit vote... Or that the Conservatives wouldn't be better off if they hadn't called an election in 2017 because Labour was "unelectable". So far, he's only been bad for the country and the Conservatives (as well as Labour), but fingers crossed it doesn't get worse, eh?

    Don’t forget the dent to business confidence that his presence delivers
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 7,311
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    As for joining to influence the choice of the next leader, why fight over who is captain of a ship after it'censored the iceberg.

    If you think there is a more likely next prime minister than the leader of either the Conservative or Labour party, I'm open to listening.

    Labour don't have the numbers to force a GE, and as much as the Brexiters hate May's deal they would rather die than vote with anything tainted by Labour. As the ERG have shot their bolt, May cannot be challenged for another year. She doesn't seem capable of admitting an error so I can't see her resigning. So we are stuck with this void of leadership.

    She has said she will not be leader at the next general election. Surely worth trying to get a reasonable leader whenever that happens.

    Who do you have in mind? The current frontrunners do not seem like an improvement; there is so little collective responsibility that surely we would have seen some evidence of leadership qualities from whoever it was by now. There are clearly a few decent people in the party but I can't see any of them ever being leader. And even if enough people joined to get one of the grown-ups elected leader, there would still be a large chunk of the party biding their time before they can pull the European wound open again.

    Local MP, almost anyone except Zac Goldsmith.
    Leader, I haven't really thought about it - Justine Greening? If enough joined, the chunk of the party that wants to tear the wound open becomes a smaller chunk.
    and then the next thing you know
  • Stevo_666Stevo_666 Posts: 36,212
    Rolf F wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    With Corbyn and this crop of Tories we’re all losers, mate.
    Speak for yourself, everybody's circumstances are different.

    Depends if you define your absence of loserishness purely on your personal circumstances rather than with regard to the wider impact of the fact that both main parties are currently, under normal circumstances, totally unelectable.

    I'll be fine whatever Brexit comes our way if indeed there is one. But I'll still be a loser along with everyone else because of it.
    My point was more generally that Rick cannot speak for everyone on this. He took that the wrong way and then tried to play the man not the ball.
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  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 15,239
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    As for joining to influence the choice of the next leader, why fight over who is captain of a ship after it'censored the iceberg.

    If you think there is a more likely next prime minister than the leader of either the Conservative or Labour party, I'm open to listening.

    Labour don't have the numbers to force a GE, and as much as the Brexiters hate May's deal they would rather die than vote with anything tainted by Labour. As the ERG have shot their bolt, May cannot be challenged for another year. She doesn't seem capable of admitting an error so I can't see her resigning. So we are stuck with this void of leadership.

    She has said she will not be leader at the next general election. Surely worth trying to get a reasonable leader whenever that happens.

    Who do you have in mind? The current frontrunners do not seem like an improvement; there is so little collective responsibility that surely we would have seen some evidence of leadership qualities from whoever it was by now. There are clearly a few decent people in the party but I can't see any of them ever being leader. And even if enough people joined to get one of the grown-ups elected leader, there would still be a large chunk of the party biding their time before they can pull the European wound open again.

    Local MP, almost anyone except Zac Goldsmith.
    Leader, I haven't really thought about it - Justine Greening? If enough joined, the chunk of the party that wants to tear the wound open becomes a smaller chunk.

    Greening would be good but she'd never be put on the shortlist by her fellow MPs*. If it comes to a leadership election it'll end up being Hunt or Javid or one of the other people suddenly keen to polish their image with the right of the party. Regardless the party will still be squabbling over Europe for decades to come.

    *This - apart from the small matter of entryism undermining Parliamentary democracy - is why paying the £25 is a bad idea. You'll only get to choose between two shortlisted by the likes of Bridgen, Grayling, Davis, etc.

    Of more interest is whether Corbyn ignoring his membership will result in any kind of reckoning there. And if there is a GE and he still can't make any headway there's also some hope that a grown-up might put in a leadership challenge there.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    1980s BSA 10sp

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 7,311
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    As for joining to influence the choice of the next leader, why fight over who is captain of a ship after it'censored the iceberg.

    If you think there is a more likely next prime minister than the leader of either the Conservative or Labour party, I'm open to listening.

    Labour don't have the numbers to force a GE, and as much as the Brexiters hate May's deal they would rather die than vote with anything tainted by Labour. As the ERG have shot their bolt, May cannot be challenged for another year. She doesn't seem capable of admitting an error so I can't see her resigning. So we are stuck with this void of leadership.

    She has said she will not be leader at the next general election. Surely worth trying to get a reasonable leader whenever that happens.

    Who do you have in mind? The current frontrunners do not seem like an improvement; there is so little collective responsibility that surely we would have seen some evidence of leadership qualities from whoever it was by now. There are clearly a few decent people in the party but I can't see any of them ever being leader. And even if enough people joined to get one of the grown-ups elected leader, there would still be a large chunk of the party biding their time before they can pull the European wound open again.

    Local MP, almost anyone except Zac Goldsmith.
    Leader, I haven't really thought about it - Justine Greening? If enough joined, the chunk of the party that wants to tear the wound open becomes a smaller chunk.

    Greening would be good but she'd never be put on the shortlist by her fellow MPs. If it comes to a leadership election it'll end up being Hunt or Javid or one of the other people suddenly keen to polish their image with the right of the party. Regardless the party will still be squabbling over Europe for decades to come.

    Does the membership have to change to make the Conservatives a party that a reasonable person could vote for with more enthusiasm than "at least they aren't Corbyn"? At the moment, their traditional natural supporters are very different from the membership.
    and then the next thing you know
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 43,769 Lives Here
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    With Corbyn and this crop of Tories we’re all losers, mate.
    Speak for yourself, everybody's circumstances are different.

    Depends if you define your absence of loserishness purely on your personal circumstances rather than with regard to the wider impact of the fact that both main parties are currently, under normal circumstances, totally unelectable.

    I'll be fine whatever Brexit comes our way if indeed there is one. But I'll still be a loser along with everyone else because of it.
    My point was more generally that Rick cannot speak for everyone on this. He took that the wrong way and then tried to play the man not the ball.

    No that wasn’t your point. Else you’d have said that.

    You were just being a smug I’m alright jack.

    It’s fine but don’t BS.

    You regularly make the “well I’m doing ok so who cares” argument.

    Micro/macro confusion, but we’ve already established that right?
  • Stevo_666Stevo_666 Posts: 36,212
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    With Corbyn and this crop of Tories we’re all losers, mate.
    Speak for yourself, everybody's circumstances are different.

    Depends if you define your absence of loserishness purely on your personal circumstances rather than with regard to the wider impact of the fact that both main parties are currently, under normal circumstances, totally unelectable.

    I'll be fine whatever Brexit comes our way if indeed there is one. But I'll still be a loser along with everyone else because of it.
    My point was more generally that Rick cannot speak for everyone on this. He took that the wrong way and then tried to play the man not the ball.

    No that wasn’t your point. Else you’d have said that.

    You were just being a smug I’m alright jack.

    It’s fine but don’t BS.

    You regularly make the “well I’m doing ok so who cares” argument.

    Micro/macro confusion, but we’ve already established that right?
    Wrong again Rick. You're not a mind reader and you interpreted it a certain way: that's your problem, not mine. And don't try to muddy the waters by dragging up your micro/macro stuff again - I'm well aware of the difference.

    You're sounding more bitter as this goes on otherwise you wouldn't be going on about it and trying to play the man not the ball.

    PS: to address your earlier point, I will empathise with your commuting plight when I come up to Cambridge to collect my new car on 1st of March :wink:
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  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 15,239
    Some of us have good reason to feel bitter. It's difficult to imagine something so pointlessly destructive as this sorry enterprise, and all to sate a bunch of idiots who get all misty-eyed about an empire that was long gone before they were even born. Apart from the economic losses, the social division that this has brought about has ruined my country. Expressing rage at the situation is perfectly natural, however ineffective ranting on here might be. It's great that some are insulated from the negative effects and have even managed to do well out of the situation. I hope those advantages are not too shortlived.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    1980s BSA 10sp

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • Stevo_666Stevo_666 Posts: 36,212
    rjsterry wrote:
    Some of us have good reason to feel bitter. It's difficult to imagine something so pointlessly destructive as this sorry enterprise, and all to sate a bunch of idiots who get all misty-eyed about an empire that was long gone before they were even born. Apart from the economic losses, the social division that this has brought about has ruined my country. Expressing rage at the situation is perfectly natural, however ineffective ranting on here might be. It's great that some are insulated from the negative effects and have even managed to do well out of the situation. I hope those advantages are not too shortlived.
    That I can understand. Except when it's directed at me - and he can't blame me as I voted Remain. There seems to be some sorted of resentment towards people who in his eyes are doing alright. Hey ho.
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    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 15,239
    Well you do put it out there by bragging about your new car ;)
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    1980s BSA 10sp

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • Stevo_666Stevo_666 Posts: 36,212
    rjsterry wrote:
    Well you do put it out there by bragging about your new car ;)
    It's a bit leftie if you think that just mentioning buying a new car is boasting, there's over 2 million sold a year in the UK. Anyhow, I think he deserved it given his chippy attitude :)
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  • thegreatdividethegreatdivide Posts: 4,949
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    Well you do put it out there by bragging about your new car ;)
    It's a bit leftie if you think that just mentioning buying a new car is boasting, there's over 2 million sold a year in the UK. Anyhow, I think he deserved it given his chippy attitude :)

    They're not sold, they're hired out. PCP innit. It's how the gammon can 'afford' their Audis.
    #f*ckwit
  • Stevo_666Stevo_666 Posts: 36,212
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    Well you do put it out there by bragging about your new car ;)
    It's a bit leftie if you think that just mentioning buying a new car is boasting, there's over 2 million sold a year in the UK. Anyhow, I think he deserved it given his chippy attitude :)

    They're not sold, they're hired out. PCP innit. It's how the gammon can 'afford' their Audis.
    True, I'm sure quite a lot of people do that.

    Out of interest, how do lefties afford cars?
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  • rjsterryrjsterry Posts: 15,239
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    Well you do put it out there by bragging about your new car ;)
    It's a bit leftie if you think that just mentioning buying a new car is boasting, there's over 2 million sold a year in the UK. Anyhow, I think he deserved it given his chippy attitude :)

    You've 'just mentioned' it in three separate threads that I can remember, but don't stop on my account. I look forward to the next update. :)
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    1980s BSA 10sp

    Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.
  • Stevo_666Stevo_666 Posts: 36,212
    rjsterry wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    Well you do put it out there by bragging about your new car ;)
    It's a bit leftie if you think that just mentioning buying a new car is boasting, there's over 2 million sold a year in the UK. Anyhow, I think he deserved it given his chippy attitude :)

    You've 'just mentioned' it in three separate threads that I can remember, but don't stop on my account. I look forward to the next update. :)
    Keeping count are we? Hmmm. A bit stalkerish but don't stop on my account :wink:
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  • Robert88Robert88 Posts: 2,722
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    rjsterry wrote:
    Well you do put it out there by bragging about your new car ;)
    It's a bit leftie if you think that just mentioning buying a new car is boasting, there's over 2 million sold a year in the UK. Anyhow, I think he deserved it given his chippy attitude :)

    They're not sold, they're hired out. PCP innit. It's how the gammon can 'afford' their Audis.
    True, I'm sure quite a lot of people do that.

    Out of interest, how do lefties afford cars?

    Interest-free credit, I guess.

    That's the system. Cash is like a slap in the face to car dealers. As like as not you'd get reported to the authorities if you tried it with anything more than a piddling amount, say over £10k.

    Even bank transfers have to be explained these days.
  • Robert88Robert88 Posts: 2,722
    How to make a small fortune.

    1. start off with a large fortune
    2. vote for David Cameron's party
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