TdF 2017: Stage 9 Nantua - Chambéry 181.5KM *Spoilers*

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  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 22,704
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    So you send Fuglsang up the road and have Aru sit on Froome's wheel.

    Rinse & repeat.

    And I don't believe Froome would play poker with a gap to Bardet...

    They set that up on the climb. Astana played the same Dauphine tactic, only by then, Aru couldn't deliver.
    If only he hadn't wasted energy in that unscripted attack earlier, maybe he could have bridged. :P

    On the flat, that they would work together was a gimme. Always happens in Le Tour.
    How many times have we seen riders protecting the GC position?
    Remember when CSC chased down Ullrich for Armstrong, doing just that?

    https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=V8m ... ur&f=false
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,648
    Yeah yeah. I was critical of it then too.

    I get the logic, I just don't think it's the right logic.
    _
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,241
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Yeah yeah. I was critical of it then too.

    I get the logic, I just don't think it's the right logic.
    You never know what might be going on behind the scenes with sponsors and contracts, pressure to get a result. Aru flopped last year. Insecurity can lead to conservative tactics.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,660
    On another note, I had a stuttering stream of ITV4 Yesterday which reset every 2 minutes or so.

    Still better than Kirby. Boulting and Millar are getting seriously good.
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,241
    ddraver wrote:
    On another note, I had a stuttering stream of ITV4 Yesterday which reset every 2 minutes or so.

    Still better than Kirby. Boulting and Millar are getting seriously good.
    Yeah, I have that if I watch via my Virgin media app. It's fine through the ITV app
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • poweredbyidris
    poweredbyidris Posts: 848
    ddraver wrote:
    On another note, I had a stuttering stream of ITV4 Yesterday which reset every 2 minutes or so.

    Still better than Kirby. Boulting and Millar are getting seriously good.

    Yep - Millar's ability to call moves as they're happening (rather than the usual slightly delayed "what just happened there is") really draws you in
  • EnacheV
    EnacheV Posts: 235
    i don't like this route at all, nothing memorable remains from all this stages. 2016 was a borefest, 2017 seems another one.

    At least 2015 had PSM and 2013 was awesome
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 27,760
    smithy21 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:

    You didn't mention football in your comparison of sports.

    Di Canio catching the ball when he could have scored as I think a keeper was down injured.

    And every time anyone gets injured and the ball gets put out of play.

    Each sport has its own unwritten rules, and Aru undoubtedly broke one of cycling's.

    Don't much like the look of Froome's subsequent attempt to shove him into a spectator, though.
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,241
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Don't much like the look of Froome's subsequent attempt to shove him into a spectator, though.
    That was just an accident. He immediately apologised. Not my opinion - Aru's.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,535
    RichN95 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Don't much like the look of Froome's subsequent attempt to shove him into a spectator, though.
    That was just an accident. He immediately apologised. Not my opinion - Aru's.

    He did actually put his hand up to apologise just after he did it. I'm still not convinced it was an accident though.

    But for the benefit of the Aru attack debate:
    viewtopic.php?t=13080764
    Warning No formatter is installed for the format
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 27,760
    RichN95 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Don't much like the look of Froome's subsequent attempt to shove him into a spectator, though.
    That was just an accident. He immediately apologised. Not my opinion - Aru's.

    It's good of both of them to realise it doesn't need to be escalated. Fair play.

    (Still think Froome was going for a gap that wasn't there.)
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,241
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    RichN95 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Don't much like the look of Froome's subsequent attempt to shove him into a spectator, though.
    That was just an accident. He immediately apologised. Not my opinion - Aru's.

    It's good of both of them to realise it doesn't need to be escalated. Fair play.

    (Still think Froome was going for a gap that wasn't there.)
    I reckon he cocked up his gear change coming around the corner
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 27,760
    Man of the day has to be the mechanic who converted Uran's Di2 rear mech into a very manual shifter.

    Could easily have been a tutorial on how to lose a finger or two.
  • Alex99
    Alex99 Posts: 1,407
    No tA Doctor wrote:
    RichN95 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Don't much like the look of Froome's subsequent attempt to shove him into a spectator, though.
    That was just an accident. He immediately apologised. Not my opinion - Aru's.

    He did actually put his hand up to apologise just after he did it. I'm still not convinced it was an accident though.

    But for the benefit of the Aru attack debate:
    viewtopic.php?t=13080764

    You're not convinced even though both players say it was an accident and there was an immediate apology. You have your own agenda.
  • Alex99
    Alex99 Posts: 1,407
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    So you send Fuglsang up the road and have Aru sit on Froome's wheel.

    Rinse & repeat.

    And I don't believe Froome would play poker with a gap to Bardet...

    Froome has been isolated and before and knows how to deal with it. They'd just been pushed to the limit by Froome on the climb and the descent. Bardet up the road... I just don't think they were feeling very positive by this point. I think 1% chance that Froome would let Fuglsang have a 10 m gap.
  • Alex99
    Alex99 Posts: 1,407
    underlayunderlay wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Alright.

    I called it back in the stage live but I stand by it.

    Astana tactics were crap. Why did they work with Froome?

    You, Chris Boardman and David Millar - the latter is quite amusingly annoyed by it. "There's six riders. The two Astana riders finished fifth and sixth. It's like, 'How stupid are you?'"

    Having watched the ITV4 show first, later watching the Eurosport coverage gave me a different impression of the final km's. Froome was pulling harder then the ITV coverage showed.
  • Alex99
    Alex99 Posts: 1,407
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Uran is even more macho.

    He rides a 54 big ring 8)

    Heh heh. And he got it put on the 11, not the 12.
  • Alex99
    Alex99 Posts: 1,407
    iainf72 wrote:
    I don't see what's so hard to understand - When Froome had his mechanical, they weren't really racing hard. Aru appeared to attack in direct response to realising Froome had an issue. Bad form in anyone's book but if Aru had wanted to wear it he could've.

    Now, if Froome had his issue 10 seconds after Aru had attacked, different story entirely.

    Porte and Marting crashed when the racing was full on, under those circumstances, you don't wait.

    Pretty darn clear really :)
  • Alex99
    Alex99 Posts: 1,407
    bobmcstuff wrote:
    Watching it back Froome really made a mess of that sprint. Basically tried to lead himself out.

    Nice to see Cannondale with some luck for a change!

    Dunno really... kept the pressure on, maximized the gap to Martin and Quintana, came third and got a few more seconds.
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,241
    Anyway, enough of Aru, there's a more important question to ask?

    Is George Bennett the new Haimar Zubeldia?
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,535
    Alex99 wrote:
    No tA Doctor wrote:
    RichN95 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Don't much like the look of Froome's subsequent attempt to shove him into a spectator, though.
    That was just an accident. He immediately apologised. Not my opinion - Aru's.

    He did actually put his hand up to apologise just after he did it. I'm still not convinced it was an accident though.

    But for the benefit of the Aru attack debate:
    viewtopic.php?t=13080764

    You're not convinced even though both players say it was an accident and there was an immediate apology. You have your own agenda.

    I have no agenda. But I'm a little too old to take cyclists at their word. Froome also said he didn't know Aru had attacked, and Aru said he didn't know Froome had a mechanical. If that doesn't indicate their unreliability as witnesses then God knows what does.

    Aru has taken a kicking in the media and the peloton for his attack, he doesn't want to stir the pot.
    Froome obviously can't admit to barging a fellow cyclist into the crowd.
    Neither can say anything other than what they said.

    Personally, I like to think that Froome left Aru in no doubt that he wasn't going to take it lying down, gave an apology for the cameras (plausible deniability) and left Aru to defend himself to the press. That might not be the truth of the story, but I like that version. It actually fits quite well with the fact that we know Froome has a completely ruthless streak to him that he doesn't expose in interviews. I'm not really a fan of his at all, but that would impress me.
    Warning No formatter is installed for the format
  • r0bh
    r0bh Posts: 2,382
    No tA Doctor wrote:
    Alex99 wrote:
    No tA Doctor wrote:
    RichN95 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Don't much like the look of Froome's subsequent attempt to shove him into a spectator, though.
    That was just an accident. He immediately apologised. Not my opinion - Aru's.

    He did actually put his hand up to apologise just after he did it. I'm still not convinced it was an accident though.

    But for the benefit of the Aru attack debate:
    viewtopic.php?t=13080764

    You're not convinced even though both players say it was an accident and there was an immediate apology. You have your own agenda.

    I have no agenda. But I'm a little too old to take cyclists at their word. Froome also said he didn't know Aru had attacked, and Aru said he didn't know Froome had a mechanical. If that doesn't indicate their unreliability as witnesses then God knows what does.

    Aru has taken a kicking in the media and the peloton for his attack, he doesn't want to stir the pot.
    Froome obviously can't admit to barging a fellow cyclist into the crowd.
    Neither can say anything other than what they said.

    Personally, I like to think that Froome left Aru in no doubt that he wasn't going to take it lying down, gave an apology for the cameras (plausible deniability) and left Aru to defend himself to the press. That might not be the truth of the story, but I like that version. It actually fits quite well with the fact that we know Froome has a completely ruthless streak to him that he doesn't expose in interviews. I'm not really a fan of his at all, but that would impress me.

    Froome not seeing Aru attack - given that at the time he was looking backwards for his team car - is much more plausible than Aru not seeing that Froome had a problem, which happened right in front of him.
  • Alex99
    Alex99 Posts: 1,407
    No tA Doctor wrote:
    Alex99 wrote:
    No tA Doctor wrote:
    RichN95 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Don't much like the look of Froome's subsequent attempt to shove him into a spectator, though.
    That was just an accident. He immediately apologised. Not my opinion - Aru's.

    He did actually put his hand up to apologise just after he did it. I'm still not convinced it was an accident though.

    But for the benefit of the Aru attack debate:
    viewtopic.php?t=13080764

    You're not convinced even though both players say it was an accident and there was an immediate apology. You have your own agenda.

    I have no agenda. But I'm a little too old to take cyclists at their word. Froome also said he didn't know Aru had attacked, and Aru said he didn't know Froome had a mechanical. If that doesn't indicate their unreliability as witnesses then God knows what does.

    Aru has taken a kicking in the media and the peloton for his attack, he doesn't want to stir the pot.
    Froome obviously can't admit to barging a fellow cyclist into the crowd.
    Neither can say anything other than what they said.

    Personally, I like to think that Froome left Aru in no doubt that he wasn't going to take it lying down, gave an apology for the cameras (plausible deniability) and left Aru to defend himself to the press. That might not be the truth of the story, but I like that version. It actually fits quite well with the fact that we know Froome has a completely ruthless streak to him that he doesn't expose in interviews. I'm not really a fan of his at all, but that would impress me.

    That's plausible. Apologies for the presumption
  • salsiccia1
    salsiccia1 Posts: 3,725
    RichN95 wrote:
    Anyway, enough of Aru, there's a more important question to ask?

    Is George Bennett the new Haimar Zubeldia?

    Zubeldia is the new Zubeldia. It's just that no-one's noticed.
    It's only a bit of sport, Mun. Relax and enjoy the racing.
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,535
    r0bh wrote:

    Froome not seeing Aru attack - given that at the time he was looking backwards for his team car - is much more plausible than Aru not seeing that Froome had a problem, which happened right in front of him.

    If you watch the long clip then Froome quite clearly sees Aru go past him with Quintana on his wheel - he's got his eyes locked on him. He even looks like he opens his mouth in surprise (or possibly to swear!). The frantic gesticulation and looking back for the car comes right after that.

    Alex99 wrote:
    That's plausible. Apologies for the presumption

    Thanks, but no apology required.
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  • onyourright
    onyourright Posts: 509
    I think it’s reasonable for Astana to be more concerned with the GC race than yesterday’s stage. And possibly their best shot at the GC is to put time into everyone else and hope Froome gets sick, injured, or caught out tactically. Between the three of these possibilities, there’s still a decent chance of something like that happening. It’s the Tour and we’re only a third of the way through!
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 22,704
    RichN95 wrote:
    Anyway, enough of Aru, there's a more important question to ask?

    Is George Bennett the new Haimar Zubeldia?

    Who? :):wink:
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    Salsiccia1 wrote:
    RichN95 wrote:
    Anyway, enough of Aru, there's a more important question to ask?

    Is George Bennett the new Haimar Zubeldia?

    Zubeldia is the new Zubeldia. It's just that no-one's noticed.

    :lol:
    Correlation is not causation.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,310
    When we have to rely on people going to A&E to have a bit of fun, it's sad racing really... three major climbs and not a single noteworthy attack from any of the GC men... maybe they shouldn't allow chimps to design mountain stages. What was wrong with a mountain top finish?
    left the forum March 2023
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    I am missing MTFs if I'm honest.
    Correlation is not causation.

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