Poo tin... Put@in...
Comments
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MattFalle said:
not sure re the former but I'd smash the latter with 2/3 of the nearby pieces of indirect fire a third of the drones I have.kingstonian said:Anyone know if the Ukraine Air Force have any fighter jets still operating?
Also I wonder what plan there is for tackling the 40 mile long convoy inching towards the capital.
tbf, its got a shed of guns around it, so air is the only real option but they won't go all in on that front.
or hit it piecemeal.
The fact it appears that the convoy hasn’t been hit yet either points to them waiting for the right time, or the Ukrainians don’t have the weaponry available to hit it. Hoping it is the former, obviously.0 -
Ok, interesting. Thanks for sharing.rick_chasey said:
US last night said they were still operating but something like "materially degraded" and that Ukranian airspace was still contested "in some areas".kingstonian said:Anyone know if the Ukraine Air Force have any fighter jets still operating?
Also I wonder what plan there is for tackling the 40 mile long convoy inching towards the capital.
So I suspect that massive convoy is an an area which is not contested.
(I'm just guessing)0 -
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They seem to be releasing a lot of info very quickly, which is a good thing (as long as the info is accurate, clearly).rick_chasey said:The US briefings are quite informative generally actually.
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Crimea I believe is predominantly ethnic Russian - if you held a referendum there it would vote for at least closer ties with Russia.First.Aspect said:
Would you maintain sanctions? Or are those part of the quid pro quo? (The latter, obviously).DeVlaeminck said:
I think I'd give up Ukraine and even the Dombass (?) region if it meant Russia withdrawing and some guarantee if Ukrainian sovereignty in the rest of the countryPross said:Recognition of Crimea as Russian is now part of Russian peace demands.
I can see it coming down to who runs out of food and supplies first if the Russians encircle Kyiv.
It's not as if there is a long history of Ukraine being a state with Crimea as an integral part of it and I believe the majority are ethnically/linguistically Russian. The former majority Tatar population have been replaced since the 19th century and deported en masse post ww2 - I don't know if there is a movement for them to reclaim it but realistically that's not happening.
So, Russia invades, gets some land, consequences of doing so removed.
What next? Where next?
Yes it's be part of a peace settlement - no more sanctions.
I'm on the side of Ukraine in all this but it's not entirely one sided. You can see why some areas might want a degree of autonomy at the very least.
Interesting documentary about right wing militias in Ukraine.
https://youtu.be/KfD_CaSIxmQ
I'm no expert in this though and it's not my country - just hate the thought of lives being lost.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
they might well be hitting it but they will just keep pushing onkingstonian said:MattFalle said:
not sure re the former but I'd smash the latter with 2/3 of the nearby pieces of indirect fire a third of the drones I have.kingstonian said:Anyone know if the Ukraine Air Force have any fighter jets still operating?
Also I wonder what plan there is for tackling the 40 mile long convoy inching towards the capital.
tbf, its got a shed of guns around it, so air is the only real option but they won't go all in on that front.
or hit it piecemeal.
The fact it appears that the convoy hasn’t been hit yet either points to them waiting for the right time, or the Ukrainians don’t have the weaponry available to hit it. Hoping it is the former, obviously.0 -
I mean you'd assume Russia would not send a huge convoy if it wasn't fairly certain it wasn't going to be bombed to bits - ok it may have miscalculated before but I'd say it's odds on Ukraine doesn't have the capability to significantly disrupt that.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0
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The ICC in The Hague have announced they are beginning to gather and preserve evidence as they begin to investigate potential war crimes.0
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They were fairly certain that Ukraine would capitulate in short order.DeVlaeminck said:I mean you'd assume Russia would not send a huge convoy if it wasn't fairly certain it wasn't going to be bombed to bits - ok it may have miscalculated before but I'd say it's odds on Ukraine doesn't have the capability to significantly disrupt that.
So far Putin has miscalculated right across the board."Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0 -
From the BBC: Russia warns it will hit targets in Kyiv
The Russian defence ministry has issued a warning to Kyiv residents that it is preparing to hit targets in the Ukrainian capital.
In a statement issued on Tuesday afternoon, Russian officials said their forces are preparing to launch "high-precision strikes" against "technological centres of the Ukrainian Security Service and the 72nd main PsyOps centre in Kyiv".
"We urge Ukrainian citizens who are being used by nationalists to carry out provocations against Russia, as well as Kyiv residents residing near relay stations to leave their home," the statement added.
Officials claimed the strikes are being carried out to "prevent information attacks against Russia".0 -
Apparently it is a well known tacticblazing_saddles said:
They were fairly certain that Ukraine would capitulate in short order.DeVlaeminck said:I mean you'd assume Russia would not send a huge convoy if it wasn't fairly certain it wasn't going to be bombed to bits - ok it may have miscalculated before but I'd say it's odds on Ukraine doesn't have the capability to significantly disrupt that.
So far Putin has miscalculated right across the board.0 -
This is nothing to do with repatriation of ethnic Russian regions, it is about restoring the Soviet Union or something akin to that. Which didn't last very long in the first place and didn't have that much of a historical underpinning around the edges. It wanted Finland at one stage, for example.
It is about as valid as the UK annexing Newfoundland.
Also, what's ethnic Russian? Do northern Siberians count? What about people from Nakhodka?
It is a fiction that there is some historical divide between Russians/not Russians that needs to be restored, and that this somehow justifies annexing bits of a neighbouring country.
Agitprop.
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yikes. Good luck to Kyiv. They're gonna need it....
This is rather worrying and what we all feared.Dorset_Boy said:From the BBC: Russia warns it will hit targets in Kyiv
The Russian defence ministry has issued a warning to Kyiv residents that it is preparing to hit targets in the Ukrainian capital.
In a statement issued on Tuesday afternoon, Russian officials said their forces are preparing to launch "high-precision strikes" against "technological centres of the Ukrainian Security Service and the 72nd main PsyOps centre in Kyiv".
"We urge Ukrainian citizens who are being used by nationalists to carry out provocations against Russia, as well as Kyiv residents residing near relay stations to leave their home," the statement added.
Officials claimed the strikes are being carried out to "prevent information attacks against Russia".0 -
I thought we were past the idea of ethno states now that it is the 21st century.DeVlaeminck said:
Crimea I believe is predominantly ethnic Russian - if you held a referendum there it would vote for at least closer ties with Russia.First.Aspect said:
Would you maintain sanctions? Or are those part of the quid pro quo? (The latter, obviously).DeVlaeminck said:
I think I'd give up Ukraine and even the Dombass (?) region if it meant Russia withdrawing and some guarantee if Ukrainian sovereignty in the rest of the countryPross said:Recognition of Crimea as Russian is now part of Russian peace demands.
I can see it coming down to who runs out of food and supplies first if the Russians encircle Kyiv.
It's not as if there is a long history of Ukraine being a state with Crimea as an integral part of it and I believe the majority are ethnically/linguistically Russian. The former majority Tatar population have been replaced since the 19th century and deported en masse post ww2 - I don't know if there is a movement for them to reclaim it but realistically that's not happening.
So, Russia invades, gets some land, consequences of doing so removed.
What next? Where next?
Yes it's be part of a peace settlement - no more sanctions.
I'm on the side of Ukraine in all this but it's not entirely one sided. You can see why some areas might want a degree of autonomy at the very least.
Interesting documentary about right wing militias in Ukraine.https://youtu.be/KfD_CaSIxmQ
I'm no expert in this though and it's not my country - just hate the thought of lives being lost.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Gazprom-RusVelo lose wheel and bike sponsors after Russian invasion of Ukraine
LOOK and Corima say they will stop "technical support and partnership" after "shocking and unforgivable news"0 -
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Anyone else notice the pro-trump and pro-brexit troll-y posts on twitter are massively few and far between since this all kicked off and the various social medias were either shut down in Russia or they kicked a lot of them off?0
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Most of them have moved onto deciding that a few Canadian truckers are their most loved people.rick_chasey said:Anyone else notice the pro-trump and pro-brexit troll-y posts on twitter are massively few and far between since this all kicked off and the various social medias were either shut down in Russia or they kicked a lot of them off?
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Reminds me of seeing this posted by a Canadian friend.kingstongraham said:
Most of them have moved onto deciding that a few Canadian truckers are their most loved people.rick_chasey said:Anyone else notice the pro-trump and pro-brexit troll-y posts on twitter are massively few and far between since this all kicked off and the various social medias were either shut down in Russia or they kicked a lot of them off?
The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
FromCitywire:
Shell has announced its intention to exit its partnership with Russian gas giant Gazprom. The planned sales include its 27.5% stake in the Sakhalin-II liquefied natural gas facility and its 50% stake in the Salym Petroleum Development and the Gydan energy venture.
Last year Shell reported adjusted earnings of £522m ($700m) from the Sakhalin-II and Salym projects.
Shell also intends to end its involvement in the Russian Nord Stream 2 pipeline project, whose certification was last week halted by the German government and 27 EU member states. Nord Stream 2 is a 1,230km-long underwater twin pipeline that was constructed to transport natural gas from Russia to Germany under the Baltic Sea.0 -
Interesting read (usual veracity caveats apply)0 -
Predates the 40 mile convoy for one thing....0
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Not sure how much optimism should come with it. You don't hear the other side's version, for example.rick_chasey said:Yes, no-one is pretending otherwise?
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Agreed, it's more I found it both interesting and remarkable (with all the usual caveats).First.Aspect said:
Not sure how much optimism should come with it. You don't hear the other side's version, for example.rick_chasey said:Yes, no-one is pretending otherwise?
TBH, for the purposes of this thread, can we assume that anything that is intel on the ongoing war has a likelihood of inaccuracy, doubly so when it comes to twitter analysis?
It doesn't mean it's not interesting, but if we all read it with the those caveats in place then it can still be informative, just in context.0 -
Yes, although it is hard to know. I guess Putin will not want to be boasting about killing Ukrainians given his pretext for all this is liberating them - and Ukraine will not want to publicise defeats so we may not get the full picture.blazing_saddles said:
They were fairly certain that Ukraine would capitulate in short order.DeVlaeminck said:I mean you'd assume Russia would not send a huge convoy if it wasn't fairly certain it wasn't going to be bombed to bits - ok it may have miscalculated before but I'd say it's odds on Ukraine doesn't have the capability to significantly disrupt that.
So far Putin has miscalculated right across the board.
I've read that Putin has made mistakes because he hasn't fought a war like this before - ok possibly true but I think it generally pays not to assume your opponent is an idiot and Putin is presumably not making the strategic decisions himself.
Well let's say a majority in certain areas of Ukraine - eg Crimea - see themselves as Russians.First.Aspect said:This is nothing to do with repatriation of ethnic Russian regions, it is about restoring the Soviet Union or something akin to that. Which didn't last very long in the first place and didn't have that much of a historical underpinning around the edges. It wanted Finland at one stage, for example.
It is about as valid as the UK annexing Newfoundland.
Also, what's ethnic Russian? Do northern Siberians count? What about people from Nakhodka?
It is a fiction that there is some historical divide between Russians/not Russians that needs to be restored, and that this somehow justifies annexing bits of a neighbouring country.
Agitprop.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
When you say majority, how do you define that, and did they vote on it? Did they want to be part of Russia, or for Ukraines foreign policy to be more pro Russia?DeVlaeminck said:
Yes, although it is hard to know. I guess Putin will not want to be boasting about killing Ukrainians given his pretext for all this is liberating them - and Ukraine will not want to publicise defeats so we may not get the full picture.blazing_saddles said:
They were fairly certain that Ukraine would capitulate in short order.DeVlaeminck said:I mean you'd assume Russia would not send a huge convoy if it wasn't fairly certain it wasn't going to be bombed to bits - ok it may have miscalculated before but I'd say it's odds on Ukraine doesn't have the capability to significantly disrupt that.
So far Putin has miscalculated right across the board.
I've read that Putin has made mistakes because he hasn't fought a war like this before - ok possibly true but I think it generally pays not to assume your opponent is an idiot and Putin is presumably not making the strategic decisions himself.
Well let's say a majority in certain areas of Ukraine - eg Crimea - see themselves as Russians.First.Aspect said:This is nothing to do with repatriation of ethnic Russian regions, it is about restoring the Soviet Union or something akin to that. Which didn't last very long in the first place and didn't have that much of a historical underpinning around the edges. It wanted Finland at one stage, for example.
It is about as valid as the UK annexing Newfoundland.
Also, what's ethnic Russian? Do northern Siberians count? What about people from Nakhodka?
It is a fiction that there is some historical divide between Russians/not Russians that needs to be restored, and that this somehow justifies annexing bits of a neighbouring country.
Agitprop.
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Surely that is the whole point of this conflict. No independent democratic Ukraine no vote. On any subject other than to re-elect Putin, which is a "Yes".First.Aspect said:
When you say majority, how do you define that, and did they vote on it? Did they want to be part of Russia, or for Ukraines foreign policy to be more pro Russia?DeVlaeminck said:
Yes, although it is hard to know. I guess Putin will not want to be boasting about killing Ukrainians given his pretext for all this is liberating them - and Ukraine will not want to publicise defeats so we may not get the full picture.blazing_saddles said:
They were fairly certain that Ukraine would capitulate in short order.DeVlaeminck said:I mean you'd assume Russia would not send a huge convoy if it wasn't fairly certain it wasn't going to be bombed to bits - ok it may have miscalculated before but I'd say it's odds on Ukraine doesn't have the capability to significantly disrupt that.
So far Putin has miscalculated right across the board.
I've read that Putin has made mistakes because he hasn't fought a war like this before - ok possibly true but I think it generally pays not to assume your opponent is an idiot and Putin is presumably not making the strategic decisions himself.
Well let's say a majority in certain areas of Ukraine - eg Crimea - see themselves as Russians.First.Aspect said:This is nothing to do with repatriation of ethnic Russian regions, it is about restoring the Soviet Union or something akin to that. Which didn't last very long in the first place and didn't have that much of a historical underpinning around the edges. It wanted Finland at one stage, for example.
It is about as valid as the UK annexing Newfoundland.
Also, what's ethnic Russian? Do northern Siberians count? What about people from Nakhodka?
It is a fiction that there is some historical divide between Russians/not Russians that needs to be restored, and that this somehow justifies annexing bits of a neighbouring country.
Agitprop.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
They can see themselves as what they like. Plenty of countries have multiple ethnicities within their borders. You may as well suggest that France could annex Wallonia from Belgium.DeVlaeminck said:
Yes, although it is hard to know. I guess Putin will not want to be boasting about killing Ukrainians given his pretext for all this is liberating them - and Ukraine will not want to publicise defeats so we may not get the full picture.blazing_saddles said:
They were fairly certain that Ukraine would capitulate in short order.DeVlaeminck said:I mean you'd assume Russia would not send a huge convoy if it wasn't fairly certain it wasn't going to be bombed to bits - ok it may have miscalculated before but I'd say it's odds on Ukraine doesn't have the capability to significantly disrupt that.
So far Putin has miscalculated right across the board.
I've read that Putin has made mistakes because he hasn't fought a war like this before - ok possibly true but I think it generally pays not to assume your opponent is an idiot and Putin is presumably not making the strategic decisions himself.
Well let's say a majority in certain areas of Ukraine - eg Crimea - see themselves as Russians.First.Aspect said:This is nothing to do with repatriation of ethnic Russian regions, it is about restoring the Soviet Union or something akin to that. Which didn't last very long in the first place and didn't have that much of a historical underpinning around the edges. It wanted Finland at one stage, for example.
It is about as valid as the UK annexing Newfoundland.
Also, what's ethnic Russian? Do northern Siberians count? What about people from Nakhodka?
It is a fiction that there is some historical divide between Russians/not Russians that needs to be restored, and that this somehow justifies annexing bits of a neighbouring country.
Agitprop.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition1 -
Putin voted on that on their behalf, kind fellow that he is.First.Aspect said:
When you say majority, how do you define that, and did they vote on it? Did they want to be part of Russia, or for Ukraines foreign policy to be more pro Russia?DeVlaeminck said:
Yes, although it is hard to know. I guess Putin will not want to be boasting about killing Ukrainians given his pretext for all this is liberating them - and Ukraine will not want to publicise defeats so we may not get the full picture.blazing_saddles said:
They were fairly certain that Ukraine would capitulate in short order.DeVlaeminck said:I mean you'd assume Russia would not send a huge convoy if it wasn't fairly certain it wasn't going to be bombed to bits - ok it may have miscalculated before but I'd say it's odds on Ukraine doesn't have the capability to significantly disrupt that.
So far Putin has miscalculated right across the board.
I've read that Putin has made mistakes because he hasn't fought a war like this before - ok possibly true but I think it generally pays not to assume your opponent is an idiot and Putin is presumably not making the strategic decisions himself.
Well let's say a majority in certain areas of Ukraine - eg Crimea - see themselves as Russians.First.Aspect said:This is nothing to do with repatriation of ethnic Russian regions, it is about restoring the Soviet Union or something akin to that. Which didn't last very long in the first place and didn't have that much of a historical underpinning around the edges. It wanted Finland at one stage, for example.
It is about as valid as the UK annexing Newfoundland.
Also, what's ethnic Russian? Do northern Siberians count? What about people from Nakhodka?
It is a fiction that there is some historical divide between Russians/not Russians that needs to be restored, and that this somehow justifies annexing bits of a neighbouring country.
Agitprop.0
