Poo tin... Put@in...
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Who is feeling sorry for him?Ben6899 said:People feeling sorry for Roman Abramovich.
You don't end up in Putin's pocket because you studied hard at school and went on to earn an honest living...
No one on here that I've seen.
Of course your Man Utd haven't taken any state money from Putin have they?0 -
What do you expect from mobilisation? It’s not voluntary. It’s an existential war for the nation - every able man fights.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
This is old school behaviour from Russia.0 -
I did sort of mention this a short while ago.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
No mileage in white males I guess.
"Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0 -
I’d like to know how you or anyone else Uk expects to force people back to Ukraine?kingstonian said:rick_chasey said:
Because it is f@ck all obviously.kingstonian said:So what’s wrong with announcing what is being done for those Ukrainians already in the UK?
This is total war. They’re literally showing the nation how to make homemade firebombs.
Any Ukrainian fleeing Ukraine is a refugee and should not need a visa regardless.
That is literally international law,
Furthermore, if Britain makes out it it supporting the nation then that is part of it.
UK pushed for Ukraine to be part of NATO. That’s to its credit.
They should have the same approach to migration to their approach for things with guns
It isn’t f@ck all to the 3 Ukrainians I know that will be benefiting from this approach.
Clearly much more can and should be done for those that are attempting to flee Ukraine, but those already here who have an upcoming visa renewal now aren’t fearing that they’d not secure a renewal and be forced back to what is now a war zone.
Asking the Russians to land on the air bases they just took?0 -
Who is trying to force people back to the Ukraine? You're imagining things.rick_chasey said:
I’d like to know how you or anyone else Uk expects to force people back to Ukraine?kingstonian said:rick_chasey said:
Because it is f@ck all obviously.kingstonian said:So what’s wrong with announcing what is being done for those Ukrainians already in the UK?
This is total war. They’re literally showing the nation how to make homemade firebombs.
Any Ukrainian fleeing Ukraine is a refugee and should not need a visa regardless.
That is literally international law,
Furthermore, if Britain makes out it it supporting the nation then that is part of it.
UK pushed for Ukraine to be part of NATO. That’s to its credit.
They should have the same approach to migration to their approach for things with guns
It isn’t f@ck all to the 3 Ukrainians I know that will be benefiting from this approach.
Clearly much more can and should be done for those that are attempting to flee Ukraine, but those already here who have an upcoming visa renewal now aren’t fearing that they’d not secure a renewal and be forced back to what is now a war zone.
Asking the Russians to land on the air bases they just took?0 -
They had several hundred thousand troops stationed in Europe and set up NATO and with it the nuclear umbrella.Pross said:
It hasn't exactly been a guarantor historically when there has been war in Europe though has it? Very late to provide support in WW1 and only joined WW2 after being attacked. The latter half of the 20th century was more about their fear if communism than protecting Europe. Since then it has been them pressuring Europe to support the wars they've started.rick_chasey said:Honestly this invasion is so big. It’s shifts everything.
We’re in a new world where if you don’t have a big f@ck off military in Europe you are under threat.
US is also not the guarantor it once was. Europe is going to have to understand war at home is a legitimate problem and that they’re not a conceptual waste of space.
US is going to be preoccupied to their west, not East.
We need to get our head around the fact hard power is back in its relevance.
Don’t be so ungrateful. “Only joined WW2 after being attacked”
Whole of Europe would have been Soviet without them.0 -
Read what he wrote. Bolded it for you.Dorset_Boy said:
Who is trying to force people back to the Ukraine? You're imagining things.rick_chasey said:
I’d like to know how you or anyone else Uk expects to force people back to Ukraine?kingstonian said:rick_chasey said:
Because it is f@ck all obviously.kingstonian said:So what’s wrong with announcing what is being done for those Ukrainians already in the UK?
This is total war. They’re literally showing the nation how to make homemade firebombs.
Any Ukrainian fleeing Ukraine is a refugee and should not need a visa regardless.
That is literally international law,
Furthermore, if Britain makes out it it supporting the nation then that is part of it.
UK pushed for Ukraine to be part of NATO. That’s to its credit.
They should have the same approach to migration to their approach for things with guns
It isn’t f@ck all to the 3 Ukrainians I know that will be benefiting from this approach.
Clearly much more can and should be done for those that are attempting to flee Ukraine, but those already here who have an upcoming visa renewal now aren’t fearing that they’d not secure a renewal and be forced back to what is now a war zone.
Asking the Russians to land on the air bases they just took?
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You don’t think this was a risk by taking money from a gangster and thief? That he might get his comeuppance?Dorset_Boy said:
Who is feeling sorry for him?Ben6899 said:People feeling sorry for Roman Abramovich.
You don't end up in Putin's pocket because you studied hard at school and went on to earn an honest living...
No one on here that I've seen.
Of course your Man Utd haven't taken any state money from Putin have they?0 -
They were notably less welcoming to the last bunch of refugees that turned up. I get that Ukraine is their next door neighbour but it's still a notable contrast.blazing_saddles said:
I would expect that to be the case at this juncture.rjsterry said:
Poland - Poland - is doing more for war refugees than us at the moment.Pross said:
Fair enough, in that case I agree it's a disgrace although with this Government you wouldn't expect anything else. Hopefully we'll take our share of refugees but I won't hold my breath.pblakeney said:
As of yesterday.Pross said:
Are they or are you just making assumptions?rick_chasey said:
They’re announcing this because they’re not announcing what they should be, which is visa waivers for all Ukrainians and routes to help refugees.Pross said:
Not sure if I'm reading that right as I seem to be seeing it differently to you. Aren't they just saying if you're here already we're going to let you stay longer? I don't think it is anything about who they are prepared to allow in going forward.rick_chasey said:
"The UK has stopped accepting visa applications from Ukrainians stuck in the country, meaning there is no safe and legal route for them to seek asylum in Britain unless they have British relatives."
More could be done to help.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
rick_chasey said:
I’d like to know how you or anyone else Uk expects to force people back to Ukraine?kingstonian said:rick_chasey said:
Because it is f@ck all obviously.kingstonian said:So what’s wrong with announcing what is being done for those Ukrainians already in the UK?
This is total war. They’re literally showing the nation how to make homemade firebombs.
Any Ukrainian fleeing Ukraine is a refugee and should not need a visa regardless.
That is literally international law,
Furthermore, if Britain makes out it it supporting the nation then that is part of it.
UK pushed for Ukraine to be part of NATO. That’s to its credit.
They should have the same approach to migration to their approach for things with guns
It isn’t f@ck all to the 3 Ukrainians I know that will be benefiting from this approach.
Clearly much more can and should be done for those that are attempting to flee Ukraine, but those already here who have an upcoming visa renewal now aren’t fearing that they’d not secure a renewal and be forced back to what is now a war zone.
Asking the Russians to land on the air bases they just took?
Stop doing your usual and trying to switch the topic. So tiresome.
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Sorry, did I miss the bit where they got involved before Pearl Harbour? They didn't feel it was their fight before that which is fair enough but they were hardly a guarantor. Even post-war I doubt the people of Poland, East Germany, Czechia / Slovakia etc. found them much of a comfort.rick_chasey said:
They had several hundred thousand troops stationed in Europe and set up NATO and with it the nuclear umbrella.Pross said:
It hasn't exactly been a guarantor historically when there has been war in Europe though has it? Very late to provide support in WW1 and only joined WW2 after being attacked. The latter half of the 20th century was more about their fear if communism than protecting Europe. Since then it has been them pressuring Europe to support the wars they've started.rick_chasey said:Honestly this invasion is so big. It’s shifts everything.
We’re in a new world where if you don’t have a big f@ck off military in Europe you are under threat.
US is also not the guarantor it once was. Europe is going to have to understand war at home is a legitimate problem and that they’re not a conceptual waste of space.
US is going to be preoccupied to their west, not East.
We need to get our head around the fact hard power is back in its relevance.
Don’t be so ungrateful. “Only joined WW2 after being attacked”
Whole of Europe would have been Soviet without them.0 -
How am I switching the topic?kingstonian said:rick_chasey said:
I’d like to know how you or anyone else Uk expects to force people back to Ukraine?kingstonian said:rick_chasey said:
Because it is f@ck all obviously.kingstonian said:So what’s wrong with announcing what is being done for those Ukrainians already in the UK?
This is total war. They’re literally showing the nation how to make homemade firebombs.
Any Ukrainian fleeing Ukraine is a refugee and should not need a visa regardless.
That is literally international law,
Furthermore, if Britain makes out it it supporting the nation then that is part of it.
UK pushed for Ukraine to be part of NATO. That’s to its credit.
They should have the same approach to migration to their approach for things with guns
It isn’t f@ck all to the 3 Ukrainians I know that will be benefiting from this approach.
Clearly much more can and should be done for those that are attempting to flee Ukraine, but those already here who have an upcoming visa renewal now aren’t fearing that they’d not secure a renewal and be forced back to what is now a war zone.
Asking the Russians to land on the air bases they just took?
Stop doing your usual and trying to switch the topic. So tiresome.
You said to paraphrase” at least the people I know don’t need to worry about being sent back to Ukraine because of this statement”
I’d like to know that without the govt statement how that would happen?
The Uk is doing far far far too little on the issue of Ukrainian refugees and that is indisputable.
It is disgraceful they are not doing more. End of.0 -
Enemy’s enemy etc.rjsterry said:
They were notably less welcoming to the last bunch of refugees that turned up. I get that Ukraine is their next door neighbour but it's still a notable contrast.blazing_saddles said:
I would expect that to be the case at this juncture.rjsterry said:
Poland - Poland - is doing more for war refugees than us at the moment.Pross said:
Fair enough, in that case I agree it's a disgrace although with this Government you wouldn't expect anything else. Hopefully we'll take our share of refugees but I won't hold my breath.pblakeney said:
As of yesterday.Pross said:
Are they or are you just making assumptions?rick_chasey said:
They’re announcing this because they’re not announcing what they should be, which is visa waivers for all Ukrainians and routes to help refugees.Pross said:
Not sure if I'm reading that right as I seem to be seeing it differently to you. Aren't they just saying if you're here already we're going to let you stay longer? I don't think it is anything about who they are prepared to allow in going forward.rick_chasey said:
"The UK has stopped accepting visa applications from Ukrainians stuck in the country, meaning there is no safe and legal route for them to seek asylum in Britain unless they have British relatives."
More could be done to help.
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So how far does everyone think Putin wants to go?
Attack most of Ukraine and then retreat/negotiate to keep the two disputed areas?
Try and hold the whole of Ukraine?
Or even further into Europe?0 -
From the BBC this evening ..........
UK Foreign Secretary Liz Truss has drawn up a new hit-list of Russian oligarchs to be sanctioned, The Sunday Times reports.
Liz Truss says more of the super-rich linked to Vladimir Putin's regime will be hit with restrictions in the coming weeks.
The paper says she warned them: “We will come after you... there will be nowhere left to hide."0 -
What do the women do? Hand out white feathers to the men not fighting?rick_chasey said:
What do you expect from mobilisation? It’s not voluntary. It’s an existential war for the nation - every able man fights.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
This is old school behaviour from Russia.0 -
Plenty have signed up.TheBigBean said:
What do the women do? Hand out white feathers to the men not fighting?rick_chasey said:
What do you expect from mobilisation? It’s not voluntary. It’s an existential war for the nation - every able man fights.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
This is old school behaviour from Russia.
It’s just not compulsory. What would you rather?0 -
Depends on success in Ukraine but Moldova and beyond in that region is on the cards. They already have an enclave there.diplodicus said:So how far does everyone think Putin wants to go?
Attack most of Ukraine and then retreat/negotiate to keep the two disputed areas?
Try and hold the whole of Ukraine?
Or even further into Europe?0 -
I wasn't really thinking about whether he was successful, more what his aims are...0
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Hopefully the Ukrainians will make it so painful that they will return to Russia.
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A lot of them are going to fight, too. Zelensky has banned men between the ages of 18 and 60 from leaving the country so of course it will be mostly women, children and the elderly evacuating. Not sure what you are getting at.TheBigBean said:
What do the women do? Hand out white feathers to the men not fighting?rick_chasey said:
What do you expect from mobilisation? It’s not voluntary. It’s an existential war for the nation - every able man fights.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
This is old school behaviour from Russia.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Honestly I think he will go as far as he can before he is stopped.diplodicus said:I wasn't really thinking about whether he was successful, more what his aims are...
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I just find it odd that you are outraged that Ukrainian women can't fly direct to London to claim asylum, but you appear to have no concerns about Ukrainian men who can't even leave the country.rick_chasey said:
Plenty have signed up.TheBigBean said:
What do the women do? Hand out white feathers to the men not fighting?rick_chasey said:
What do you expect from mobilisation? It’s not voluntary. It’s an existential war for the nation - every able man fights.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
This is old school behaviour from Russia.
It’s just not compulsory. What would you rather?
What would I rather? Voluntary for all.
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Not gonna win a war like this like that.TheBigBean said:
I just find it odd that you are outraged that Ukrainian women can't fly direct to London to claim asylum, but you appear to have no concerns about Ukrainian men who can't even leave the country.rick_chasey said:
Plenty have signed up.TheBigBean said:
What do the women do? Hand out white feathers to the men not fighting?rick_chasey said:
What do you expect from mobilisation? It’s not voluntary. It’s an existential war for the nation - every able man fights.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
This is old school behaviour from Russia.
It’s just not compulsory. What would you rather?
What would I rather? Voluntary for all.
It’s sh!t for everyone. And bluntly, it’s not the place to worry about gender equality.0 -
DB may have his finger more on the pulse of the British public than some of us- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
I disagree. If you are fighting for a democracy part of that is the freedom to leave.rick_chasey said:
Not gonna win a war like this like that.TheBigBean said:
I just find it odd that you are outraged that Ukrainian women can't fly direct to London to claim asylum, but you appear to have no concerns about Ukrainian men who can't even leave the country.rick_chasey said:
Plenty have signed up.TheBigBean said:
What do the women do? Hand out white feathers to the men not fighting?rick_chasey said:
What do you expect from mobilisation? It’s not voluntary. It’s an existential war for the nation - every able man fights.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
This is old school behaviour from Russia.
It’s just not compulsory. What would you rather?
What would I rather? Voluntary for all.
It’s sh!t for everyone. And bluntly, it’s not the place to worry about gender equality.0 -
If you lose there is no democracy anyway. Gotta win it first. The military ain’t a democracy for good reasonsTheBigBean said:
I disagree. If you are fighting for a democracy part of that is the freedom to leave.rick_chasey said:
Not gonna win a war like this like that.TheBigBean said:
I just find it odd that you are outraged that Ukrainian women can't fly direct to London to claim asylum, but you appear to have no concerns about Ukrainian men who can't even leave the country.rick_chasey said:
Plenty have signed up.TheBigBean said:
What do the women do? Hand out white feathers to the men not fighting?rick_chasey said:
What do you expect from mobilisation? It’s not voluntary. It’s an existential war for the nation - every able man fights.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
This is old school behaviour from Russia.
It’s just not compulsory. What would you rather?
What would I rather? Voluntary for all.
It’s sh!t for everyone. And bluntly, it’s not the place to worry about gender equality.0 -
There you go stevo. USAF MC-130J Commando II special ops tanker in a climb out from the Polish / Ukraine border just now. It’s main job is to fuel slow aircraft like the Ospreys, Blackhawks and Chinooks and HALO parachute drops (I doubt they’re doing the latter). What those rotor aircraft that we can’t see are doing is speculation, but I’d put my money on in country supply drops.
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Our (UK's) refugee policy is within our sphere of influence though. How Ukraine decides to defend itself is less so.TheBigBean said:
I disagree. If you are fighting for a democracy part of that is the freedom to leave.rick_chasey said:
Not gonna win a war like this like that.TheBigBean said:
I just find it odd that you are outraged that Ukrainian women can't fly direct to London to claim asylum, but you appear to have no concerns about Ukrainian men who can't even leave the country.rick_chasey said:
Plenty have signed up.TheBigBean said:
What do the women do? Hand out white feathers to the men not fighting?rick_chasey said:
What do you expect from mobilisation? It’s not voluntary. It’s an existential war for the nation - every able man fights.TheBigBean said:No male refugees. Very old school. No chat about that here either.
This is old school behaviour from Russia.
It’s just not compulsory. What would you rather?
What would I rather? Voluntary for all.
It’s sh!t for everyone. And bluntly, it’s not the place to worry about gender equality.- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0
