Stage 20 TdF 2015 - Modane Valfréjus/Alpe d'Huez**SPOILERS**
Comments
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Certainly one of the hardest tours in recents years that I can remember.0
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A lot of talk about who should have done what and where. The simple fact is if you have the form, you attack, If you dont have the form you cant. The strongest rider over the three weeks won.0
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Certainly one of the hardest tours in recents years that I can remember.
I suspect this was behind Riis' comments about Froome making a big mistake by chasing solo yesterday. A little more of that effort may have made the Alpe harder.
Just to add that the failure of Quintana to try repeated full-gas attacks, when he clearly had the measure at least once, suggests that recovery doesn't come for free these days....a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.0 -
Great comments from Contador:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/contador-has-no-regrets-over-failed-giro-tour-double-attempt
The fact he gave it a go you have to give him respect. I for one would like to see him lunching searing attacks against Quintana and Froome in the tour.
Yeah his style and attitude would really lend itself to the spectacle. He beat Quintana at Route du Sud before the Tour so surprised he is so far back...cummulative fatigue most likely.
Quintana just used the Route du Sud as a bit of a warm up and to do some reconnaissance of the Plateau de Beille. He was just following Contador's wheel.0 -
They both were in a way but Quintana clearly said Contador was stronger so wouldn't take a pull. Unless he was lying...but he doesnt strike me as that sort of person.Contador is the Greatest0
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Would be a shame for him to retire at end of 2016 if he won Olympic RR - imagine all the bling bits of kit he'd have for the next 4 years, if nothing else...
What, like black shoes with grey socks?0 -
A lot of talk about who should have done what and where. The simple fact is if you have the form, you attack, If you dont have the form you cant. The strongest rider over the three weeks won.
You just need better form than your opponent, you don't know his form that is why you have to attack and hope yours is better, especially at over 3 minutes down. There were other opportunities in the Alps, when Contador attacked the other day, when Nibali went, he needed to roll the dice.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
The fact he gave it a go you have to give him respect.
Should you give someone respect for doing what their boss told them to do? And thinking about it, this is the 2nd time Contador tried the Giro/Tour double. Failed both times for the same reason. Was it really such a smart move?
Anyway, I'm more interested to see how the younger riders do next year. Impressed with how both Pinot and Bardet picked themselves up after having problems early in the race.0 -
Certainly one of the hardest tours in recents years that I can remember.
I suspect this was behind Riis' comments about Froome making a big mistake by chasing solo yesterday. A little more of that effort may have made the Alpe harder.
Just to add that the failure of Quintana to try repeated full-gas attacks, when he clearly had the measure at least once, suggests that recovery doesn't come for free these days.
Yeah, it's that lack of recovery that convinces me the sport is much cleaner now than a decade ago. It's not just in race recovery either, as we've seen with Bertie recovering between races is a struggle too and we haven't seen anyone retain a Tour (or Giro) title for a few years now.0 -
Quintana was better than I expected.
I also liked the way Movistar (and friends) choreographed this. Seeing Valverde, Super Mario and Winner working for Quintana one after the other was really well done.0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19664762#p19664762]disgruntledgoat[/url] wrote:
Uck. Henmanhillamendous
This from someone who would write "Contador" on his c0ck if he thought it would get him noticed by 'His Man' !0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19664762#p19664762]disgruntledgoat[/url] wrote:
Uck. Henmanhillamendous
This from someone who would write "Contador" on his c0ck if he thought it would get him noticed by 'His Man' !
I would?!"In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
Not only is Froome the first Brit to win the Tour twice, he's the second English speaker to win the KOM*.
(I became a smug bellend thanks to the first.)
*Cycling Podcast intel...a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.0 -
A lot of talk about who should have done what and where. The simple fact is if you have the form, you attack, If you dont have the form you cant. The strongest rider over the three weeks won.
You just need better form than your opponent, you don't know his form that is why you have to attack and hope yours is better, especially at over 3 minutes down. There were other opportunities in the Alps, when Contador attacked the other day, when Nibali went, he needed to roll the dice.
I think he would have gone with Niabli, he commended the move as well. The reason he didn't go is because he was on the verge of cramping all stage (so he did well to only lose what he did). I would have been SO happy he he gone with Niabli, would have been the best thing about the whole Tour.Contador is the Greatest0 -
"“We fought all that we could to try and gain the time we had lost on Froome, with an attacking strategy from far, far away from the finish, trying to isolate him at the Croix de Fer, yet we couldn't open a big gap and we had to give all into the final ascent. Winner Anacona did an amazing job for me, riding strong and steady through most of Alpe d'Huez, and the whole team helped me much from the very start, but it wasn't to be today.
"I leave the race satisfied. We lost the Tour in the first week, but I'll stay content after all good things we found during this race: I've got an excellent team, which always took care and supported me, and we all are happy with this. Alejandro? I'm so, so excited about his podium finish. It's something he searched for during most of his sporting career, and he got it today. There's many people who don't know the kind of rider he is: he wins from January to December, no matter if it's a classic, a one-week race... and even podium finishes in three-week grandtours. It's already a decade since he's on top of the sport and many people don't value enough what he does, and criticized him. He's a superb rider and a wonderful person."
~Quintana0 -
For all Quintana's attacking yesterday ultimately he didn't achieve anything except what he started with i.e. the white jersey. No yellow, no polka dot, no stage win, must be pretty disappointing. Didn't win a stage, no-one in the team even won a stage!Eddy Merckx EMX-3
Dolan L'Etape
Cougar Zero Uno
Genesis Core 50
Planet X TOR0 -
Another thing which strikes me about Quintana is that he seems such a quiet, reserved type, it's hard to imagine him taking charge of a team quite in the same way that Froome or Contador would.
A lot of people seemed to be praising Valverde on this Tour as well and maybe he fullfilled this function to take the pressure off Quintana. However, I very rarely saw Valverde performing the "loyal lieutenant's" job for Quintana like Thomas or Porte did for Froome. Mostly it was lone attacks off the front which everyone supposed was Movistar's strategy but even when they did come together it didn't seem to last very long.
Witness the Valverde attack on the upper part of the CdF yesterday and Quintana then bridged across to him and Valverde seemed to then slow letting Froome close the gap. I think Quintana would stand a much better chance without Valverde around to split the team's efforts.0 -
I'm not sure Valverde slowed as much as he couldn't ride at the pace Quintana required. Can you imagine the effort to escape from Froome even just riding tempo up a mountain. Valverde just didn't have it.Another thing which strikes me about Quintana is that he seems such a quiet, reserved type, it's hard to imagine him taking charge of a team quite in the same way that Froome or Contador would.
A lot of people seemed to be praising Valverde on this Tour as well and maybe he fullfilled this function to take the pressure off Quintana. However, I very rarely saw Valverde performing the "loyal lieutenant's" job for Quintana like Thomas or Porte did for Froome. Mostly it was lone attacks off the front which everyone supposed was Movistar's strategy but even when they did come together it didn't seem to last very long.
Witness the Valverde attack on the upper part of the CdF yesterday and Quintana then bridged across to him and Valverde seemed to then slow letting Froome close the gap. I think Quintana would stand a much better chance without Valverde around to split the team's efforts.0 -
I don't really know what else Valverde could have done. Other than maybe attacking like he was still blood doping.0
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Odd comment considering Froome and Contador are the very definition of quiet, reserved types. Quintana actually says all the right things (also quietly). I have been impressed with the content if not the delivery of his answers to the press during this Tour.Another thing which strikes me about Quintana is that he seems such a quiet, reserved type, it's hard to imagine him taking charge of a team quite in the same way that Froome or Contador would.
Obviously being a team leader in a bike race does not require the same qualities as being a manager in a bank or even a lieutenant in a platoon. Your legs do most of the talking. That’s why Froome, Contador, and Quintana have all proved effective team leaders despite not being cut out for giving motivation speeches.
The persona that Froome and Contador project is at odds with what I have read about both of them behind the scenes. Dave Brailsford said in his post-stage interview yesterday that on the bike Froome is the most resiliant character he has ever met. Luke Rowe also described him as a pit bull and he should know.
I'm not criticising Quintana because he does let his legs do the talking. I just get the impression that he doesn't seem to organise the team to support him that often and takes a lot of the responsibilty for attacking all on himself. This may have been partially the reason for the lost time in Stage 2 but having said that the same thing happened to Froome in a previous Tour so it's inconclusive I know.
I do think Quintana has to be a bit more tactically savvy if he is to win a future Tour but he may well have learned a lot from this year's failed attempt and he is relatively young after all.0 -
Where's the other 'O' disappeared to. Unless of course they are fans of the Edith Wharton novel Ethan Frome
Maybe they love the Somerset market town. Had they known how to spell their hero's name they could have done away with a 'y' or the !0 -
I don't really know what else Valverde could have done. Other than maybe attacking like he was still blood doping.
If Valverde didn't have it then I'm not sure what any of his attacks achieved. It certainly didn't rattle Sky at any point and didn't help Quintana one iota so what was the point? Quintana actually seemed to get a bit of help from Ancona who was up the road yesterday but Valverde might just have well not been there in my opinion.
I'm pretty sure that if Valverde could have got away and actually gained any time on Quintana during the three weeks he would have. I always got the impression he was stalking the Columbian just hoping he would fail so that Valverde could regain the No 1 spot in the team.0 -
The penultimate stage was an anti-climax. In a year when the time trial distances were much less than previous years, Quintana failed to make his advantages in the mountains count. That should be a concern to him.0
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Someone just told me that yesterday Froome said he was a human being first and foremost and should be treated as such. Just about sums it up for me.
Says more about you to be honest.
I don't see what he's said there that's in any way bad. I read it as he agrees that Froome doesn't deserve all this vitriol.
Exactly this...which is how 99% of normal people would read it.
You wouldnt spit etc on a man on the street you don't like so just because he is doing a sport doesnt justify it even more. There is a minimum moral acceptability which doesnt change.
Cut to two days ago...
Glad he is my man. Glad he has won a Giro and Vuelta that Froome hasnt. Great comments. Proper racer.
See comments about Froome. The guy is an egotitstical bad loser with his lanky legs, no attacks, off-putting style and posh voice. The guy has clearly spent too much time in private school. Nibali's attacks is irrelevant from a GC perspective, Froome just wants a moan. The world does not revolve around you what what tally ho.
As for the bar and the Sky dislike. As I have explained to you already, there are obvious reasosn people never liked them.0 -
The penultimate stage was an anti-climax. In a year when the time trial distances were much less than previous years, Quintana failed to make his advantages in the mountains count. That should be a concern to him.
Quintana is young, he'll keep improving.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
Indeed. Contractor is mentally hard, winning despite Armstrong and Bruyneel, and also quick read early in this race where a team mate badly positioned himself allowing none Saxo to ride the Saxo echelon. Froome too is mentally solid, handling the stuff in this Tour much of which was unacceptable. Quintana will have to learn, he had the benefit in this race of all the extra crap thrown at Froome, and Froome having continuous Yellow resonsibilities he didn't.The persona that Froome and Contador project is at odds with what I have read about both of them behind the scenes. Dave Brailsford said in his post-stage interview yesterday that on the bike Froome is the most resiliant character he has ever met. Luke Rowe also described him as a pit bull and he should know.
I'm not criticising Quintana because he does let his legs do the talking. I just get the impression that he doesn't seem to organise the team to support him that often and takes a lot of the responsibilty for attacking all on himself. This may have been partially the reason for the lost time in Stage 2 but having said that the same thing happened to Froome in a previous Tour so it's inconclusive I know.
I do think Quintana has to be a bit more tactically savvy if he is to win a future Tour but he may well have learned a lot from this year's failed attempt and he is relatively young after all.0 -
Certainly one of the hardest tours in recents years that I can remember.
I suspect this was behind Riis' comments about Froome making a big mistake by chasing solo yesterday. A little more of that effort may have made the Alpe harder.
Just to add that the failure of Quintana to try repeated full-gas attacks, when he clearly had the measure at least once, suggests that recovery doesn't come for free these days.
Yeah, it's that lack of recovery that convinces me the sport is much cleaner now than a decade ago. It's not just in race recovery either, as we've seen with Bertie recovering between races is a struggle too and we haven't seen anyone retain a Tour (or Giro) title for a few years now.
Indeed. Gone are the days of the same usual suspects bombing up every MTF day after day, sailing past the remains of a breakaway with 3 km to go and taking all the stage wins. Sky managed it once on stage 10, and then managed the combination of defence and fatigue there after. Its just not possible any more without some special jus d'orange.Edinburgh Revolution Curve
http://app.strava.com/athletes/19200480 -
Duty call for a few days so couldn't watch the stage. Lots of good links on this thread so thanks. The one of Valverde makes everything about today ok! The guy is fuiroclasse and I have been a fan since forever and am glad to see lots of you warm to him over the last couple of years after the amount of abuse he sustained on these forums. He started in 2003 and did it with a bang and a scream from a palmares perspective (well worth a gander). 8 years of trying for the Tour podium and now he gets it and never by riding wheels.
Got to love little Nairo whose voice and face bely his stature and age. I wish they did more interviews with him. Guy is poetry on the bike when he attacks, pure joy creation visually and emotionally.
Congratulations Froome on your 2nd GT win, one more and you match Nibali. It wasnt pretty today and it wasnt impressive but you won the Tour. I would have been very scared myself to ride up there today with all those numpties (constant booing). As for the video posted by G, they are all from Ned so I wouldnt expect much, still complete and utter tossers.
Pinot, Pinot, very little congratulations on here but you have mine. Excellent win albeit with that odd style of his. Very pleased he and Bardet got a huge win and fought hard on other days; animators.
Contador, I must admit I thought he would be challenging for the win so disappointed with his performance but then I suppose I underestimate the Giro fatigue. And those grey socks mate, just plain wrong, like wearing tracksuit bottoms and dress shoes.
Hope you guys enjoyed the Tour overall. Been a very mixed bag from my side.
Poetry Frenchie.
When I'm on tour I wear tracksuit bottoms a lot and often have to through on my docs because I can't find other shoes when we do a toilet stop.0 -
Duty call for a few days so couldn't watch the stage. Lots of good links on this thread so thanks. The one of Valverde makes everything about today ok! The guy is fuiroclasse and I have been a fan since forever and am glad to see lots of you warm to him over the last couple of years after the amount of abuse he sustained on these forums. He started in 2003 and did it with a bang and a scream from a palmares perspective (well worth a gander). 8 years of trying for the Tour podium and now he gets it and never by riding wheels.
Got to love little Nairo whose voice and face bely his stature and age. I wish they did more interviews with him. Guy is poetry on the bike when he attacks, pure joy creation visually and emotionally.
Congratulations Froome on your 2nd GT win, one more and you match Nibali. It wasnt pretty today and it wasnt impressive but you won the Tour. I would have been very scared myself to ride up there today with all those numpties (constant booing). As for the video posted by G, they are all from Ned so I wouldnt expect much, still complete and utter tossers.
Pinot, Pinot, very little congratulations on here but you have mine. Excellent win albeit with that odd style of his. Very pleased he and Bardet got a huge win and fought hard on other days; animators.
Contador, I must admit I thought he would be challenging for the win so disappointed with his performance but then I suppose I underestimate the Giro fatigue. And those grey socks mate, just plain wrong, like wearing tracksuit bottoms and dress shoes.
Hope you guys enjoyed the Tour overall. Been a very mixed bag from my side.
Poetry Frenchie.
When I'm on tour I wear tracksuit bottoms a lot and often have to through on my docs because I can't find other shoes when we do a toilet stop.
Not quite, just the usual Sky bashing and Contador blikered excuses, but hey, you are more than entitled to your opinion. The best man won, as always, and Contador was nowhere. No excuses, If you start you are there to be beaten. Man up.0 -
To be honest there's neither of those in Frenchie's post. He congratulates Froome and says Contador was fatigued (which any reasonable person would agree with though most were predicting it in advance). I'm sure you only post on here to raise an argument with FF and decided to see what you wanted / expected to just to argue.0
