Stage 16 TdF 2015 Bourg-de-Peage - Gap *SPOILERS*
Comments
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[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19658202#p19658202]The Loyal Lieutenant[/url] wrote:Exactly right. The move to high cadence removed a lot of strain on the muscular system from low cadence pedalling and instead placed it on the cardiovascular system. Because of EPO use, the extra capacity the body then had to absorb and use oxygen resulted in the massive performance gains we saw in the past.
I know this is often claimed but is there any actual evidence for it ?[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
Just watched this.
Sagan descends like I used to 20 years ago...lol, no fear. I love the high speed cornering, one if not the most exciting bit of riding a bike.
luckily for Thomas his speed wasn't that high in that tight corner before Barguile moshed him and his shoulder hit the post first so the head was just a glancing low speed blow exactly what helmets are designed for.
Whilst several posters are calling for Barguile's head that's nonsense, he made a mistake, his excuse about TJ is bollox he was going way too fast and still failed to brake enough before and after the contact to make the corner.
However though it does put another rider in a bit of bother and could have being worse, that can be applied to so many incidents in competitive cycle racing especially riders taking risks in the rain, in sprints, on cobbles all over the place and in many other sports besides.0 -
Barguil apologizes and Thomas doesn't bare a grudge so I guess it's all over. I really thought it was bad for gnomes for a while but hopefully he's ok today.0
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Descenders? Bahamontes was the 'Eagle of Toledo' and Charly Gaul was supposedly superb but there is v.little or no footage of them. It was said that if you tried to follow Bettini downhill there was a good chance you would die.
Yesterday was another day at the TdF and another story to add to it's history. No-one got injured but that accident will get replayed for years. Wonder who'll go nuts on the Allos descent?M.Rushton0 -
Thomas commenting on the incident later:-
“It’s frustrating because you try so hard to get over that climb … I don’t know why some guys sit where you are on the descent, what’s the difference between fifth and third?
“Just get down the descent, everyone knows it’s a tough descent,” Thomas added.
That's basically it in a nutshell. What was Barguil thinking? WIth less than 8km to the finish there was no way he was going to make any time on the others and if he had wanted to he should have gone earlier on the descent like maybe Valverde tried. At that point of the race he should have just followed the wheels and got down safely.
To try and explain it away by a collision with TVG throwing him off line is just pathetic. He shouldn't have even been on a line going at a speed where he could have collided with any other rider which was always going to be be potentially dangerous.0 -
Love you guys commenting on how you think Barguil can descend after the fact.
Well here is a fact for you, when descending the Tourmalet Barguil made up a minute or so gap on the GC group after he got dropped not long before the top of the climb.
He is only 23 and currently top 10 in the TdF, 8th in the Vuelta, 8th in Strade Bianche and has two GT wins to his name. All this while on a small team dedicated to sprinters. His dad also died when he was younger which is a large part of his inspiration when attacking up the mountains. The guy is simply wonderful, a massive talent, has more panache then the whole Sky team (full, not just Tour team) combined and provides a lot of entertainment for the fans. I don't think Porte or Froome even knew pro cycling existed at his age.
Contador is the Greatest0 -
You'd think he'd know how to hold his line on a corner then"In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19658532#p19658532]disgruntledgoat[/url] wrote:You'd think he'd know how to hold his line on a corner then
Quite. No number of pretty pictures and past exploits change the fact he rode like a d*ck yesterday (repeating the divebombing at a later corner as well).
I can just imagine the reaction if the incident had been the other way round.0 -
Frenchfighter is completely right. Barguil is a very good descender. But also a bit young and reckless. Sagan overcooked some corners on that descent. Doesn't mean he's a poor descender. Young Warren will hear about it the next few days in the peloton, and I'm sure he's learned from it0
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No criticism of English-speaking Van Garderen for drifting off the line and into the racing Barguil? I totally understand what Barguil was attempting (he was racing) but I have no clue why TJVG would make such a dangerous maneuver.0
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Yep, great to watch.Can't recall a better descender than Sagan. I really can't. Absolutely incredible.
But since Plaza stayed away to win by 30 seconds (after apparently having 50 seconds at the top) and Pantano was only 6 seconds behind Sagan I'd venture that both those riders descended pretty darned fast too.
I wouldn't give young Barguil too hard a time. He had the decency to admit his mistake and apologise straight away, something a lot of riders could learn from.Aspire not to have more, but to be more.0 -
No criticism of English-speaking Van Garderen for drifting off the line and into the racing Barguil? I totally understand what Barguil was attempting (he was racing) but I have no clue why TJVG would make such a dangerous maneuver.
Meh, the problem was Barguil divebombing him, and it was going to end badly regardless. It was just a brush on TJVG as he was passing. Too fast, too close to the corner, too tight a line. He got it wrong. It happens.0 -
Hushovd is maybe the best I've seen.
didn't watch cycling throughout his entire career but this day was pretty special
apparently L'Equipe did a survey of the peloton in 2009 to ask who the best descender was, and Thor was the top pick0 -
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No criticism of English-speaking Van Garderen for drifting off the line and into the racing Barguil? I totally understand what Barguil was attempting (he was racing) but I have no clue why TJVG would make such a dangerous maneuver.
Really? Because the other members of the group he was riding with didn't.
Quintana was clearly unimpressed. Not only did he give him the stare down at the finish,
he made a post stage comment to the effect that Barguil was trying to move up position while he should have been just riding the climb.
Mollema also had words with him on the climb as he almost took him out, with another error further down the climb.
As for Van Garderen moving out. He was riding his line into the corner. Why should he be forded wide by a guy who had no right to be there?
Bottom line was Barguil wanted to attack, in the way Nibali did.
He tried, he failed and ended up at the back of the group.
Instead of calling it a day, he decided he should force his way to the front on a difficult downhill, then try and get off the front.
It's all well and good a riding risking his personal safety, but not that of his fellow riders.
As it is, he didn't only owe Thomas an apology, but thanks for saving him from potentially a self-inflicted serious injury from that telegraph pole."Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0 -
Absolutely. I did the same thing myself as a 4th cat in my first year racing.
Racing accident surely...
Hopefully Barguill is removed from the race tonight. That was an appalling move.
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Descenders? Bahamontes was the 'Eagle of Toledo' and Charly Gaul was supposedly superb but there is v.little or no footage of them. It was said that if you tried to follow Bettini downhill there was a good chance you would die.
Yesterday was another day at the TdF and another story to add to it's history. No-one got injured but that accident will get replayed for years. Wonder who'll go nuts on the Allos descent?
Bahamontes was a notoriously poor descender, there is that story, probably (in fact definitely) apocryphal, about him stopping at the top of a col for an ice cream to wait for the bunch because he didn't fancy the descent.
One of Bahamontes and Gaul was also famous for spinning up climbs in the days when most would grind up, not sure how he managed it with a 5 speed block and old fashioned front mech without having a ridiculously easy high gear but there you go.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
There's always some fool who dives down the inside on a corner with no idea why he's doing it.
I got a right bo**ocking once for doing it. He was a pro, I was 18.0 -
Bahamontes was a talented climber but a poor descender, sometimes taking one foot off the pedal to take mountain bends like a speedway rider. He landed in a cactus bush descending the Montserrat as an amateur and thereafter refused to descend mountains alone, once waiting at the top of a col in the Tour de France for other riders to arrive. He reached the top minutes before a chase group arrived, and famously passed the time eating ice cream by the side of the road.
My apologies on that - I knew someone had an ice cream somewhere in a TdF.M.Rushton0 -
@GeraintThomas86: Just seen some guy walking around with my yellow jersey on, holding hands with my pregnant wife.... #whatsgoingon0
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Love you guys commenting on how you think Barguil can descend after the fact.
Well here is a fact for you, when descending the Tourmalet Barguil made up a minute or so gap on the GC group after he got dropped not long before the top of the climb.
He is only 23 and currently top 10 in the TdF, 8th in the Vuelta, 8th in Strade Bianche and has two GT wins to his name. All this while on a small team dedicated to sprinters. His dad also died when he was younger which is a large part of his inspiration when attacking up the mountains. The guy is simply wonderful, a massive talent, has more panache then the whole Sky team (full, not just Tour team) combined and provides a lot of entertainment for the fans. I don't think Porte or Froome even knew pro cycling existed at his age.
so if he was choppering it up like a cat 4 idiot, thats ok then is it.
I agree, he is some talent, and he has a lot going for him. we'll call yesterdays moment stupidity.0 -
He's a Pinball Wazza:
Ain't got no distractions
Can't hear no buzzers and bells,
Don't see no lights a-flashin'
Plays by sense of smell.
Always gets a replay,
Never seen him fall.
That deaf, dumb and blind kid
Sure plays a mean pinball!...a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.0 -
Geraint Thomas @GeraintThomas86 9m9 minutes ago
Just seen some guy walking around with my yellow jersey on, holding hands with my pregnant wife.... #whatsgoingon
Ha! Still OK then.0 -
Plaza was a former Movistar rider. Friends.
Contador is the Greatest0 -
Can't recall a better descender than Sagan. I really can't. Absolutely incredible.
I didn't think he was too special today (edit: yesterday). I know there was a lot of throwing himself around and stuff but he didn't exactly put huge time into the rider behind, they were virtually on him at the finish (yes yes, more riders to pace on the final flat section, I know). It did look impressive though.
A lot of the guys in the groupetto could probably drop him. Read Cav's book, lots of remarks about being one of the best in the bunch simply because they have to make up time they lose going up hill. It was Renshaw that hit over 100km the other day2020 Reilly Spectre - raw titanium
2020 Merida Reacto Disc Ltd - black on black
2015 CAAD8 105 - very green - stripped to turbo bike
2018 Planet X Exocet 2 - grey
The departed:
2017 Cervelo R3 DI2 - sold
Boardman CX Team - sold
Cannondale Synapse - broken
Cube Streamer - stolen
Boardman Road Comp - stolen0 -
Love you guys commenting on how you think Barguil can descend after the fact.
Well here is a fact for you, when descending the Tourmalet Barguil made up a minute or so gap on the GC group after he got dropped not long before the top of the climb.
He is only 23 and currently top 10 in the TdF, 8th in the Vuelta, 8th in Strade Bianche and has two GT wins to his name. All this while on a small team dedicated to sprinters. His dad also died when he was younger which is a large part of his inspiration when attacking up the mountains. The guy is simply wonderful, a massive talent, has more panache then the whole Sky team (full, not just Tour team) combined and provides a lot of entertainment for the fans. I don't think Porte or Froome even knew pro cycling existed at his age.
so if he was choppering it up like a cat 4 idiot, thats ok then is it.
I agree, he is some talent, and he has a lot going for him. we'll call yesterdays moment stupidity.
It was textbook 4th cat riding. Screw up a corner, then find someone else to blame
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Bahamontes was a talented climber but a poor descender, sometimes taking one foot off the pedal to take mountain bends like a speedway rider. He landed in a cactus bush descending the Montserrat as an amateur and thereafter refused to descend mountains alone, once waiting at the top of a col in the Tour de France for other riders to arrive. He reached the top minutes before a chase group arrived, and famously passed the time eating ice cream by the side of the road.
My apologies on that - I knew someone had an ice cream somewhere in a TdF.
He stopped because he had a mechanical.I only stopped because two of my spokes were broke and I had to wait for assistance. I had got away with three guys, one of them a Belgian. The Belgian's team car came up to him to tell him not to collaborate because that was only going to favour me. When his car came past me, it struck a stone, which bounced up and broke my spokes. The Romeyere was a shortish climb [13.4 kilometres, topping out at 1,074 metres] but very tough, with some very steep sections. When I got to the top, with my spokes broken, I was nervous and really angry. There was no sign of [Spanish team director Julián ] Berrendero So I stopped. The summit was packed, just like every summit of the Tour. But there were two ice cream carts. I picked up a cone from one of them and put in a scoop of vanilla ice cream. At the time I was more angry with Berrendero than anything else.0 -
Good selection of shots FF.0
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On the Highlights program I noted Sagan's Epic "whoa" braking that almost overshot a right hander.
Try telling that to the old French guys I ended up watching with. I've never heard so many ooh lah lahs and seen so much hand shaking every time he cut a corner fine or ended up over cooking a corner.Can't recall a better descender than Sagan. I really can't. Absolutely incredible.
That if his brakes had failed he would have gone through the crowd and made a nice cushion for "G" Thomas to fall on. (Note, the van on the opposite corner)
This descent will have infamous memories of Bargy knocking Thomas and also the Beloki-Armstrong incident.Organiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 19720
