TdF 2015 - Stage 3 Anvers - Huy *SPOILERS*
Comments
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Hadn't appreciated how many riders were caught in the 2nd crash on the left hand side of the road (as you say, TV cameras missed it). I was kind of astonished that some people were arguing the race should not have been temporarily halted even after it became apparent that they had exhausted the medical cover.On this clip @1.05 you see the first crash, and then @ 1.18 you see the second crash Prudy was talking about.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mn-HeyBPs2c&feature=youtu.be
Think the cameras missed that 2nd one.0 -
Yeah I know you didn't, it was more directed towards certain others who have been debating the point :P There may have been a clear difference between the two sets of circumstances in this instance, but the question is where do you draw the line between acceptable and unacceptable (assuming doing so even makes sense)?I didn't make any comment as to whether it was ok or not - I was just pointing out that the circumstances were different.0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19643412#p19643412]Blazing Saddles[/url] wrote:Thank goodness I have that dave bloke on block as he is still posting pure drivel. Looks like Blazing will be next for the remainder of the Tour as he is possibly the number one Contador hater and Frenchie baiter.
Well, that's up to you, but what was written was true.
In certain places, a load of abuse hurled at Sky, followed by praise for Astana and Tinkoff repeating the same act.
Hardly the stuff of informed, intelligent debate, more the stuff of the average 10 year old.
Nothing to do with loving or hating riders, just disliking the attitude of those who can resist the urge to express their double standards in text.
It's pretty simple. The Tinkoff move was quite a bit after the crash and neutralization. The Sky move was immediately after it. There are no double standards, there never have been, take your glazed glasses off.
I suggest you try to watch more stage starts and watch what happens when Mr Prudhomme waves his little white flag.
You don't get to call when "acceptable" racing can commence; he does.
If the race director got it wrong at the time because he wasn't aware of what was happening behind, how the heck are the riders supposed to know?"Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0 -
To be fair, if Sky hadn't attacked when the race was un-neutralised (regardless of its subsequent re-neutralisation) and they'd been caught out by another team attacking they'd have been criticised from some quarters. They just can't win with some people, it's as simple as that.Correlation is not causation.0
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some French people
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[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19643529#p19643529]Blazing Saddles[/url] wrote:I suggest you try to watch more stage starts and watch what happens when Mr Prudhomme waves his little white flag.
You don't get to call when "acceptable" racing can commence; he does.
If the race director got it wrong at the time because he wasn't aware of what was happening behind, how the heck are the riders supposed to know?
This is irrelevant to the discussion.
My point still stands.
'Debating' with a lot of you is pointless hence the move to block and save me time as I spend enough time on this forum as it is.Contador is the Greatest0 -
To be fair, if Sky hadn't attacked when the race was un-neutralised (regardless of its subsequent re-neutralisation) and they'd been caught out by another team attacking they'd have been criticised from some quarters. They just can't win with some people, it's as simple as that.
There must be more posts suggesting what 'Sky critics' fans would say in hypothetical situations then what 'Sky critics' say in actual racing situations :roll:
Not sure who your post is being fair to either. Maybe yourself?Contador is the Greatest0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19643529#p19643529]Blazing Saddles[/url] wrote:I suggest you try to watch more stage starts and watch what happens when Mr Prudhomme waves his little white flag.
You don't get to call when "acceptable" racing can commence; he does.
Quite so. Even in amateur racing when the flag drops, the race is on, even if half the field is still stuck behind a tractor in the neutral zone. And you don't stop before the finish unless your legs fall off, your bike breaks or the marshalls' cars block you in like French trucker impersonators.0 -
Yeah I know you didn't, it was more directed towards certain others who have been debating the point :P There may have been a clear difference between the two sets of circumstances in this instance, but the question is where do you draw the line between acceptable and unacceptable (assuming doing so even makes sense)?I didn't make any comment as to whether it was ok or not - I was just pointing out that the circumstances were different.
There is no line. The sport feeds on the inevitable feuds. Valverde is Spanish for vendetta....a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.0 -
Can we modify the forum so people can get little labels underneath their avatars? Would make it a lot easier to keep track. Potential suggestions include:
- Sky hater/lover (obviously nothing in between is conceivable)
- Contador hater
- Frenchie baiter
- True champion
- ...
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Yates finished right up there despite crashing:
Contador is the Greatest0 -
Contador is the Greatest0 -
I know that road very well on my many trips to F.W. and coming off the motorway to go fast down hill to Andenne.I thought it and even wrote it here - they were going bizarrely fast given the race situation and moments to go. 60km to go, break with no threat - very odd.
I think one of the Orica guys said 80kmph but he may have been exaggerating... it was downhill at that stage...
When I read that I thought it was a bit much then TJ says 80-90km/h which is even more crazy. Looking at the photos though it was slightly downhill:
The on-bike footage (from someone at the back of the peloton) showed them tucking in on the downhill just before they reached the crash. Someone who rides should be able to say whether that matches the 42kph that is quoted from GPS on bikes
The camera didn't emphasise the speed they were traveling at.
My estimate was 70/80 KPH at least and 42 KPH is ludicrus considering the averages for any flat stage.
That TJ had time to look at the speed when I presume he glanced because of the high speed (and possibility of wheel wobble) and saw 75/80 KPH is acceptable to me and this picture shdendeows the modern bend of the road.
The carnage caused rather supports this point of view.
It was bloody Fast.
EDIT..No Pun IntendedOrganiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 19720 -
The 42kph figure was described as "average speed during fall" or something similar to that. Whatever it actually means, many riders saying it was 70+kph makes it pretty clear it was a lot faster than 42kph!0
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Can we modify the forum so people can get little labels underneath their avatars? Would make it a lot easier to keep track. Potential suggestions include:
- Sky hater/lover (obviously nothing in between is conceivable)
- Contador hater
- Frenchie baiter
- True champion
- ...
Aren't Contador hater and Frenchie baiter one and the same? In Frenchie's view anyway...0 - Sky hater/lover (obviously nothing in between is conceivable)
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Actually come to think of it anyone who is anything other than disgusted by Sky probably falls into that group too.0
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All this talk of blocking and I still have no idea how...0
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I did think about that, but I'm sure there must be things that qualify as "Frenchie baiting" without being "Contador hating" and I didn't want to lose such an important distinction.Can we modify the forum so people can get little labels underneath their avatars? Would make it a lot easier to keep track. Potential suggestions include:- Sky hater/lover (obviously nothing in between is conceivable)
- Contador hater
- Frenchie baiter
- True champion
- ...
Aren't Contador hater and Frenchie baiter one and the same? In Frenchie's view anyway...0 - Sky hater/lover (obviously nothing in between is conceivable)
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User control panel -> Friends and foes tab -> Add person to be blocked to foes list.All this talk of blocking and I still have no idea how...
(Oh and then make sure to tell them you've done it, otherwise what's the point!)0 -
Without trawling through the thread but has anyone seen the Irony of the Belgian stage a few years ago with Cancelara neutralising the stage of his own back while his team mates the Schleck's got back into the peloton.Organiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 19720
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on here, no - on twitter, a few
Watching the ES replay is interesting. Bertie wheelsucks Froome all the way up the climb. Thrn J-Rod and Gallopin go past on the inside and Bertie tries to follow but cant. Froome accelerates off the front to get on the back of Gallopin then moves past him as it flattens out and Gallopin fades.
So a little concerning for Bertie if he can't even hold Froome's wheel. But as said, it's a unique hill...
It really is a great place to end a bike race too. Such a cauldron of noise and painWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19643529#p19643529]Blazing Saddles[/url] wrote:I suggest you try to watch more stage starts and watch what happens when Mr Prudhomme waves his little white flag.
You don't get to call when "acceptable" racing can commence; he does.
If the race director got it wrong at the time because he wasn't aware of what was happening behind, how the heck are the riders supposed to know?
This is irrelevant to the discussion.
My point still stands.
'Debating' with a lot of you is pointless hence the move to block and save me time as I spend enough time on this forum as it is.
When the rules become irrelevant to a "debate" over the rules, then I would have to concede that your final sentence is correct."Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0 -
I never had the impession they were going 70+ on that stretch and I watched the whole stage so would like to think I was pretty tuned in to the rythmn of the race. Likewise the photo of Fab above doesn't show any true slope, however the key point is, once they were racing again they were very quickly going downhill and the Sky lad on the front (Kennaugh) was shown to be doing 75kph. So... regardless of what they were doing at the time of the accident, if all the medical people were dealing with that disaster, what if there'd been another serious accident 5 minutes later at a true downhill 75 kph? I hate to admit but they were right to stop it when they did... not that it stopped me dancin' round the living room with my arms raised above my head demoaning how soft the world has become - as basically Carlton and Kelly were doing.'Performance analysis and Froome not being clean was a media driven story. I haven’t heard one guy in the peloton say a negative thing about Froome, and I haven’t heard a single person in the peloton suggest Froome isn’t clean.' TSP0
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[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19643698#p19643698]Blazing Saddles[/url] wrote:When the rules become irrelevant to a "debate" over the rules, then I would have to concede that your final sentence is correct.
*sigh*Contador is the Greatest0 -
I never had the impession they were going 70+ on that stretch and I watched the whole stage so would like to think I was pretty tuned in to the rythmn of the race. Likewise the photo of Fab above doesn't show any true slope, however the key point is, once they were racing again they were very quickly going downhill and the Sky lad on the front (Kennaugh) was shown to be doing 75kph. So... regardless of what they were doing at the time of the accident, if all the medical people were dealing with that disaster, what if there'd been another serious accident 5 minutes later at a true downhill 75 kph? I hate to admit but they were right to stop it when they did... not that it stopped me dancin' round the living room with my arms raised above my head demoaning how soft the world has become - as basically Carlton and Kelly were doing.
But the carnage/casualties did.The camera didn't emphasise the speed they were traveling at.
Stopping the race was a safe and only thing to do by the organisers and the neutralising of the Cote de Bohissau gave everybody warm up space for the race to restart.Organiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 19720 -
Greipel's power data from the intermediate sprint
seven minutes leading into the sprint
short climb before the sprint requiring 2 mins at 515w
770w for the minute leading into the sprint
1000w average for 39seconds in the sprint to beat Degenkolb and 1350w for 20seconds max
beast0 -
That's some pretty scary numbers0
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Some own photos from Mur de Huy
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Great pictures +10
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That's some pretty scary numbers
indeed. these guys are just on another level. 1803 watts is pretty phenomenal (track sprint level almost). Be interesting to see J rods 1 minute power numbers up the Huy.0
