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No idea as I don't like hot drinks but just doing some quick calcs.skyblueamateur said:
Do people really spend £150 on coffee a month? I feel almost prehistoric.shirley_basso said:I don't think £5 per day £150/month, £2,000/annum is going to buy a house
I would have rattled out at least £150 most weekends on the tear in my 20's tbf but that seems better value then on coffee. Pffft.0 -
The most expensive coffee Starbucks sell is about £3.50, and it would be weekdays only, so make that £60-70/month for the committed caffeine junky. A 1-bed ex-council flat in Shadwell will cost you £800 a month to rent.Dorset_Boy said:
On its own it might not, but you have to start somewhere.shirley_basso said:I don't think £5 per day £150/month, £2,000/annum is going to buy a house
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
So actually it would be 3 years of saving at that rate, if you include purchase costs, and that excludes house price rises in the intervening period, during which time prices could well have doubled.Pross said:
It still depends massively on geography though. My daughter (23) bought her first house, a 3 bed semi, a few months ago for about £130k. Good sized ex-Council house with a large garden and located on the edge of a really nice park so no risk to the views over the countryside. Admittedly she was lucky enough to have inherited money to cover the deposit and got a 75% LTV mortgage but she would have saved a 10% deposit within 12 months. Her mortgage costs less than many of her friends were paying for their cars (and about the same as she is now paying for her car having got a new one after moving in and getting the house sorted).rick_chasey said:
If people think a coffee out every day is holding them back from home ownership I don't think they really understand the size of deposits required.pblakeney said:
Bejeezus you must work in a strange location. All of the 20's and early 30's (mostly pre-children) I've worked with in the past 10 years (various offices) walk into the office every morning with their takeaway bag and cup of coffee.
I'll offer an example. I have a friend who's 33 and currently lives with his parents. He earns above average, but not by much.
He's currently looking to buy a 1 bed. Only, the price of the houses are literally rising as quickly as he can save, so the cost of the flats near where he works are continuously out of reach.
it is ludicrous that this point is contested. All the published data on this is crystal clear. Even the literature coming out of banks points to this. There are now special products which are fairly popular where parents can help underwrite mortgages for their grown up children to compensate for the high LTV ratio.
All the while she wouldn't have been able to afford the car she now has, so presumably would have different work prospects.0 -
30% pa house price inflation?shirley_basso said:
So actually it would be 3 years of saving at that rate, if you include purchase costs, and that excludes house price rises in the intervening period, during which time prices could well have doubled.Pross said:
It still depends massively on geography though. My daughter (23) bought her first house, a 3 bed semi, a few months ago for about £130k. Good sized ex-Council house with a large garden and located on the edge of a really nice park so no risk to the views over the countryside. Admittedly she was lucky enough to have inherited money to cover the deposit and got a 75% LTV mortgage but she would have saved a 10% deposit within 12 months. Her mortgage costs less than many of her friends were paying for their cars (and about the same as she is now paying for her car having got a new one after moving in and getting the house sorted).rick_chasey said:
If people think a coffee out every day is holding them back from home ownership I don't think they really understand the size of deposits required.pblakeney said:
Bejeezus you must work in a strange location. All of the 20's and early 30's (mostly pre-children) I've worked with in the past 10 years (various offices) walk into the office every morning with their takeaway bag and cup of coffee.
I'll offer an example. I have a friend who's 33 and currently lives with his parents. He earns above average, but not by much.
He's currently looking to buy a 1 bed. Only, the price of the houses are literally rising as quickly as he can save, so the cost of the flats near where he works are continuously out of reach.
it is ludicrous that this point is contested. All the published data on this is crystal clear. Even the literature coming out of banks points to this. There are now special products which are fairly popular where parents can help underwrite mortgages for their grown up children to compensate for the high LTV ratio.
All the while she wouldn't have been able to afford the car she now has, so presumably would have different work prospects.
Is 3 years really a long time to save for a deposit?
Pross didn't suggest she wouldn't have had a car at all, I don't think.
PS There is a world outside the M25, and amazingly under 30s inhabit it too!0 -
My favourite example of this was arjsterry said:
The most expensive coffee Starbucks sell is about £3.50, and it would be weekdays only, so make that £60-70/month for the committed caffeine junky. A 1-bed ex-council flat in Shadwell will cost you £800 a month to rent.Dorset_Boy said:
On its own it might not, but you have to start somewhere.shirley_basso said:I don't think £5 per day £150/month, £2,000/annum is going to buy a house
Facebook video that suggested that you go without your flat white, and put the money in a bank earning 8 per cent interest.
I'm sure a while back everyone was in a panic because with lockdown and no one buying prets, suddenly loads of land was worthless. So do people want younguns to buy coffee or not!0 -
Point taken re price inflation, but 10% YoY wouldn't be unreasonable for the short term, which would coincide with the rate of her saving.
3y doesn't seem long, no.
He said she has a car now she has the house - if she was still saving for said house, then she wouldn't have the car, at a guess. I don't know what her situation was. At 23 you're just out of uni, perhaps living at home for 2 years with use of parents' car?
I don't live inside the M25. I am about 50 miles from Central London, as the crow flies.
Edit to add - this is presuming she was living at home during that time, thus not paying rent, etc.
I was told on no uncertain terms that I would be evicted by September of the year of my graduation, so was told to get looking. My net worth went down about £1,000 per year living in London, for about 5 years. Zero savings, zero pension, extending overdraft and a credit card.0 -
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Why is the average age of first time buyers rising?Dorset_Boy said:
30% pa house price inflation?
Is 3 years really a long time to save for a deposit?
Pross didn't suggest she wouldn't have had a car at all, I don't think.
PS There is a world outside the M25, and amazingly under 30s inhabit it too!0 -
Average age of becoming a parent is also rising.rick_chasey said:
Why is the average age of first time buyers rising?Dorset_Boy said:
30% pa house price inflation?
Is 3 years really a long time to save for a deposit?
Pross didn't suggest she wouldn't have had a car at all, I don't think.
PS There is a world outside the M25, and amazingly under 30s inhabit it too!
It's often been attributed to people (mainly women) wanting to have a career first, but I'm sure being able to buy/rent suitable housing in which to raise a family is also a factor.
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I also think people don't want to. I love parenthood, but there's a lot to be said about being a double-income couple with no kids.0
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Anyway, despite the protestations of the aged here, the modern left voting base see these as problems that need to be solved.
Whether or not the aged want to give that legitimacy or not is really an irrelevance with the original point I was making which was that a lot of people feel these are problems and it is up to the left to come up with a solution that works.
What are the solutions that mean, in the future, British working folk are in a better position than they are currently?
It can't just be pandering to an outdated idea of what it means to work for a wage. It can't be getting stuck into a culture war about values and whether the majority should compromise for minorities > that almost by definition cannot get you into power, even if it is important.0 -
I hear ya.shirley_basso said:I also think people don't want to. I love parenthood, but there's a lot to be said about being a double-income couple with no kids.
Wife and I travelled the world together, not quite at the drop of a hat, but we often did one nighters in places like Oslo, but also trips out into the wilds and -10degree temps looking for wildlife. Couldn't do that with the kids.
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The background as well is that wages for anyone under the age of 35 have stagnated for a decade now.0
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That is a matter of opinion. Sure, yours is a mainstream view, but people do do that sort of stuff with kids.elbowloh said:
I hear ya.shirley_basso said:I also think people don't want to. I love parenthood, but there's a lot to be said about being a double-income couple with no kids.
Wife and I travelled the world together, not quite at the drop of a hat, but we often did one nighters in places like Oslo, but also trips out into the wilds and -10degree temps looking for wildlife. Couldn't do that with the kids.0 -
Did you deliberately ignore the next part of the sentence?pangolin said:
BrilliantPross said:
It still depends massively on geography though. My daughter (23) bought her first house, a 3 bed semi, a few months ago for about £130k. Good sized ex-Council house with a large garden and located on the edge of a really nice park so no risk to the views over the countryside. Admittedly she was lucky enough to have inherited money to cover the deposit and got a 75% LTV mortgage but she would have saved a 10% deposit within 12 months. Her mortgage costs less than many of her friends were paying for their cars (and about the same as she is now paying for her car having got a new one after moving in and getting the house sorted).rick_chasey said:
If people think a coffee out every day is holding them back from home ownership I don't think they really understand the size of deposits required.pblakeney said:
Bejeezus you must work in a strange location. All of the 20's and early 30's (mostly pre-children) I've worked with in the past 10 years (various offices) walk into the office every morning with their takeaway bag and cup of coffee.
I'll offer an example. I have a friend who's 33 and currently lives with his parents. He earns above average, but not by much.
He's currently looking to buy a 1 bed. Only, the price of the houses are literally rising as quickly as he can save, so the cost of the flats near where he works are continuously out of reach.
it is ludicrous that this point is contested. All the published data on this is crystal clear. Even the literature coming out of banks points to this. There are now special products which are fairly popular where parents can help underwrite mortgages for their grown up children to compensate for the high LTV ratio.0 -
🤣Jezyboy said:
My favourite example of this was arjsterry said:
The most expensive coffee Starbucks sell is about £3.50, and it would be weekdays only, so make that £60-70/month for the committed caffeine junky. A 1-bed ex-council flat in Shadwell will cost you £800 a month to rent.Dorset_Boy said:
On its own it might not, but you have to start somewhere.shirley_basso said:I don't think £5 per day £150/month, £2,000/annum is going to buy a house
Facebook video that suggested that you go without your flat white, and put the money in a bank earning 8 per cent interest.
I'm sure a while back everyone was in a panic because with lockdown and no one buying prets, suddenly loads of land was worthless. So do people want younguns to buy coffee or not!1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Yes!Jezyboy said:
My favourite example of this was arjsterry said:
The most expensive coffee Starbucks sell is about £3.50, and it would be weekdays only, so make that £60-70/month for the committed caffeine junky. A 1-bed ex-council flat in Shadwell will cost you £800 a month to rent.Dorset_Boy said:
On its own it might not, but you have to start somewhere.shirley_basso said:I don't think £5 per day £150/month, £2,000/annum is going to buy a house
Facebook video that suggested that you go without your flat white, and put the money in a bank earning 8 per cent interest.
I'm sure a while back everyone was in a panic because with lockdown and no one buying prets, suddenly loads of land was worthless. So do people want younguns to buy coffee or not!
And no!1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
No but the next part isn't exactly helping your case either, as SB pointed out.Pross said:
Did you deliberately ignore the next part of the sentence?pangolin said:
BrilliantPross said:
It still depends massively on geography though. My daughter (23) bought her first house, a 3 bed semi, a few months ago for about £130k. Good sized ex-Council house with a large garden and located on the edge of a really nice park so no risk to the views over the countryside. Admittedly she was lucky enough to have inherited money to cover the deposit and got a 75% LTV mortgage but she would have saved a 10% deposit within 12 months. Her mortgage costs less than many of her friends were paying for their cars (and about the same as she is now paying for her car having got a new one after moving in and getting the house sorted).rick_chasey said:
If people think a coffee out every day is holding them back from home ownership I don't think they really understand the size of deposits required.pblakeney said:
Bejeezus you must work in a strange location. All of the 20's and early 30's (mostly pre-children) I've worked with in the past 10 years (various offices) walk into the office every morning with their takeaway bag and cup of coffee.
I'll offer an example. I have a friend who's 33 and currently lives with his parents. He earns above average, but not by much.
He's currently looking to buy a 1 bed. Only, the price of the houses are literally rising as quickly as he can save, so the cost of the flats near where he works are continuously out of reach.
it is ludicrous that this point is contested. All the published data on this is crystal clear. Even the literature coming out of banks points to this. There are now special products which are fairly popular where parents can help underwrite mortgages for their grown up children to compensate for the high LTV ratio.
The conversation was broadly about people being unable to buy on their own home as young as they could do in the past. Rick said earlier in the thread:
"That, combined with the cost of homeownership makes growing up just very different. A good proportion of people, especially ironically those who want good paying careers, can't expect to own homes without help from their parents until deep into their 30s."
Which is true. And a lot of the responses have been variations on "work harder", "it was tough for us as well" or "but my daughter bought a house (with money she inherited)". We even had DB inform us that phones used to be heavier in his day.
I guess I'm not sure what point you are making given the context. Yes, some parts of the country are cheaper than others. Yes, some people spend a lot on cars.- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
I don't get what you're saying. She could have had a deposit within 12 months, her mortgage payments would have been higher but still affordable (as in around £500 per month). Prices will probably rise over that time but we're talking 5-10% maybe, houses around here have taken about 15-20 years to double in price. By contrast she was previously renting a one bedroom flat in Salford with her then boyfriend that was costing more than double her current mortgage.shirley_basso said:
So actually it would be 3 years of saving at that rate, if you include purchase costs, and that excludes house price rises in the intervening period, during which time prices could well have doubled.Pross said:
It still depends massively on geography though. My daughter (23) bought her first house, a 3 bed semi, a few months ago for about £130k. Good sized ex-Council house with a large garden and located on the edge of a really nice park so no risk to the views over the countryside. Admittedly she was lucky enough to have inherited money to cover the deposit and got a 75% LTV mortgage but she would have saved a 10% deposit within 12 months. Her mortgage costs less than many of her friends were paying for their cars (and about the same as she is now paying for her car having got a new one after moving in and getting the house sorted).rick_chasey said:
If people think a coffee out every day is holding them back from home ownership I don't think they really understand the size of deposits required.pblakeney said:
Bejeezus you must work in a strange location. All of the 20's and early 30's (mostly pre-children) I've worked with in the past 10 years (various offices) walk into the office every morning with their takeaway bag and cup of coffee.
I'll offer an example. I have a friend who's 33 and currently lives with his parents. He earns above average, but not by much.
He's currently looking to buy a 1 bed. Only, the price of the houses are literally rising as quickly as he can save, so the cost of the flats near where he works are continuously out of reach.
it is ludicrous that this point is contested. All the published data on this is crystal clear. Even the literature coming out of banks points to this. There are now special products which are fairly popular where parents can help underwrite mortgages for their grown up children to compensate for the high LTV ratio.
All the while she wouldn't have been able to afford the car she now has, so presumably would have different work prospects.
Her previous car was perfectly adequate and she certainly didn't need to upgrade, that's an upside of her no longer having to save for a deposit. She is still with the same employer though now in a different team and more in line with her long-term career plans (her new office is actually closer, walking distance of home at a push).
The point I was making was that the '30 something unable to buy a 1 bedroom flat' undoubtably exists but that it is by no means a national issue. People talk as though there is no hope of young people buying their own place anymore which is blatantly untrue in large parts of the country.0 -
Too many questions. One of these days I would like to look into it and form an opinion. Plus, if I change jobs I might be able to claim.kingstongraham said:
Actually, at £10 an hour for a 40 hour week, a single person renting a room in a house could get £70 a week depending on how much rent they pay. The housing situation makes a big difference.TheBigBean said:
Then I'm not persuaded by your argumentkingstongraham said:
It depends how many hours you work and what your housing situation is.TheBigBean said:
So what sort of top up does universal credit give you if you earn £10/hour?kingstongraham said:
Universal credit now replacing wtc for people without children, but the point remains, I think.TheBigBean said:
Forgive my ignorance, but I thought you only got it if you have kids, so someone without kids isn't subsidised?surrey_commuter said:
the great socialist idea of WTC has acted as a subsidy for the likes of Tesco so they don't have to pay a living wagekingstongraham said:If inflation goes the way some think, £15 per hour in 2024 won't be ridiculous though.
It's difficult to argue that a profitable business should pay someone so little they need additional government support. That's the state giving handouts to businesses.
Otherwise, I just see it as subsidy for kids paid to their parents.
Zero to not much though.
But £10 is already 15% above the minimum wage, so for 40 hours at minimum wage, you would be getting more.
Take a look here https://www.entitledto.co.uk/0 -
On a macro level the conservatives want coffee and sandwich buying to continue at a high volume to fuel the economy.Jezyboy said:
My favourite example of this was arjsterry said:
The most expensive coffee Starbucks sell is about £3.50, and it would be weekdays only, so make that £60-70/month for the committed caffeine junky. A 1-bed ex-council flat in Shadwell will cost you £800 a month to rent.Dorset_Boy said:
On its own it might not, but you have to start somewhere.shirley_basso said:I don't think £5 per day £150/month, £2,000/annum is going to buy a house
Facebook video that suggested that you go without your flat white, and put the money in a bank earning 8 per cent interest.
I'm sure a while back everyone was in a panic because with lockdown and no one buying prets, suddenly loads of land was worthless. So do people want younguns to buy coffee or not!
On an individual level anyone who does this is stupid and doesn't deserve to own a home.
It's quite simple.- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
Of course they exist. There are just less of them than there used to be.Pross said:
The point I was making was that the '30 something unable to buy a 1 bedroom flat' undoubtably exists but that it is by no means a national issue. People talk as though there is no hope of young people buying their own place anymore which is blatantly untrue in large parts of the country.
It's very funny that the example you could think of was someone who theoretically could have done it one day, but actually used their inheritance, that's all.- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
That's how complicated it is though. That's the easier of the two sites the government links to when I took a quick look earlier.TheBigBean said:
Too many questions. One of these days I would like to look into it and form an opinion. Plus, if I change jobs I might be able to claim.kingstongraham said:
Actually, at £10 an hour for a 40 hour week, a single person renting a room in a house could get £70 a week depending on how much rent they pay. The housing situation makes a big difference.TheBigBean said:
Then I'm not persuaded by your argumentkingstongraham said:
It depends how many hours you work and what your housing situation is.TheBigBean said:
So what sort of top up does universal credit give you if you earn £10/hour?kingstongraham said:
Universal credit now replacing wtc for people without children, but the point remains, I think.TheBigBean said:
Forgive my ignorance, but I thought you only got it if you have kids, so someone without kids isn't subsidised?surrey_commuter said:
the great socialist idea of WTC has acted as a subsidy for the likes of Tesco so they don't have to pay a living wagekingstongraham said:If inflation goes the way some think, £15 per hour in 2024 won't be ridiculous though.
It's difficult to argue that a profitable business should pay someone so little they need additional government support. That's the state giving handouts to businesses.
Otherwise, I just see it as subsidy for kids paid to their parents.
Zero to not much though.
But £10 is already 15% above the minimum wage, so for 40 hours at minimum wage, you would be getting more.
Take a look here https://www.entitledto.co.uk/
You can put "No" for most of the questions, and just say what earnings, housing costs and council tax you want to get a figure for.
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Not really, she would have had a 10% deposit within 12 months (was already half way there). This was mainly as she had been living with us for the previous 15 months, the pandemic also helped take away the opportunities to spend though she was pretty good anyway. Her salary was fairly typical for a new graduate I would guess (mid £20k). Before she moved back home she was renting and that was eating up all her money and I think that's one of the big issues, a lot of people who go to Uni don't want to move back home afterwards and therefore are having to spend money on somewhere to live in the short-term. To sound like an old fart, when I was that age very few of my friends went to Uni and most lived with their parents until they got their own place.pangolin said:
No but the next part isn't exactly helping your case either, as SB pointed out.Pross said:
Did you deliberately ignore the next part of the sentence?pangolin said:
BrilliantPross said:
It still depends massively on geography though. My daughter (23) bought her first house, a 3 bed semi, a few months ago for about £130k. Good sized ex-Council house with a large garden and located on the edge of a really nice park so no risk to the views over the countryside. Admittedly she was lucky enough to have inherited money to cover the deposit and got a 75% LTV mortgage but she would have saved a 10% deposit within 12 months. Her mortgage costs less than many of her friends were paying for their cars (and about the same as she is now paying for her car having got a new one after moving in and getting the house sorted).rick_chasey said:
If people think a coffee out every day is holding them back from home ownership I don't think they really understand the size of deposits required.pblakeney said:
Bejeezus you must work in a strange location. All of the 20's and early 30's (mostly pre-children) I've worked with in the past 10 years (various offices) walk into the office every morning with their takeaway bag and cup of coffee.
I'll offer an example. I have a friend who's 33 and currently lives with his parents. He earns above average, but not by much.
He's currently looking to buy a 1 bed. Only, the price of the houses are literally rising as quickly as he can save, so the cost of the flats near where he works are continuously out of reach.
it is ludicrous that this point is contested. All the published data on this is crystal clear. Even the literature coming out of banks points to this. There are now special products which are fairly popular where parents can help underwrite mortgages for their grown up children to compensate for the high LTV ratio.
The conversation was broadly about people being unable to buy on their own home as young as they could do in the past. Rick said earlier in the thread:
"That, combined with the cost of homeownership makes growing up just very different. A good proportion of people, especially ironically those who want good paying careers, can't expect to own homes without help from their parents until deep into their 30s."
Which is true. And a lot of the responses have been variations on "work harder", "it was tough for us as well" or "but my daughter bought a house (with money she inherited)". We even had DB inform us that phones used to be heavier in his day.
I guess I'm not sure what point you are making given the context. Yes, some parts of the country are cheaper than others. Yes, some people spend a lot on cars.0 -
You could do it, but would be much less inclined and would take more planning, cost more and you probably wouldn't slum it as much (we often stayed in hostels). We also sat outside in those minus 10 degree temps in the the mountains of Transylvania for about 4 or 5 hours straight in the hope of seeing lynx or wolves. We also stayed overnight in bear hides with no running water or electricity and sawdust toilets. Would certainly not do that with kids, and definitely not a 7 month old!TheBigBean said:
That is a matter of opinion. Sure, yours is a mainstream view, but people do do that sort of stuff with kids.elbowloh said:
I hear ya.shirley_basso said:I also think people don't want to. I love parenthood, but there's a lot to be said about being a double-income couple with no kids.
Wife and I travelled the world together, not quite at the drop of a hat, but we often did one nighters in places like Oslo, but also trips out into the wilds and -10degree temps looking for wildlife. Couldn't do that with the kids.0 -
When you say 'large parts of the country' - what metric exactly are you using? Saying things like 'blatently untrue' is quite emotive when using a statistic sample of one anecdote who actually did have an inheritence to buy their first home, and just about every statistic is saying the opposite.Pross said:
I don't get what you're saying. She could have had a deposit within 12 months, her mortgage payments would have been higher but still affordable (as in around £500 per month). Prices will probably rise over that time but we're talking 5-10% maybe, houses around here have taken about 15-20 years to double in price. By contrast she was previously renting a one bedroom flat in Salford with her then boyfriend that was costing more than double her current mortgage.shirley_basso said:
So actually it would be 3 years of saving at that rate, if you include purchase costs, and that excludes house price rises in the intervening period, during which time prices could well have doubled.Pross said:
It still depends massively on geography though. My daughter (23) bought her first house, a 3 bed semi, a few months ago for about £130k. Good sized ex-Council house with a large garden and located on the edge of a really nice park so no risk to the views over the countryside. Admittedly she was lucky enough to have inherited money to cover the deposit and got a 75% LTV mortgage but she would have saved a 10% deposit within 12 months. Her mortgage costs less than many of her friends were paying for their cars (and about the same as she is now paying for her car having got a new one after moving in and getting the house sorted).rick_chasey said:
If people think a coffee out every day is holding them back from home ownership I don't think they really understand the size of deposits required.pblakeney said:
Bejeezus you must work in a strange location. All of the 20's and early 30's (mostly pre-children) I've worked with in the past 10 years (various offices) walk into the office every morning with their takeaway bag and cup of coffee.
I'll offer an example. I have a friend who's 33 and currently lives with his parents. He earns above average, but not by much.
He's currently looking to buy a 1 bed. Only, the price of the houses are literally rising as quickly as he can save, so the cost of the flats near where he works are continuously out of reach.
it is ludicrous that this point is contested. All the published data on this is crystal clear. Even the literature coming out of banks points to this. There are now special products which are fairly popular where parents can help underwrite mortgages for their grown up children to compensate for the high LTV ratio.
All the while she wouldn't have been able to afford the car she now has, so presumably would have different work prospects.
Her previous car was perfectly adequate and she certainly didn't need to upgrade, that's an upside of her no longer having to save for a deposit. She is still with the same employer though now in a different team and more in line with her long-term career plans (her new office is actually closer, walking distance of home at a push).
The point I was making was that the '30 something unable to buy a 1 bedroom flat' undoubtably exists but that it is by no means a national issue. People talk as though there is no hope of young people buying their own place anymore which is blatantly untrue in large parts of the country.0 -
At least someone is capable of reading beyond a few words.Dorset_Boy said:
30% pa house price inflation?shirley_basso said:
So actually it would be 3 years of saving at that rate, if you include purchase costs, and that excludes house price rises in the intervening period, during which time prices could well have doubled.Pross said:
It still depends massively on geography though. My daughter (23) bought her first house, a 3 bed semi, a few months ago for about £130k. Good sized ex-Council house with a large garden and located on the edge of a really nice park so no risk to the views over the countryside. Admittedly she was lucky enough to have inherited money to cover the deposit and got a 75% LTV mortgage but she would have saved a 10% deposit within 12 months. Her mortgage costs less than many of her friends were paying for their cars (and about the same as she is now paying for her car having got a new one after moving in and getting the house sorted).rick_chasey said:
If people think a coffee out every day is holding them back from home ownership I don't think they really understand the size of deposits required.pblakeney said:
Bejeezus you must work in a strange location. All of the 20's and early 30's (mostly pre-children) I've worked with in the past 10 years (various offices) walk into the office every morning with their takeaway bag and cup of coffee.
I'll offer an example. I have a friend who's 33 and currently lives with his parents. He earns above average, but not by much.
He's currently looking to buy a 1 bed. Only, the price of the houses are literally rising as quickly as he can save, so the cost of the flats near where he works are continuously out of reach.
it is ludicrous that this point is contested. All the published data on this is crystal clear. Even the literature coming out of banks points to this. There are now special products which are fairly popular where parents can help underwrite mortgages for their grown up children to compensate for the high LTV ratio.
All the while she wouldn't have been able to afford the car she now has, so presumably would have different work prospects.
Is 3 years really a long time to save for a deposit?
Pross didn't suggest she wouldn't have had a car at all, I don't think.
PS There is a world outside the M25, and amazingly under 30s inhabit it too!0 -
Right so it's perfectly possible as long as you have no living costs for almost 3 years, or inherit the money. And want to buy somewhere well below average price, and have an above average salary for your age. It's amazing more people haven't cottoned on to this scheme!Pross said:
Not really, she would have had a 10% deposit within 12 months (was already half way there). This was mainly as she had been living with us for the previous 15 months, the pandemic also helped take away the opportunities to spend though she was pretty good anyway. Her salary was fairly typical for a new graduate I would guess (mid £20k). Before she moved back home she was renting and that was eating up all her money and I think that's one of the big issues, a lot of people who go to Uni don't want to move back home afterwards and therefore are having to spend money on somewhere to live in the short-term. To sound like an old fart, when I was that age very few of my friends went to Uni and most lived with their parents until they got their own place.pangolin said:
No but the next part isn't exactly helping your case either, as SB pointed out.Pross said:
Did you deliberately ignore the next part of the sentence?pangolin said:
BrilliantPross said:
It still depends massively on geography though. My daughter (23) bought her first house, a 3 bed semi, a few months ago for about £130k. Good sized ex-Council house with a large garden and located on the edge of a really nice park so no risk to the views over the countryside. Admittedly she was lucky enough to have inherited money to cover the deposit and got a 75% LTV mortgage but she would have saved a 10% deposit within 12 months. Her mortgage costs less than many of her friends were paying for their cars (and about the same as she is now paying for her car having got a new one after moving in and getting the house sorted).rick_chasey said:
If people think a coffee out every day is holding them back from home ownership I don't think they really understand the size of deposits required.pblakeney said:
Bejeezus you must work in a strange location. All of the 20's and early 30's (mostly pre-children) I've worked with in the past 10 years (various offices) walk into the office every morning with their takeaway bag and cup of coffee.
I'll offer an example. I have a friend who's 33 and currently lives with his parents. He earns above average, but not by much.
He's currently looking to buy a 1 bed. Only, the price of the houses are literally rising as quickly as he can save, so the cost of the flats near where he works are continuously out of reach.
it is ludicrous that this point is contested. All the published data on this is crystal clear. Even the literature coming out of banks points to this. There are now special products which are fairly popular where parents can help underwrite mortgages for their grown up children to compensate for the high LTV ratio.
The conversation was broadly about people being unable to buy on their own home as young as they could do in the past. Rick said earlier in the thread:
"That, combined with the cost of homeownership makes growing up just very different. A good proportion of people, especially ironically those who want good paying careers, can't expect to own homes without help from their parents until deep into their 30s."
Which is true. And a lot of the responses have been variations on "work harder", "it was tough for us as well" or "but my daughter bought a house (with money she inherited)". We even had DB inform us that phones used to be heavier in his day.
I guess I'm not sure what point you are making given the context. Yes, some parts of the country are cheaper than others. Yes, some people spend a lot on cars.
I'm only pulling your leg but this is not really helping your case.- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
Get yourself a pandemic and let the money pile up.0
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More people going to Uni and not wanting to return home afterwards, people marrying / getting into a serious relationship later and therefore not having a dual income? I don't think anyone is arguing it is getting harder to close the gap between earnings and buying a house during your early career but I still don't think your mid 30s mate unable to buy a one bedroom flat is typical nationwide either.rick_chasey said:
Why is the average age of first time buyers rising?Dorset_Boy said:
30% pa house price inflation?
Is 3 years really a long time to save for a deposit?
Pross didn't suggest she wouldn't have had a car at all, I don't think.
PS There is a world outside the M25, and amazingly under 30s inhabit it too!1
