BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
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Well even in the small group of CS regulars we have a few examples of direct negative effects.Stevo_666 said:
I think you're making that assumption.rjsterry said:
You do keep assuming your experience is representative.Stevo_666 said:
Or maybe as I've said before, it really isn't that big an issue any more and most of us are just getting on with life and dealing with some of the current big issues.wallace_and_gromit said:Well I guess pretending it didn't happen is consistent with there being no benefits.
It's also completely hollowed out the Conservative Party. And if your predictions of Labour bringing in higher personal taxes are correct, there's a direct consequence for you too.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
There is evidence both ways. My point is that that it's not the most important issue of the day and there have been more important things to deal with, like the pandemic, the Ukraine war and the onsequences of those.rjsterry said:
Well even in the small group of CS regulars we have a few examples of direct negative effects.Stevo_666 said:
I think you're making that assumption.rjsterry said:
You do keep assuming your experience is representative.Stevo_666 said:
Or maybe as I've said before, it really isn't that big an issue any more and most of us are just getting on with life and dealing with some of the current big issues.wallace_and_gromit said:Well I guess pretending it didn't happen is consistent with there being no benefits.
It's also completely hollowed out the Conservative Party. And if your predictions of Labour bringing in higher personal taxes are correct, there's a direct consequence for you too.
As for whether this will directly cause a Labour govt, that's another debate. In the end governments have a finite life as UK political history has shown."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
And thankfully this one only has 18 months left.Stevo_666 said:
There is evidence both ways. My point is that that it's not the most important issue of the day and there have been more important things to deal with, like the pandemic, the Ukraine war and the onsequences of those.rjsterry said:
Well even in the small group of CS regulars we have a few examples of direct negative effects.Stevo_666 said:
I think you're making that assumption.rjsterry said:
You do keep assuming your experience is representative.Stevo_666 said:
Or maybe as I've said before, it really isn't that big an issue any more and most of us are just getting on with life and dealing with some of the current big issues.wallace_and_gromit said:Well I guess pretending it didn't happen is consistent with there being no benefits.
It's also completely hollowed out the Conservative Party. And if your predictions of Labour bringing in higher personal taxes are correct, there's a direct consequence for you too.
As for whether this will directly cause a Labour govt, that's another debate. In the end governments have a finite life as UK political history has shown.
Then we can start the proper conversation about our future relationship with Europe, once the nutcased are consigned to history0 -
Labour have publicly rules out rejoining the EU, the single market and the customs Union IIRC, so if the leftie nutcases do get into power in 2025, what changes do you think they're going to make that will make a difference?super_davo said:
And thankfully this one only has 18 months left.Stevo_666 said:
There is evidence both ways. My point is that that it's not the most important issue of the day and there have been more important things to deal with, like the pandemic, the Ukraine war and the onsequences of those.rjsterry said:
Well even in the small group of CS regulars we have a few examples of direct negative effects.Stevo_666 said:
I think you're making that assumption.rjsterry said:
You do keep assuming your experience is representative.Stevo_666 said:
Or maybe as I've said before, it really isn't that big an issue any more and most of us are just getting on with life and dealing with some of the current big issues.wallace_and_gromit said:Well I guess pretending it didn't happen is consistent with there being no benefits.
It's also completely hollowed out the Conservative Party. And if your predictions of Labour bringing in higher personal taxes are correct, there's a direct consequence for you too.
As for whether this will directly cause a Labour govt, that's another debate. In the end governments have a finite life as UK political history has shown.
Then we can start the proper conversation about our future relationship with Europe, once the nutcased are consigned to history
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives0
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There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
Anyone of that calibre you can see waiting in the wings? I think Sunak is toast if things stay as they are (and hasn't got the political nous, heft or intellect to turn things around anyway).
I suppose the obvious one remains Hunt, as at least he's got the experience, has some record of pragmatism, and isn't from the loony end of the party, so isn't hostage to them to the same extent.0 -
I don't know the party well enough to know. I remember ack in the day that I'd not been aware of Cameron until he suddenly jumped into the limelight and Tory leadership pretty sharpish. Mordaunt is the most obvious leader in waiting currently that I know of.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
Anyone of that calibre you can see waiting in the wings? I think Sunak is toast if things stay as they are (and hasn't got the political nous, heft or intellect to turn things around anyway).
I suppose the obvious one remains Hunt, as at least he's got the experience, has some record of pragmatism, and isn't from the loony end of the party, so isn't hostage to them to the same extent.
In the short term, you need to be more worried about leftie loons (the ones in the Labour party, not our resident SNP and leftiebollox fanboi
) "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Stevo_666 said:
I don't know the party well enough to know. I remember ack in the day that I'd not been aware of Cameron until he suddenly jumped into the limelight and Tory leadership pretty sharpish. Mordaunt is the most obvious leader in waiting currently that I know of.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
Anyone of that calibre you can see waiting in the wings? I think Sunak is toast if things stay as they are (and hasn't got the political nous, heft or intellect to turn things around anyway).
I suppose the obvious one remains Hunt, as at least he's got the experience, has some record of pragmatism, and isn't from the loony end of the party, so isn't hostage to them to the same extent.
In the short term, you need to be more worried about leftie loons (the ones in the Labour party, not our resident SNP and leftiebollox fanboi )
Who are the prominent lefty loons who are likely to bypass Starmer's iron grip then, and get into positions of power? I've got my bingo card ready.
The problem with the Tories is that because of Johnson and the suspension of pragmatism and logic to make his political choices 'add up' (which they never did, thanks to the innate contradictions in Brexit, e.g. in NI), a lot of the more sensible ones have been pushed out or to the sidelines, mirroring to Republicans (though, thankfully, not to quite the same extent).0 -
I surely can’t be the only one to be concerned that Mourdant’s “credentials” as leader have been largely, if not solely, proven by how she carried a flag.Stevo_666 said:
I don't know the party well enough to know. I remember ack in the day that I'd not been aware of Cameron until he suddenly jumped into the limelight and Tory leadership pretty sharpish. Mordaunt is the most obvious leader in waiting currently that I know of.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
Anyone of that calibre you can see waiting in the wings? I think Sunak is toast if things stay as they are (and hasn't got the political nous, heft or intellect to turn things around anyway).
I suppose the obvious one remains Hunt, as at least he's got the experience, has some record of pragmatism, and isn't from the loony end of the party, so isn't hostage to them to the same extent.
In the short term, you need to be more worried about leftie loons (the ones in the Labour party, not our resident SNP and leftiebollox fanboi )
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wallace_and_gromit said:
I surely can’t be the only one to be concerned that Mourdant’s “credentials” as leader have been largely, if not solely, proven by how she carried a flag.Stevo_666 said:
I don't know the party well enough to know. I remember ack in the day that I'd not been aware of Cameron until he suddenly jumped into the limelight and Tory leadership pretty sharpish. Mordaunt is the most obvious leader in waiting currently that I know of.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
Anyone of that calibre you can see waiting in the wings? I think Sunak is toast if things stay as they are (and hasn't got the political nous, heft or intellect to turn things around anyway).
I suppose the obvious one remains Hunt, as at least he's got the experience, has some record of pragmatism, and isn't from the loony end of the party, so isn't hostage to them to the same extent.
In the short term, you need to be more worried about leftie loons (the ones in the Labour party, not our resident SNP and leftiebollox fanboi )
Given the depth of the talent left in the Tory Party, that's probably enough.0 -
She managed to look like a Dungeons and Dragons warrior leader so maybe that’s going to appeal to a certain demographic.wallace_and_gromit said:
I surely can’t be the only one to be concerned that Mourdant’s “credentials” as leader have been largely, if not solely, proven by how she carried a flag.Stevo_666 said:
I don't know the party well enough to know. I remember ack in the day that I'd not been aware of Cameron until he suddenly jumped into the limelight and Tory leadership pretty sharpish. Mordaunt is the most obvious leader in waiting currently that I know of.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
Anyone of that calibre you can see waiting in the wings? I think Sunak is toast if things stay as they are (and hasn't got the political nous, heft or intellect to turn things around anyway).
I suppose the obvious one remains Hunt, as at least he's got the experience, has some record of pragmatism, and isn't from the loony end of the party, so isn't hostage to them to the same extent.
In the short term, you need to be more worried about leftie loons (the ones in the Labour party, not our resident SNP and leftiebollox fanboi )0 -
I’d be happy with a Thatcher type leader (that might dent my leftie credentials). A strong leader with clear policies (even if I don’t agree with the policies) is better for the country than a weak leader with no political direction.Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
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Ooooh, Matron!Pross said:
She managed to look like a Dungeons and Dragons warrior leader so maybe that’s going to appeal to a certain demographic.wallace_and_gromit said:
I surely can’t be the only one to be concerned that Mourdant’s “credentials” as leader have been largely, if not solely, proven by how she carried a flag.Stevo_666 said:
I don't know the party well enough to know. I remember ack in the day that I'd not been aware of Cameron until he suddenly jumped into the limelight and Tory leadership pretty sharpish. Mordaunt is the most obvious leader in waiting currently that I know of.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
Anyone of that calibre you can see waiting in the wings? I think Sunak is toast if things stay as they are (and hasn't got the political nous, heft or intellect to turn things around anyway).
I suppose the obvious one remains Hunt, as at least he's got the experience, has some record of pragmatism, and isn't from the loony end of the party, so isn't hostage to them to the same extent.
In the short term, you need to be more worried about leftie loons (the ones in the Labour party, not our resident SNP and leftiebollox fanboi )
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Pross said:
I’d be happy with a Thatcher type leader (that might dent my leftie credentials). A strong leader with clear policies (even if I don’t agree with the policies) is better for the country than a weak leader with no political direction.Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
It's point that all but the die-hard leftie of my friends concede when I voice this opinion: you knew what she stood for, had deeply-held beliefs, and valued a thorough intellectual argument with people she disagreed with. And she went with a reasonable amount of grace when she knew she was done.0 -
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Careful now Pross, say things like that and you might get herds of closet lefties piling in to disagree with you every time you postPross said:
I’d be happy with a Thatcher type leader (that might dent my leftie credentials). A strong leader with clear policies (even if I don’t agree with the policies) is better for the country than a weak leader with no political direction.Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Stevo_666 said:
Careful now Pross, say things like that and you might get herds of closet lefties piling in to disagree with you every time you postPross said:
I’d be happy with a Thatcher type leader (that might dent my leftie credentials). A strong leader with clear policies (even if I don’t agree with the policies) is better for the country than a weak leader with no political direction.Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
I've said it several times on here. Little/no pushback.0 -
Who knows, but we will only find out once they get in. Iron grips (if Starmer's approach can be called that) don't last forever and lefties are patient - look how long they stayed under their rocks until Corbyn was installed.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
I don't know the party well enough to know. I remember ack in the day that I'd not been aware of Cameron until he suddenly jumped into the limelight and Tory leadership pretty sharpish. Mordaunt is the most obvious leader in waiting currently that I know of.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
Anyone of that calibre you can see waiting in the wings? I think Sunak is toast if things stay as they are (and hasn't got the political nous, heft or intellect to turn things around anyway).
I suppose the obvious one remains Hunt, as at least he's got the experience, has some record of pragmatism, and isn't from the loony end of the party, so isn't hostage to them to the same extent.
In the short term, you need to be more worried about leftie loons (the ones in the Labour party, not our resident SNP and leftiebollox fanboi )
Who are the prominent lefty loons who are likely to bypass Starmer's iron grip then, and get into positions of power? I've got my bingo card ready.
The problem with the Tories is that because of Johnson and the suspension of pragmatism and logic to make his political choices 'add up' (which they never did, thanks to the innate contradictions in Brexit, e.g. in NI), a lot of the more sensible ones have been pushed out or to the sidelines, mirroring to Republicans (though, thankfully, not to quite the same extent).
Careful what you wish for, as I've said a few times before.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Stevo_666 said:
Who knows, but we will only find out once they get in. Iron grips (if Starmer's approach can be called that) don't last forever and lefties are patient - look how long they stayed under their rocks until Corbyn was installed.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
I don't know the party well enough to know. I remember ack in the day that I'd not been aware of Cameron until he suddenly jumped into the limelight and Tory leadership pretty sharpish. Mordaunt is the most obvious leader in waiting currently that I know of.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
Anyone of that calibre you can see waiting in the wings? I think Sunak is toast if things stay as they are (and hasn't got the political nous, heft or intellect to turn things around anyway).
I suppose the obvious one remains Hunt, as at least he's got the experience, has some record of pragmatism, and isn't from the loony end of the party, so isn't hostage to them to the same extent.
In the short term, you need to be more worried about leftie loons (the ones in the Labour party, not our resident SNP and leftiebollox fanboi )
Who are the prominent lefty loons who are likely to bypass Starmer's iron grip then, and get into positions of power? I've got my bingo card ready.
The problem with the Tories is that because of Johnson and the suspension of pragmatism and logic to make his political choices 'add up' (which they never did, thanks to the innate contradictions in Brexit, e.g. in NI), a lot of the more sensible ones have been pushed out or to the sidelines, mirroring to Republicans (though, thankfully, not to quite the same extent).
Careful what you wish for, as I've said a few times before.
If even you can't find someone to scare us all, that's telling.
As you know, my wish is simple: send the Tories into the wilderness for long enough to rediscover what responsible government looks like, because they've totally forgotten, along with the other principles that make them Tories.0 -
I so wanted to like this article, but I’d barely started reading before encountering reference to the U.K. underperforming G7 countries and having experienced an unprecedented fall in economic output since leaving the eu.briantrumpet said:FWIW, some pragmatism.
G7 reference is interesting as most of the G7 is not in the eu. The UK’s recent economic performance compares well with the eu. Any credible article should surely have referenced that Germany is in a recession at the moment whilst the U.K. isn’t.
“Unprecedented” reference is interesting as the unprecedented fall was clearly due to Covid and has pretty much been fully reversed.
I didn’t read the rest of the article given such disingenuous nonsense encountered early on.
It’s really quite painful that bright people will write such things. If Brexit really is bad then it can surely be demonstrated objectively!
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Given how long we are post Brexit there may be a reason for that - as I've said above, there are bigger fish to fry these days.wallace_and_gromit said:
I so wanted to like this article, but I’d barely started reading before encountering reference to the U.K. underperforming G7 countries and having experienced an unprecedented fall in economic output since leaving the eu.briantrumpet said:FWIW, some pragmatism.
G7 reference is interesting as most of the G7 is not in the eu. The UK’s recent economic performance compares well with the eu. Any credible article should surely have referenced that Germany is in a recession at the moment whilst the U.K. isn’t.
“Unprecedented” reference is interesting as the unprecedented fall was clearly due to Covid and has pretty much been fully reversed.
I didn’t read the rest of the article given such disingenuous nonsense encountered early on.
It’s really quite painful that bright people will write such things. If Brexit really is bad then it can surely be demonstrated objectively!
I reckon the minority of unreconciled remainers must feel that the only way they can keep up some sort of momentum for rejoining is to try to kid themselves and everyone else that it's the worst thing ever, despite the fact that we've had quite a few of the 4 horsemen knocking around lately with pandemics and war."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Fairly sure that due to inflation, there are now 8 Horsemen!Stevo_666 said:
Given how long we are post Brexit there may be a reason for that - as I've said above, there are bigger fish to fry these days.wallace_and_gromit said:
I so wanted to like this article, but I’d barely started reading before encountering reference to the U.K. underperforming G7 countries and having experienced an unprecedented fall in economic output since leaving the eu.briantrumpet said:FWIW, some pragmatism.
G7 reference is interesting as most of the G7 is not in the eu. The UK’s recent economic performance compares well with the eu. Any credible article should surely have referenced that Germany is in a recession at the moment whilst the U.K. isn’t.
“Unprecedented” reference is interesting as the unprecedented fall was clearly due to Covid and has pretty much been fully reversed.
I didn’t read the rest of the article given such disingenuous nonsense encountered early on.
It’s really quite painful that bright people will write such things. If Brexit really is bad then it can surely be demonstrated objectively!
I reckon the minority of unreconciled remainers must feel that the only way they can keep up some sort of momentum for rejoining is to try to kid themselves and everyone else that it's the worst thing ever, despite the fact that we've had quite a few of the 4 horsemen knocking around lately with pandemics and war.
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The 8 Horsemen of the Cake Stop?wallace_and_gromit said:
Fairly sure that due to inflation, there are now 8 Horsemen!Stevo_666 said:
Given how long we are post Brexit there may be a reason for that - as I've said above, there are bigger fish to fry these days.wallace_and_gromit said:
I so wanted to like this article, but I’d barely started reading before encountering reference to the U.K. underperforming G7 countries and having experienced an unprecedented fall in economic output since leaving the eu.briantrumpet said:FWIW, some pragmatism.
G7 reference is interesting as most of the G7 is not in the eu. The UK’s recent economic performance compares well with the eu. Any credible article should surely have referenced that Germany is in a recession at the moment whilst the U.K. isn’t.
“Unprecedented” reference is interesting as the unprecedented fall was clearly due to Covid and has pretty much been fully reversed.
I didn’t read the rest of the article given such disingenuous nonsense encountered early on.
It’s really quite painful that bright people will write such things. If Brexit really is bad then it can surely be demonstrated objectively!
I reckon the minority of unreconciled remainers must feel that the only way they can keep up some sort of momentum for rejoining is to try to kid themselves and everyone else that it's the worst thing ever, despite the fact that we've had quite a few of the 4 horsemen knocking around lately with pandemics and war."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
I suspect there are many on here who are really centre right and who have probably voted Conservative in the past. The issue is that they are looking beyond the colour of the rosette at what they have become and decided it is no longer for them.Stevo_666 said:
Careful now Pross, say things like that and you might get herds of closet lefties piling in to disagree with you every time you postPross said:
I’d be happy with a Thatcher type leader (that might dent my leftie credentials). A strong leader with clear policies (even if I don’t agree with the policies) is better for the country than a weak leader with no political direction.Stevo_666 said:
There will certainly be changes - any party that finds themselves in opposition go through that. If we find ourselves saddled with Labour for 5 years then another Maggie type leader of the Tories may be just what we need to put sort things out after that.Jezyboy said:I wouldn't necessarily rule out adults getting back in charge of the conservatives
I’m sure deep down even you know that the current lot are only Tory in name and weirdly very right-wing in many ways but with an almost socialist view on economic issues. I think you just have to take the burden of the right wing torch and do your best to wind up the Lefties but in your heart must be pining for the Thatcher years0 -
Brexit has done your head in.wallace_and_gromit said:
I so wanted to like this article, but I’d barely started reading before encountering reference to the U.K. underperforming G7 countries and having experienced an unprecedented fall in economic output since leaving the eu.briantrumpet said:FWIW, some pragmatism.
G7 reference is interesting as most of the G7 is not in the eu. The UK’s recent economic performance compares well with the eu. Any credible article should surely have referenced that Germany is in a recession at the moment whilst the U.K. isn’t.
“Unprecedented” reference is interesting as the unprecedented fall was clearly due to Covid and has pretty much been fully reversed.
I didn’t read the rest of the article given such disingenuous nonsense encountered early on.
It’s really quite painful that bright people will write such things. If Brexit really is bad then it can surely be demonstrated objectively!
You sound like one of those Americans who tried to be “neutral” on gun control, where both sides have a point (they do not)0 -
Any substantive comments on my observations? Meaningless sound bites don’t cut it intellectually with me I’m afraid.rick_chasey said:
Brexit has done your head in.wallace_and_gromit said:
I so wanted to like this article, but I’d barely started reading before encountering reference to the U.K. underperforming G7 countries and having experienced an unprecedented fall in economic output since leaving the eu.briantrumpet said:FWIW, some pragmatism.
G7 reference is interesting as most of the G7 is not in the eu. The UK’s recent economic performance compares well with the eu. Any credible article should surely have referenced that Germany is in a recession at the moment whilst the U.K. isn’t.
“Unprecedented” reference is interesting as the unprecedented fall was clearly due to Covid and has pretty much been fully reversed.
I didn’t read the rest of the article given such disingenuous nonsense encountered early on.
It’s really quite painful that bright people will write such things. If Brexit really is bad then it can surely be demonstrated objectively!
You sound like one of those Americans who tried to be “neutral” on gun control, where both sides have a point (they do not)
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Yeah all of it.
We’ve gone over this over and over.
Professional economists, including within the UK government and institutions whose job it is to evaluate Uk economic performance and policy independently, OBR, BoE, all say that Brexit has cost the UK a lot.
How much is up for debate, but we’re talking at the margins. UK consistently underperforms its G7 counterparts. Comments like “oh they don’t mention Germany going into recession this year” when Germany is the *most* exposed g7 country to both the Ukrainian war and a global slowdown, as it’s an export economy, does not a change that materially.
I genuinely think you’re seeing the trees and missing the forest when you read this stuff. You’re too focused with having to present a “both sides” argument.
You should read some foreign press about Brexit, which is David Miliband’s experience as he’s lived in New York for the entirety of Brexit.
It’s similar to our coverage of gun control in the US, in that everyone is baffled why this nonsense position is so popular.
No humanities data is perfect, nor is any comparison perfect.
In aggregate the narrative is obvious, but you seem genuinely overly focused on highlighting the imperfect nature of economic evaluation and presenting that as evidence that whichever side is using that data is wrong.0 -
The US view on Brexit always amuses me. They can't even sign up to the international criminal court.
Yes, yes, they're a bigger country.0 -
A good way to summarise it is that Brexit did not cause all the economic problems Britain has but it as made all of them worse, to different degrees.1
