BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
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You said that the situation that NI is in would be "effectively" EU membership if it applied to the UK. I don't agree with these shades of grey, it's very much binary.Stevo_666 said:
True, 'tis done.surrey_commuter said:
If you find yourself questioning if Brexit is done then give your head a shake and ask yourself is the UK an EU member.pblakeney said:
"Our" as in GB?surrey_commuter said:
Brexit is done!!! Our relationship with the EU will continue to evolvetailwindhome said:At a basic level you might ask yourself to reconcile 'Brexit is done' with 'changes to EU rules mean NI pays 25% tarriffs on steel from GB'
And if you still want to get pedantic, imagine if Chris Tarrant is offering you a million quid if you answer the question correctly
I admire the efforts of a hardcore few to keep this thread alive - luckily someone posted before it dropped of the front page of the forum
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I did and could see a blue tinge. I'd say 95% black, 5% blue.surrey_commuter said:
Seriously, put it on something blackmasjer said:They seem to be black with the merest hint of blue. `Iconic blue` indeed.
https://bbc.co.uk/news/education-51737116
95% black is not something Brexiteers wished for.
I certainly had a false memory of the old blue passports being a definite blue.0 -
Still, an EU action that caused it. Your original post implied that it was directly and solely down to Lord Frost, so I was calling Euroobollox on that.tailwindhome said:
Yup.Stevo_666 said:
Doesn't change the fact that the EU made a change that caused this. And they did not have to do so.tailwindhome said:
Frosty agreed a deal which meant NI follows EU rules, however they change in the future.Stevo_666 said:
Time for some context here. The reasons for this are down to changes made by the EU inn connection with the Russia/Ukraine conflict and this has had a consequential impact on NI steel imports:tailwindhome said:25% tarrif on steel from GB to NI
Cracking deal Frosty negotiated
https://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-62672105
Quote:
The EU has changed some of its rules in regard to steel imports for reasons related to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
That has had a knock-on effect on steel sales from Great Britain to Northern Ireland.
Trade expert Sam Lowe set out the complicated background to the issue earlier this month.
Essentially, steel from Great Britain had been able to enter Northern Ireland without a tariff because it was covered by a tariff rate quota (TRQ) for UK exports to the EU.
A TRQ allows a certain amount of a product to enter a customs territory without a tariff being paid, but once a set limit is reached tariffs apply.
Until June there was a specific TRQ for UK steel exports to the EU.
However, when sanctions were applied to Russia EU businesses could no longer buy steel from there.
So at that time the EU scrapped country-specific TRQs for the UK and others in favour of one TRQ for Ukraine and another TRQ covering all "other countries".
The Northern Ireland Protocol means NI continues to follow EU customs rules
Mr Lowe said this was intended to give EU steel importers more flexibility in the absence of Russian supplies.
However it also means that the tariff free limit for Great Britain supplies to Northern Ireland has been quickly reached, as Mr Lowe explained.
"Whereas before the UK had access to its own country-specific quota, which it could rely on to accommodate steel moving from Great Britain to Northern Ireland, now these movements would be covered by the 'other countries' quota which could fill up much more quickly, given the entire world has access to it," he said.
The EU was not forced to make this change, was it?
I've been explaining this to you for 2 years.
Frosty did a free trade deal so bad, the UK no longer has free trade with itself."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Stevo_666 said:
Still, an EU action that caused it. Your original post implied that it was directly and solely down to Lord Frost, so I was calling Euroobollox on that.tailwindhome said:
Yup.Stevo_666 said:
Doesn't change the fact that the EU made a change that caused this. And they did not have to do so.tailwindhome said:
Frosty agreed a deal which meant NI follows EU rules, however they change in the future.Stevo_666 said:
Time for some context here. The reasons for this are down to changes made by the EU inn connection with the Russia/Ukraine conflict and this has had a consequential impact on NI steel imports:tailwindhome said:25% tarrif on steel from GB to NI
Cracking deal Frosty negotiated
https://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-62672105
Quote:
The EU has changed some of its rules in regard to steel imports for reasons related to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
That has had a knock-on effect on steel sales from Great Britain to Northern Ireland.
Trade expert Sam Lowe set out the complicated background to the issue earlier this month.
Essentially, steel from Great Britain had been able to enter Northern Ireland without a tariff because it was covered by a tariff rate quota (TRQ) for UK exports to the EU.
A TRQ allows a certain amount of a product to enter a customs territory without a tariff being paid, but once a set limit is reached tariffs apply.
Until June there was a specific TRQ for UK steel exports to the EU.
However, when sanctions were applied to Russia EU businesses could no longer buy steel from there.
So at that time the EU scrapped country-specific TRQs for the UK and others in favour of one TRQ for Ukraine and another TRQ covering all "other countries".
The Northern Ireland Protocol means NI continues to follow EU customs rules
Mr Lowe said this was intended to give EU steel importers more flexibility in the absence of Russian supplies.
However it also means that the tariff free limit for Great Britain supplies to Northern Ireland has been quickly reached, as Mr Lowe explained.
"Whereas before the UK had access to its own country-specific quota, which it could rely on to accommodate steel moving from Great Britain to Northern Ireland, now these movements would be covered by the 'other countries' quota which could fill up much more quickly, given the entire world has access to it," he said.
The EU was not forced to make this change, was it?
I've been explaining this to you for 2 years.
Frosty did a free trade deal so bad, the UK no longer has free trade with itself.
You're defending Lord Frost's deal by explaining how EU decisions govern intraUK trade
Superb work.
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
Frost negotiated the deal that allowed the EU action. You know from work that any contract has provisos that cover all eventualitiesStevo_666 said:
Still, an EU action that caused it. Your original post implied that it was directly and solely down to Lord Frost, so I was calling Euroobollox on that.tailwindhome said:
Yup.Stevo_666 said:
Doesn't change the fact that the EU made a change that caused this. And they did not have to do so.tailwindhome said:
Frosty agreed a deal which meant NI follows EU rules, however they change in the future.Stevo_666 said:
Time for some context here. The reasons for this are down to changes made by the EU inn connection with the Russia/Ukraine conflict and this has had a consequential impact on NI steel imports:tailwindhome said:25% tarrif on steel from GB to NI
Cracking deal Frosty negotiated
https://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-62672105
Quote:
The EU has changed some of its rules in regard to steel imports for reasons related to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
That has had a knock-on effect on steel sales from Great Britain to Northern Ireland.
Trade expert Sam Lowe set out the complicated background to the issue earlier this month.
Essentially, steel from Great Britain had been able to enter Northern Ireland without a tariff because it was covered by a tariff rate quota (TRQ) for UK exports to the EU.
A TRQ allows a certain amount of a product to enter a customs territory without a tariff being paid, but once a set limit is reached tariffs apply.
Until June there was a specific TRQ for UK steel exports to the EU.
However, when sanctions were applied to Russia EU businesses could no longer buy steel from there.
So at that time the EU scrapped country-specific TRQs for the UK and others in favour of one TRQ for Ukraine and another TRQ covering all "other countries".
The Northern Ireland Protocol means NI continues to follow EU customs rules
Mr Lowe said this was intended to give EU steel importers more flexibility in the absence of Russian supplies.
However it also means that the tariff free limit for Great Britain supplies to Northern Ireland has been quickly reached, as Mr Lowe explained.
"Whereas before the UK had access to its own country-specific quota, which it could rely on to accommodate steel moving from Great Britain to Northern Ireland, now these movements would be covered by the 'other countries' quota which could fill up much more quickly, given the entire world has access to it," he said.
The EU was not forced to make this change, was it?
I've been explaining this to you for 2 years.
Frosty did a free trade deal so bad, the UK no longer has free trade with itself.0 -
Which gets to the crux of where we are.surrey_commuter said:
Frost negotiated the deal that allowed the EU action. You know from work that any contract has provisos that cover all eventualitiesStevo_666 said:
Still, an EU action that caused it. Your original post implied that it was directly and solely down to Lord Frost, so I was calling Euroobollox on that.tailwindhome said:
Yup.Stevo_666 said:
Doesn't change the fact that the EU made a change that caused this. And they did not have to do so.tailwindhome said:
Frosty agreed a deal which meant NI follows EU rules, however they change in the future.Stevo_666 said:
Time for some context here. The reasons for this are down to changes made by the EU inn connection with the Russia/Ukraine conflict and this has had a consequential impact on NI steel imports:tailwindhome said:25% tarrif on steel from GB to NI
Cracking deal Frosty negotiated
https://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-62672105
Quote:
The EU has changed some of its rules in regard to steel imports for reasons related to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
That has had a knock-on effect on steel sales from Great Britain to Northern Ireland.
Trade expert Sam Lowe set out the complicated background to the issue earlier this month.
Essentially, steel from Great Britain had been able to enter Northern Ireland without a tariff because it was covered by a tariff rate quota (TRQ) for UK exports to the EU.
A TRQ allows a certain amount of a product to enter a customs territory without a tariff being paid, but once a set limit is reached tariffs apply.
Until June there was a specific TRQ for UK steel exports to the EU.
However, when sanctions were applied to Russia EU businesses could no longer buy steel from there.
So at that time the EU scrapped country-specific TRQs for the UK and others in favour of one TRQ for Ukraine and another TRQ covering all "other countries".
The Northern Ireland Protocol means NI continues to follow EU customs rules
Mr Lowe said this was intended to give EU steel importers more flexibility in the absence of Russian supplies.
However it also means that the tariff free limit for Great Britain supplies to Northern Ireland has been quickly reached, as Mr Lowe explained.
"Whereas before the UK had access to its own country-specific quota, which it could rely on to accommodate steel moving from Great Britain to Northern Ireland, now these movements would be covered by the 'other countries' quota which could fill up much more quickly, given the entire world has access to it," he said.
The EU was not forced to make this change, was it?
I've been explaining this to you for 2 years.
Frosty did a free trade deal so bad, the UK no longer has free trade with itself.
Brexit isn’t about deals and contracts.
It’s about the ability to blame others. Political fodder.0 -
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Truss vs Reality
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/aug/31/brexit-monster-under-bed-liz-truss-ignoreWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
I think that I am well known as an early adopter of the opinion that Boris was uniquely unqualified to be the leader of this country, he then surrounded himself with 2nd raters and far exceeded (on the downside) my expectations.
My point is to not to crow about how clever I am but to say that I am looking at Truss and the 3rd raters surrounding her and am genuinely starting to wonder whether Boris was really that bad.0 -
Tangentially related but I was listening to some news on what Biden is up to with his pretty narrow majority and I was thinking how strange it is to see a government making pretty big decisions that aren't forced by a crisis, as this government hasn't now for quite a while.
Even Brexit was offered to the electorate rather than the govt deciding themselves
It's just been a steady attrition of all the services they run, as well as some civil rights, and then crisis management. That's about it.
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It is remarkable to think that Brexit has paralysed the State for 7 years with no immediate end in sightrick_chasey said:Tangentially related but I was listening to some news on what Biden is up to with his pretty narrow majority and I was thinking how strange it is to see a government making pretty big decisions that aren't forced by a crisis, as this government hasn't now for quite a while.
Even Brexit was offered to the electorate rather than the govt deciding themselves
It's just been a steady attrition of all the services they run, as well as some civil rights, and then crisis management. That's about it.0 -
johnson and his enablers are the cause of the problem, uk has no chance of recovery until they're all flushed out of the systemsurrey_commuter said:I think that I am well known as an early adopter of the opinion that Boris was uniquely unqualified to be the leader of this country, he then surrounded himself with 2nd raters and far exceeded (on the downside) my expectations.
My point is to not to crow about how clever I am but to say that I am looking at Truss and the 3rd raters surrounding her and am genuinely starting to wonder whether Boris was really that bad.
if he was still there, he'd continue the blatant corruption and erosion of (already low) standards - he should have been jailed for funnelling public funds to his mistress's company, instead he became pmmy bike - faster than god's and twice as shiny0 -
Truss is a Johnson legacy.surrey_commuter said:I think that I am well known as an early adopter of the opinion that Boris was uniquely unqualified to be the leader of this country, he then surrounded himself with 2nd raters and far exceeded (on the downside) my expectations.
My point is to not to crow about how clever I am but to say that I am looking at Truss and the 3rd raters surrounding her and am genuinely starting to wonder whether Boris was really that bad.
You don't get Truss without Johnson.0 -
All of the above.rick_chasey said:
Truss is a Johnson legacy.surrey_commuter said:I think that I am well known as an early adopter of the opinion that Boris was uniquely unqualified to be the leader of this country, he then surrounded himself with 2nd raters and far exceeded (on the downside) my expectations.
My point is to not to crow about how clever I am but to say that I am looking at Truss and the 3rd raters surrounding her and am genuinely starting to wonder whether Boris was really that bad.
You don't get Truss without Johnson.
Truss could actually prove to be more incompetent (scary) but counter intuitively, less bad.
She doesn’t have the charisma to steam roller opposition and galvanise support so will ultimately be less dangerous.
She will also help turn the less moronic back to normal thinking as they realise what they’ve done.0 -
My worry is that she does not have BoJo's indolence so will do more damagemorstar said:
All of the above.rick_chasey said:
Truss is a Johnson legacy.surrey_commuter said:I think that I am well known as an early adopter of the opinion that Boris was uniquely unqualified to be the leader of this country, he then surrounded himself with 2nd raters and far exceeded (on the downside) my expectations.
My point is to not to crow about how clever I am but to say that I am looking at Truss and the 3rd raters surrounding her and am genuinely starting to wonder whether Boris was really that bad.
You don't get Truss without Johnson.
Truss could actually prove to be more incompetent (scary) but counter intuitively, less bad.
She doesn’t have the charisma to steam roller opposition and galvanise support so will ultimately be less dangerous.
She will also help turn the less moronic back to normal thinking as they realise what they’ve done.0 -
Fair.surrey_commuter said:
My worry is that she does not have BoJo's indolence so will do more damagemorstar said:
All of the above.rick_chasey said:
Truss is a Johnson legacy.surrey_commuter said:I think that I am well known as an early adopter of the opinion that Boris was uniquely unqualified to be the leader of this country, he then surrounded himself with 2nd raters and far exceeded (on the downside) my expectations.
My point is to not to crow about how clever I am but to say that I am looking at Truss and the 3rd raters surrounding her and am genuinely starting to wonder whether Boris was really that bad.
You don't get Truss without Johnson.
Truss could actually prove to be more incompetent (scary) but counter intuitively, less bad.
She doesn’t have the charisma to steam roller opposition and galvanise support so will ultimately be less dangerous.
She will also help turn the less moronic back to normal thinking as they realise what they’ve done.
I 100% see the next two years being bad for the country.
I can only take a longer term view of people hopefully turning against nonsense populist politics. I think she is less of a threat to that hope than Bojo.
My only worry is what if that doesn’t happen?0 -
Off-topic somewhat, I remember a 2*2 matrix classification of army officers, originally credited to General von Manstein of the Wehrmacht and perhaps pilfered by the Boston Consulting Group, who could "2*2 matrix" pretty much anything.surrey_commuter said:
My worry is that she does not have BoJo's indolence so will do more damagemorstar said:
All of the above.rick_chasey said:
Truss is a Johnson legacy.surrey_commuter said:I think that I am well known as an early adopter of the opinion that Boris was uniquely unqualified to be the leader of this country, he then surrounded himself with 2nd raters and far exceeded (on the downside) my expectations.
My point is to not to crow about how clever I am but to say that I am looking at Truss and the 3rd raters surrounding her and am genuinely starting to wonder whether Boris was really that bad.
You don't get Truss without Johnson.
Truss could actually prove to be more incompetent (scary) but counter intuitively, less bad.
She doesn’t have the charisma to steam roller opposition and galvanise support so will ultimately be less dangerous.
She will also help turn the less moronic back to normal thinking as they realise what they’ve done.
On one axis you have lazy/hardworking and on the other you have stupid/intelligent.
Anyway, to cut a long story short, it's the stupid hard working types about which you need to be aware, ideally firing as quickly as possible. They have the ability to cause all sorts of damage with their stupidity, and their work ethic means they can spread their damage far and wide. Truss seems fairly and squarely in this box.
Stupid lazy types can be largely ignored. They may have the capability to cause mayhem but prefer to do as little as possible. In military situations, they are perfect "cannon fodder".
Hard working intelligent types are the ideal senior field officers who can give and take orders, and can be relied on to deliver.
The lazy intelligent types are the one destined for leadership as they have all the ideas but leave it to the hard working intelligent types to implement sensibly. Boris is probably in the "lazy intelligent" quadrant but he'd sacked all the hard working intelligent types prior to the 2019 GE, so there was no-one left to implement his ideas sensibly, with the void since 2019 filled by the hard working stupid types. Hence the chaos.
https://mikelaud.blogspot.com/2010/02/von-manstein-matrix.html#:~:text=The Von Manstein Matrix is an excellent paradigm,categorisation applies to employees most organisations even today.
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Stupid, yes. Hard working? How many of those #toryscum qualify for that? More like hard lining their own and their mates pockets. Little Hatty Mancock for example.0
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I wonder which category most Cake Stoppers would fall into.wallace_and_gromit said:
Off-topic somewhat, I remember a 2*2 matrix classification of army officers, originally credited to General von Manstein of the Wehrmacht and perhaps pilfered by the Boston Consulting Group, who could "2*2 matrix" pretty much anything.surrey_commuter said:
My worry is that she does not have BoJo's indolence so will do more damagemorstar said:
All of the above.rick_chasey said:
Truss is a Johnson legacy.surrey_commuter said:I think that I am well known as an early adopter of the opinion that Boris was uniquely unqualified to be the leader of this country, he then surrounded himself with 2nd raters and far exceeded (on the downside) my expectations.
My point is to not to crow about how clever I am but to say that I am looking at Truss and the 3rd raters surrounding her and am genuinely starting to wonder whether Boris was really that bad.
You don't get Truss without Johnson.
Truss could actually prove to be more incompetent (scary) but counter intuitively, less bad.
She doesn’t have the charisma to steam roller opposition and galvanise support so will ultimately be less dangerous.
She will also help turn the less moronic back to normal thinking as they realise what they’ve done.
On one axis you have lazy/hardworking and on the other you have stupid/intelligent.
Anyway, to cut a long story short, it's the stupid hard working types about which you need to be aware, ideally firing as quickly as possible. They have the ability to cause all sorts of damage with their stupidity, and their work ethic means they can spread their damage far and wide. Truss seems fairly and squarely in this box.
Stupid lazy types can be largely ignored. They may have the capability to cause mayhem but prefer to do as little as possible. In military situations, they are perfect "cannon fodder".
Hard working intelligent types are the ideal senior field officers who can give and take orders, and can be relied on to deliver.
The lazy intelligent types are the one destined for leadership as they have all the ideas but leave it to the hard working intelligent types to implement sensibly. Boris is probably in the "lazy intelligent" quadrant but he'd sacked all the hard working intelligent types prior to the 2019 GE, so there was no-one left to implement his ideas sensibly, with the void since 2019 filled by the hard working stupid types. Hence the chaos.
https://mikelaud.blogspot.com/2010/02/von-manstein-matrix.html#:~:text=The Von Manstein Matrix is an excellent paradigm,categorisation applies to employees most organisations even today."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Definitely one of the two lazy ones for me.0
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Those pesky Eu laws
https://www.techradar.com/news/the-eu-wants-smartphones-and-tablets-to-last-longer-heres-why-you-should-care
Bloody red tape introduced with a clear and positive objective. Obviously, outcomes can vary from intention.0 -
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0
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Lol
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
You would need a heart of stone not to find that funnytailwindhome said:1 -
the sort of policies that result from bottom of the barrel ministers with a hard brexit mentality and donors to keep happy
https://www.theregister.com/2022/09/05/culture_secretary_data_bill_uk/
it removes or degrades individuals' rights - already a proven brexit outcome, this will make things worse
it damages trade with eu - already a proven brexit outcome, losing adequacy will make things worse
it's trivial to both comply with gdpr and avoid managing pop-up consent forms, just stop tracking people
dorries' plan certainly makes life easier for organizations that want to play fast and loose with your personal data - thw big brexit funder's company and his leave.eu misinformation site, were fined for exactly this
but dorries instead thinks weakening protections is the solution, wonder whymy bike - faster than god's and twice as shiny0 -
It's either completely stupid or completely disingenuous.sungod said:the sort of policies that result from bottom of the barrel ministers with a hard brexit mentality and donors to keep happy
https://www.theregister.com/2022/09/05/culture_secretary_data_bill_uk/
it removes or degrades individuals' rights - already a proven brexit outcome, this will make things worse
it damages trade with eu - already a proven brexit outcome, losing adequacy will make things worse
it's trivial to both comply with gdpr and avoid managing pop-up consent forms, just stop tracking people
dorries' plan certainly makes life easier for organizations that want to play fast and loose with your personal data - thw big brexit funder's company and his leave.eu misinformation site, were fined for exactly this
but dorries instead thinks weakening protections is the solution, wonder why- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
A common argument on here: is Brexit done? Fact checked by the BBC today:Johnson's Brexit claim fact-checked
In his speech earlier, Boris Johnson paid tribute to the people in his government who’d “got Brexit done” - a claim he’s made many times before.
In a literal sense, the UK did leave the EU on 31 January 2020.
But if this slogan implied Brexit would be done and dusted, this has clearly not happened.
A huge amount remains unresolved, from Northern Ireland to financial services.
A large number of trade deals have been signed around the world (the vast majority of which simply replace the ones the UK already had as an EU member), but a deal with the US hasn't happened.
The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), which makes economic judgements for the government, predicts that leaving the EU will reduce the UK's imports and exports by about 15% in the long term, with about a 4% hit to productivity.
Supporters of Brexit say sovereignty has been restored, and unwanted regulations can now be cut.
You can read about Boris Johnson's other pledges and whether he met them here.- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
Did Lincoln get the Civil War done? any people in the south of USA believe that the Civil War is not over and merely in abeyance.pangolin said:A common argument on here: is Brexit done? Fact checked by the BBC today:
Johnson's Brexit claim fact-checked
In his speech earlier, Boris Johnson paid tribute to the people in his government who’d “got Brexit done” - a claim he’s made many times before.
In a literal sense, the UK did leave the EU on 31 January 2020.
But if this slogan implied Brexit would be done and dusted, this has clearly not happened.
A huge amount remains unresolved, from Northern Ireland to financial services.
A large number of trade deals have been signed around the world (the vast majority of which simply replace the ones the UK already had as an EU member), but a deal with the US hasn't happened.
The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), which makes economic judgements for the government, predicts that leaving the EU will reduce the UK's imports and exports by about 15% in the long term, with about a 4% hit to productivity.
Supporters of Brexit say sovereignty has been restored, and unwanted regulations can now be cut.
You can read about Boris Johnson's other pledges and whether he met them here.
Did the Allies get WW2 done or is the current issue in Ukraine the latest continuance of that.
As a literal person I am genuinely intrigued what else people consider "not done"1 -
In the supermarket the other day I had this exchange over Pringles…
Guy is shaking tubes to find the full ones.
Me: “You need to be careful, some of the tubes are different sizes”. (Some 200g and some 165g all mixed together).
Him: “It’s that European sizing they’re forcing on us. I don’t know why, we voted out of all that”.
Me: Dumbfounded silence. Another argument for passing a test before voting on anything.0
