BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
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Please people have some respect fr
It's all a little complicated for my noggin to take in. All such a waste of time though relative to being in the EU.tailwindhome said:
🚗🚀🔋☀️🛰️🐦🤯tailwindhome said:Twitter thread on the mechanisms of former an Executive for anyone interested
(Yeah, I know, you hate Twitter, you don't want to click it....)
Hadn't fully appreciated the significance of tweet 2
Under the current framework,
the refusal to nominate FM or DFN means the Executive can't meet. However Assembly business continues, the Assembly can meet, private members bills can be moved, committees function and crucially, ministers can continue to run their departments on a day to day basis - though 'new' decisions which require Executive approval can't happen
If the DUP refuse to approve a speaker, all this stops and we're back to the NI Civil Service running the country on reduced funding0 -
.skyblueamateur said:
I thought they’d ‘got Brexit done’.
We're almost there... instead of the simplicity of an ultra hard Brexit, they are going for 'International Pariah Hard Brexit' by signing an international treaty to 'get Brexit done', then reneging on it, so no-one trusts the UK in future negotiations. Genius. But then, of course, everyone who voted for Brexit knew what they were voting for.0 -
At ease, Stevo. Your link refers to treaty changes being needed. Treaties can have all manner of opt-outs negotiated into them, as they can only be implemented following unanimous approval by member states.Stevo_666 said:Interestingly the EU is now moving to abolish the veto on tax and EU treaty related matters in the EU. After a lot of talk on here a while back about there being no problem as we could just use our veto...
Quote from a technical update type email I received recently:
"Report from Carla Valério, Associate, IBFD
European Commission President Speaks in Favour of Ending Unanimity Voting in Key Areas
On 9 May 2022, at the closing event of the Conference on the Future of Europe, Ursula von der Leyen, President of the European Commission, stated that she has always argued that unanimity voting in some key areas simply no longer makes sense if the European Union wants to be able to move faster.
Even though von der Leyen did not specify which key areas she was referring to, this statement followed the adoption of the proposal of measures on tax matters at the Conference Plenary, including "ensuring that decisions on tax matters can be taken by qualified majority in the Council of the European Union" (see European Union-4, News 2 May 2022).
The European Parliament also recently adopted a resolution asking the Committee on Constitutional Affairs of the European Parliament to prepare proposals to reform the EU treaties, including ending the unanimity in the Council of the European Union, following up on the same proposals by the Conference Plenary (see European Union-3, News 4 May 2022). "
That said, despite being a remainer, one of my big misgivings about the EU was once a member state had approved a treaty, that was pretty much it. The next government in that member state was bound by it, even if the country by that stage was totally opposed to the relevant laws. There was the potential for renegotiating treaties, but I don't recall any EU laws ever being relaxed via new treaties - change was only ever in one direction i.e. towards more centralisation.
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Other than reduced funding were there any noticeable downsides to not having a Govt?tailwindhome said:
Hadn't fully appreciated the significance of tweet 2tailwindhome said:Twitter thread on the mechanisms of former an Executive for anyone interested
(Yeah, I know, you hate Twitter, you don't want to click it....)
Under the current framework,
the refusal to nominate FM or DFN means the Executive can't meet. However Assembly business continues, the Assembly can meet, private members bills can be moved, committees function and crucially, ministers can continue to run their departments on a day to day basis - though 'new' decisions which require Executive approval can't happen
If the DUP refuse to approve a speaker, all this stops and we're back to the NI Civil Service running the country on reduced funding
I am sure I read an article that countries without Govt’s got on just fine. Dodgy memory but possibly Belgium and Trinidad were in that position for years and life carried on as before0 -
Weird why people should think this way, with all those Brexit benefits...
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17% is probably in line with how many people claim to have seen aliensbriantrumpet said:Weird why people should think this way, with all those Brexit benefits...
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Going badly aligns with those who voted remain so it suggests Brexiteers have split over going well, neither or don't know. Although it could be that those who voted remain are thinking it isn't as bad as they'd expected I suppose. The thing I'm most surprised at is that there seems to be a very slow shift from badly to well, I'd love to know what has happened since January to make some people more optimistic.0
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We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
it is like a metaphor for Brexit, it really is not the end of the world but there is less choice at more expense.ddraver said:0 -
Treaties is one part, tax is the other. There are potentially a lot of tax changes that could be imposed by directive that would not require treaty changes. Which given these sorts of things are usually be a messy compromise between member states would probably not be totally suitable for the UK in many cases.wallace_and_gromit said:
At ease, Stevo. Your link refers to treaty changes being needed. Treaties can have all manner of opt-outs negotiated into them, as they can only be implemented following unanimous approval by member states.Stevo_666 said:Interestingly the EU is now moving to abolish the veto on tax and EU treaty related matters in the EU. After a lot of talk on here a while back about there being no problem as we could just use our veto...
Quote from a technical update type email I received recently:
"Report from Carla Valério, Associate, IBFD
European Commission President Speaks in Favour of Ending Unanimity Voting in Key Areas
On 9 May 2022, at the closing event of the Conference on the Future of Europe, Ursula von der Leyen, President of the European Commission, stated that she has always argued that unanimity voting in some key areas simply no longer makes sense if the European Union wants to be able to move faster.
Even though von der Leyen did not specify which key areas she was referring to, this statement followed the adoption of the proposal of measures on tax matters at the Conference Plenary, including "ensuring that decisions on tax matters can be taken by qualified majority in the Council of the European Union" (see European Union-4, News 2 May 2022).
The European Parliament also recently adopted a resolution asking the Committee on Constitutional Affairs of the European Parliament to prepare proposals to reform the EU treaties, including ending the unanimity in the Council of the European Union, following up on the same proposals by the Conference Plenary (see European Union-3, News 4 May 2022). "
That said, despite being a remainer, one of my big misgivings about the EU was once a member state had approved a treaty, that was pretty much it. The next government in that member state was bound by it, even if the country by that stage was totally opposed to the relevant laws. There was the potential for renegotiating treaties, but I don't recall any EU laws ever being relaxed via new treaties - change was only ever in one direction i.e. towards more centralisation.
However I am definitely at ease as it doesn't impact us
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Of course, it never would have.0
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It would if we were still in the EU, clearly.kingstongraham said:Of course, it never would have.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Why did it never happen while we were in the EU then?Stevo_666 said:
It would if we were still in the EU, clearly.kingstongraham said:Of course, it never would have.
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Stevo - At the moment, national tax policy is not an EU competence. It would require a treaty change via unanimous vote to end this, and that is simply not going to happen as even the "best" European won't cede powers over tax to anyone. VAT is different as this was established as a EC competence 60+ years ago. If the EU could claim powers to change national tax policy via QMV then the Irish would have been stuffed years ago.
Though by not being in the EU, we are of course removed from the risk of a pro-EU UK government ceding powers in perpetuity in an act of unreciprocated European harmony.
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Once again, the EU just ignores Britain until we sheepishly just have to use their standards anyway...
https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/foreign-office-passport-validity-europe-travel-b2077606.htmlWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
baffled that this is news, eu rules on non-eu passport validity were clear pre-brexit, it's almost as if the government didn't want to publicise yet another negative 'bonus'ddraver said:Once again, the EU just ignores Britain until we sheepishly just have to use their standards anyway...
https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/foreign-office-passport-validity-europe-travel-b2077606.html
i've had several 10+ year passports due to them filling up with visas, the 'unused' years are added to the new passport's term, last one would've hit the ten years next month, but still had three years until expiry
renewed mine november while travel was still down as the current backlog seemed inevitable, looks horrible too
my bike - faster than god's and twice as shiny0 -
But it is blue!0
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Seems we've gained 90,000 civil servants since 2016.
Startling stuff given the wheels of government provided services seem to creak so badly.0 -
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rick_chasey said:
Brexit innitmorstar said:Seems we've gained 90,000 civil servants since 2016.
Startling stuff given the wheels of government provided services seem to creak so badly.
So we gain lots of people to manage the UK's being outside the EU, so this shambles of a government plan to axe people who actually do stuff for UK citizens. Got it.
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Can't imagine there's a huge appetite over there for a trade war with the EU over NI?“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0
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Is there much appetite in the EU?tailwindhome said:Can't imagine there's a huge appetite over there for a trade war with the EU over NI?
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tailwindhome said:
Can't imagine there's a huge appetite over there for a trade war with the EU over NI?
Lack of imagination on your part. If only you had the imagination of the Brexiters, who still think that we can have cake & eat it, and no-one will care if the UK tears up international treaties they've signed when they don't suit the UK.
All you can imagine is chickens coming home to roost. Try harder.0 -
Is the UK planning to tear up the treaty or use the terms of it in a way one party doesn't like?briantrumpet said:tailwindhome said:Can't imagine there's a huge appetite over there for a trade war with the EU over NI?
Lack of imagination on your part. If only you had the imagination of the Brexiters, who still think that we can have cake & eat it, and no-one will care if the UK tears up international treaties they've signed when they don't suit the UK.
All you can imagine is chickens coming home to roost. Try harder.0 -
TheBigBean said:
Is the UK planning to tear up the treaty or use the terms of it in a way one party doesn't like?briantrumpet said:tailwindhome said:Can't imagine there's a huge appetite over there for a trade war with the EU over NI?
Lack of imagination on your part. If only you had the imagination of the Brexiters, who still think that we can have cake & eat it, and no-one will care if the UK tears up international treaties they've signed when they don't suit the UK.
All you can imagine is chickens coming home to roost. Try harder.
What do you think unilaterally disregarding parts of a legal agreement looks like?0 -
From who? Obviously, the Conservative government only care about what will agitate their voters, so NI is very helpful if it continues to provide antagonism with the EU. As there are no Conservative votes in NI, it doesn't actually matter much what the local effects are.tailwindhome said:Can't imagine there's a huge appetite over there for a trade war with the EU over NI?
For most people though? I wouldn't have thought it's a great idea - but I don't know that it would be a massive majority that think that.0 -
Article 16 allows unilateral action.briantrumpet said:TheBigBean said:
Is the UK planning to tear up the treaty or use the terms of it in a way one party doesn't like?briantrumpet said:tailwindhome said:Can't imagine there's a huge appetite over there for a trade war with the EU over NI?
Lack of imagination on your part. If only you had the imagination of the Brexiters, who still think that we can have cake & eat it, and no-one will care if the UK tears up international treaties they've signed when they don't suit the UK.
All you can imagine is chickens coming home to roost. Try harder.
What do you think unilaterally disregarding parts of a legal agreement looks like?0 -
I would argue that the vast majority have no idea what it means and so with a bit of jingoism will be right behind the idea.kingstongraham said:
From who? Obviously, the Conservative government only care about what will agitate their voters, so NI is very helpful if it continues to provide antagonism with the EU. As there are no Conservative votes in NI, it doesn't actually matter much what the local effects are.tailwindhome said:Can't imagine there's a huge appetite over there for a trade war with the EU over NI?
For most people though? I wouldn't have thought it's a great idea - but I don't know that it would be a massive majority that think that.
The EU of course will hammer politically sensitive industries like fish and farming0
