BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
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They might do. We will see. We are essentially arguing about something that is not very important in the grand scheme of things.elbowloh said:
There's a reason why they all have their groupsets aimed at similar brackets of riders and similar price points. If Shimanos price went up £400, I think the only thing that would happen with Campag and SRAM is a price increase also.john80 said:
If the groupset cost £1600 pre brexit and this then gets priced up to £2000 post brexit there is a £400 gap for a competitor to come into. If the competition all collude and accept the price is £2000 then you are right. If one breaks then they will increase their market share. The overall market will shrink at the £2000 but again this will be on a curve where sales and price will have an optimum profit which is a second factor. Your focus on how Britain is viewed around the world says more about you than me. Businesses don't generally care about the personal beliefs of the customer. They care that they want to buy something and have the money generally. Shimano will do what is best for their business bottom line.ddraver said:
Its hard not to use the word deluded to describe your impressions of how GB is viewed around the world right now...john80 said:
Shimano to take your case in point should pivot to either supplying complete items or assembling far east components in the UK to sell in the UK market. It is a opportunity in as much as it is a problem. The loss would be the EUs problem unless there is no competition indefinitely which will not be the case.yorkshireraw said:
name some none EU suppliers - and don't say Shimano as they assemble stuff in the EU.john80 said:
Non EU suppliers will do a roaring trade at the detriment to EU suppliers.yorkshireraw said:
Food is subject to a very different set of rules than man made metal objects.david37 said:yesterday i ordered some tooling from a German manufacturer.
The order process was visually the same as previously, delivery times are the same, cost was the same.
Invoice looks different with an additional note about the tax treatment and a note re reclaiming vat.
Brexit is not a complete nightmare (for me at least).
The tooling and machinery are manufactured in Germany, are delivered directly from Germany by a company that is trading with the UK and presumably many other independent countries around the world.
no doubt they had to put some work and thought into this.
It's going to be alright xxx
Also, my LBS is reporting they have been told of massive (30%) price increases for bikes and components out of Europe, due to COO complexities for different parts that are then assembled together in the EU.
I am glad this isn't an issue for your area, but that isn't to say there aren't severe consequences for many other businesses and consumers.
Why on earth would Shimano (or Campag or SRAM) do that?
If none of them do it, prices go up, the only people who lose out is us0 -
You are the one getting hung up on mainly trivial discretionary spend items. Etsy limiting the cr@p they can sell you will save the planet as how many impractical office chairs do you need to go with your scented candles. I have got 4 bikes so groupset manufacturers will be waiting a while for my discretionary spend if I dont think it is good value. There will be competition in the market and it won't involve the three companies following illogical import routes that don't change as markets change unless they want to make less money in the long run.ddraver said:So why would they do this..?
Like the erstwhile Coop you're now having an argument with yourself...john80 said:pivot to either supplying complete items or assembling far east components in the UK to sell in the UK market.
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Whilst not important it is something we know more about, collectively, than any other retail market. Why do you not think it will be the same for many other products?john80 said:
They might do. We will see. We are essentially arguing about something that is not very important in the grand scheme of things.elbowloh said:
There's a reason why they all have their groupsets aimed at similar brackets of riders and similar price points. If Shimanos price went up £400, I think the only thing that would happen with Campag and SRAM is a price increase also.john80 said:
If the groupset cost £1600 pre brexit and this then gets priced up to £2000 post brexit there is a £400 gap for a competitor to come into. If the competition all collude and accept the price is £2000 then you are right. If one breaks then they will increase their market share. The overall market will shrink at the £2000 but again this will be on a curve where sales and price will have an optimum profit which is a second factor. Your focus on how Britain is viewed around the world says more about you than me. Businesses don't generally care about the personal beliefs of the customer. They care that they want to buy something and have the money generally. Shimano will do what is best for their business bottom line.ddraver said:
Its hard not to use the word deluded to describe your impressions of how GB is viewed around the world right now...john80 said:
Shimano to take your case in point should pivot to either supplying complete items or assembling far east components in the UK to sell in the UK market. It is a opportunity in as much as it is a problem. The loss would be the EUs problem unless there is no competition indefinitely which will not be the case.yorkshireraw said:
name some none EU suppliers - and don't say Shimano as they assemble stuff in the EU.john80 said:
Non EU suppliers will do a roaring trade at the detriment to EU suppliers.yorkshireraw said:
Food is subject to a very different set of rules than man made metal objects.david37 said:yesterday i ordered some tooling from a German manufacturer.
The order process was visually the same as previously, delivery times are the same, cost was the same.
Invoice looks different with an additional note about the tax treatment and a note re reclaiming vat.
Brexit is not a complete nightmare (for me at least).
The tooling and machinery are manufactured in Germany, are delivered directly from Germany by a company that is trading with the UK and presumably many other independent countries around the world.
no doubt they had to put some work and thought into this.
It's going to be alright xxx
Also, my LBS is reporting they have been told of massive (30%) price increases for bikes and components out of Europe, due to COO complexities for different parts that are then assembled together in the EU.
I am glad this isn't an issue for your area, but that isn't to say there aren't severe consequences for many other businesses and consumers.
Why on earth would Shimano (or Campag or SRAM) do that?
If none of them do it, prices go up, the only people who lose out is us0 -
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Did the Polish truckie have his sandwiches confiscated at Dover?0
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It is remarkable how two groups who were part of the leave coalition, fishing and ulster unionists have been suffering immediately.
How does BoJo get away with it?0 -
All that focus on who could fish where, and no focus on what Brexit was doing to the existing trade.
Remarkable short sightedness.
Did they just think the guys were lying to everyone else and not them? As ever, the real mugs are the people who believe the lies.0 -
I am not convinced by the arguments. If I was Shimano I would be importing direct to the UK from the far east as it would save me cash over the assumed current model that it all comes into a EU central hub and is distributed from there. The UK market is big enough to support this. I would not just increase prices in the hope that say SRAM don't do this. The generic argument still stands that businesses will look at market change and aim to raise prices as much as possible without harming sales unduly.surrey_commuter said:
Whilst not important it is something we know more about, collectively, than any other retail market. Why do you not think it will be the same for many other products?john80 said:
They might do. We will see. We are essentially arguing about something that is not very important in the grand scheme of things.elbowloh said:
There's a reason why they all have their groupsets aimed at similar brackets of riders and similar price points. If Shimanos price went up £400, I think the only thing that would happen with Campag and SRAM is a price increase also.john80 said:
If the groupset cost £1600 pre brexit and this then gets priced up to £2000 post brexit there is a £400 gap for a competitor to come into. If the competition all collude and accept the price is £2000 then you are right. If one breaks then they will increase their market share. The overall market will shrink at the £2000 but again this will be on a curve where sales and price will have an optimum profit which is a second factor. Your focus on how Britain is viewed around the world says more about you than me. Businesses don't generally care about the personal beliefs of the customer. They care that they want to buy something and have the money generally. Shimano will do what is best for their business bottom line.ddraver said:
Its hard not to use the word deluded to describe your impressions of how GB is viewed around the world right now...john80 said:
Shimano to take your case in point should pivot to either supplying complete items or assembling far east components in the UK to sell in the UK market. It is a opportunity in as much as it is a problem. The loss would be the EUs problem unless there is no competition indefinitely which will not be the case.yorkshireraw said:
name some none EU suppliers - and don't say Shimano as they assemble stuff in the EU.john80 said:
Non EU suppliers will do a roaring trade at the detriment to EU suppliers.yorkshireraw said:
Food is subject to a very different set of rules than man made metal objects.david37 said:yesterday i ordered some tooling from a German manufacturer.
The order process was visually the same as previously, delivery times are the same, cost was the same.
Invoice looks different with an additional note about the tax treatment and a note re reclaiming vat.
Brexit is not a complete nightmare (for me at least).
The tooling and machinery are manufactured in Germany, are delivered directly from Germany by a company that is trading with the UK and presumably many other independent countries around the world.
no doubt they had to put some work and thought into this.
It's going to be alright xxx
Also, my LBS is reporting they have been told of massive (30%) price increases for bikes and components out of Europe, due to COO complexities for different parts that are then assembled together in the EU.
I am glad this isn't an issue for your area, but that isn't to say there aren't severe consequences for many other businesses and consumers.
Why on earth would Shimano (or Campag or SRAM) do that?
If none of them do it, prices go up, the only people who lose out is us
To put this in perspective Yanmar manufacturing yacht engines have a UK distributor on much smaller albeit higher unit costs for what is a very small market. I can't buy an engine direct from Yanmar. I bought an engineer from a UK company as they import a Kubota base engine into the UK and marinise it for a significantly cheaper cost as I essentially cut out a layer of distribution that Yanmar don't allow due to their business model.0 -
Exactly - the UK has decided to impose that additional cost on Shimano, for sales to UK customers. It's not just the way the market works or unpredictable flows or competition that did it. The market effects of that are less predictable - could be reduced profit for Shimano, could be increased prices. That could lead to reduced market share or increased prices from their competitors, depending on how the market reacts.john80 said:
I am not convinced by the arguments. If I was Shimano I would be importing direct to the UK from the far east as it would save me cash over the assumed current model that it all comes into a EU central hub and is distributed from there. The UK market is big enough to support this. I would not just increase prices in the hope that say SRAM don't do this. The generic argument still stands that businesses will look at market change and aim to raise prices as much as possible without harming sales unduly.surrey_commuter said:
Whilst not important it is something we know more about, collectively, than any other retail market. Why do you not think it will be the same for many other products?john80 said:
They might do. We will see. We are essentially arguing about something that is not very important in the grand scheme of things.elbowloh said:
There's a reason why they all have their groupsets aimed at similar brackets of riders and similar price points. If Shimanos price went up £400, I think the only thing that would happen with Campag and SRAM is a price increase also.john80 said:
If the groupset cost £1600 pre brexit and this then gets priced up to £2000 post brexit there is a £400 gap for a competitor to come into. If the competition all collude and accept the price is £2000 then you are right. If one breaks then they will increase their market share. The overall market will shrink at the £2000 but again this will be on a curve where sales and price will have an optimum profit which is a second factor. Your focus on how Britain is viewed around the world says more about you than me. Businesses don't generally care about the personal beliefs of the customer. They care that they want to buy something and have the money generally. Shimano will do what is best for their business bottom line.ddraver said:
Its hard not to use the word deluded to describe your impressions of how GB is viewed around the world right now...john80 said:
Shimano to take your case in point should pivot to either supplying complete items or assembling far east components in the UK to sell in the UK market. It is a opportunity in as much as it is a problem. The loss would be the EUs problem unless there is no competition indefinitely which will not be the case.yorkshireraw said:
name some none EU suppliers - and don't say Shimano as they assemble stuff in the EU.john80 said:
Non EU suppliers will do a roaring trade at the detriment to EU suppliers.yorkshireraw said:
Food is subject to a very different set of rules than man made metal objects.david37 said:yesterday i ordered some tooling from a German manufacturer.
The order process was visually the same as previously, delivery times are the same, cost was the same.
Invoice looks different with an additional note about the tax treatment and a note re reclaiming vat.
Brexit is not a complete nightmare (for me at least).
The tooling and machinery are manufactured in Germany, are delivered directly from Germany by a company that is trading with the UK and presumably many other independent countries around the world.
no doubt they had to put some work and thought into this.
It's going to be alright xxx
Also, my LBS is reporting they have been told of massive (30%) price increases for bikes and components out of Europe, due to COO complexities for different parts that are then assembled together in the EU.
I am glad this isn't an issue for your area, but that isn't to say there aren't severe consequences for many other businesses and consumers.
Why on earth would Shimano (or Campag or SRAM) do that?
If none of them do it, prices go up, the only people who lose out is us
To put this in perspective Yanmar manufacturing yacht engines have a UK distributor on much smaller albeit higher unit costs for what is a very small market. I can't buy an engine direct from Yanmar. I bought an engineer from a UK company as they import a Kubota base engine into the UK and marinise it for a significantly cheaper cost as I essentially cut out a layer of distribution that Yanmar don't allow due to their business model.
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Let's play a game of Brexit ownership avoidance. Been given a concrete example of a downside to Brexit? Just pick from one of these handy answers to avoid ever admitting it was a mistake:
I never liked (X) anyway
I've already got loads of (X) so I don't care if the price goes up
Actually (X) is bad for the environment so it's good we can't get it now
Lol remainers are unhappy so this is a good thing
This is a great opportunity for us to make (X) in the UK!
Something about how the EU is bad
They took my sandwich!- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono3 -
Why do you think Shimano do not do that?john80 said:
I am not convinced by the arguments. If I was Shimano I would be importing direct to the UK from the far east as it would save me cash over the assumed current model that it all comes into a EU central hub and is distributed from there. The UK market is big enough to support this. I would not just increase prices in the hope that say SRAM don't do this. The generic argument still stands that businesses will look at market change and aim to raise prices as much as possible without harming sales unduly.surrey_commuter said:
Whilst not important it is something we know more about, collectively, than any other retail market. Why do you not think it will be the same for many other products?john80 said:
They might do. We will see. We are essentially arguing about something that is not very important in the grand scheme of things.elbowloh said:
There's a reason why they all have their groupsets aimed at similar brackets of riders and similar price points. If Shimanos price went up £400, I think the only thing that would happen with Campag and SRAM is a price increase also.john80 said:
If the groupset cost £1600 pre brexit and this then gets priced up to £2000 post brexit there is a £400 gap for a competitor to come into. If the competition all collude and accept the price is £2000 then you are right. If one breaks then they will increase their market share. The overall market will shrink at the £2000 but again this will be on a curve where sales and price will have an optimum profit which is a second factor. Your focus on how Britain is viewed around the world says more about you than me. Businesses don't generally care about the personal beliefs of the customer. They care that they want to buy something and have the money generally. Shimano will do what is best for their business bottom line.ddraver said:
Its hard not to use the word deluded to describe your impressions of how GB is viewed around the world right now...john80 said:
Shimano to take your case in point should pivot to either supplying complete items or assembling far east components in the UK to sell in the UK market. It is a opportunity in as much as it is a problem. The loss would be the EUs problem unless there is no competition indefinitely which will not be the case.yorkshireraw said:
name some none EU suppliers - and don't say Shimano as they assemble stuff in the EU.john80 said:
Non EU suppliers will do a roaring trade at the detriment to EU suppliers.yorkshireraw said:
Food is subject to a very different set of rules than man made metal objects.david37 said:yesterday i ordered some tooling from a German manufacturer.
The order process was visually the same as previously, delivery times are the same, cost was the same.
Invoice looks different with an additional note about the tax treatment and a note re reclaiming vat.
Brexit is not a complete nightmare (for me at least).
The tooling and machinery are manufactured in Germany, are delivered directly from Germany by a company that is trading with the UK and presumably many other independent countries around the world.
no doubt they had to put some work and thought into this.
It's going to be alright xxx
Also, my LBS is reporting they have been told of massive (30%) price increases for bikes and components out of Europe, due to COO complexities for different parts that are then assembled together in the EU.
I am glad this isn't an issue for your area, but that isn't to say there aren't severe consequences for many other businesses and consumers.
Why on earth would Shimano (or Campag or SRAM) do that?
If none of them do it, prices go up, the only people who lose out is us
To put this in perspective Yanmar manufacturing yacht engines have a UK distributor on much smaller albeit higher unit costs for what is a very small market. I can't buy an engine direct from Yanmar. I bought an engineer from a UK company as they import a Kubota base engine into the UK and marinise it for a significantly cheaper cost as I essentially cut out a layer of distribution that Yanmar don't allow due to their business model.0 -
And I assume that any company that had the UK as its hub for EU supply has to decide what to do about the scale of that operation in the UK, and whether to duplicate that in the EU.0
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rick_chasey said:
All that focus on who could fish where, and no focus on what Brexit was doing to the existing trade.
Remarkable short sightedness.
Did they just think the guys were lying to everyone else and not them? As ever, the real mugs are the people who believe the lies.
I am torn on this, my initial reaction is fvck off you thick cvnt, this is what you voted for.
On the other hand these people left school at 16 and have spent the last 30 years bobbing around the North Sea, how were they meant to know that the Boris was a lying cvnt and was lying to them.
If he was strung up I would not shed a tear2 -
In the scale of their total business, I suspect cycling components sold in the UK isn't all that significant - not enough to warrant setting up a whole supply chain & manufacturing / assembly for one market. They would probably accept taking a bit of a hit in volumes to protect margins, if that even happened - if you need a rear mech, you don't have massive choice is the rest of your kit is already shimano.john80 said:
Shimano to take your case in point should pivot to either supplying complete items or assembling far east components in the UK to sell in the UK market. It is a opportunity in as much as it is a problem. The loss would be the EUs problem unless there is no competition indefinitely which will not be the case.yorkshireraw said:
name some none EU suppliers - and don't say Shimano as they assemble stuff in the EU.john80 said:
Non EU suppliers will do a roaring trade at the detriment to EU suppliers.yorkshireraw said:
Food is subject to a very different set of rules than man made metal objects.david37 said:yesterday i ordered some tooling from a German manufacturer.
The order process was visually the same as previously, delivery times are the same, cost was the same.
Invoice looks different with an additional note about the tax treatment and a note re reclaiming vat.
Brexit is not a complete nightmare (for me at least).
The tooling and machinery are manufactured in Germany, are delivered directly from Germany by a company that is trading with the UK and presumably many other independent countries around the world.
no doubt they had to put some work and thought into this.
It's going to be alright xxx
Also, my LBS is reporting they have been told of massive (30%) price increases for bikes and components out of Europe, due to COO complexities for different parts that are then assembled together in the EU.
I am glad this isn't an issue for your area, but that isn't to say there aren't severe consequences for many other businesses and consumers.
Most shimano is probably sold to 3rd parties (i.e. bike manufacturers) anyway, so it is, as has been pointed out, not straightforward, involves different markets, rules, paperwork etc, and hence why end product to a now 3rd country becomes more costly.
But is suspect you know all this.0 -
are you 12?david37 said:
if he told you the sky was going to fall in would you believe that too? He was a senior manageroooo he has spoken to his supplier ooooooyorkshireraw said:
It's the owner. He's been told it directly from suppliers. He's an ex senior manager one of the UKs biggest retailers. He knows exactly what he's talking about.david37 said:
your local bike shop is talking boll ocks. I suspect that most local bike shop employees know about as much about the complexities of COO as i do about nucleur physics.yorkshireraw said:
Food is subject to a very different set of rules than man made metal objects.david37 said:yesterday i ordered some tooling from a German manufacturer.
The order process was visually the same as previously, delivery times are the same, cost was the same.
Invoice looks different with an additional note about the tax treatment and a note re reclaiming vat.
Brexit is not a complete nightmare (for me at least).
The tooling and machinery are manufactured in Germany, are delivered directly from Germany by a company that is trading with the UK and presumably many other independent countries around the world.
no doubt they had to put some work and thought into this.
It's going to be alright xxx
Also, my LBS is reporting they have been told of massive (30%) price increases for bikes and components out of Europe, due to COO complexities for different parts that are then assembled together in the EU.
I am glad this isn't an issue for your area, but that isn't to say there aren't severe consequences for many other businesses and consumers.
You should apply to CERN.
seriously i know someone who told me that someone who knew a doctor at a hospital that covid was something and nothing.
If the big brands dont see the uk as a market worth investing in, they wont. if they dont someone else will appear that can and will make an effort. Its a massive opportunity.0 -
ah the smell of remoaner bile is growing stale.
Time to move on to more positive things youll feel better and achieve more.
of course if it really is greener over there go and live in Europe or anywhere else youre able to. there's work to be done over here. Alternately if it really is that awful and you cant see the way out there is no shame in stopping your suffering now.
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It's the 'Leopards eating people's faces' thing....rick_chasey said:All that focus on who could fish where, and no focus on what Brexit was doing to the existing trade.
Remarkable short sightedness.
Did they just think the guys were lying to everyone else and not them? As ever, the real mugs are the people who believe the lies.0 -
That one doesn't work any more. You need new tunes.david37 said:ah the smell of remoaner bile is growing stale.
Time to move on to more positive things youll feel better and achieve more.
of course if it really is greener over there go and live in Europe or anywhere else youre able to. there's work to be done over here. Alternately if it really is that awful and you cant see the way out there is no shame in stopping your suffering now.
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Indeed - it's a deliberate strawman - there never used to be an 'over there', we were in it.kingstongraham said:
That one doesn't work any more. You need new tunes.david37 said:ah the smell of remoaner bile is growing stale.
Time to move on to more positive things youll feel better and achieve more.
of course if it really is greener over there go and live in Europe or anywhere else youre able to. there's work to be done over here. Alternately if it really is that awful and you cant see the way out there is no shame in stopping your suffering now.0 -
yorkshireraw said:
It's the 'Leopards eating people's faces' thing....rick_chasey said:All that focus on who could fish where, and no focus on what Brexit was doing to the existing trade.
Remarkable short sightedness.
Did they just think the guys were lying to everyone else and not them? As ever, the real mugs are the people who believe the lies.
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rick_chasey said:yorkshireraw said:
It's the 'Leopards eating people's faces' thing....rick_chasey said:All that focus on who could fish where, and no focus on what Brexit was doing to the existing trade.
Remarkable short sightedness.
Did they just think the guys were lying to everyone else and not them? As ever, the real mugs are the people who believe the lies.
"If only someone could have foreseen this" etc....0 -
"I didn't think people wouldn't be able to buy OUR shellfish, says company that supported 'Preventing populations procuring prawns' Party "rick_chasey said:yorkshireraw said:
It's the 'Leopards eating people's faces' thing....rick_chasey said:All that focus on who could fish where, and no focus on what Brexit was doing to the existing trade.
Remarkable short sightedness.
Did they just think the guys were lying to everyone else and not them? As ever, the real mugs are the people who believe the lies.0 -
So please feel free to extol the virtues of the brave new world.david37 said:ah the smell of remoaner bile is growing stale.
Time to move on to more positive things youll feel better and achieve more.
of course if it really is greener over there go and live in Europe or anywhere else youre able to. there's work to be done over here. Alternately if it really is that awful and you cant see the way out there is no shame in stopping your suffering now.
BTW, we are still in Europe, it's a geographical continent.
It's just a hill. Get over it.1 -
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Others have claimed they don't hence the price increase claims. If they already directly import then nothing has changed. Tariffs are the same and paperwork from the far East is the same. I am not the one claiming that it is all ported to a EU country and then distributed from there. Ddraver is.surrey_commuter said:
Why do you think Shimano do not do that?john80 said:
I am not convinced by the arguments. If I was Shimano I would be importing direct to the UK from the far east as it would save me cash over the assumed current model that it all comes into a EU central hub and is distributed from there. The UK market is big enough to support this. I would not just increase prices in the hope that say SRAM don't do this. The generic argument still stands that businesses will look at market change and aim to raise prices as much as possible without harming sales unduly.surrey_commuter said:
Whilst not important it is something we know more about, collectively, than any other retail market. Why do you not think it will be the same for many other products?john80 said:
They might do. We will see. We are essentially arguing about something that is not very important in the grand scheme of things.elbowloh said:
There's a reason why they all have their groupsets aimed at similar brackets of riders and similar price points. If Shimanos price went up £400, I think the only thing that would happen with Campag and SRAM is a price increase also.john80 said:
If the groupset cost £1600 pre brexit and this then gets priced up to £2000 post brexit there is a £400 gap for a competitor to come into. If the competition all collude and accept the price is £2000 then you are right. If one breaks then they will increase their market share. The overall market will shrink at the £2000 but again this will be on a curve where sales and price will have an optimum profit which is a second factor. Your focus on how Britain is viewed around the world says more about you than me. Businesses don't generally care about the personal beliefs of the customer. They care that they want to buy something and have the money generally. Shimano will do what is best for their business bottom line.ddraver said:
Its hard not to use the word deluded to describe your impressions of how GB is viewed around the world right now...john80 said:
Shimano to take your case in point should pivot to either supplying complete items or assembling far east components in the UK to sell in the UK market. It is a opportunity in as much as it is a problem. The loss would be the EUs problem unless there is no competition indefinitely which will not be the case.yorkshireraw said:
name some none EU suppliers - and don't say Shimano as they assemble stuff in the EU.john80 said:
Non EU suppliers will do a roaring trade at the detriment to EU suppliers.yorkshireraw said:
Food is subject to a very different set of rules than man made metal objects.david37 said:yesterday i ordered some tooling from a German manufacturer.
The order process was visually the same as previously, delivery times are the same, cost was the same.
Invoice looks different with an additional note about the tax treatment and a note re reclaiming vat.
Brexit is not a complete nightmare (for me at least).
The tooling and machinery are manufactured in Germany, are delivered directly from Germany by a company that is trading with the UK and presumably many other independent countries around the world.
no doubt they had to put some work and thought into this.
It's going to be alright xxx
Also, my LBS is reporting they have been told of massive (30%) price increases for bikes and components out of Europe, due to COO complexities for different parts that are then assembled together in the EU.
I am glad this isn't an issue for your area, but that isn't to say there aren't severe consequences for many other businesses and consumers.
Why on earth would Shimano (or Campag or SRAM) do that?
If none of them do it, prices go up, the only people who lose out is us
To put this in perspective Yanmar manufacturing yacht engines have a UK distributor on much smaller albeit higher unit costs for what is a very small market. I can't buy an engine direct from Yanmar. I bought an engineer from a UK company as they import a Kubota base engine into the UK and marinise it for a significantly cheaper cost as I essentially cut out a layer of distribution that Yanmar don't allow due to their business model.0 -
That was poorly written on my part.john80 said:
Others have claimed they don't hence the price increase claims. If they already directly import then nothing has changed. Tariffs are the same and paperwork from the far East is the same. I am not the one claiming that it is all ported to a EU country and then distributed from there. Ddraver is.surrey_commuter said:
Why do you think Shimano do not do that?john80 said:
I am not convinced by the arguments. If I was Shimano I would be importing direct to the UK from the far east as it would save me cash over the assumed current model that it all comes into a EU central hub and is distributed from there. The UK market is big enough to support this. I would not just increase prices in the hope that say SRAM don't do this. The generic argument still stands that businesses will look at market change and aim to raise prices as much as possible without harming sales unduly.surrey_commuter said:
Whilst not important it is something we know more about, collectively, than any other retail market. Why do you not think it will be the same for many other products?john80 said:
They might do. We will see. We are essentially arguing about something that is not very important in the grand scheme of things.elbowloh said:
There's a reason why they all have their groupsets aimed at similar brackets of riders and similar price points. If Shimanos price went up £400, I think the only thing that would happen with Campag and SRAM is a price increase also.john80 said:
If the groupset cost £1600 pre brexit and this then gets priced up to £2000 post brexit there is a £400 gap for a competitor to come into. If the competition all collude and accept the price is £2000 then you are right. If one breaks then they will increase their market share. The overall market will shrink at the £2000 but again this will be on a curve where sales and price will have an optimum profit which is a second factor. Your focus on how Britain is viewed around the world says more about you than me. Businesses don't generally care about the personal beliefs of the customer. They care that they want to buy something and have the money generally. Shimano will do what is best for their business bottom line.ddraver said:
Its hard not to use the word deluded to describe your impressions of how GB is viewed around the world right now...john80 said:
Shimano to take your case in point should pivot to either supplying complete items or assembling far east components in the UK to sell in the UK market. It is a opportunity in as much as it is a problem. The loss would be the EUs problem unless there is no competition indefinitely which will not be the case.yorkshireraw said:
name some none EU suppliers - and don't say Shimano as they assemble stuff in the EU.john80 said:
Non EU suppliers will do a roaring trade at the detriment to EU suppliers.yorkshireraw said:
Food is subject to a very different set of rules than man made metal objects.david37 said:yesterday i ordered some tooling from a German manufacturer.
The order process was visually the same as previously, delivery times are the same, cost was the same.
Invoice looks different with an additional note about the tax treatment and a note re reclaiming vat.
Brexit is not a complete nightmare (for me at least).
The tooling and machinery are manufactured in Germany, are delivered directly from Germany by a company that is trading with the UK and presumably many other independent countries around the world.
no doubt they had to put some work and thought into this.
It's going to be alright xxx
Also, my LBS is reporting they have been told of massive (30%) price increases for bikes and components out of Europe, due to COO complexities for different parts that are then assembled together in the EU.
I am glad this isn't an issue for your area, but that isn't to say there aren't severe consequences for many other businesses and consumers.
Why on earth would Shimano (or Campag or SRAM) do that?
If none of them do it, prices go up, the only people who lose out is us
To put this in perspective Yanmar manufacturing yacht engines have a UK distributor on much smaller albeit higher unit costs for what is a very small market. I can't buy an engine direct from Yanmar. I bought an engineer from a UK company as they import a Kubota base engine into the UK and marinise it for a significantly cheaper cost as I essentially cut out a layer of distribution that Yanmar don't allow due to their business model.
I am not doubting that Ddraver is correct.
My question is why do you think that Shimano do not directly import into the UK?0 -
that is too small for me to read but it does seem bizarre that she only just noticed.rick_chasey said:
Interesting that she can not resist the knee jerk blame the Tories when I am pretty sure she would have been first in the queue to reject all attempts to keep maintain the UK0 -
Are we allowed to use the word Schadenfreude now we've left the EU or is there a British equivalent for British people?0
