BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
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Ballysmate wrote:Not being able to see into TM's mind I can only guess, just like the rest.
Perhaps she has accepted the result of the referendum and feels that she must set out to get the best deal for the UK in the circumstances.
or she realised she has no choice and as she has to do what the EU tells us then she may as well look like she is control0 -
Lookyhere wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:So the Brexiters, so despised on here by some are actually less bigoted than us remainers. We draw a distinction between people from our own continent and the rest of the world. Brexiters want to treat all potential entrants on merit.
Well I never!!
No. Brexiteers want the population to be as English as possible, but understand some need to be let in to do their cleaning for less money and generally fill some gaps where necessary in the labour market.
Not all Brexiteers are racists, but all racists are Brexiteers.
Whereas we remainers want the population to be European. We don't want any of those African or American types do we? Or perish the thought, Aussies?
the immigration policy toward non eu nationals was particularly harsh because the tories said they wanted immigration down to the 10s of 1000s.
what will no doubt happen now is that less eu citizens will come here, to be replaced with more non eu ones, probably the exact opposite to what brixiters want.
i thought one of the brexiters arguments was that if we stay in, all those millions in libya and turkey would be coming here?
i m quite amazed at how a supporter of our membership of the EU has suddenly became a hardened Brexiter, step forward Mrs May, a conviction politician of some renown :?
what do you think she should do?0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:So the Brexiters, so despised on here by some are actually less bigoted than us remainers. We draw a distinction between people from our own continent and the rest of the world. Brexiters want to treat all potential entrants on merit.
Well I never!!
No. Brexiteers want the population to be as English as possible, but understand some need to be let in to do their cleaning for less money and generally fill some gaps where necessary in the labour market.
Not all Brexiteers are racists, but all racists are Brexiteers.
Whereas we remainers want the population to be European. We don't want any of those African or American types do we? Or perish the thought, Aussies?
I think it is xenophobia rather than racism. The more like us the immigrant is the more accepted they are, so a white English speaking, christian is more acceptable than non-white, non-English speaking, non-christian0 -
Surrey Commuter wrote:Lookyhere wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:So the Brexiters, so despised on here by some are actually less bigoted than us remainers. We draw a distinction between people from our own continent and the rest of the world. Brexiters want to treat all potential entrants on merit.
Well I never!!
No. Brexiteers want the population to be as English as possible, but understand some need to be let in to do their cleaning for less money and generally fill some gaps where necessary in the labour market.
Not all Brexiteers are racists, but all racists are Brexiteers.
Whereas we remainers want the population to be European. We don't want any of those African or American types do we? Or perish the thought, Aussies?
the immigration policy toward non eu nationals was particularly harsh because the tories said they wanted immigration down to the 10s of 1000s.
what will no doubt happen now is that less eu citizens will come here, to be replaced with more non eu ones, probably the exact opposite to what brixiters want.
i thought one of the brexiters arguments was that if we stay in, all those millions in libya and turkey would be coming here?
i m quite amazed at how a supporter of our membership of the EU has suddenly became a hardened Brexiter, step forward Mrs May, a conviction politician of some renown :?
what do you think she should do?
I've always wanted the PM to do the right thing for the country. Clearly she's failed that already. Pathetic.
Just watching the conference now and wanting to throw the remote at the TV. What a bunch of self-satisfied, smug, deluded pricks.0 -
Surrey Commuter wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:So the Brexiters, so despised on here by some are actually less bigoted than us remainers. We draw a distinction between people from our own continent and the rest of the world. Brexiters want to treat all potential entrants on merit.
Well I never!!
No. Brexiteers want the population to be as English as possible, but understand some need to be let in to do their cleaning for less money and generally fill some gaps where necessary in the labour market.
Not all Brexiteers are racists, but all racists are Brexiteers.
Whereas we remainers want the population to be European. We don't want any of those African or American types do we? Or perish the thought, Aussies?
I think it is xenophobia rather than racism. The more like us the immigrant is the more accepted they are, so a white English speaking, christian is more acceptable than non-white, non-English speaking, non-christian
Correct.0 -
Joelsim wrote:Surrey Commuter wrote:Lookyhere wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:So the Brexiters, so despised on here by some are actually less bigoted than us remainers. We draw a distinction between people from our own continent and the rest of the world. Brexiters want to treat all potential entrants on merit.
Well I never!!
No. Brexiteers want the population to be as English as possible, but understand some need to be let in to do their cleaning for less money and generally fill some gaps where necessary in the labour market.
Not all Brexiteers are racists, but all racists are Brexiteers.
Whereas we remainers want the population to be European. We don't want any of those African or American types do we? Or perish the thought, Aussies?
the immigration policy toward non eu nationals was particularly harsh because the tories said they wanted immigration down to the 10s of 1000s.
what will no doubt happen now is that less eu citizens will come here, to be replaced with more non eu ones, probably the exact opposite to what brixiters want.
i thought one of the brexiters arguments was that if we stay in, all those millions in libya and turkey would be coming here?
i m quite amazed at how a supporter of our membership of the EU has suddenly became a hardened Brexiter, step forward Mrs May, a conviction politician of some renown :?
what do you think she should do?
I've always wanted the PM to do the right thing for the country. Clearly she's failed that already. Pathetic.
Just watching the conference now and wanting to throw the remote at the TV. What a bunch of self-satisfied, smug, deluded pricks.
What I meant is that bearing in mind the situation that she has inherited what would you like her to do? this is a genuine question0 -
FTSE 100 up just over 1.1%Joelsim wrote:It'll be interesting to see what the markets think tomorrow.
FTSE 250 up approx 1.4%
Euro/Sterling down by just less than 1%
Probably to be expected."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Seems quite a few people have sidestepped this rather relevant point. I've always argued that while we need to be able to have people with the right skills come here, there is a still a need in the longer term to control the size of the population on a small island. Especially in a country which has seen large scale population increases in recent times. It simply cannot go on forever. Unfortunately the EU is squarely against this as we know.Ballysmate wrote:verylonglegs wrote:Joelsim wrote:This has the potential to be the biggest f*ck up in UK history, at a time when we already have massive borrowing.
It defies any logic or sense.
Why should it make sense? Nationalism and bigotry has never made any sense.
First off, I voted remain.
I get pissed off with the lazy way terms like bigot get used though. People lazily assume that 17m people voted the way they did because they are bigots.
Yes, immigration played a big part in the referendum but it doesn't make all OUT voters bigots.
There are rules that govern the admission of non EU nationals, which I assume people are quite happy with. Otherwise there would be a clamour for an open border to the rest of the world. Some Brexiters want this extended to EU nationals as well. How does that make them bigots in making everyone applying for entry the same? People applying from N and S America, Africa, Asia and Australia are treated differently from those wishing to come from Europe.
Surely withholding rights that are conferred on others is more akin to bigotry than treating everyone as being equal?
Why is withholding entry from a person from say Africa is regarded as being acceptable but to potentially bar a person from Europe considered bigotry?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:Everyone's basically inherently racist BigBean.
It's about the active fight against it, rather than succumbing to it in varying degrees.
If we take racism to include national identity, any discussion on immigration whatsoever is fundamentally racist; that's kinda the point; we decide who of them has rights here. Any we/them distinction discriminates. That's just the way identity works.
I broadly agree although I don't think I'm everyone. I think everyone should challenge the prejudices they have and try to live without them. Separate discussion, but it is something I try to do. It makes reading CVs a complete nightmare.0 -
Report from one of the big banks today:
"The Great Repeal Act will of course require a debate in parliament. We still do not know for sure
whether parliament also has to approve the triggering of Article 50 – the law firm Mishcon de Reya is
bringing a case arguing that it does, which will be heard this month, although no specific date has been
confirmed. Again, we do not think parliament would stand in the way of the action itself, if the court
ruled against the government. But the debate around it could be noisy and time-consuming."
Probably not what you want to hear JS."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Surrey Commuter wrote:Lookyhere wrote:
the immigration policy toward non eu nationals was particularly harsh because the tories said they wanted immigration down to the 10s of 1000s.
what do you think she should do?
Allow people to live with their spouses rather than follow her own vindictive policy that she spent millions defending.0 -
Stevo 666 wrote:
FTSE 100 up just over 1.1%Joelsim wrote:It'll be interesting to see what the markets think tomorrow.
Euro/Sterling down by just less than 1%
Probably to be expected.
FTSE since 2011
Same chart, but in $
Basically, FTSE has been flat in $$ (which is the currency in which most of the firms operate in) since Brexit vote.
FTSE also down nearly 5% since the day before the Brexit vote, in $
FTSE 250 is down 9.4% YTD in $0 -
TheBigBean wrote:Surrey Commuter wrote:Lookyhere wrote:
the immigration policy toward non eu nationals was particularly harsh because the tories said they wanted immigration down to the 10s of 1000s.
what do you think she should do?
Allow people to live with their spouses rather than follow her own vindictive policy that she spent millions defending.
and about
" i m quite amazed at how a supporter of our membership of the EU has suddenly became a hardened Brexiter, step forward Mrs May, a conviction politician of some renown :?"0 -
Surrey Commuter wrote:TheBigBean wrote:Surrey Commuter wrote:Lookyhere wrote:
the immigration policy toward non eu nationals was particularly harsh because the tories said they wanted immigration down to the 10s of 1000s.
what do you think she should do?
Allow people to live with their spouses rather than follow her own vindictive policy that she spent millions defending.
and about
" i m quite amazed at how a supporter of our membership of the EU has suddenly became a hardened Brexiter, step forward Mrs May, a conviction politician of some renown :?"
She's a politician. There is no such thing as conviction.0 -
Incidentally, one of the promises that Boris made to encourage a Brexit vote was an end to the current spouse nonsense. This encouraged a lot of ethic minorities to vote for Brexit because it tapped into lingering feelings that they were discriminated against in comparison to EU citizens.
And then May got even more power, so I guess they were wasted votes.0 -
Stevo 666 wrote:Report from one of the big banks today:
"The Great Repeal Act will of course require a debate in parliament. We still do not know for sure
whether parliament also has to approve the triggering of Article 50 – the law firm Mishcon de Reya is
bringing a case arguing that it does, which will be heard this month, although no specific date has been
confirmed. Again, we do not think parliament would stand in the way of the action itself, if the court
ruled against the government. But the debate around it could be noisy and time-consuming."
Probably not what you want to hear JS.
It'll boil down to whether MPs do the right thing for their constituents or do the right thing for themselves as far as reelections are concerned.0 -
Stevo 666 wrote:
Seems quite a few people have sidestepped this rather relevant point. I've always argued that while we need to be able to have people with the right skills come here, there is a still a need in the longer term to control the size of the population on a small island. Especially in a country which has seen large scale population increases in recent times. It simply cannot go on forever. Unfortunately the EU is squarely against this as we know.Ballysmate wrote:verylonglegs wrote:Joelsim wrote:This has the potential to be the biggest f*ck up in UK history, at a time when we already have massive borrowing.
It defies any logic or sense.
Why should it make sense? Nationalism and bigotry has never made any sense.
First off, I voted remain.
I get pissed off with the lazy way terms like bigot get used though. People lazily assume that 17m people voted the way they did because they are bigots.
Yes, immigration played a big part in the referendum but it doesn't make all OUT voters bigots.
There are rules that govern the admission of non EU nationals, which I assume people are quite happy with. Otherwise there would be a clamour for an open border to the rest of the world. Some Brexiters want this extended to EU nationals as well. How does that make them bigots in making everyone applying for entry the same? People applying from N and S America, Africa, Asia and Australia are treated differently from those wishing to come from Europe.
Surely withholding rights that are conferred on others is more akin to bigotry than treating everyone as being equal?
Why is withholding entry from a person from say Africa is regarded as being acceptable but to potentially bar a person from Europe considered bigotry?
https://www.ft.com/content/0deacb52-178 ... 386a18e39d
http://www.economist.com/news/britain/2 ... er-done-us
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... -ucl-study
Oh.0 -
Joelsim wrote:Stevo 666 wrote:Report from one of the big banks today:
"The Great Repeal Act will of course require a debate in parliament. We still do not know for sure
whether parliament also has to approve the triggering of Article 50 – the law firm Mishcon de Reya is
bringing a case arguing that it does, which will be heard this month, although no specific date has been
confirmed. Again, we do not think parliament would stand in the way of the action itself, if the court
ruled against the government. But the debate around it could be noisy and time-consuming."
Probably not what you want to hear JS.
It'll boil down to whether MPs do the right thing for their constituents or do the right thing for themselves as far as reelections are concerned.
My MP is leading Brexiteer Chris Grayling. In the referendum his constituency voted overwhelmingly to remain. Are the wishes of the people on the overall vote or on his constituency? This is purely theoretical as the serial expenses abuser will probably be too indolent to cast his vote0 -
I know. Interesting, but JS' question was how the markets will react to the news of a hard BREXIT possibility, so the relevant info is the movements since yesterday. RTQRick Chasey wrote:Stevo 666 wrote:
FTSE 100 up just over 1.1%Joelsim wrote:It'll be interesting to see what the markets think tomorrow.
Euro/Sterling down by just less than 1%
Probably to be expected.
FTSE since 2011
Same chart, but in $
Basically, FTSE has been flat in $$ (which is the currency in which most of the firms operate in) since Brexit vote.
FTSE also down nearly 5% since the day before the Brexit vote, in $
FTSE 250 is down 9.4% YTD in $
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Not disputing the economic benefit of immigrants, although clearly in the longer term there are limits as to how many people a country can take without causing other issues.Joelsim wrote:Stevo 666 wrote:
Seems quite a few people have sidestepped this rather relevant point. I've always argued that while we need to be able to have people with the right skills come here, there is a still a need in the longer term to control the size of the population on a small island. Especially in a country which has seen large scale population increases in recent times. It simply cannot go on forever. Unfortunately the EU is squarely against this as we know.Ballysmate wrote:verylonglegs wrote:Joelsim wrote:This has the potential to be the biggest f*ck up in UK history, at a time when we already have massive borrowing.
It defies any logic or sense.
Why should it make sense? Nationalism and bigotry has never made any sense.
First off, I voted remain.
I get pissed off with the lazy way terms like bigot get used though. People lazily assume that 17m people voted the way they did because they are bigots.
Yes, immigration played a big part in the referendum but it doesn't make all OUT voters bigots.
There are rules that govern the admission of non EU nationals, which I assume people are quite happy with. Otherwise there would be a clamour for an open border to the rest of the world. Some Brexiters want this extended to EU nationals as well. How does that make them bigots in making everyone applying for entry the same? People applying from N and S America, Africa, Asia and Australia are treated differently from those wishing to come from Europe.
Surely withholding rights that are conferred on others is more akin to bigotry than treating everyone as being equal?
Why is withholding entry from a person from say Africa is regarded as being acceptable but to potentially bar a person from Europe considered bigotry?
https://www.ft.com/content/0deacb52-178 ... 386a18e39d
http://www.economist.com/news/britain/2 ... er-done-us
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... -ucl-study
Oh.
The point made above was about discriminating between Europeans and non-Europeans - see point in bold above from Bally's post. Same point as I made to Rick - RTQ."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Its more to do with the fact that we can work/travel in any other EU country, i cannot up sticks and move to Australia and work can i?
bigotry and discrimination have nowt to do with it.0 -
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Lookyhere wrote:Its more to do with the fact that we can work/travel in any other EU country, i cannot up sticks and move to Australia and work can i?
bigotry and discrimination have nowt to do with it.
Why? Are the Aussies bigots?0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Lookyhere wrote:Its more to do with the fact that we can work/travel in any other EU country, i cannot up sticks and move to Australia and work can i?
bigotry and discrimination have nowt to do with it.
Why? Are the Aussies bigots?
ha ha you know exactly what i mean! and yes most Aussies are!
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Last time I looked you could if you had some skills that they needed, or had a company sponsor you. Same way that a lot of Australians are working over here with no apparent difficulty - I just hired one today.Lookyhere wrote:Its more to do with the fact that we can work/travel in any other EU country, i cannot up sticks and move to Australia and work can i?
bigotry and discrimination have nowt to do with it.
Countries like Australia, NZ and Canada have points based immigration systems and nobody vaguely sensble is calling them a bunch of bigots "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Stevo 666 wrote:Lookyhere wrote:Its more to do with the fact that we can work/travel in any other EU country, i cannot up sticks and move to Australia and work can i?
bigotry and discrimination have nowt to do with it.
Last time I looked you could if you had some skills that they needed, or had a company sponsor you. Same way that a lot of Australians are working over here with no apparent difficulty - I just hired one today.
Countries like Australia, NZ and Canada have points based immigration systems and nobody vaguely sensble is calling them a bunch of bigots
whats your point?0 -
Just explaining why your statement above is wrong.Lookyhere wrote:Stevo 666 wrote:Lookyhere wrote:Its more to do with the fact that we can work/travel in any other EU country, i cannot up sticks and move to Australia and work can i?
bigotry and discrimination have nowt to do with it.
Last time I looked you could if you had some skills that they needed, or had a company sponsor you. Same way that a lot of Australians are working over here with no apparent difficulty - I just hired one today.
Countries like Australia, NZ and Canada have points based immigration systems and nobody vaguely sensble is calling them a bunch of bigots
whats your point?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Stevo, no -one has come close to answering the question I posed 2 pages ago. Perhaps everyone is a remainer bigot?0
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Ballysmate wrote:Stevo, no -one has come close to answering the question I posed 2 pages ago. Perhaps everyone is a remainer bigot?
That was soooo last year. :roll:seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
Pinno wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Stevo, no -one has come close to answering the question I posed 2 pages ago. Perhaps everyone is a remainer bigot?
That was soooo last year. :roll:
Well what do you expect from a dickhead?
viewtopic.php?p=19977943#p19977944
Cut to the quick, I was. :roll:0
