Road tubeless tyres, where and how much?

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  • Fat-Boy-Roubaix
    Fat-Boy-Roubaix Posts: 413
    Have to say I have never used anything extra on a tubeless, Co2 very occasionally on a wide tyre on a wide rim that more because its easier to use with one pair of hands. And I am pretty much crap at everything mechanical.

    I had a bad off on a clincher that the bead broke on and the tube got through in seconds right in a fast right hander, that's when I first flirted with tubeless and mainly why I am trying to stick with them although the memory of the off a distant one I like to know I might stand a little more chance on them. These Panaracers have now done 380 miles and I have just wiped them clean and not one cut, which is amazing as I have been on gravel and some really rough road surfaces. At 400 with the Schwalbe's I would have at least one cut to keep an eye on and quite a few nicks. At the end of the day they are race tyres, but still good as they are driving the market forward.

    If I can get 2k+ out of these it will be ok, not brilliant but ok.

    All in all I have 9k miles under my belt on Tubeless and only one roadside repair needed, a few need at home when the tyre would only hold 30-40psi. I reckon the secret to it is not keeping them at clincher levels of PSI 65-80 on 23mm
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    3000 miles on my Sector and still going...
    left the forum March 2023
  • Fat-Boy-Roubaix
    Fat-Boy-Roubaix Posts: 413
    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    3000 miles on my Sector and still going...

    Only 28's though! Cannot even clear a skinny 25mm on my summer bike :-(

    Although I like these my next target is the Hutchinson All season 23mm Fusion 5 £45.99 at the moment from Probikekit which is a decent price.
  • munkster
    munkster Posts: 819
    Although I like these my next target is the Hutchinson All season 23mm Fusion 5 £45.99 at the moment from Probikekit which is a decent price.

    Cheaper at acycles if these are the same: http://www.acycles.co.uk/hutchinson-fus ... 15229.html

    They are pretty quick too, deliver from France. IME the Fusions seem to be some of the "skinniest" so their 25mm may even be OK for you. Bit of a risk though as I know only too well...
  • fat_tail
    fat_tail Posts: 786
    i think I figured out what was wrong. it was simply a badly installed rim tape which was leaking. I will not mention the company I bought the wheels from until I give the opportunity to resolve it as I think it is very poor.

    Anyway, anyone know where I can get some 18mm tubeless rim tape on bank holiday Monday in South West London ?

    thanks
    Ridley Fenix SL
  • thegibdog
    thegibdog Posts: 2,106
    thecycleclinic wrote:
    Thegibdog you make not like your tubeless experience but that is because you have been useing the schwable one tyre. Also tubeless is a learning curve. The one is a mixed bag, it holds so much promise but punctures often and grip in the wet is awful. Not all tyres are like this. Irc manage better and the sector 28's are pretty good too. No idea on bontragers tyres and panracer have offers now. You have dimissed an entire technology based on a sample of one. It would be like dimissing all clinchers because you tried the vittoria zaffiro and thought all clichers would be the same. They are not, neither are all tubeless tyres the same. Also stans race sealant is wonderful stuff it plugs holes the size of your valve, which makes getting into the tyre through the valve awkward, but i am learning how to do that now without mess.
    I'm not dismissing tubeless, I'm just going back to standard clinchers. As you say the tubeless offering is still very limited and, as this thread demonstrates, getting hold of decent tyres at a reasonable price isn't easy. When (if?) tubeless tyres become more mainstream I might go back to them. At the moment I can get top quality clinchers - which I know ride well - for half the price of experimenting further with tubeless.

    As for the puncture I was using Continental sealant which wasn't doing the job - although it had filled some smaller holes previously I think. I will note the recommendation for Stan's (maybe you should update your website which recommends Zefal/Continental?) if I return to tubeless. I did just shove a tube in but getting the tyre off and on again was a nightmare.

    Anyway, apologies for taking the thread a bit off-topic.
    https://gibworth.mypixieset.com
  • graememacd
    graememacd Posts: 386
    Hi all, I'm after some new 25mm tubeless tyres to replace the Schwalbe one's that I've had on for 2500 miles. Preferably 25mm again, durable and fast if possible, any ideas?
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    graememacd wrote:
    Hi all, I'm after some new 25mm tubeless tyres to replace the Schwalbe one's that I've had on for 2500 miles. Preferably 25mm again, durable and fast if possible, any ideas?

    IRC roadlite

    https://whosatthewheel.com/2015/05/19/f ... ess-tyres/
    left the forum March 2023
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,698
    If one wanted something less tough as I am lucky enough to live in a place with smooth, clean well maintained roads, what would the alternative to the roadlite be -

    I don't only want a race light tyre mind as there has to be some real world riding...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • graememacd
    graememacd Posts: 386
    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    graememacd wrote:
    Hi all, I'm after some new 25mm tubeless tyres to replace the Schwalbe one's that I've had on for 2500 miles. Preferably 25mm again, durable and fast if possible, any ideas?

    IRC roadlite

    https://whosatthewheel.com/2015/05/19/f ... ess-tyres/

    Cheers Ugo, 2 ordered from the cycle clinic! If they are at least as good as the Schwalbe one's I'll be happy.
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    ddraver the less tough alternative is the Schwalbe Pro one or the old one. it is just the old one was not that great in the wet. It was O.K but had gator skin levels of wet grip not pave levels actually I still have not found a tyre that grips as well in the wet. IRC do have something new in the works though with a herring bone tread pattern I will have to wait and see if it lives up to the promise of being a tubeless Pave.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,698
    OK, there's no love for Hutchinson or the other IRC tyres then?
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    thecycleclinic wrote:
    IRC do have something new in the works though with a herring bone tread pattern I will have to wait and see if it lives up to the promise of being a tubeless Pave.

    Is it not widely accepted that any shallow thread pattern is little more than a cosmetic feature?
    left the forum March 2023
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    The compound is different too. The pattern will be mostly cosmetic but maybe it is not it look good though. I dont know any more though have not seen them and probably wont for a while.

    There are only 4 IRC offerings and only 2 folk seem interested in and to be honest the Roadlite and RBCC are the two I would use and do use. The formula lights has no buytl coating so they loose air more quickly. so while they ride nicely they are not much lighter than the first two and grip does not seem any better either, they are not a tyre that seems to be worth the premium. That is my honest opinion. .the formula X guard with the extra puncture protection belt is a good idea but only available in 23mm which is not a good idea. So love for a couple and the 5th version who knows.
    As for the hutchinson fusions there seems to be many people who find fitting issues to some rims so I think they could be fine tyres but they need to be on the right rims. If the fit is too tight the ammount of compression on the rim can be high and this can lead to relaibility issues. Picking wheels with offset rims and or 2:1 lacing like Campag/fulcrum do is a good idea.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,698
    Well, I have said wheels and I'm going to france which is where Hutchinson are from and so obviously they will be perfect there (...ahem :oops: )

    I ll let you know how I get on!

    (picking MTB tyres is a flipping nightmare in comparison to this...)
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • kingtubby
    kingtubby Posts: 45
    Ok, guys, got it sorted, for those who are interested the tips that worked for me to get the tightest tyres onto the Pacenti rim are
    a: Start opposite end to valve and finish at rim
    b: Keep pinching tyres towards the rim well
    c: Small increments.....
    d: Use a combination of the Var lever and a pedro for the last bit
    e: After all that to get it seated, ensure valve is tight and good to go.

    Thoughts: No wonder they came out with a MK2 rim for the Pacenti and am trying to think of a fool proof, quick easy cheap tool and method that will work for all tubeless tyres a la dragons den. Something that requires little technique or strength.

    Thanks for all the help
  • kingtubby
    kingtubby Posts: 45
    Oh and forgot to mention, as always once it was on, I realised the tyre was the wrong way....However second time is so much easier....
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    thecycleclinic wrote:
    The compound is different too. The pattern will be mostly cosmetic but maybe it is not it look good though. I dont know any more though have not seen them and probably wont for a while.

    Road patterns are always cosmetic. Once you put load on them, the pattern flattens against the tarmac. Besides, pattern on car tyres is there to avoid hydroplanning, there is no such risk on a bicycle. Pattern on an off road tyre is deep and it's there to find grip on soft or rocky terrain... pattern on a road tyre has no function whatsoever
    left the forum March 2023
  • skeetam
    skeetam Posts: 178
    Due to the Schwalbe One's being as rare as rocking horse sh*t and my current One's cracking and squaring off after about 8000 miles (not a gripe BTW), I've reluctantly had to look at some different tyres. My chosen rubber for the past 3 months has been the Bontrager R2 Hard-case lite TLR. Whilst they're no easier or harder to get on that the Ones, on the road, they're definitely an adequate replacement and at £29, they're a bit cheaper too. I can't really comment on how durable they are yet but they don't seem to collect as many cuts as the Ones did.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,698
    bike discount have all the schwalbe models in stock (and reduced significantly)

    Do you think I'd notice an improvement in speed using a 23c tyre vs a 25c in the Alps :P
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    ddraver wrote:
    bike discount have all the schwalbe models in stock (and reduced significantly)

    Do you think I'd notice an improvement in speed using a 23c tyre vs a 25c in the Alps :P

    You better stock up before Boris and Nigel start charging VAT on them... :wink:
    left the forum March 2023
  • skeetam
    skeetam Posts: 178
    ddraver wrote:
    bike discount have all the schwalbe models in stock (and reduced significantly)

    Thanks, just checked and indeed they are so ordered a set for one of my other bikes. I had been checking all the German sites but got fed up with them not being in stock.
  • graememacd
    graememacd Posts: 386
    Received my IRC Roadlites today from the cycleclinic. They look great however how do I get the bloody things to seal?? took my old Schwalbe one off fitted the new tyre without any issues, added some continental sealant and trying to pump it up all the sealant comes out the sides. rims are Archetypes if that makes a difference. I'm sure it was easy with the schwalbes
  • dork_knight
    dork_knight Posts: 405
    Inflate the tyre and have it seated and holding pressure without sealant, I found the IRC to leak more air than the Schwalbe One before adding sealant.

    Remove the valve core, add the sealant, inflate the tyres and spin it a few times to coat the inside of the tyre and leave over night to see if it holds pressure.
    The path of my life is strewn with cowpats from the devil's own satanic herd.
  • drlodge
    drlodge Posts: 4,826
    I had to add more rim tape to pop on the rim and they wouldn't seal fully until I added sealant.
    WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
    Find me on Strava
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    Archetype are not tubeless rims, so you can't seat the tyre without sealant, so you need to build pressure if you want them to seal. More tape helps, but you might need a compressor
    left the forum March 2023
  • graememacd
    graememacd Posts: 386
    Managed to inflate them in the end with some sealant and a Co2 inflator. All that faffing didn't leave me enough time for a test ride though! will try them later today
  • dork_knight
    dork_knight Posts: 405
    I didn't realize the issue with the H Plus Son Rim.

    graememacd ~ Maybe you should take a look at the video below as inflating with co2 and sealant is not advisable;
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtmatxJG_zg
    The path of my life is strewn with cowpats from the devil's own satanic herd.
  • fat_tail
    fat_tail Posts: 786
    edited June 2016
    an update on my move to tubeless.

    I replaced the poorly installed rim tape 3x. the first two with the replacement tape supplied by the wheel builders and the last time with some Stans tape. I also bought some o rings from b&q thinking that they might help with leak at the valve. None worked. Each time I pumped up the tyre after a rim tape installation there was a leak at the valve. no matter how much I tightened the lock nut or added an o ring. Finally, faced with no other options and with the prospect of an imminent divorce I popped in some Stans sealant, pumped it and prayed like hell. 15 minutes later the pressure was still holding, it held over night and seems to be ok !

    I had been reluctant to add sealant as I was concerned that it wouldn't work and I would have a mess on my hands.

    I hope all this effort is worth it !

    on 23 mm rims the 25mm IRC roadlites come up at 27mm ! yikes!

    ps

    first ride on the irc roadlites and they are the mutts

    pps

    If anyone has a problem getting a tubeless tyre seated, use the washing up liquid approach. It really does work.
    Ridley Fenix SL
  • Fat-Boy-Roubaix
    Fat-Boy-Roubaix Posts: 413
    Popped in to Evans warehouse store today asked if their awful website was really correct and they only stocked two road tubeless Specialized @ £80 and a Bonty Hardcase, he went on and told with me with quite some authority that the Schwalbe One would probably be ok as they do tubeless... Wow! He did cover himself with the statement you should check that online or maybe check out Wiggle as they have a large range of tyres lol

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