Vuelta al País Vasco 2014 **Spoilers**

ddraver

It's hardly an excuse, just the truth...

thomthom

Holm said today, during the race, that multiple Sky riders had trained too much.

mroli

frenchfighter wrote:

Some random stuff.

You're a mischievous scamp aren't you

frenchfighter

mroli wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Some random stuff.

You're a mischievous scamp aren't you

Dont you think it odd?! Im not sure how they can be fatigued unless they have been riding up hills somewhere sunny for the last three or four weeks. Its not the case though and if it was then it goes to show how much Sky care about competing and backing their Spanish team leader in his home race.

Give me more

Maybe if the Sky boys didn't have to put in lots of work to tow Nieve back up to the lead bunch because he gets out of position and misses a split 90k from home then they'd not be so tired out.

frenchfighter

They are pros on the biggest team in the world and ride harder than this for three weeks long in the biggest race in the world. Pretty much every other rider managed today and from what I read there wasnt that much going on after the initial flurry apart from Tinkoff chasing 12 or so riders down, some of whom they caught early the rest later. So they should be able to deal with it very easily and then protect Nieve until at least 5km to go.

kamil1891

I've got nothing against Sky...but Frenchie is right in this case. They are taking a pi*s.

ddraver

Betancur retires - fine
Cav has a stomach bug - fine
BMC riders retire - fine
etc
etc

Sky get tired or ill - WAR, DISASTER, FLAME, FAMINE

Seriously do people not know they re doing it or something? Is it involuntary?

andyp

What I like is how people be able to see how hard some of the riders worked based on what they read.

Mac9

Great to See Evans looking strong. Typical climb from him - you think he has popped but keeps chugging away and gets back on.

Valverde didn't give Contador an inch today but it has to be said, the pair looked like they had plenty more left in the tank and both looked very strong indeed.

Enjoyed that last 10km.

mroli

frenchfighter wrote:

Dont you think it odd?! Im not sure how they can be fatigued unless they have been riding up hills somewhere sunny for the last three or four weeks. Its not the case though and if it was then it goes to show how much Sky care about competing and backing their Spanish team leader in his home race.

Nah - not really. Kennaugh won his first stage race last week. He did T-A as well (coming 3rd in the Mountains classification). He's done 3145km in 23 days since mid Feb, plus training and will be aiming to peak at the TdF (presumably). Kiriyienka has done 3662km in 24 days in that time.

Its not masses (Contador has done similar), but its not an easy workload, especially as they have to work on days that Contador can take "easy".

You noted that PK's been showing signs of fatigue in this race already and I think that its far more likely than "they can't be arsed" or "its Nieve and they don't like him because he's Spanish", or "they don't care about Spanish races". Sure they could probably finish the race, but what's the point if it destroys your fitness? I agree that on their list of priorities "the tour of the Basque country" comes fairly low, but I still think they'd want to win it if they could...

Sky tried to win everything they rode over the past 2 years - I think that their failure to do so this year is a sign that their team is a little weaker (Wiggins not stage racing, Rogers gone, Uran gone, Henao on gardening leave, Porte sick, Froome injured, other valuable team members concentrating on classics) and also (touch wood) that other teams have closed the gap. I think its exciting and makes for a good season.

If you want to talk about who is the biggest team - its got to be OPQS right - I mean look at their Classics presence. Look at their sprint line up. Look at how promising a GT line up of Kwakker, De Gendt and Uran could be... No-one else can compete at that level across all 3 main disciplines?

frenchfighter

Good post mroli. What you say is fair to an extent. If these guys are genuinely fatigued then Sky are doing something massively wrong. Kiri especially is a monster and a pro for ages - zero chance he should be weary after a few pulls on the front.

Yeah PK was in TA. Fyi he finished 55mins down on Contador. 55mins down is not someone who is busting balls inside out. Grupetto riding. He and his team did an appalling job for Nieve in that race too.

Yeah OPQS are a great team. They know about the sports history, they come to almost all races to perform, they win a ton (check the tables this year) and they have a smaller budget than Sky. Kwiatek is younger than PK, a proper racer, exciting and stylish and 100x more successful than him.

That Sky are falling well short of expectations so far this season is great and the racing is more exciting. Kind of proves my point all along. They are doing better than expected in the one day races which is good to see. They are a single focused stage racing team though. Imo with their scientists, marginal gains and bucket loads of money they should be able to perform from one end of the season to the end like the other big teams do.

RichN95.

frenchfighter wrote:

Yeah OPQS are a great team. They know about the sports history, they come to almost all races to perform, they win a ton (check the tables this year) and they have a smaller budget than Sky.

They have a similar budget, bankrolled by two billionaires. And they always have lots of wins early season as they focus on the classics season, which thus far has been quite disappointing for them.

frenchfighter wrote:

They are a single focused stage racing team though. Imo with their scientists, marginal gains and bucket loads of money they should be able to perform from one end of the season to the end like the other big teams do.

They've been top ten in 6 of the 8 WT races so far (would have been 7 if Thomas hadn't crashed in Paris-Nice), compared to only 4 for OPQS

ddraver

Except that other teams don't! Saxo only have one card to play - ok it's a half decent one - but when Contador calls it a season that ll be that. Next Sunday Evening is the end of season party for OPQS. Lotto only have to worry about the last 10km in flat stages so they can keep that going for longer. Movistar are only interested in Spanish races and GTs

Your statements against Sky simply don't stand up to any rational analysis.

thegibdog

Had the gardeners in this afternoon taking care of some trees & hedges and they had the chipper running whilst I was watching this. Just a coincidence?

frenchfighter

Ps. Where did you get his km raced? I just checked CQ and it says he has 2.5k km. That is 525th position. Vasil only has 3k.

Its interesting looking at that table. Boonen tops it with over 5k, double Wiggins.

RichN95.

frenchfighter wrote:

Ps. Where did you get his km raced? I just checked CQ and it says he has 2.5k km. That is 525th position. Vasil only has 3k.

Its interesting looking at that table. Boonen tops it with over 5k, double Wiggins.

And after Sunday you won't see Boonen again until the Belgian Nationals.

Crankbrother

Trouble with SKY is they give soundbite excuses rather than just saying nothing ... If PK couldn't race then just don't send him ... Send a bunch of nobodies and if seriously pushed for a reason give the 'to give other riders some stage race experience' line ...

A leader from SKY should be at this race, especially if they are short of proper stage race miles and are a certainty for the start come July ... Saying that, Andy Schleck is in the wrong race given previous form ...

RichN95.

With regard to the idea that Sky should be competing in all the races like the other big teams. This is how many of the eight World Tour races each team has got a rider in the top ten (i.e. competing):

7 Katusha
6 Sky, BMC
5 Trek
4 Garmin, Belkin, Lotto, Movistar, OPQS
3 Lampre, Astana, Cannondale
2 Orica, FDJ, Saxo, Giant
1 Europcar

mroli

ddraver wrote:

Except that other teams don't! Saxo only have one card to play

Bit harsh on Roche and Kreuziger that. Roche has 7 top 20 GT finishes - including 5th in his last one. Kreuziger has finished 5th in the Tour and the Giro. If Contador does go to Alonso, you can bet your bottom dollar that Tinkoff will bring in a "name".

Mileage stats from Procyling - CQ only covers .1 and above and doesn't pick up (I assume) Mallorca Challenge. http://www.procyclingstats.com/rider/Peter_Kennaugh

DeadCalm

kamil1891 wrote:

I've got nothing against Sky...but Frenchie is right in this case. They are taking a pi*s.

Don't know about that. I certanly don't think it's a case of disrespecting the race or Nieve. Kennaugh had aspirations for a high GC place in this race himself but he has been simply unable to perform.

Peter kennaugh ‏@Petekennaugh Apr 9
Probly close to the worst I have ever felt on a bike today !

Why he has been suffering so badly must be of some concern to him and Sky though because FF is right, on the face of it, others who are competitive in this race have done similar or greater race miles recently.

Pross

RichN95 wrote:

With regard to the idea that Sky should be competing in all the races like the other big teams. This is how many of the eight World Tour races each team has got a rider in the top ten (i.e. competing):

7 Katusha
6 Sky, BMC
5 Trek
4 Garmin, Belkin, Lotto, Movistar, OPQS
3 Lampre, Astana, Cannondale
2 Orica, FDJ, Saxo, Giant
1 Europcar

What have I told you about using real facts on the Internet?

Richmond Racer

Extreme fatigue & no power in the legs = often a sign that the athlete's coming down with something.

But I'm sure everyone's already thought of that possibility.

frenchfighter

Stage 5:


In the last two years Contador and Peraud have been fairly evenly matched in the Time Trials. In 2010 Contador was a runaway winner.

I wonder if Contador will be happy with his current 36sec gap going into the 26km TT. I suspect Valverde will go all out today and Contador will be there but very few others. This would be ideal as Contador could gain more of a buffer. I suspect his buffer is enough vs all the other riders but it would be better to have it closer to a minute. Kwaitek at 41 secs is also a potential danger especially as he is better than Contador in the TT.

The TT having two climbs will work to Contador's advantage though.

frenchfighter

frenchfighter

RichN95.

I don't think I'll ever get used to the sight of Sanchez in non-orange kit.

ddraver

frenchfighter wrote:

Boring Robot tactics killing cyling for the real fans

joelsim

OPQS just need a GC contender and they would be the perfect team.

Sky have been found out, and their squad is nowhere near as strong as it was a couple of years ago. Decent riders but only Froome is a top top rider.

Richmond Racer

Joelsim wrote:

OPQS just need a GC contender and they would be the perfect team.

Sky have been found out, and their squad is nowhere near as strong as it was a couple of years ago. Decent riders but only Froome is a top top rider.

Broken record.

Umm...so is that why they won all the major stage races last year that they also won in 2012 (plus a couple of others on top), incl of course the Tour? They've got some problems at the moment, but did you actually watch last year's Dauphine? Or P-N? Or CI? Or Oman?

As for only Froome being a top rider...is that why Porte won one of the biggest stage races outside the GTs (P-N), finished runner up in another one of the biggest (Dauphine) AND finished 10th top rider on the UCI ranking table?

Now, where's that tuppence...