The Hour *** spoilers ***

ddraver

The other thing Rich is that each will want to do it on the best velodrome, at the best time of day at the best temperature. ie they re all going to want to do it in the exact same place....

Paul 8v

JSCL wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

Right people who can arrange this sort of thing. You know what we all want. Martin, Cancellara and Wiggins all going for the record at exactly the same time on three different velodromes. A TV event. A showdown of men and machines two weeks after the Worlds. Make it happen.

The "people who can arrange this sort of thing" have been discussing it since last September. It's a nice idea, but don't expect the multi-attempt broadcast. When it happens, it'll be done solo. Trek are already well advanced with their bike design for the effort. The plan being to sell track bikes off the back of it.

Trek's design is based off the old rules though isn't it? I remember reading an interview with Keith Bontrager about the wheels, from what he was saying they had been working on box section wheels with super thin bladed spokes.

RichN95.

ddraver wrote:

The other thing Rich is that each will want to do it on the best velodrome, at the best time of day at the best temperature. ie they re all going to want to do it in the exact same place....

A big pay check can change their minds about that. They can always have another go later.

ddraver

Well true but if Canc loses to Martin by 200m and has had to do it in conditions that are worse then it's going to be a bit naff innit....

jscl

Paul 8v wrote:

JSCL wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

Right people who can arrange this sort of thing. You know what we all want. Martin, Cancellara and Wiggins all going for the record at exactly the same time on three different velodromes. A TV event. A showdown of men and machines two weeks after the Worlds. Make it happen.

The "people who can arrange this sort of thing" have been discussing it since last September. It's a nice idea, but don't expect the multi-attempt broadcast. When it happens, it'll be done solo. Trek are already well advanced with their bike design for the effort. The plan being to sell track bikes off the back of it.

Trek's design is based off the old rules though isn't it? I remember reading an interview with Keith Bontrager about the wheels, from what he was saying they had been working on box section wheels with super thin bladed spokes.

I was talking more about the frame design. They've been concerned about progressing further without knowing what rule changes were coming. This news will help them, a lot.

Don't forget, Fabian's agent (well, the firm he works for) also has rights to Tour de Suisse now and also runs a large media broadcasting network. So if anyone is in a position to sell broadcasting rights to an event, it's going to be them.

The event is going to be majestic, it needs to be, an hour record alone isn't spectacular enough. Here's one for you - a 6-Day-style race meet with the hour record embedded within.

Daz555

Multiple efforts on the same night won't happen. Too much science here. Anyone attempting it will need to know the numbers first and know if they even have the capacity to break the record.

There is no point even attempting the record if you are say 10 watts short of the requirement. It would end up being an hour of pain in front of the world for nothing.

Paul 8v

Daz555 wrote:

Multiple efforts on the same night won't happen. Too much science here. Anyone attempting it will need to know the numbers first and know if they even have the capacity to break the record.

There is no point even attempting the record if you are say 10 watts short of the requirement. It would end up being an hour of pain in front of the world for nothing.

This is true, didn't Merckx say one he thought it took a year off his life or something?

To be fair, I can't see any of the big boys beating the 49 km/h record on a modern pursuit bike. I am still confused as to how Board man's record will still stand being further though!?

rick_chasey

The most tedious thing to watch.

Pross

Are there restrictions on track altitude? Times at the recent worlds were ridiculous from memory but then I guess at some point the dis benefits of less oxygen outweigh the reduced air density.

Yellow Peril

Rick Chasey wrote:

The most tedious thing to watch.

the thing with a televised event is not to just show a contuinuous hour of someone riding around the track but to intersperse it heavily with footage of the build up and training for the attempt and a history of the hour record.Then you only end up with say 30 mins of actual attempt for the commentators to talk through. Of that you might want the last 10 or 15 mins of the attempt for the will he won't he and I suggest Kirby does that commentary slot to ensure maximum freak out

greasedscotsman

Paul 8v wrote:

To be fair, I can't see any of the big boys beating the 49 km/h record on a modern pursuit bike.

No? Boardman did over 52km on this...

graeme_s-2

In 2011 Jack Bobridge broke Boardman's 1996 4km individual pursuit world record. Bobridge broke it on a modern UCI legal pursuit bike and Boardman set his on his Lotus bike in the superman position.

I appreciate that there's a big difference between 4km and 50km, but it does show the old records set in/on currently illegal positions/bikes are potentially beatable.

RichN95.

Graeme_S wrote:

In 2011 Jack Bobridge broke Boardman's 1996 4km individual pursuit world record. Bobridge broke it on a modern UCI legal pursuit bike and Boardman set his on his Lotus bike in the superman position.

I appreciate that there's a big difference between 4km and 50km, but it does show the old records set in/on currently illegal positions/bikes are potentially beatable.

In his book* Michael Hutchinson said he did aerodynamic testing on a Boardman Lotus frame and it was only slightly worst than current bikes - it was that far ahead of its time. But time has finally caught up and surpassed it as far as frames are concerned.

*Faster, not The Hour

Yellow Peril

RichN95 wrote:

Graeme_S wrote:

In 2011 Jack Bobridge broke Boardman's 1996 4km individual pursuit world record. Bobridge broke it on a modern UCI legal pursuit bike and Boardman set his on his Lotus bike in the superman position.

I appreciate that there's a big difference between 4km and 50km, but it does show the old records set in/on currently illegal positions/bikes are potentially beatable.

In his book* Michael Hutchinson said he did aerodynamic testing on a Boardman Lotus frame and it was only slightly worst than current bikes - it was that far ahead of its time. But time has finally caught up and surpassed it as far as frames are concerned.
*Faster, not The Hour

Except on my 66cm Canyon AL which has a down tube the size of a soil pipe (I do love it though)

Crampeur

Yellow Peril wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

Graeme_S wrote:

In 2011 Jack Bobridge broke Boardman's 1996 4km individual pursuit world record. Bobridge broke it on a modern UCI legal pursuit bike and Boardman set his on his Lotus bike in the superman position.

I appreciate that there's a big difference between 4km and 50km, but it does show the old records set in/on currently illegal positions/bikes are potentially beatable.

In his book* Michael Hutchinson said he did aerodynamic testing on a Boardman Lotus frame and it was only slightly worst than current bikes - it was that far ahead of its time. But time has finally caught up and surpassed it as far as frames are concerned.
*Faster, not The Hour

Except on my 66cm Canyon AL which has a down tube the size of a soil pipe (I do love it though)

You ride a 66cm frame! :shock:

Daz555

RichN95 wrote:

Graeme_S wrote:

In 2011 Jack Bobridge broke Boardman's 1996 4km individual pursuit world record. Bobridge broke it on a modern UCI legal pursuit bike and Boardman set his on his Lotus bike in the superman position.

I appreciate that there's a big difference between 4km and 50km, but it does show the old records set in/on currently illegal positions/bikes are potentially beatable.

In his book* Michael Hutchinson said he did aerodynamic testing on a Boardman Lotus frame and it was only slightly worst than current bikes - it was that far ahead of its time.

As was Boardman himself.

RichN95.

Supposedly Cancellara/Trek will be announcing something in the next few days.

Obree also says he's tempted to have a crack as 49.7 is 'low hanging fruit' on a modern bike. He reckons Cancellara will do 53-54.

Richmond Racer

RichN95 wrote:

Supposedly Cancellara/Trek will be announcing something in the next few days.

Obree also says he's tempted to have a crack as 49.7 is 'low hanging fruit' on a modern bike. He reckons Cancellara will do 53-54.

Obree's knocking on for 50. Maybe a bit optimistic there?

Paul 8v

greasedscotsman wrote:

Paul 8v wrote:

To be fair, I can't see any of the big boys beating the 49 km/h record on a modern pursuit bike.

No? Boardman did over 52km on this...

Sorry, meant to say I can't see them having a problem beating it!

Martin could probably do it on the road, let alone on a smooth track with no incline or wind!

Lanterne_Rogue

Richmond Racer wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

Supposedly Cancellara/Trek will be announcing something in the next few days.

Obree also says he's tempted to have a crack as 49.7 is 'low hanging fruit' on a modern bike. He reckons Cancellara will do 53-54.

Obree's knocking on for 50. Maybe a bit optimistic there?

I agree he's being a bit optimistic, but if you had to put money on one bike designer to do something devious within the rules and pop up with a ludicrously unexpected record...

ic.

Paul 8v wrote:

To be fair, I can't see any of the big boys beating the 49 km/h record on a modern pursuit bike. I am still confused as to how Board man's record will still stand being further though!?

Disagree, I think the big news about this change is that the current record is now very achievable given the rule changes. Even Obree is giving it thought apparently!

The UCI have reinstated all the old records by saying they were records set given the rules at the time of the attempt. So By saying that the record can go up and down.

I'm not sure it makes too much sense, but it does go someway towards re establishing the aura and status of this record.

It would be terrible TV sure, and a three way attempt would never ever happen as there's too much science behind each attempt. None of the three you mention would give up 30 watts by riding a track at lower altitude for example. And there aren't three identical tracks. There are simply too many variables. Best you could do was one after the other on the same track, but even then things like temperature have a huge effect. The temp and pressure could change significantly over three hours. Even someone opening the velodrome door has an effect

Paul 8v

IC. wrote:

Paul 8v wrote:

To be fair, I can't see any of the big boys beating the 49 km/h record on a modern pursuit bike. I am still confused as to how Board man's record will still stand being further though!?

Disagree, I think the big news about this change is that the current record is now very achievable given the rule changes. Even Obree is giving it thought apparently!

I did correct myself, that's not what I meant. See my post two up from yours Do keep up at the back

frenchfighter

“It kind of begs the question: Why did they change it in the first place?,” Wiggins asked Saturday following stage 7 at the Tour of California. “We’ve lost a decade now of the hour record. It’s a shame that they changed it.

“We can all blame Chris Boardman for that with his superman position,” Wiggins joked. “It’s a shame, really, that we’ve missed maybe [Fabian] Cancellara doing it five or six years ago. So it’s good I guess that they’ve gone back now.”

Wiggins has said that while he never really considered attempting the record, the rule change has piqued his interest.

“I’d like to do it,” he said. “For me, the last person to do it in that position was Tony Rominger and [Miguel] Indurain. And I’ve always said that I’d love to go for it just to compare myself to Indurain purely over an hour. So I would consider it now, actually.”.

Richmond Racer

*gets Boardman on speed dial*

(to quote Yellow Peril)

RideOnTime

Paul 8v wrote:

greasedscotsman wrote:

Paul 8v wrote:

To be fair, I can't see any of the big boys beating the 49 km/h record on a modern pursuit bike.

No? Boardman did over 52km on this...

Sorry, meant to say I can't see them having a problem beating it!

Martin could probably do it on the road, let alone on a smooth track with no incline or wind!

That's not even a bike its a Highway Warning sign.

poppit

frenchfighter wrote:

“It kind of begs the question: Why did they change it in the first place?,” Wiggins asked Saturday following stage 7 at the Tour of California. “We’ve lost a decade now of the hour record. It’s a shame that they changed it.

“We can all blame Chris Boardman for that with his superman position,” Wiggins joked. “It’s a shame, really, that we’ve missed maybe [Fabian] Cancellara doing it five or six years ago. So it’s good I guess that they’ve gone back now.”

Wiggins has said that while he never really considered attempting the record, the rule change has piqued his interest.

“I’d like to do it,” he said. “For me, the last person to do it in that position was Tony Rominger and [Miguel] Indurain. And I’ve always said that I’d love to go for it just to compare myself to Indurain purely over an hour. So I would consider it now, actually.”.

...and in Derby

Pokerface

I genuinely want to have a crack at doing the hour record for my category in Paracycling. Would need to do 42km+ to make it worthwhile. After riding the Worlds in Aguascalientes, I would definitely go back there to do the hour. If you can survive the heat for a full hour, the track will give you a nice boost in time.

poppit

Derby will be relatively fast, as most new tracks are, and we can crank the heat up if required. There's probably tracks with a better geometry as being fast wasn't the number 1 priority at design stage, being easy to ride was. Would be nice to have Wiggins attempting the record plus a para attempt at a launch event though.

Pokerface

poppit wrote:

Derby will be relatively fast, as most new tracks are, and we can crank the heat up if required. There's probably tracks with a better geometry as being fast wasn't the number 1 priority at design stage, being easy to ride was. Would be nice to have Wiggins attempting the record plus a para attempt at a launch event though.

If you get Wiggins to attempt it there I will too!

Pross

Can someone explain to me the physics that mean the average speed for an hour on the track is lower than it is for a 50 mile TT on the road? I know that the drag from traffic on the road helps a fair bit but I would have thought the affects of even gentle gradients and wind would offset that whereas on the track it's flat, no wind and no junctions to negotiate. For some reason for the best cyclists of their day to be averaging just over 30mph always seems slower than I would expect given the amount of decent amateur cyclists that can do similar on a 25.