Giro Stage 10 - Spoiler thread
Comments
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Alan A wrote:junglist_matty wrote:Wiggo looks a lot weaker this year, maybe it's because Sky won't use "a car" to help him along now that UCI will ban riders being helped along by "a car"
....OOOH, controversial
Whoooosh straight over the top of my head.
Explanation please?
It's just a typical cowardly bit of trolling from someone who wants to 'be controversial' but is scared to make a real accusation in case they get taken to the cleaners (see Twitter for further examples). He's trying to imply that Wiggins was on Aicar last season but has had to stop this year which is why he is apparently 'a lot weaker'.0 -
plectrum wrote:disgruntledgoat wrote:plectrum wrote:Garmin just don't have that good a squad and Ryder certainly is a very average lead rider, lots of hasbeans and nearly men and a couple of decent but not spectacular youngsters. If it wasn't for media savvy Vaughters they would hardly get a mention.
As for Wiggins - the end is nigh - he's 33 and i'm not sure he can win anything of note going forward. I don't know when his contract is up but I can't see it being renewed in a team leader guise. Whether he wants to have a tail-end to his career like a Jens Voight and become a workhorse for team Sky is another question.
I think its perhaps a shame Sky are going to take the drive and single prong approach to le Tour as if they had Uran also then him and Froome springing off on the mtns would cause total havoc.
Apart from all those stage wins in GTs, a Paris Roubaix, a Giro D'Italia and a Liege Bastogne Liege.
Yup as I said Dan Martin is decent but not spectacular.
They won the Giro with Ryder. They won P-R with Vansummeren. They won L-B-L with Martin. They won Catalunya with Martin. Talansky placed 2nd in last year's Tour of Romandie, and 2nd in P-R this year.
Garmin punch well above their weight for a team with a much smaller budget than the super teams.0 -
greeny12 wrote:So Wiggins has a bad 300 metres on a vicious slope, drops to 4th (a second or two from the podium) in a Grand Tour with a parcours that seems deliberately set up to screw him over, and the end is nigh???
Phew - tough crowd.
Wait, what? Because they have to get down the mountains after they'd gone up?
He was the favorite, the Tour winner, has a strong team with him, had a 50+km long TT to smash everyone on. He has been so far from what was expected that it's hard to describe. Don't be ridiculous.
That said, he can still win the race, obviously. But nothing suggests that he will.0 -
Pretty annoyed Henao finished today 3mins down. There must have been something wrong with him as he would normally be at the fore quite easily.Contador is the Greatest0
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greeny12 wrote:So Wiggins has a bad 300 metres on a vicious slope, stays in 4th (a second or two from the podium) in a Grand Tour with a parcours that seems deliberately set up to screw him over, and the end is nigh???
Phew - tough crowd.
Fixed - it was even less of a bad day than you suggested. At least now it is his team mate a second or two in front of him. He's also increased the gap over some others marginally (should get a place at Sky for positive spin) 0 -
TheBigBean wrote:greeny12 wrote:So Wiggins has a bad 300 metres on a vicious slope, drops to 4th (a second or two from the podium) in a Grand Tour with a parcours that seems deliberately set up to screw him over, and the end is nigh???
Phew - tough crowd.
Wiggins has another bad day and drops to 4th in a GT with a parcours deliberately set up to attract him to the race.
Take 3:
Wiggins had exactly the day his ability and form would suggest - he's never going to be the best on brutally steep grades. It's the poor descending mojo last week and excellent TT by Nibs that's led to the gaps now. Like I said before, if he'd made up minutes rather than seconds in the TT, we'd be calmly saying "yup, he's lost about what we'd expect today". Well, we might
Think Sky should continue to support him, also Uran - much as happened today, until one or other is properly out of it.@shraap | My Men 2016: G, Yogi, Cav, Boonen, Degenkolb, Martin, J-Rod, Kudus, Chaves0 -
TheBigBean wrote:greeny12 wrote:So Wiggins has a bad 300 metres on a vicious slope, drops to 4th (a second or two from the podium) in a Grand Tour with a parcours that seems deliberately set up to screw him over, and the end is nigh???
Phew - tough crowd.
Wiggins has another bad day and drops to 4th in a GT with a parcours deliberately set up to attract him to the race.
No dropping - he was 4th before this stage, and is now ahead of Gesink - and even increased his gap over Scarponi by a couple of seconds.
The only bit of the parcours that was supposed to attract him was that first TT - and as it turned out, the first half of it was actually tailor made for Nibali. Nothing else about this Giro parcours is Wiggins-friendly, and constructed to attract him.0 -
frenchfighter wrote:Pretty annoyed Henao finished today 3mins down. There must have been something wrong with him as he would normally be at the fore quite easily.
He seemed to struggle throughout the stage didn't he? Like Uran he has been prone to bad days in the past - from memory the two of them took it in turns to have bad days in the final week of last years Giro.0 -
plectrum wrote:
Yup as I said Dan Martin is decent but not spectacular.
Yea, that win in Liege-Bastogne-Liege by Dan Martin wasn't the least bit spectacular. I hope he's the first guy they cut from the squad at the end of the year. You can't can't have mediocre guys like him going around winning monuments. It's just not on!
DD.0 -
Richmond Racer wrote:plectrum wrote:disgruntledgoat wrote:plectrum wrote:Garmin just don't have that good a squad and Ryder certainly is a very average lead rider, lots of hasbeans and nearly men and a couple of decent but not spectacular youngsters. If it wasn't for media savvy Vaughters they would hardly get a mention.
As for Wiggins - the end is nigh - he's 33 and i'm not sure he can win anything of note going forward. I don't know when his contract is up but I can't see it being renewed in a team leader guise. Whether he wants to have a tail-end to his career like a Jens Voight and become a workhorse for team Sky is another question.
I think its perhaps a shame Sky are going to take the drive and single prong approach to le Tour as if they had Uran also then him and Froome springing off on the mtns would cause total havoc.
Apart from all those stage wins in GTs, a Paris Roubaix, a Giro D'Italia and a Liege Bastogne Liege.
Yup as I said Dan Martin is decent but not spectacular.
They won the Giro with Ryder. They won P-R with Vansummeren. They won L-B-L with Martin. They won Catalunya with Martin. Talansky placed 2nd in last year's Tour of Romandie, and 2nd in P-R this year.
Garmin punch well above their weight for a team with a much smaller budget than the super teams.
The VS ride was impressive but a real one off, the Ryder win was meaningless in the grand scheme of GTS (alot like Wiggins 2012 is fairly meaningless long term) - so they are left with Talansky and Martin... I'm not really sure what Talansky's future is but I can't really see him becoming a GC contendor and so you are left with Martin.
The team is certainly a good mid level team but they are hyped to be a top tier and this is mainly due to Vaughters hubris. Good for them - they get by, they do what they do, everyone gets paid and the sponsors seem to like them.
They also make cool Garmin adverts.0 -
Plus LBL isn't really an important race is it ?The UCI are Clowns and Fools0
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Obvious troll is indeed obvious.0
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Calm down Smithy ... my point isn't that Garmin are crap - of course they aren't - it is more the general tone surrounding them and in the Giro 'the oh I'm surprised by how Ryder is doing, perhaps he isn't fit or ill or ...'smithy21 wrote:Obvious troll is indeed obvious.
No its perhaps Garmin are just mid tier average and sending Ryder as their team leader to Giro is about has misplaced as if Sky sent Wiggins to TdF as team leader this year instead of Froome.0 -
plectrum wrote:
Calm down Smithy ... my point isn't that Garmin are crap - of course they aren't - it is more the general tone surrounding them and in the Giro 'the oh I'm surprised by how Ryder is doing, perhaps he isn't fit or ill or ...'smithy21 wrote:Obvious troll is indeed obvious.
No its perhaps Garmin are just mid tier average and sending Ryder as their team leader to Giro is about has misplaced as if Sky sent Wiggins to TdF as team leader this year instead of Froome.
Um... are you forgetting he won it last year?___________________
Strava is not Zen.0 -
So your argument is that last year's defending Giro and Tour champions are shoot and shouldn't be in this race? Meanwhile a rider like Froome who may or may not have won a GT if he was team leader is superior? Hope the weather is nicer on your planet than it is on Earth.0
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Naming last year's winner as one of the favorites this year..? I'm shocked to the bones.
plectrum, where was this brilliant prediction of yours 11 days ago on this forum? Can't find it. Or the hours after Ryder had attacked each and everyone on, what.., stage 3?0 -
No I'm not but it depends on whether you are there for the procession or to challenge. 2012 was also a pretty weird year almost like a transitional year between doping and no doping with many teams in disarray.calvjones wrote:plectrum wrote:
Calm down Smithy ... my point isn't that Garmin are crap - of course they aren't - it is more the general tone surrounding them and in the Giro 'the oh I'm surprised by how Ryder is doing, perhaps he isn't fit or ill or ...'smithy21 wrote:Obvious troll is indeed obvious.
No its perhaps Garmin are just mid tier average and sending Ryder as their team leader to Giro is about has misplaced as if Sky sent Wiggins to TdF as team leader this year instead of Froome.
Um... are you forgetting he won it last year?
Anyhow I accept they've won stuff and accept they are not poor but I just feel the way they are portrayed is a bit like a shiny gem but when you look close its just a varnish finish.0 -
As for Wiggins - the end is nigh - he's 33 and i'm not sure he can win anything of note going forward
Same thing everyone was saying about Cadel Evans two weeks ago.
Kiserlovski is the new Zubeldia.0 -
Nibali has fallen, had his chain come off twice and is looking incredibly impressive. Seems completely up for a bit of adversity. He always looks in good shape until he fails to deliver at key moments but I don't think that is going to happen over the next 2 weeks. Wiggins is going pretty well but Nibs is bossing things big time at the moment. Great stage
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ThomThom wrote:Naming last year's winner as one of the favorites this year..? I'm shocked to the bones.
plectrum, where was this brilliant prediction of yours 11 days ago on this forum? Can't find it. Or the hours after Ryder had attacked each and everyone on, what.., stage 3?
Did anyone here predict Ryder for podium this year and if so can you really make a credible argument as to why?
Ryder Hesjedal's Palmares record - seriously impressive. :shock:
Sorry why is he team leader? At least due to Vandevelde's early season injury and Hesjedal's Giro performance we may see one of the young guys(Martin perhaps) been given the TdF limelight and see how good they really are.0 -
LOL
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Was an enthralling stage. Seems to me Sky will be content, as were in a sort of win-win situation.
The key for this stage was always going to be how Uran and Henao were to be used (aka unleashed), and what effect that would have.
Unleash Uran (or Henao), and Nibali+Astana chase and get tired earlier, potentially exposing Nibali. Or, unleash Uran (or Henao) and Nibali+Astana leave them, and Uran gains time on GC. Turns out Uran got away and gained time overall, so will have to be chased next time by Nibali+Astana. Therefore Sky have more leverage on Astana now, and its still early days in the mountains.
Given the very steep kick up and the end of the stage, its almost like today Wiggin's job was to not lose too much time on Nibs. Somewhat accomplished. Meanwhile as we saw a few other GC cracked and lost more.
Bottom line, seems to me that Sky are in a stronger position now. Whether they will ever switch to Uran as lead rider is another conversation, but its almost like they don't have to worry about that for now. At this point just arrange the pieces, and create maximum discomfort on Astana and Nibali
(cant remember old account login)0 -
@Pross - Thank you for the explanation.0
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Milton50 wrote:As for Wiggins - the end is nigh - he's 33 and i'm not sure he can win anything of note going forward
Same thing everyone was saying about Cadel Evans two weeks ago.
Kiserlovski is the new Zubeldia.
Really - Cadel has had a far better, longer and more consistent GT career than Wiggins and has started the season quite well but there is nothing to date that would suggest he will make up time on Nibali and to the contrary he will lose more time. One is 36 the other 28 and at the peak of his career and better suited to the stages to come. Nibali's historic weaker element was TT and he has done very well so far and perhaps is even the favourite for the uphill TT but we shall see.
Thank God though for Evans as if he wasn't there and there was a 2m+ gap between the 1st and the rest after the first week then we'd all be pissed off that it was done, at least with Cadel in touching distance there is a permanent and credible challenger.0 -
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There are 3 GTs in the year, and he's defending champion! Seriously, do you think Vandevelde would have been a better option?plectrum wrote:Sorry why is he team leader? At least due to Vandevelde's early season injury and Hesjedal's Giro performance we may see one of the young guys(Martin perhaps) been given the TdF limelight and see how good they really are.
We know how good Martin is, he won a monument last month...0 -
I do like Millar & how honest he is
David Millar @millarmind 3s
Jesus H Christ, day one of getting my breakaway legs back was horrible. Stat of the day: that was the first ever GT break for @DekkerThomas.Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.0 -
Tom Dean wrote:
There are 3 GTs in the year, and he's defending champion! Seriously, do you think Vandevelde would have been a better option?plectrum wrote:Sorry why is he team leader? At least due to Vandevelde's early season injury and Hesjedal's Giro performance we may see one of the young guys(Martin perhaps) been given the TdF limelight and see how good they really are.
We know how good Martin is, he won a monument last month...
I'm not sure VdV is fit post the Catalunya fall & hand bone break and I appreciate the respect deserving of an existing champion but let's just say Sky back Wiggins over Froome this year - all forums would go ballistic because it is so clearly the wrong decision. I do think Garmin do well and I do think they maximise their capabilities but those are mid-tier at best & I think it is a shame that they go into another GT without putting a Talansky or a Martin as team leader and pushing those to their full potential.
Here is a pre race quote from Ryder “My season has been built around the Giro again this year with the goal of defending my title and the whole team is coming into it very focused and extremely motivated."
Wow - he came in 20 minutes down today - it is stage 10, perhaps he is really ill with a virus or something and i'm being unfair.0
