Lance Armstrong gets life ban,loses 7 TDF,confesses he doped

reallyarunner

I'm curious Vino as to why doping doesn't bother you. I think you said somewhere you liked to see how they can perform then relate it to your own abilities? Problem is, you aren't watching Contador or Valverde or Ricco or Rasmussen etc etc etc flying up a mountain due to their abilities. You are watching them performance enhanced. I could ride up a mountain on a motorbike as this would enhance my performance significantly and then compare it to someone riding a bike, but what would be the point?

Whilst you didn't say doping was morally right I don't understand your apathy towards it. As for Contador, there is massive doubt as to whether any of his wins have been clean so I can understand the dislike towards him. If he had come out after steakgate, apologised and done a millar I would have forgiven him and had much more respect for him.

deejay

Vino'sGhost wrote:

Though i do sense that now lance has been done theres less anger about him and youve moved on to new targets like a pack of rabid dogs. (see the poll for most hated)

No he hasn't been done to my satisfaction because the scumbag is still lying and cannot admit publicly that he is a FRAUD.
I've put up with his and the Media bullsh*t for 15 years and for 5 years before that this bigheaded bum kept telling us how good he thought he was.
He had so many 2nd place's where his mouth had proclaimed he would win. (please don't tell me about the few races he did in fact win with 2 balls)

dennisn

reallyarunner wrote:

I'm curious Vino as to why doping doesn't bother you. I think you said somewhere you liked to see how they can perform then relate it to your own abilities? Problem is, you aren't watching Contador or Valverde or Ricco or Rasmussen etc etc etc flying up a mountain due to their abilities. You are watching them performance enhanced. I could ride up a mountain on a motorbike as this would enhance my performance significantly and then compare it to someone riding a bike, but what would be the point?

Whilst you didn't say doping was morally right I don't understand your apathy towards it. As for Contador, there is massive doubt as to whether any of his wins have been clean so I can understand the dislike towards him. If he had come out after steakgate, apologised and done a millar I would have forgiven him and had much more respect for him.

I think your last sentence was way off the mark. AC does not need or want your forgiveness and / or respect any more than I do. He, you, and I want and need respect and forgiveness from those close to us, not total strangers on the Internet.

dennisn

deejay wrote:

Vino'sGhost wrote:

Though i do sense that now lance has been done theres less anger about him and youve moved on to new targets like a pack of rabid dogs. (see the poll for most hated)

No he hasn't been done to my satisfaction because the scumbag is still lying and cannot admit publicly that he is a FRAUD.
I've put up with his and the Media bullsh*t for 15 years and for 5 years before that this bigheaded bum kept telling us how good he thought he was.
He had so many 2nd place's where his mouth had proclaimed he would win. (please don't tell me about the few races he did in fact win with 2 balls)

Well, you're certainly in a sad state of affairs. P*ssed off at the media, p*ssed off at some cyclist's for doping, and the best / worst part is that you have let this eat at you for 20 years. All I can say is I wish you another 20 years of hate, jealously, and pain, as it appears you have a taste for that kind of stuff.

dennisn

nathancom wrote:

I don't get how saying doping in sport is fine is just another opinion. That is like saying theft is fine or murder is fine and then defending the viewpoint on the grounds that it is your opinion and all opinions are equally valid.

All opinions are valid. Key word OPINIONS.

reallyarunner

dennisn wrote:

reallyarunner wrote:

I'm curious Vino as to why doping doesn't bother you. I think you said somewhere you liked to see how they can perform then relate it to your own abilities? Problem is, you aren't watching Contador or Valverde or Ricco or Rasmussen etc etc etc flying up a mountain due to their abilities. You are watching them performance enhanced. I could ride up a mountain on a motorbike as this would enhance my performance significantly and then compare it to someone riding a bike, but what would be the point?

Whilst you didn't say doping was morally right I don't understand your apathy towards it. As for Contador, there is massive doubt as to whether any of his wins have been clean so I can understand the dislike towards him. If he had come out after steakgate, apologised and done a millar I would have forgiven him and had much more respect for him.

I think your last sentence was way off the mark. AC does not need or want your forgiveness and / or respect any more than I do. He, you, and I want and need respect and forgiveness from those close to us, not total strangers on the Internet.

I think you're mistaken there, Dennis. I seem to remember Contador getting so cheesed off with a heckler in the giro he punched him - the guy with the steak on a fishing rod, or the surgeon with the syringe - think it was the former. In any case I think it demonstrated how he felt when faced with an unforgiving crowd. In any case, whether he wants, needs it or whatever doesn't really make any odds to me. I'll boo him when he goes past me at the side of the road just like I did to Vino.

Lichtblick

In my opinion this thread has descended into a slanging match and should be closed.

But since Rick's hardly here any more, I guess that won't happen any time soon.

Vino'sGhost

Im quite happy to let haters hate, but please dont tell me how i should feel. Contador is (in my opinion) the most exciting racer out there full stop.

ratsbeyfus

dennisn wrote:

Well, you're certainly in a sad state of affairs. P*ssed off at the media, p*ssed off at some cyclist's for doping, and the best / worst part is that you have let this eat at you for 20 years. All I can say is I wish you another 20 years of hate, jealously, and pain, as it appears you have a taste for that kind of stuff.

Calm down... it's over dennisn. Go ride your bike.

knedlicky

Stanley222 wrote:

Vino'sGhost wrote:

Stanley222 wrote:

But if that sprinter could only run so fast because he was full of gear wouldn't that make you feel a bit cheated?

Ive thought about this sort of thing and for my own view, i enjoy seeing em run as fast as possible. Oddly i feel differently about swimmers. perhaps because of the arrogance of a certain swimmer.

I also enjoy watching a variety of sports but if they are cheating then that's just wrong and they shouldn't be allowed back into the sport or allowed to compete again.

If you watch football or some other similar sport, how do you come to terms with some of the cheating which goes on there?
A fake fall in the penalty area which results in a penalty goal doesn’t include drugs but it can be very decisive in the eventual result and cost a club millions and associated players a lot of prestige. If the fake fall wasn’t registered by the referee, it’s like in cycling a doper not being tested that day. If the referee did see it and gave a card, by your thinking, should that player then be not allowed to ever play professionally again?

I don’t mean I see the two behaviours, doping in cycling and faking in football, as equal; but I only see doping as worse because it’s interference with one’s own body. And the doper has to himself recognise those risks.
Anyway, in terms of how it eventually directly affects us, there is a lot worse going on in the world, in aspects of business and politics, 'untruth' if not actual cheating, to get over-moral about cheating in sport.

knedlicky

Lichtblick wrote:

Petty, petty, petty, IMHO. I shouldn't think LA gives a, either.
.......I wonder what he's doing nowadays, hiding in his redoubt.

I think he is probably quietly (but really arrogantly) relishing all the recent fuss and publicity about his personage, and being not too cared.

He brought his sponsors the required publicity at the time, and the TdF winnings were divided too complicatedly to easily return (e.g. Is Emma O'Reilly going to give back her share too?) so he only needs to check if where he invested his money gives back enough dividends for him to continue his (huge) ranch lifestyle.

ddraver

ratsbeyfus wrote:

dennisn wrote:

Well, you're certainly in a sad state of affairs. P*ssed off at the media, p*ssed off at some cyclist's for doping, and the best / worst part is that you have let this eat at you for 20 years. All I can say is I wish you another 20 years of hate, jealously, and pain, as it appears you have a taste for that kind of stuff.

Calm down... it's over dennisn. Go ride your bike.

Zing!

tailwindhome

dennisn wrote:

All opinions are valid. Key word OPINIONS.

They're not Dennis. They're really not.

tarzan13

Lichtblick wrote:

IOC opens Lance Armstrong probe

The IOC opened an investigation Thursday into Lance Armstrong's role in a doping scandal that has already wiped out his seven Tour de France titles and could cost him his Olympic bronze medal.


This is from 2000, 12 years ago. Who gives a ???? about a bronze medal from 12 years ago? :shock:

Petty, petty, petty, IMHO. I shouldn't think LA gives a, either.

.......I wonder what he's doing nowadays, hiding in his redoubt. No more news on SCA Promotions wanting their $7.5m back, is there?

Oops, increased to $12mln
http://www.deccanchronicle.com/channels ... onuses-874

dennisn

reallyarunner wrote:

dennisn wrote:

reallyarunner wrote:

I'm curious Vino as to why doping doesn't bother you. I think you said somewhere you liked to see how they can perform then relate it to your own abilities? Problem is, you aren't watching Contador or Valverde or Ricco or Rasmussen etc etc etc flying up a mountain due to their abilities. You are watching them performance enhanced. I could ride up a mountain on a motorbike as this would enhance my performance significantly and then compare it to someone riding a bike, but what would be the point?

Whilst you didn't say doping was morally right I don't understand your apathy towards it. As for Contador, there is massive doubt as to whether any of his wins have been clean so I can understand the dislike towards him. If he had come out after steakgate, apologised and done a millar I would have forgiven him and had much more respect for him.

I think your last sentence was way off the mark. AC does not need or want your forgiveness and / or respect any more than I do. He, you, and I want and need respect and forgiveness from those close to us, not total strangers on the Internet.

I think you're mistaken there, Dennis. I seem to remember Contador getting so cheesed off with a heckler in the giro he punched him - the guy with the steak on a fishing rod, or the surgeon with the syringe - think it was the former. In any case I think it demonstrated how he felt when faced with an unforgiving crowd. In any case, whether he wants, needs it or whatever doesn't really make any odds to me. I'll boo him when he goes past me at the side of the road just like I did to Vino.

If you hate these guys that much why would you even bother to be on the side of the road? As far as punching some guy, what the hell, I've punched a few people, in anger, in my life. Could it be that the guy with the fishing rod was just an *sshole who needed to be punched. Have you never met anyone like that? I say punch a whole lot more of those moronic types. I'm also thinking thay most of these guys you're booing, and it sounds like just about everyone these days, are laughing all the way to the bank. Don't pump yourself up into believing that you really matter, you don't.

nathancom

dennisn wrote:

reallyarunner wrote:

dennisn wrote:

reallyarunner wrote:

I'm curious Vino as to why doping doesn't bother you. I think you said somewhere you liked to see how they can perform then relate it to your own abilities? Problem is, you aren't watching Contador or Valverde or Ricco or Rasmussen etc etc etc flying up a mountain due to their abilities. You are watching them performance enhanced. I could ride up a mountain on a motorbike as this would enhance my performance significantly and then compare it to someone riding a bike, but what would be the point?

Whilst you didn't say doping was morally right I don't understand your apathy towards it. As for Contador, there is massive doubt as to whether any of his wins have been clean so I can understand the dislike towards him. If he had come out after steakgate, apologised and done a millar I would have forgiven him and had much more respect for him.

I think your last sentence was way off the mark. AC does not need or want your forgiveness and / or respect any more than I do. He, you, and I want and need respect and forgiveness from those close to us, not total strangers on the Internet.

I think you're mistaken there, Dennis. I seem to remember Contador getting so cheesed off with a heckler in the giro he punched him - the guy with the steak on a fishing rod, or the surgeon with the syringe - think it was the former. In any case I think it demonstrated how he felt when faced with an unforgiving crowd. In any case, whether he wants, needs it or whatever doesn't really make any odds to me. I'll boo him when he goes past me at the side of the road just like I did to Vino.

If you hate these guys that much why would you even bother to be on the side of the road? As far as punching some guy, what the hell, I've punched a few people, in anger, in my life. Could it be that the guy with the fishing rod was just an *sshole who needed to be punched. Have you never met anyone like that? I say punch a whole lot more of those moronic types. I'm also thinking thay most of these guys you're booing, and it sounds like just about everyone these days, are laughing all the way to the bank. Don't pump yourself up into believing that you really matter, you don't.

what a load of guff.

dennisn

nathancom wrote:

dennisn wrote:

reallyarunner wrote:

dennisn wrote:

reallyarunner wrote:

I'm curious Vino as to why doping doesn't bother you. I think you said somewhere you liked to see how they can perform then relate it to your own abilities? Problem is, you aren't watching Contador or Valverde or Ricco or Rasmussen etc etc etc flying up a mountain due to their abilities. You are watching them performance enhanced. I could ride up a mountain on a motorbike as this would enhance my performance significantly and then compare it to someone riding a bike, but what would be the point?

Whilst you didn't say doping was morally right I don't understand your apathy towards it. As for Contador, there is massive doubt as to whether any of his wins have been clean so I can understand the dislike towards him. If he had come out after steakgate, apologised and done a millar I would have forgiven him and had much more respect for him.

I think your last sentence was way off the mark. AC does not need or want your forgiveness and / or respect any more than I do. He, you, and I want and need respect and forgiveness from those close to us, not total strangers on the Internet.

I think you're mistaken there, Dennis. I seem to remember Contador getting so cheesed off with a heckler in the giro he punched him - the guy with the steak on a fishing rod, or the surgeon with the syringe - think it was the former. In any case I think it demonstrated how he felt when faced with an unforgiving crowd. In any case, whether he wants, needs it or whatever doesn't really make any odds to me. I'll boo him when he goes past me at the side of the road just like I did to Vino.

If you hate these guys that much why would you even bother to be on the side of the road? As far as punching some guy, what the hell, I've punched a few people, in anger, in my life. Could it be that the guy with the fishing rod was just an *sshole who needed to be punched. Have you never met anyone like that? I say punch a whole lot more of those moronic types. I'm also thinking thay most of these guys you're booing, and it sounds like just about everyone these days, are laughing all the way to the bank. Don't pump yourself up into believing that you really matter, you don't.

what a load of guff.

How so? :?

Vino'sGhost

Dennis, ignore him hes just a troll that gets angry and abusive. Hes not even very funny with it

andrewjoseph

dennisn wrote:

...
If you hate these guys that much why would you even bother to be on the side of the road? As far as punching some guy, what the hell, I've punched a few people, in anger, in my life. Could it be that the guy with the fishing rod was just an *sshole who needed to be punched. Have you never met anyone like that? I say punch a whole lot more of those moronic types. I'm also thinking thay most of these guys you're booing, and it sounds like just about everyone these days, are laughing all the way to the bank. Don't pump yourself up into believing that you really matter, you don't.

Why doesn't bertie punch all the other morons running along and shouting at him then? Why only those (that we've seen) pointing out his cheating?

If he really doesn't care about the views of the fans, he would be leaving these guys alone, they don't come nowhere near to danger the screaming runners pose, yet the guys that are taunting his doping, are the guys that get punched.

As for the fans, most pro cyclists i've read about do it for the fame as well as the fortune, you don't get the fame if no one knows you or cares about you.

Riders care about what the fans think, which is why they keep the doping secrets away from them for as long as possible.

nathancom

dennisn wrote:

nathancom wrote:

dennisn wrote:

If you hate these guys that much why would you even bother to be on the side of the road? As far as punching some guy, what the hell, I've punched a few people, in anger, in my life. Could it be that the guy with the fishing rod was just an *sshole who needed to be punched. Have you never met anyone like that? I say punch a whole lot more of those moronic types. I'm also thinking thay most of these guys you're booing, and it sounds like just about everyone these days, are laughing all the way to the bank. Don't pump yourself up into believing that you really matter, you don't.

what a load of guff.

How so? :?

Because of all your pop psychology bollocks and your belief that people on forums are really so emotionally tied up in events instead of just wasting a bit of time expressing their opinions on events...get back on your bike, maybe you need a tandem now though to fit Vino's Ghost on the back though.

Vino'sGhost

hey Nathan,

Attack Attack! and hopefully people wont notice you've not contributed anything new eh?

I was an angry young man once full of bile and frustration. Then I experienced life and got more rounded perspectives, became more tolerant and generally a better person.

dennisn

nathancom wrote:

dennisn wrote:

nathancom wrote:

dennisn wrote:

If you hate these guys that much why would you even bother to be on the side of the road? As far as punching some guy, what the hell, I've punched a few people, in anger, in my life. Could it be that the guy with the fishing rod was just an *sshole who needed to be punched. Have you never met anyone like that? I say punch a whole lot more of those moronic types. I'm also thinking thay most of these guys you're booing, and it sounds like just about everyone these days, are laughing all the way to the bank. Don't pump yourself up into believing that you really matter, you don't.

what a load of guff.

How so? :?

Because of all your pop psychology **** and your belief that people on forums are really so emotionally tied up in events instead of just wasting a bit of time expressing their opinions on events...get back on your bike, maybe you need a tandem now though to fit Vino's Ghost on the back though.

Too be honest I'm thinking that I could go back on this thread alone and find whole bunches of examples of name calling, hatred, jealousy, and bile spilling out of lots of people. Doesn't seem like the kind of stuff people are "...just wasting a bit of time expressing...". No, hatred like this is all about people wrapped up and very "...emotionally tied up.." in all this. Sad, but very interesting to me. You know, the why's of it all. :?

nathancom

Vino'sGhost wrote:

hey Nathan,

Attack Attack! and hopefully people wont notice you've not contributed anything new eh?

I was an angry young man once full of bile and frustration. Then I experienced life and got more rounded perspectives, became more tolerant and generally a better person.

Yeah such a better person that you don't care about about sportsmen dying just to give you a bit of entertainment. eejit.

nathancom

dennisn wrote:

Too be honest I'm thinking that I could go back on this thread alone and find whole bunches of examples of name calling, hatred, jealousy, and bile spilling out of lots of people. Doesn't seem like the kind of stuff people are "...just wasting a bit of time expressing...". No, hatred like this is all about people wrapped up and very "...emotionally tied up.." in all this. Sad, but very interesting to me. You know, the why's of it all. :?

Ok, whatever. You must be real upset Lance is fit for the bonfire.

andrewjoseph

nathancom wrote:

dennisn wrote:

Too be honest I'm thinking that I could go back on this thread alone and find whole bunches of examples of name calling, hatred, jealousy, and bile spilling out of lots of people. Doesn't seem like the kind of stuff people are "...just wasting a bit of time expressing...". No, hatred like this is all about people wrapped up and very "...emotionally tied up.." in all this. Sad, but very interesting to me. You know, the why's of it all. :?

Ok, whatever. You must be real upset Lance is fit for the bonfire.

No, Dennis doesn't care about Lance, or any of 'our heroes'. He cares about what he thinks WE care about, so he can tell us all to get a grip and that he doesn't care.

dennisn

andrewjoseph wrote:

nathancom wrote:

dennisn wrote:

Too be honest I'm thinking that I could go back on this thread alone and find whole bunches of examples of name calling, hatred, jealousy, and bile spilling out of lots of people. Doesn't seem like the kind of stuff people are "...just wasting a bit of time expressing...". No, hatred like this is all about people wrapped up and very "...emotionally tied up.." in all this. Sad, but very interesting to me. You know, the why's of it all. :?

Ok, whatever. You must be real upset Lance is fit for the bonfire.

No, Dennis doesn't care about Lance, or any of 'our heroes'. He cares about what he thinks WE care about, so he can tell us all to get a grip and that he doesn't care.

Exactly what I've been saying for some time now. Find yourselves some better heroes.
You know, friends, family, and people you can count on in life. Plenty of those kind of people out there, but no, you choose to worship someone because he can pedal a bike.
Not really the best of reasons to make someone your "hero". :roll:

andrewjoseph

This why we should care: http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/11/analysis/opinion-armstrong-case-provides-a-window-into-our-collective-morality_263480

andrewjoseph

dennisn wrote:

...
Exactly what I've been saying for some time now. Find yourselves some better heroes.
You know, friends, family, and people you can count on in life. Plenty of those kind of people out there, but no, you choose to worship someone because he can pedal a bike.
Not really the best of reasons to make someone your "hero". :roll:

Thing is Dennis, YOU are the one that keeps telling US that WE made these people OUR heroes.

You don't know who our real heroes are, you are just assuming that because we comment on these things we are obsessed with our 'heroes'. I am not, I am commenting on things I care a little bit about, things that interest me. Yet you paint most people on here that don't agree with you with a very broad brush, saying we should get over our obsession with our false heros that we shouldn't have idolised in the first place.

You must be aware that you are amongst the most prolific contributors to these threads, saying quite often (I'm paraphrasing here): 'I don't care about the sport. I'm interested in the reactions.'

Well, this looks very much like the people who post inflammatory or ill judged, remarks on many topics worldwide, and when called out about it, state: 'it was just a social experiment to see the reaction.' Instead they should just apologise instead of pretending it was 'a social experiment'.

Many people see this for what it is. It's not big and it's not clever.

dennisn

andrewjoseph wrote:

This why we should care: http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/11/analysis/opinion-armstrong-case-provides-a-window-into-our-collective-morality_263480

Sounds like the good Doctor got taken in by it all too. He(not me or you) put LA on that pedastal / altar and when it fell apart he got p*ssed off. Not an unusual reaction when your heroes fail you. Now he wants us to feel as bad as he does. And how does he get us to feel badly too? He tells us it is party our collective faults. He's not going to get an apoligy from LA so maybe he can blame others and somehow feel better about himself. B*llsh*t, plain and simple. Not my, or anyone elses, problem doc', to feel sorry for your missteps or mistaken judgement. C'mon, this guy is telling you it's partly your fault and YOU go along with it??????

reallyarunner

If you hate these guys that much why would you even bother to be on the side of the road? As far as punching some guy, what the hell, I've punched a few people, in anger, in my life. Could it be that the guy with the fishing rod was just an *sshole who needed to be punched. Have you never met anyone like that? I say punch a whole lot more of those moronic types. I'm also thinking thay most of these guys you're booing, and it sounds like just about everyone these days, are laughing all the way to the bank. Don't pump yourself up into believing that you really matter, you don't.[/quote]

A) I didn't say I hated 'these guys'. I called Armstrong a scumbag many pages ago, and said I didnt respect Contador. Do I hate Armstrong? Maybe, probably. Do I hate Contador? No. I would be hard pressed to find a handful of people I actually hate. Dislike a few more, granted.

why on earth do you think I would be on the side of the road when pro cyclists are racing? What a stupid question. If you cant figure out the answer to that God help you.

C) I haven't punched anyone since school actually, sounds like you have some violence issues though.

D) I don't pretend that i am important and matter more than I do. Don't really see where you're going with that one.

E) You are boring.

F) Ignore A to D and just multiply E by a million.