Tyler sinks the Lance

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  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,559
    RichN95 wrote:
    Tusher wrote:
    How about a nice Lopi jumper, Mr Doctor?
    Haven't knitted one of those in years, and they're such fun to make. Easy too.

    Tusher, how about knitting an orange jumpsuit? Maybe to suit someone about 5' 10", slim build. If you could incorporate the words 'Austin Correctional Facility' on the back, all the better

    There's no way I'm wearing that.
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  • Tusher
    Tusher Posts: 2,762
    Lopi jumper photo here-http://www.icelandicsheep.com/images/wpe3B.jpg

    Difficult to get the wool now, but they knit up soo fast (on circular needles).
    Rank up there with Fair Isle on the feline destruction and amusement scale.

    Oddly enough, whenever we've visited Iceland, hardly anyone wears them- they're too busy looking cool in Reykjavik.
    Although now that they've all fallen on hard times......
  • cajun_cyclist
    cajun_cyclist Posts: 493
    http://www.icelandicsheep.com/images/wpe3B.jpg

    Real nice, they should sell them at IKEA. I like a good wool jersey, the right one can be great and used ones can be found at not too high of a cost. Get used, new ones can be exorbitantly priced.

    [/img]
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,559
    cajun_cyclist wrote:
    http://www.icelandicsheep.com/images/wpe3B.jpg

    Real nice, they should sell them at IKEA. I like a good wool jersey, the right one can be great and used ones can be found at not too high of a cost. Get used, new ones can be exorbitantly priced.

    [/img]

    Or attempt to get Tusher to knit one for you :lol:
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  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Even if Lance is found to have used the jungle juice, I'm sure he's got enough tucked away to live a very comfortable life.
    _
  • PBo
    PBo Posts: 2,493
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Even if Lance is found to have used the jungle juice, I'm sure he's got enough tucked away to live a very comfortable life.

    Although presumably if the feds make some of the fraud stuff stick, he'll be facing time?
  • Noclue
    Noclue Posts: 503
    Haven't been watching the main stream news over the last few days, but even friends of mine that don't follow cycling are talking about this now.
    Flickr
  • Tusher
    Tusher Posts: 2,762
    If The Sunday Times is successful in suing him, there'll be a queue behind them and he may be left with zero.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    PBo wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Even if Lance is found to have used the jungle juice, I'm sure he's got enough tucked away to live a very comfortable life.

    Although presumably if the feds make some of the fraud stuff stick, he'll be facing time?

    I'd be VERY surprised if he ends up in prison.

    Slap on the wirst, suspended sentence at worst, surely....
    _
  • Tusher
    Tusher Posts: 2,762
    If the charges are as strong as rumoured, he's going down.
  • itisaboutthebike
    itisaboutthebike Posts: 1,120
    just give it Christophe Bassons

    Or Simeoni...................
  • DavMartinR
    DavMartinR Posts: 897
    Would the ASO try and get they're prize money back?

    And give it to errr................
  • Gazzaputt
    Gazzaputt Posts: 3,227
    Tusher wrote:
    If the charges are as strong as rumoured, he's going down.

    :lol:

    He won't go down has a lot of political friends.

    I think we're all getting very excited over some overzealous journalism.

    For me I'm waiting to see the outcome of the investigation as then and only then will we see what everyone really testified.

    I have a feeling for those that say they saw Lance dope they'll be a similar number saying they never.

    Jury is out for me until a real court of law shows the hard facts.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    DavMartinR wrote:
    Would the ASO try and get they're prize money back?

    And give it to errr................

    Nah. In the grand scheme of things the prize money isn't much - and the winner hands it all to his team - the mechanics, masseurs etc.

    The damage to the sport generally is massive.


    Was having a chat with the GF about this - she was taking the line "this is so damaging to the sport, it's a waste of an inspirational story, where's the value?"

    I explained that the damage was done when the riders were injecting the jungle juice, not when the feds decided to investigate - and therein lies the rub for me.

    It's indicative of the genuinely corrupt nature of the sport that it takes 10 years and a federal investigation to blow this out of the water - just like it took a police raid to bust Puerto - like it took a police car search to bust Festina.

    If the Swiss positive bit is found to be true, that the UCI assisted covering it up, then I can't see cycling's structure remaining intact in its current form.

    The ringkeeper can't be given the task of rooting out cheating when it makes money from the success from those in the ring. It's too big a conflict of interest.
    _
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Gazzaputt wrote:
    I have a feeling for those that say they saw Lance dope they'll be a similar number saying they never.

    Jury is out for me until a real court of law shows the hard facts.

    In the Tyler interview, he mentions someone having blood extracted at the same time as him - If that person denies it happened, then there's a problem. But seeing as their have been statements attributed to Hincapie you could probably assume it's him.

    Interesting thing on 60 Minutes is they had some hard evidence that starts heading towards proving something.
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,559
    Gazzaputt wrote:
    Tusher wrote:
    If the charges are as strong as rumoured, he's going down.

    :lol:

    He won't go down has a lot of political friends.

    I think we're all getting very excited over some overzealous journalism.

    For me I'm waiting to see the outcome of the investigation as then and only then will we see what everyone really testified.

    I have a feeling for those that say they saw Lance dope they'll be a similar number saying they never.

    Jury is out for me until a real court of law shows the hard facts.

    I've never seen Lance dope. This isn't surprising really, but it still points up an important fact re eyewitness testimony. Not witnessing something is a far cry from witnessing that it didn't happen.
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  • shouldbeinbed
    shouldbeinbed Posts: 2,660
    Gazzaputt wrote:
    Tusher wrote:
    If the charges are as strong as rumoured, he's going down.

    :lol:

    He won't go down has a lot of political friends.

    I think we're all getting very excited over some overzealous journalism.

    For me I'm waiting to see the outcome of the investigation as then and only then will we see what everyone really testified.

    I have a feeling for those that say they saw Lance dope they'll be a similar number saying they never.

    Jury is out for me until a real court of law shows the hard facts.

    Yes beause political friends are a loyal and steadfast bunch when they can see a scandal coming.... hmmm He'll be dropped and people will distance themselves like there is no tomorrow if half of what is reported is true. Political friends will be the worst thing he could have as they publically line up to cover their own arses and charitable causes by twisting the knives and demanding an example is made of him given his high profile use of cancer as a denial tool and the fact they allowed themselves to be duped so completely.

    Also I'm sure theres only a tiny coterie of trusted friends/lieutenants/like a brother to me's that would ever see him dope. He's hardly likely to stand up at the end of team dinner and anounce he's off for a quick shower and an EPO session. Most crimes are done pretty furtively.

    I agree on waiting to see what actually comes out but I fear you're clutching at straws with the rest of it.
  • le_patron
    le_patron Posts: 494
    Aren't the UCI suing Landis over some claims ? Assume they'll have to sue Hamilton too now ?
  • Dgh
    Dgh Posts: 180
    PBo wrote:
    HOW can any of you say what is going on? Were you on the Grand Jury? Do you KNOW what evidence has been given? Or do you have Big George 's phone number? Have YOU asked Lance for his version of events? I think not. And to be honest, Lance probably doesn't CARE that you don't know all the facts, but still spend HOURS posting on the internet.

    Maybe he doped, maybe he didn't, it doesn't really matter, but how do YOU know that he didn't look after Floyd or Tyler. Have you been talking to either of them? Lance may be a reet bugger, he may not, but you haven't met him to know whether that's true or NOT have you?
    I bet I know the answer to that already.



    Phew, sorry, been missing Dennisn.......... :twisted:

    None of us were on the Grand Jury, but we've all read the L'Equipe stuff on the 99 tests.
  • Dgh
    Dgh Posts: 180
    I do actually feel a little bit sorry for Lance. Perhaps his biggest difficulty will be if he's called before the Grand Jury himself. Does he remain silent, in which case his reputation is even more gravely damaged? If he lies, he's facing a perjury charge and (if convicted) likely prison time. Even though I'm a LeMond fan, I can't help feeling sorry for someone in that dilemma.

    Unless, of course, he is in fact innocent of all wrongdoing.

    The credibility of Landis and Hamilton can be attacked, although to say that they are unbelievable because they have lied in the past is going too far. But then there's the stuff about Hincapie's testimony, if the reports are true. And the tests for 1999.

    I wonder if the US's foreign corrupt practices legislation would bite on the pay-off of the UCI that Landis alleged?
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Is there anyone here who still believes Armstrong didn't use performance enhancing drugs to help win the Tour 7 times?
    _
  • BarryBonds
    BarryBonds Posts: 344
    Gazzaputt wrote:
    Tusher wrote:
    If the charges are as strong as rumoured, he's going down.

    :lol:

    He won't go down has a lot of political friends.

    I think we're all getting very excited over some overzealous journalism.

    For me I'm waiting to see the outcome of the investigation as then and only then will we see what everyone really testified.

    I have a feeling for those that say they saw Lance dope they'll be a similar number saying they never.

    Jury is out for me until a real court of law shows the hard facts.

    I never saw Armstrong dope.
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Is there anyone here who still believes Armstrong didn't use performance enhancing drugs to help win the Tour 7 times?

    This guy, for one

    get_a_brain_morans.jpg
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • disgruntledgoat
    disgruntledgoat Posts: 8,957
    How dare he insult the owner of Warrington Wolves RLFC and uber-successful concert promoter Simon Moran in that way!
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
  • Cumulonimbus
    Cumulonimbus Posts: 1,730
    edited May 2011
    iainf72 wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Is there anyone here who still believes Armstrong didn't use performance enhancing drugs to help win the Tour 7 times?

    This guy, for one

    get_a_brain_morans.jpg

    Reminds me of this

    http://www.worth1000.com/entries/96712/ ... rica-untie
  • TMR
    TMR Posts: 3,986
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Is there anyone here who still believes Armstrong didn't use performance enhancing drugs to help win the Tour 7 times?

    I believe he did use drugs, but that's the way the world was then. It's ridiculous applying modern morals and views to practices that occured 10 years ago FFS. Cycling needs to move on and live in the now.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    The Mad Rapper wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Is there anyone here who still believes Armstrong didn't use performance enhancing drugs to help win the Tour 7 times?

    I believe he did use drugs, but that's the way the world was then. It's ridiculous applying modern morals and views to practices that occured 10 years ago FFS. Cycling needs to move on and live in the now.

    I don't think the view on doping between 1998 and 2011 has changed much - other than people are a little more cynical now.

    I don't think anyone here is suggesting Armstrong wasn't fighting with equal weapons.

    It's about understanding how it actually was. Virtually everyone else around him has suffered in some way or another because of doping (either by being caught, or not taking it and being rubbish as a result), and he's got off - and made a fortune out of it.

    He made being clean a big thing. Remember that Nike video? He was making money out of it.

    I take it you weren't a fan of history as a subject eh? :wink:
    _
  • Gazzaputt
    Gazzaputt Posts: 3,227
    For me I have had my view change a testimony given. I'm cynical towards Landis and Hamilton but for Hincapie to testify against Lance says a lot.

    I would advise Lance to come clean and get it over and done with. Otherwise we await the verdict and then the prolonged legal wranglings .

    In a years time he'll be living his life still with a pot of money and this would all be forgotten about.
  • brookter
    brookter Posts: 51
    The Mad Rapper wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Is there anyone here who still believes Armstrong didn't use performance enhancing drugs to help win the Tour 7 times?

    I believe he did use drugs, but that's the way the world was then. It's ridiculous applying modern morals and views to practices that occured 10 years ago FFS. Cycling needs to move on and live in the now.

    The usual caveat: these are still allegations and until they're tested in a court of law, Mr Armstrong is not guilty of any crime.

    Generally, should we forget any doping or crimes now they're in the past?

    Of course there should be a statute of limitations for some crimes. It's six months for minor traffic offences in the UK. There isn't one for murder. Where does this case come on that continuum? I would have thought that the fact that the investigation into the fraud seems to be connected also to the doping suggests that the limit shouldn't be six months... (And even then, Mr A only retired 3 months ago...)

    Mr A was phenomenally successful and for may years was a role model for millions: the allegation is that success was built upon lies, cheating and crime. Without an exemplary punishment shaming of the same magnitude as the rewards, how do you persuade the next generation that the fruits aren't worth it? After all, stay undetected long enough and nothing really bad will happen...

    For further marks, discuss the relevance of S2 (fraud by false representation) and S3 (fraud by failing to disclose information) of the Fraud Act 2006... Does failing to tell the organisers that you've been slurping EPO constitute failing to provide information? The jurisdiction might be a problem though...
  • Monty Dog
    Monty Dog Posts: 20,614
    C'mon, we all know all the 'players' doped, but it was the degree to which the whole edifice was tilted in their favour through corrupt doctors and governing authorities that galls and that so many succumbed to the myth and shouted-down anyone who dare not be a 'believer'. There is no statute of limitations on fraud, money-laundering and drug-peddling and people will want payback for all the spurious litigation that was launched on the back on honest donations. I'll be so pleased when the whole sham is torn-down and the likes of Lemond and Betsy Andreu can be vindicated for being the few that were prepared to speak out.
    Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..

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