Giro Stage 16 *spoiler*

AidanR

Sorry, I didn't mean to sound like I was having a go.

frenchfighter

Pokerface wrote:

Wiggins finished in 46:19, 4:51 back.

So his climbing form is rounding into shape nicely for the Tour then.

Went 10 secs faster in 2008. Lightweight, I don't think he is going as well as he may have liked. Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

donrhummy

AidanR wrote:

Sorry, I didn't mean to sound like I was having a go.

no problem.

DaveyL

frenchfighter wrote:

Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

Aaaah, now this one *has* to go into the BS top 10...

Pokerface

DaveyL wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

Aaaah, now this one *has* to go into the BS top 10...

I dunno. I actually agree with him.

dave_1

frenchfighter wrote:

Pokerface wrote:

Wiggins finished in 46:19, 4:51 back.

So his climbing form is rounding into shape nicely for the Tour then.

Went 10 secs faster in 2008. Lightweight, I don't think he is going as well as he may have liked. Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

you're just out to antagonize Wiggins fans, why do you troll every night on here?

Pokerface

Dave_1 wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Pokerface wrote:

Wiggins finished in 46:19, 4:51 back.

So his climbing form is rounding into shape nicely for the Tour then.

Went 10 secs faster in 2008. Lightweight, I don't think he is going as well as he may have liked. Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

you're just out to antagonize Wiggins fans, why do you troll every night on here?

Who? FF or me?

Cumulonimbus

Maybe Wiggo'll give the break a go tomorrow? Could be a good chance of the break succeeding, would have thought that most of the big teams would see better use of time on the front on friday's and saturday's stage? Cunego might fancy giving it a big one in the last few kilometres though so maybe Lampre will give chase.

dave_1

Pokerface wrote:

Dave_1 wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Pokerface wrote:

Wiggins finished in 46:19, 4:51 back.

So his climbing form is rounding into shape nicely for the Tour then.

Went 10 secs faster in 2008. Lightweight, I don't think he is going as well as he may have liked. Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

you're just out to antagonize Wiggins fans, why do you troll every night on here?

Who? FF or me?

I meant FF...

DaveyL

Pokerface wrote:

DaveyL wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

Aaaah, now this one *has* to go into the BS top 10...

I dunno. I actually agree with him.

Yeah, but if you're gonna take it easy then all you have to do is make sure you are within the likely cut-off plus a bit of a safety margin. Other than that, why try to read too much into it?

iainf72

Dave_1 wrote:

Still, Evans has the boost today...Basso is getting a bit tired, certainly off 2 days ago's high, maybe Evans can handle Basso on any climb...and a great duel on the final stage. Fingers crossed.

Is it more likely that Basso just doesn't like CLM, and didn't like the road surface. Liquigas will probably keep the race very hard - I even expect tomorrow will be a tough one.

Really great race though, it has to be said.

If I were a betting man I'd say it'll be decided by the end of Saturday. I would be happy for either Basso or Evans to win.

greasedscotsman

frenchfighter wrote:

Went 10 secs faster in 2008. Lightweight, I don't think he is going as well as he may have liked. Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

lightweight? Surely for a cyclist that's a good thing. I would be very happy if someone shouted it at me if I was out for a ride...

frenchfighter

Dave_1 wrote:

you're just out to antagonize Wiggins fans, why do you troll every night on here?

If you cannot see that I am extremely far from being a so called 'troll' yourself I have no time or possibility of trying or wanting to convince you otherwise.

My comment was giving my opinion. If you don't agree with it then that doesn't make me a 'troll'.

takethehighroad

http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/road/2006//giro06/?id=results/giro0620

The last time the Giro went over the Mortirolo to finish at Aprica. Granted it's maybe not the best example, but Friday looks easy compared to Saturday!

DaveyL

TakeTheHighRoad wrote:

http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/road/2006//giro06/?id=results/giro0620

The last time the Giro went over the Mortirolo to finish at Aprica. Granted it's maybe not the best example, but Friday looks easy compared to Saturday!

"No more Mr. Nice Guy: Basso takes a(nother) leaf out of the Armstrong bible"

Quite.

frenchfighter

The backdrop here is simply stunning

dave_1

iainf72 wrote:

Dave_1 wrote:

Still, Evans has the boost today...Basso is getting a bit tired, certainly off 2 days ago's high, maybe Evans can handle Basso on any climb...and a great duel on the final stage. Fingers crossed.

Is it more likely that Basso just doesn't like CLM, and didn't like the road surface. Liquigas will probably keep the race very hard - I even expect tomorrow will be a tough one.

Really great race though, it has to be said.

If I were a betting man I'd say it'll be decided by the end of Saturday. I would be happy for either Basso or Evans to win.

true...i want Evans to win but Basso would be fine too. How brilliant it would be to see them battle for the GC win in the final TT stage?!!!

dave_1

frenchfighter wrote:

Dave_1 wrote:

you're just out to antagonize Wiggins fans, why do you troll every night on here?

If you cannot see that I am extremely far from being a so called 'troll' yourself I have no time or possibility of trying or wanting to convince you otherwise.

My comment was giving my opinion. If you don't agree with it then that doesn't make me a 'troll'.

I wouldn't dismiss people who raced 16 days of the Giro and up Plan de Corones as lightweights in the pejorative sense. Surely a little respect is due? This isn't club runs stuff...it's so hard you and I probabaly cannot imagine how painful it is day in day out. And Wiggins has not been loud like Lance so surely does not deserve hassle

moray_gub

frenchfighter wrote:

All these guys would have beaten Garzelli:

1 Franco Pellizotti (Ita) Liquigas DOPER 40.26 (19.142 km/h)
2 Emanuele Sella (Ita) CSF Group Navigare DOPER 0.06
3 Gilberto Simoni (Ita) Serramenti PVC Diquigiovanni-Androni Giocattoli 0.17
4 Alberto Contador Velasco (Spa) Astana 0.22
5 Riccardo Riccò (Ita) Saunier Duval - Scott DOPER 0.30
6 José Rujano Guillen (Ven) Caisse d'Epargne 0.49
7 Marzio Bruseghin (Ita) Lampre 1.04

Didnt you miss out nos and 3 and 4 there ?

moray_gub

DaveyL wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

Aaaah, now this one *has* to go into the BS top 10...

I wonder when it comes to race tactics etc is FF as clueless as he makes makes out or as Blaze says he is just at the wind up .

dave_1

Moray Gub wrote:

DaveyL wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Even if he is taking it easy, his 'easy' should be quite a bit better than in 2008 considering.

Aaaah, now this one *has* to go into the BS top 10...

I wonder when it comes to race tactics etc is FF as clueless as he makes makes out or as Blaze says he is just at the wind up .

I think FF is mostly a troll, the juvenile switching of avatars puzzles me, his/her arousal at mens legs suggest female or maybe not..who knows, but the boy or girl is interested in cycling. I found his negative comment on Dan Martin-only 23 and at the Giro to be so ill informed, so stupid that it might actually just be blatant trolling. FFs Ras comment , again a rush to judge, showing FF to be a mouthy opinionated person. I am going to try harder to scroll past his comments as he's defo out to get a reaction...

iainf72

Sweet Jaysus


http://twitpic.com/1r2oyy

frenchfighter

Dave, since you suggest I am young then I may think you are old. From other things I gather you have been involved with cycling forums a while. Should these both be the case then I would assume you are able to accept that people will have different opinions, views, perspectives and interests about road cycling to you.

For the benefit of the doubt I will explain Wiggins further:

He is touted by himself, his team and the press as being a top contender for the Tour, even being capable of winning it.
His team make a big fuss and are often saying things which they don't deliver on.
He has moved on a HUGE amount since 2008, since he is now very specifically targetting the Tour. Namely his climbing.
I understand that he may be taking it 'easy' now so to speak (although only a few days ago his team were saying they wanted to get him a good GC position), so don't expect him to top ten (regardless of whether I dislike him not going hard).

From the above I don't think my first comment is far-fetched. If you diasgree, either ignore or press my point of view or state why you think otherwise. I would prefer you didn't simply make a couple of posts trying to 'put me down'.

Enough said on this topic.

rockmount

Firmly in my favourites...
http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/search.php?search_author=frenchfighter

jimmythecuckoo

And in mine now... every post a classic.

greeny12

All the FF baiting aside, last year's Giro was notable for the emergence of Brad up with the best of the climbers in several stages, particularly in the race's first half. That's not really been the case this year, so there is a difference.

Maybe it's because the pace last year was less savage, because the "big favourites" didn't need to work so hard to make up time? Maybe Brad was feeling slightly better/in form? Maybe the quality at the front is just a bit higher this year?

I don't know, and I'm not going to start saying things like Brad's lost it and all that, but as a fan I have to say I've been a bit disappointed in him so far. If the Giro is training for the Tour, why be seen to soft-pedal in key mountain stages - surely training is all about the "no pain, no gain" thing???

That said, rightly or wrongly he says the Tour is everything for him this year, so I'll judge him finally in Paris....

RichN95.

greeny12 wrote:

All the FF baiting aside, last year's Giro was notable for the emergence of Brad up with the best of the climbers in several stages, particularly in the race's first half. That's not really been the case this year, so there is a difference.

Maybe it's because the pace last year was less savage, because the "big favourites" didn't need to work so hard to make up time? Maybe Brad was feeling slightly better/in form? Maybe the quality at the front is just a bit higher this year?

I don't know, and I'm not going to start saying things like Brad's lost it and all that, but as a fan I have to say I've been a bit disappointed in him so far. If the Giro is training for the Tour, why be seen to soft-pedal in key mountain stages - surely training is all about the "no pain, no gain" thing???

That said, rightly or wrongly he says the Tour is everything for him this year, so I'll judge him finally in Paris....

The thing is, he's climbed better this year. It's just now we know he can climb we expect more. Last year it was a surprise and a novelty.

Last year he came 22nd on one mountain stage (he first one). After that he was outside the top 80, often in the autobus.

This year, in the first two mountain stages he came 16th and 11th - so an improvement.

Now I'd like to see him put in a strong effort on a stage with a plurality of climbs, but I'm no coach.

Pokerface

iainf72 wrote:

Sweet Jaysus


http://twitpic.com/1r2oyy

How odd that he finally choose to SIT on one of the steepest parts of the course - but is out of the saddle most of the rest of the time!


That is an epic photo.

Pokerface

I am not a troll. And I posted the original info about where he finished yesterday and made the comment that his climbing form basically sucked.

I AM a Wiggo fan. But felt he should be doing much better at this stage of the season if he wants to do well in the Tour. I didn't expect him to win yesterday, just maybe better than 5 minutes down on the leaders. He obviously wasn't trying - and if he WAS, the Houston.....we have a problem.

greeny12

RichN95 wrote:

greeny12 wrote:

All the FF baiting aside, last year's Giro was notable for the emergence of Brad up with the best of the climbers in several stages, particularly in the race's first half. That's not really been the case this year, so there is a difference.

Maybe it's because the pace last year was less savage, because the "big favourites" didn't need to work so hard to make up time? Maybe Brad was feeling slightly better/in form? Maybe the quality at the front is just a bit higher this year?

I don't know, and I'm not going to start saying things like Brad's lost it and all that, but as a fan I have to say I've been a bit disappointed in him so far. If the Giro is training for the Tour, why be seen to soft-pedal in key mountain stages - surely training is all about the "no pain, no gain" thing???

That said, rightly or wrongly he says the Tour is everything for him this year, so I'll judge him finally in Paris....

The thing is, he's climbed better this year. It's just now we know he can climb we expect more. Last year it was a surprise and a novelty.

Last year he came 22nd on one mountain stage (he first one). After that he was outside the top 80, often in the autobus.

This year, in the first two mountain stages he came 16th and 11th - so an improvement.

Now I'd like to see him put in a strong effort on a stage with a plurality of climbs, but I'm no coach.

That's really interesting - a lesson on perception and reality. I watched all of the Giro last year and I could have sworn he did better than that - but it's probably because the first time he showed at the front on a mountain Harmon would have been giving it the big 'un and so the perception that he climbed like a mountain goat the whole time stuck!