Armstrong vs Contador
Comments
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camerone wrote:this is the same albert contador who rode for liberty seguras isnt it? just checking thats all. lots of love for someone who by the guilty by association rules of the forum is dirty as sh1t.
if valverde is anything to go by he wont be here next year....
If you have been on this forum long and read any posts of mine on this subject you will know that I will only go on hard evidence and fact. Not hearsay, not opinion, not gossip and not team association.
Also, guess who else rode for Liberty Seguros: Vande Velde! So I assume you think he is a doper? Huh?
And how about: Paulinho, Allan Davis, LL Sanchez, Beloki, Barredo?Contador is the Greatest0 -
frenchfighter wrote:If you have been on this forum long and read any posts of mine on this subject you will know that I will only go on hard evidence and fact. Not hearsay, not opinion, not gossip ...
.. who said that, internet forum people ?0 -
Ooohh check out the bitchiness on here!
Shouldn't we just consider that it makes a great spectacle and interesting event?? Also, is it not impressive that at 12 years AC's junior and having not raced for 3.5 years, Lance is actually doing very well??
I liked seeing the intense rivalry between the two when Lance caught him back up first time, seemed like they were almost riding each other off the road! Great stuff to watch!
Also, whoever said Lance has fat legs, behave! If anything AC has unbelievably thin legs for the performance he puts out.
Anyway, all entertaining stuff, I'm just glad a rider in his late 30s is showing such impressive performance! Oh yes, I am in favour of Lance! 0 -
frenchfighter wrote:camerone wrote:this is the same albert contador who rode for liberty seguras isnt it? just checking thats all. lots of love for someone who by the guilty by association rules of the forum is dirty as sh1t.
if valverde is anything to go by he wont be here next year....
If you have been on this forum long and read any posts of mine on this subject you will know that I will only go on hard evidence and fact. Not hearsay, not opinion, not gossip and not team association.
Also, guess who else rode for Liberty Seguros: Vande Velde! So I assume you think he is a doper? Huh?
And how about: Paulinho, Allan Davis, LL Sanchez, Beloki, Barredo?
now now. the clue is in the title of the thread, i was talking about contador. we weren't discussing the whole peleton.i didnt say contador was on drugs, huh, i just pointed out lots of love for someone who has dodgy connections. can i suggest you read the post before responding. goodnight.0 -
Maybe it seemed a bit unfair to frenchfighter that you picked up about Contador on this subject, when actually 5 of the leading 6 in the GC have a degree of suspicion around them about the same subject.camerone wrote:now now. the clue is in the title of the thread, i was talking about contador. we weren't discussing the whole peloton.i didnt say contador was on drugs, huh, i just pointed out lots of love for someone who has dodgy connections. can i suggest you read the post before responding. goodnight.0 -
Did you see the (albeit brief) interview with him yesterday? For someone who is 81 years old, he not only looked in good nick, but he sounded very much all there. I was quite impressed!micron wrote:Thanks for the photo of Bahamontes - a very charming gent and an extraordinary rider - would have loved to see him in his prime0 -
I think it's beautiful the blind admiration for the riders of Astana. Most ex Brunyneel riders have progressed on to other teams and have since got busted.
If Contador goes to another team then the risk will be there of himself being caught. Armstrong knows that Brunyneel gets the job done without any problems and Contador should stay there if he knows what's good for his long term future.
I have the same opinion as Jorg Jaksche that the Tour will be won by a doper. Too much water has passed under the bridge to know that a clean Tour is a nonsense.
Garmin is the Team I have some interest in with Wiggins saying that his form may not last the whole 3 weeks. I know that not taking Steriods does effect the 3rd week in a Tour as the pressure begins to take it's toll. Millar was rubbish today and that seems to suggest a poor recovery which again would suggest a lack of Steriods. I think that these are promising signs. I must remember though that the sport is based on advertising the sponsor's product by getting their rider first across the line which generates publicity and shifts stock. Hence the ambition win at (almost) any cost. The Human Billboard on wheels.
No rider is sacred and anyone could easily be a doper including Lance, Contador, Wiggins etc. So we can all put the handbags down and just enjoy a good race.
Ciao Jerry“Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving”- Albert Einstein
"You can't ride the Tour de France on mineral water."
-Jacques Anquetil0 -
As someone who take the centre field of opinion on Armstrong, here's my assessment of the civil war.
Armstrong still has control of the team. Here's why. During his winning years, the Armstrong trademark was to put a train of his riders of the front for the final climb of the first uphill finish. The train set a ferocious pace, making attacks impossible and blowing out all but Beloki or Basso.
Today the tactics looked the same. But the thinning of the bunch didn't happen, with many riders including Wiggins and Martin finishing with LA. Bertie attacked, as did Evans, van den Brouke and even Wiggins.
So why couldn't they replacate the glory days. It wasn't because of the personnel - Levi, Zubeldia, Kloden and Popo are all GT top 5 finishers. They're more than capable. They could have done the high pace for Berie, but they didn't - they went at Lance's pace. This shows they were working for LA primarily.
With only 2 seconds between the teammates, I don't see this changing yet.Twitter: @RichN950 -
The biggest thing today was Contador reacting first to an attack from EVANS, also it was Wiggins who reacted first to that one too, out of the Garmin boys.0
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frenchfighter wrote:That is why I respect Contador. He lets his LEGS do the TALKING. And guess what - they work.
Contador has quality friends. Not movie stars. That there is Bahamontes.
ahem... do i have to send you back to the Lance/Merckx I sent you to the other day?
http://www.livestrong.com/lance-armstro ... bca79f7ad/0 -
TakeTheHighRoad wrote:The biggest thing today was Contador reacting first to an attack from EVANS, also it was Wiggins who reacted first to that one too, out of the Garmin boys.
Then Lance and Klodi came around and completely boxed Evans in. Poor guy.0 -
frenchfighter wrote:Lance is ego is so big that I am pretty sure he would like to have had the jersey tonight. He could see he was desperate for the maglia rosa in the first week of the Giro. He wont be happy with Contador taking it. As for him being 2nd favourite, not in my eyes...
Wanting the Yellow.. what an awful egomaniacal thing.
Johan is the one that didn't want or even to be this close to it.0 -
knedlicky wrote:
Maybe it seemed a bit unfair to frenchfighter that you picked up about Contador on this subject, when actually 5 of the leading 6 in the GC have a degree of suspicion around them about the same subject.camerone wrote:now now. the clue is in the title of the thread, i was talking about contador. we weren't discussing the whole peloton.i didnt say contador was on drugs, huh, i just pointed out lots of love for someone who has dodgy connections. can i suggest you read the post before responding. goodnight.
this is a post about contador v armstrong, where the majority are creaming themselves over contador. hence i made a point about contador. if thats unfair then i apologise. BUT IT ISNT.0 -
And the reason for that? "My enemy's enemy is my friend". Wind the forum back 12 months and AC's name was mud on here. Lance announces his comeback and all of a sudden it's poor, dear, sweet Bertie...Le Blaireau (1)0
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Contador (please not Bertie) was always my favourite and I never liked Armstrong. If people have changed their opinion on him so much the better. They may have done so as they see that Contador is consistently humble, far from the media and generally likeable. Furthermore, he lets his legs do the talking and they rarely let him down.
Camerone, it was quite clear you were implicating Contador. The only thing is that you couldn't say it outright - just like so many other people. If you have something to say do not mask it, just say it straight out, be frank like Cavendish - it is better for everyone. Mentionning CVV made everything else seem a bit flimsy, but whatever, I don't care.Contador is the Greatest0 -
I'm quite used to using Bertie now so I think I will stick with that. It could be worse, why dont you look back to threads during last year's Giro and Vuleta. "Dertie" and "Cerador" were the order of the day - he was the most despised rider on the forums. Now, he's dear little put-upon Bertie. What could possibly have caused such a re-evaluation? Le Blaireau (1)0
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What interests me more is why he was 'the most despised rider on the forums'?Contador is the Greatest0
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He was winning GTs and had been linked to OP. And he was riding for Buryneel's team.Le Blaireau (1)0
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frenchfighter wrote:Contador (please not Bertie) was always my favourite and I never liked Armstrong. If people have changed their opinion on him so much the better. They may have done so as they see that Contador is consistently humble, far from the media and generally likeable. Furthermore, he lets his legs do the talking and they rarely let him down.
Camerone, it was quite clear you were implicating Contador. The only thing is that you couldn't say it outright - just like so many other people. If you have something to say do not mask it, just say it straight out, be frank like Cavendish - it is better for everyone. Mentionning CVV made everything else seem a bit flimsy, but whatever, I don't care.
if you read my post properly you will read that i was suggesting most posters operate a guilty by association rule. and i didnt mention CVdV. that was you.0 -
frenchfighter wrote:That is why I respect Contador. He lets his LEGS do the TALKING. And guess what - they work.
Contador has quality friends. Not movie stars. That there is Bahamontes.
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Lance is a big friend of Eddy Merckyx but hey ho a second rater if ever there was one eh !Gasping - but somehow still alive !0 -
Didn't see the interview with Bahamontes but met him once (and Van Impe) at my local Champion supermarket when they were doing a King of the Mountains promotion. It was an absolute honour to be within 5 feet of those 2 legends.
Merckx introduced Armstrong to Ferrari, I believe.
I loved Contador when he first emerged, was very excited about him - even though he regarded Manolo Saiz as 'like a father'. I was disappointed when he went to Discovery/Astana and came under the influence of Bruyneel - just seemed like out of the frying pan into a very big fire. But if I have to choose between 'Contadope' and 'Pharmstrong', I prefer Contador's comportment off the bike and panache on it to the endless spin of the Boss Hog machine.0 -
DaveyL wrote:He was winning GTs and had been linked to OP. And he was riding for Buryneel's team.
So that makes him the most despised person on here? Sorry I am COMPLETELY lost.
If that kind of logic is to be followed then Lance is about about 1000 times worse than Contador - he has an EXTREMELY tight relationship with Bruyneel has won more GTs than Contador and has had positives for corticoids and EPO as well as well as plenty of other 'doping' issues, about which there are many more knowledgable people on here than me.
The logic is completely flawed.
I am flummoxed! I was expecting something terrible...Contador is the Greatest0 -
I'm not standing up for it - just explaining the way it was. LA was gone, so the forumers needed a new hate figure and Bertie fitted quite nicely - he was the new "chosen one" of Bruyneel, quite enough in its own right for them. Now that the lightning rod is back, the Bertie-hating has pretty much stopped.
No one said it should make sense.Le Blaireau (1)0 -
micron wrote:I loved Contador when he first emerged, was very excited about him - even though he regarded Manolo Saiz as 'like a father'. I was disappointed when he went to Astana and came under the influence of Bruyneel - just seemed like out of the frying pan into a very big fire. But if I have to choose between 'Contadope' and 'Pharmstrong', I prefer Contador's comportment off the bike and panache on it to the endless spin of the Boss Hog machine.
He went to Discovery from Astana, and fell under the influence of JB. He returned to Astana with JB.
Doesn't matter though, I am very much a Bertie fan (I find that nickname rather endearing).
I understand that Vino is keen for him to stay as leader, along with Klodi. Interesting.0 -
DaveyL wrote:I'm not standing up for it - just explaining the way it was. LA was gone, so the forumers needed a new hate figure and Bertie fitted quite nicely - he was the new "chosen one" of Bruyneel, quite enough in its own right for them. Now that the lightning rod is back, the Bertie-hating has pretty much stopped.
No one said it should make sense.
I'm not sure there was ever any Bertie-hating, to be honest. People may have pointed out his links to OP, expressed dissatisfaction at his choice to ride for Bruyneel, and showed some sceptisism at his dominant performance, but no cyclist has ever provoked a reaction in the same way as LA has.
I think it's just down to personalities. One is likable, the other one isn't.0 -
DaveyL wrote:And the reason for that? "My enemy's enemy is my friend". Wind the forum back 12 months and AC's name was mud on here. Lance announces his comeback and all of a sudden it's poor, dear, sweet Bertie...
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Just over 12 months ago, I suggested that AC might not be clean after his Giro performance & was comprehensively flamed, not sure how that equates with the idea of his name being mud....
The first part of this is incredibly true, the second less so. There are psychological conditions that polarise responses massively. For me, the interesting question is why LA polarises opinion so, rather than endlessly rehashing old arguments & this quote comes very close to pinning it down.akx237vi wrote:I think it's just down to personalities. One is likable, the other one isn't.0 -
You were probably comprehensively flamed by one or two posters, dare I call them "fanboys" ? The threads are still there, 80-odd pages back. I had a quick look and the "Dertie" moniker was not imagined, neither was the flak he received for associating himself with Bruyneel.Le Blaireau (1)0
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One has to be careful about the company one keeps.
In a way I'm disappointed that Astana didn't fold and he didn't join Garmin, purely because it would have been interesting to see if moving to such a team had any material effect on his performance.0
