Today's discussion about the news

That graph doesn't pass the smell test to me.

OK here is the original with more context, it's for a specific couple

Unfortunately there wasn't a corresponding chart posted. The argument was: Germany is struggling to reward extra effort and France is worse due to the higher overall tax burden (44% versus 37%), much bigger state (as a proportion of the economy) and bigger debt.

And then France has just gone and voted for a bunch of big spenders (L & R) and blame it all on foreigners. "donne-moi une plus grosse pelle."

lol I didn’t even post it hahahahahaha

No, it's just another highly selective and misleading piece of crap on the internet.

So my theory, hardly original, is young people hating the right wing party (aka the Tories) unlike the rest of Europe will not hold once Tories are out.

reform are picking up a lot of young (men) votes and I reckon the Tories were uniquely unattractive to young people.

with labour in, the youth will follow their continental equivalents and go far right to the tune of 30-40%

This. His target audience is much the same as Trump’s, older working class people who want someone / something to blame for their lack of success in life. No-one really cares about the vote of young men as they are the least likely to vote. It may be a cliched view but I feel young French people are more likely to protest and engage in politics.

In which case Reform is in direct competition for Labour, which seems to me to be the natural home for people who want to blame their lack of success on anything apart from their own bad luck or lack of skill/ hard work/ foresight etc.

That's a 679 page report. Read it, have you?

I also note you subscribe to the argumentative style whereby if you criticise something specific, you are accused of a far broader point, which you then have to deny. Tell you what, read what I said and figure it out for yourself.

The graph was bollocks. Or to the extent is wasn't, it likely disguises salient information such as what those deductions are actually for, and what the parents get in return. Like seemingly everything on Twatter, anything seemingly astonishing is actually probably less so when you drill down. Probably it's on page 300ish - let me know when you've found it.

The issue with the medics here is running out of tax free pension contributions. Diddums, and more in the realms of can't be bothered any more than it not being beneficial to work, for the other 99%.

That aside, I'm more directly acquainted with the concept of progressive taxation than you are, thanks.

It always seems to stem from an idiotic graph on twitter as well. There's a pathological hostility towards questioning something that doesn't look quite right, or that itself is suggesting a fat broader point than is supported.

It's argumentative gaslighting, really.

Oh calm down. I believe I commented that it was an interesting take on the French situation. After the statutory dismissal of anything published on Twitter, the chart police then focused on Germany, which is somewhat beside the point.

No, of course I haven't read all 679 pages in a half hour train journey, but I can read a contents page and skip to the relevant table. I mistakenly thought you might be interested in the OECD data (which seems to be the starting point for most of the charts I've found). If you're not that's fine.

I did find a chart that compared the UK and US, which - surprise surprise - showed that low earners are better off in the UK, while higher earners get to keep more of their money in the US. It's a fairly straight line once you get out of the low earnings zone (contrary to a lot of assumptions).

https://blog.thesalarycalculator.co.uk/wp-content/visualisations/usukchart.htm

You can see the tax thresholds in the wobble in the blue line around £100,000.

On your pensions argument, it may well be diddums, but if they retire at 55 to avoid it, the Treasury loses out and we are down a medic. Nobody's asking for sympathy, but if we want to fix even some of the endless list of things that need fixing we need to maximise receipts not create incentives for people to duck out of earning early.

A few people on here need to be more aware that that they have a weakness for not realising twitter is often full of opinionated shyte.

I think there is evidence you struggle with it. Your average social sciences graph consistently trips you up, from all sorts of sources.

You also often miss the wood for the trees whenever there is a social science chart.

It’s fine. I think your experience of the forum would improve if you didn’t have a hissy fit every time there was a chart

lol you’re very good at convincing yourself you’re right I’ll give you that.

There is a difference between science and social science and I don’t think you necessarily appreciate that.

Pretty much every chart posted on here tbh. You get in such a froth you convince yourself you’re right and we all give up as we can’t be arsed with your chart related hissy fit.

Youll eventually work out there aren’t many cast iron discrete things in social sciences. It’s all grey. I think when you see a chart you immediately think it must be discrete and black & white. It never is.