The Big 'Let's sell our cars and take buses/ebikes instead' thread (warning: probably very dull)
Comments
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Sure, the article doesn't. I am making that argument. I brought my own fag-packet numbers, and they're bringing theirs. That's all. It's not an infallible article, nor did I write it.First.Aspect said:
The article doesn't compare costs of public transport though. Just bikes. So it is comparing journeys by just bikes with all car journeys, and proposing one as a substitute for the other.rick_chasey said:I suspect there is a kernal of truth and it ties back to the discussion we had earlier about how much of total transport spend is on cars and how the mentality is such that spending loads of money on a private car to sit in jams and struggle to park is totally normal but swapping that money out for better infrastructure for things like cycling or public transport is still *madness*
Even if the numbers are likely wrong, I doubt they're so wrong that that argument falls over.
Is that a reasonable argument to make?
Their research has some, if limited merit, and their stats highlighted an argument I made, so I thought I'd share it, to support what I have been saying.0 -
so flawed, biaised, limited merit and useless, coupled with back of ciggie packet figures from a biaised organisation and a US political expert cum HR administrator currently living in a too small house in Cambridge.
May as well ask Fat Les down The Winchestet.
.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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Rick, I thought you might like this image that came up on my LinkedIn feed!
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So the article doesn't actually add anything that you've not already said, then?rick_chasey said:
Sure, the article doesn't. I am making that argument. I brought my own censored -packet numbers, and they're bringing theirs. That's all. It's not an infallible article, nor did I write it.First.Aspect said:
The article doesn't compare costs of public transport though. Just bikes. So it is comparing journeys by just bikes with all car journeys, and proposing one as a substitute for the other.rick_chasey said:I suspect there is a kernal of truth and it ties back to the discussion we had earlier about how much of total transport spend is on cars and how the mentality is such that spending loads of money on a private car to sit in jams and struggle to park is totally normal but swapping that money out for better infrastructure for things like cycling or public transport is still *madness*
Even if the numbers are likely wrong, I doubt they're so wrong that that argument falls over.
Is that a reasonable argument to make?
Their research has some, if limited merit, and their stats highlighted an argument I made, so I thought I'd share it, to support what I have been saying.0 -
It's almost like you're asking me to repeat myself. Bringing evidence and/or another perspective to the argument not a bad thing.0
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And for bonus points, published in the Guardian.MattFalle said:.
produced by the cycle industry campaign grouprick_chasey said:Millions of Britons are trapped in transport poverty owing to a lack of alternatives to car ownership, with some spending nearly a fifth of their pre-tax income keeping a car on the road, a study has found.
Those who own a car spend on average 13% of their gross income on it, above the 10% generally seen as the indicator of transport poverty. For those paying for their car with a finance or loan deal this proportion rises to 19%.
The report, produced by the cycle industry campaign group Bike Is Best, found that about three-quarters of drivers think they will always own a car, while just under half, 47%, believe they have no alternative.
so no bias, no?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]1 -
and you've, yet again, done none of thisrick_chasey said:Bringing evidence and/or another perspective to the argument not a bad thing.
gents - don't feed the troll..The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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wonder which way they are dangling their rod?Stevo_666 said:
And for bonus points, published in the Guardian.MattFalle said:.
produced by the cycle industry campaign grouprick_chasey said:Millions of Britons are trapped in transport poverty owing to a lack of alternatives to car ownership, with some spending nearly a fifth of their pre-tax income keeping a car on the road, a study has found.
Those who own a car spend on average 13% of their gross income on it, above the 10% generally seen as the indicator of transport poverty. For those paying for their car with a finance or loan deal this proportion rises to 19%.
The report, produced by the cycle industry campaign group Bike Is Best, found that about three-quarters of drivers think they will always own a car, while just under half, 47%, believe they have no alternative.
so no bias, no?.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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No it's almost like I am asking you not to repeat yourself.rick_chasey said:It's almost like you're asking me to repeat myself. Bringing evidence and/or another perspective to the argument not a bad thing.
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definition of insanity, no?First.Aspect said:
No it's almost like I am asking you not to repeat yourself.rick_chasey said:It's almost like you're asking me to repeat myself. Bringing evidence and/or another perspective to the argument not a bad thing.
.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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To be fair, I set it up to stop Rick polluting the Cars thread with this sort of stuff and he was already getting a bit of 'pushback' on his ideas on that thread...ddraver said:
Given that this entire thread, all 32 pages of it, was set up entirely to troll RC, that seems rather rich...MattFalle said:
gents - don't feed the troll."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]1 -
Yup - it was set up to stop Rick trolling the car thread which was a pretty harmless yet diverting thread tbh.
I mudt admit that there actually hasn't been much trolling of the Rick on this thread which is surprising..The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.1 -
I remember getting the company supplied bus into work, so yes. I'd argue that it is not a viable option for most commutes as the general public will not cycle 5 miles.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
It's not a choice they are going to make. Which government is going to force them to?The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
incorrect totally.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
no its not..The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Housing is part of the problem.Stevo_666 said:
He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
And a bakfiets can carry a lot. Not a solution to everything, but certainly can carry a lot.0 -
Had to google a bakfiet. Call me a cynic, but there may be a reason why they haven't caught on with the trade, especially around this time of year...rick_chasey said:
Housing is part of the problem.Stevo_666 said:
He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
And a bakfiets can carry a lot. Not a solution to everything, but certainly can carry a lot.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Very popular in holland with local tradesmen.Stevo_666 said:
Had to google a bakfiet. Call me a cynic, but there may be a reason why they haven't caught on with the trade, especially around this time of year...rick_chasey said:
Housing is part of the problem.Stevo_666 said:
He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
And a bakfiets can carry a lot. Not a solution to everything, but certainly can carry a lot.
A lot cheaper to run. No need to have to charge for the residents parking fee, no petrol etc etc. Usually have an electric motor so it's assisted too.0 -
I'll be sure to mention it to the blokes who are coming from 10 miles away to deliver and fit my new garage door.rick_chasey said:
Very popular in holland with local tradesmen.Stevo_666 said:
Had to google a bakfiet. Call me a cynic, but there may be a reason why they haven't caught on with the trade, especially around this time of year...rick_chasey said:
Housing is part of the problem.Stevo_666 said:
He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
And a bakfiets can carry a lot. Not a solution to everything, but certainly can carry a lot.
A lot cheaper to run. No need to have to charge for the residents parking fee, no petrol etc etc. Usually have an electric motor so it's assisted too.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]2 -
Kent is more cut off than I realised 😀Stevo_666 said:
Had to google a bakfiet. Call me a cynic, but there may be a reason why they haven't caught on with the trade, especially around this time of year...rick_chasey said:
Housing is part of the problem.Stevo_666 said:
He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
And a bakfiets can carry a lot. Not a solution to everything, but certainly can carry a lot.
Pretty much the entire London construction industry works without private cars because there's nowhere to put them. A typical small contractor has maybe a couple of vans. Labour arrives by public transport (you see plenty of guys with their small tools on the tube) and plant and materials are delivered direct.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
I bet they all share the same van.Stevo_666 said:
I'll be sure to mention it to the blokes who are coming from 10 miles away to deliver and fit my new garage door.rick_chasey said:
Very popular in holland with local tradesmen.Stevo_666 said:
Had to google a bakfiet. Call me a cynic, but there may be a reason why they haven't caught on with the trade, especially around this time of year...rick_chasey said:
Housing is part of the problem.Stevo_666 said:
He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
And a bakfiets can carry a lot. Not a solution to everything, but certainly can carry a lot.
A lot cheaper to run. No need to have to charge for the residents parking fee, no petrol etc etc. Usually have an electric motor so it's assisted too.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
My point is about the tools and materials they need to bring to the job. Pretty much all needs motorised transport.rjsterry said:
Kent is more cut off than I realised 😀Stevo_666 said:
Had to google a bakfiet. Call me a cynic, but there may be a reason why they haven't caught on with the trade, especially around this time of year...rick_chasey said:
Housing is part of the problem.Stevo_666 said:
He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
And a bakfiets can carry a lot. Not a solution to everything, but certainly can carry a lot.
Pretty much the entire London construction industry works without private cars because there's nowhere to put them. A typical small contractor has maybe a couple of vans. Labour arrives by public transport (you see plenty of guys with their small tools on the tube) and plant and materials are delivered direct.
Also we're not in London
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
I see them a lot, but often wonder where they get parked. They're not small.rick_chasey said:
Very popular in holland with local tradesmen.Stevo_666 said:
Had to google a bakfiet. Call me a cynic, but there may be a reason why they haven't caught on with the trade, especially around this time of year...rick_chasey said:
Housing is part of the problem.Stevo_666 said:
He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.davebradswmb said:
I made it into work on my bike this morning, despite the pissing rain. People used to make it into work before there were cars. The bike is a viable alternative to cars for most commutes, not using a bike is a choice.pblakeney said:Possibly in the sunlit fantasy world.
Not so much in pissing January.
And a bakfiets can carry a lot. Not a solution to everything, but certainly can carry a lot.
A lot cheaper to run. No need to have to charge for the residents parking fee, no petrol etc etc. Usually have an electric motor so it's assisted too.0 -
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bet they'llbe popular in the Yokshire dales.
But then again, in Ricktopi we've already walled off Ricktopolis and flooded everything outside The Walls.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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the irony runs deep, Lukerick_chasey said:Car parking slots, usually.
.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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So what we're saying is they're a bit like a van, but with a crap engine, no weather protection and much lower carrying capacity?MattFalle said:
the irony runs deep, Lukerick_chasey said:Car parking slots, usually.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]2 -
For most people the distance from home to work is also a choice they have made, based upon being able to drive there. If this was not an option they would make a different choice.Stevo_666 said:He does that work for someone who lives too far from work to cycle? Or trades people who need to take tools and equipment with them? For example.
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