The Big 'Let's sell our cars and take buses/ebikes instead' thread (warning: probably very dull)

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Comments

  • shirley_basso
    shirley_basso Posts: 6,195
    edited September 2023
    First.Aspect said:

    shirley_basso said:

    We don't have any double glazing. Where can I get a grant to get it done, as it's going to cost a fortune - more than it will ever save in energy costs or add to property value.

    Have you got house insurance?

    If so, I know some guys.
    Do they work with all major insurers and does their workmanship come with a customer satisfaction guarantee? I worry that if I am not happy with their work, my legs may go the same way as the windows.
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 16,683
    Munsford0 said:

    Replacing boilers with heat pumps would, if the 'lectric comes from renewables, do a tiny bit towards averting fires and floods.

    My fear is we've already fvcked up the climate so much we've passed a tipping point. If we stopped all fossil fuel burning tomorrow would the ice caps ever recover??

    Well no, in the sense we are still geologically coming out of an ice age.

    My understanding is that CO2 levels would eventually drop though.
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,148
    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    I'm amazed there are still properties out there (other than where heritage issues affect them) that haven't got double glazing. Ours is at least 25 years old and we are now in a position where it really needs to be upgraded so how there are any properties deemed fit to rent out that don't have it at all is ridiculous. There have also been all sorts of grant schemes over the years to improve insulation. I've been looking at the costs of replacing our boiler with a heat pump and with the government grant it looks like it will be less than £5k. The reason I'm not getting it done is the space required for the kit rather than the cost.

    Okay. So are you going to buy more land, or is there not a grant for that?

    Fwiw almost none of the houses we've looked at had double glazing. Perhaps due to type, various barm conversions or listed ones, people have been replacing them peacemeal as required.

    The ones that do have double glazing tend to be two panes either side of a moist tropical ecosystem.
    Did you chuck 1970s into the search bar on Rightmove?

    I've been looking at houses pretty much daily for the last year and can't say I've seen any in the search parameters (£180k - £350k) that haven't had double glazing. There is one house on my street that I think has been owned by the same person / his mother since it was built in the early 70s that still has all the original 'features' including rotting wooden framed single glazed windows, wooden front door and rotting eaves / soffits but everything else is uPVC double glazed.
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 21,523
    Single glazing is a feature of listed buildings and conservation areas.
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,084
    edited September 2023
    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Munsford0 said:

    As I understand it, replacing a gas boiler with a heat pump requires much bigger radiators and in older properties a lot of sealing and insulation to make it effective? Or have I been sold a myth?

    We're in a 30's semi with solid brick walls and would likely need to have external insulation fitted, so not just a simple swap?

    You've had a decade to make this vast investment and if you face the Hobsons choice of selling a worthless property or spending what its worth making it worth what it used to be, well thats just bad luck. Talk to the hand.

    Is that right folks?
    External insulation is likely to be somewhere around £15-25k at a very rough guess. There are now heat pumps available well under £10k installed. I'm not sure I'd call that vast in the context of, say, a foreign family holiday. I think it's unlikely that the lack of either renders a property worthless. Of course it's not a trivial cost, but neither is a £4k annual energy bill, nor the cost of cleaning up after a flash flood.
    Wow, bubble alert.

    Yeah, most people would have to borrow to find £40k. And some just couldn't, because they, you know, already borrowed?

    Interesting you think that's not that much.

    For me, £10k is an awful lot to spend on a holiday, let alone 3-4 times that. I just managed to get to 5 figures for our 50th, but that included 5 star hotel and scuba diving.

    How the hell much are you spending?
    No sh*t. I'd certainly need to borrow if I was spending that. Pick a different comparator if you like. Point is, it's a fraction of the value of the property and much less than flood or fire damage will cost you.
    How is a new boiler going to prevent flooding?
    Who said anything about a new boiler? See, I can do deliberate misinterpretation, too.

    By all means prioritise whatever else you are spending your money on and moan about the lack of fibre broadband in whichever bit of Devon you eventually pick. Meanwhile the stuff that has happened in southern Europe will be happening here soon enough. Then you'll be moaning about why hasn't someone (else, obviously) done something to avoid this.
    Already happening here. You should pay more attention.

    As I said earlier, the destination is fine, but I intensely dislike that discussing how to get there descends into either you are with us or against us. Either you agree with this route, or you are a climate change denier. Either you agree with ULEZ or you want babies to die prematurely.

    Bit simplistic when it comes down to it.

    Oh but the fires and the babies and the floods. Oh the humanity.
    To counter that, I dislike the pervasive can't-be-done-ism. It's the same mindset that thought vacuum braking on trains, or lifeboats on ships or was unnecessary and far too expensive.

    By all means come up with an alternative proposal but delay is effectively saying that you think other (generally much poorer) people should pay for us continuing to avoid doing our bit.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 16,683
    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Munsford0 said:

    As I understand it, replacing a gas boiler with a heat pump requires much bigger radiators and in older properties a lot of sealing and insulation to make it effective? Or have I been sold a myth?

    We're in a 30's semi with solid brick walls and would likely need to have external insulation fitted, so not just a simple swap?

    You've had a decade to make this vast investment and if you face the Hobsons choice of selling a worthless property or spending what its worth making it worth what it used to be, well thats just bad luck. Talk to the hand.

    Is that right folks?
    External insulation is likely to be somewhere around £15-25k at a very rough guess. There are now heat pumps available well under £10k installed. I'm not sure I'd call that vast in the context of, say, a foreign family holiday. I think it's unlikely that the lack of either renders a property worthless. Of course it's not a trivial cost, but neither is a £4k annual energy bill, nor the cost of cleaning up after a flash flood.
    Wow, bubble alert.

    Yeah, most people would have to borrow to find £40k. And some just couldn't, because they, you know, already borrowed?

    Interesting you think that's not that much.

    For me, £10k is an awful lot to spend on a holiday, let alone 3-4 times that. I just managed to get to 5 figures for our 50th, but that included 5 star hotel and scuba diving.

    How the hell much are you spending?
    No sh*t. I'd certainly need to borrow if I was spending that. Pick a different comparator if you like. Point is, it's a fraction of the value of the property and much less than flood or fire damage will cost you.
    How is a new boiler going to prevent flooding?
    Who said anything about a new boiler? See, I can do deliberate misinterpretation, too.

    By all means prioritise whatever else you are spending your money on and moan about the lack of fibre broadband in whichever bit of Devon you eventually pick. Meanwhile the stuff that has happened in southern Europe will be happening here soon enough. Then you'll be moaning about why hasn't someone (else, obviously) done something to avoid this.
    Already happening here. You should pay more attention.

    As I said earlier, the destination is fine, but I intensely dislike that discussing how to get there descends into either you are with us or against us. Either you agree with this route, or you are a climate change denier. Either you agree with ULEZ or you want babies to die prematurely.

    Bit simplistic when it comes down to it.

    Oh but the fires and the babies and the floods. Oh the humanity.
    To counter that, I dislike the pervasive can't-be-done-ism. It's the same mindset that thought vacuum braking on trains, or lifeboats on ships or was unnecessary and far too expensive.

    By all means come up with an alternative proposal but delay is effectively saying that you think other (generally much poorer) people should pay for us continuing to avoid doing our bit.
    We are all decades behind. Bumping the cutoff a couple more years because the world has gone through a pandemic, etc isn't going to make a blind bit of difference to how fukced things are.
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 16,683
    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    I'm amazed there are still properties out there (other than where heritage issues affect them) that haven't got double glazing. Ours is at least 25 years old and we are now in a position where it really needs to be upgraded so how there are any properties deemed fit to rent out that don't have it at all is ridiculous. There have also been all sorts of grant schemes over the years to improve insulation. I've been looking at the costs of replacing our boiler with a heat pump and with the government grant it looks like it will be less than £5k. The reason I'm not getting it done is the space required for the kit rather than the cost.

    Okay. So are you going to buy more land, or is there not a grant for that?

    Fwiw almost none of the houses we've looked at had double glazing. Perhaps due to type, various barm conversions or listed ones, people have been replacing them peacemeal as required.

    The ones that do have double glazing tend to be two panes either side of a moist tropical ecosystem.
    Did you chuck 1970s into the search bar on Rightmove?

    I've been looking at houses pretty much daily for the last year and can't say I've seen any in the search parameters (£180k - £350k) that haven't had double glazing. There is one house on my street that I think has been owned by the same person / his mother since it was built in the early 70s that still has all the original 'features' including rotting wooden framed single glazed windows, wooden front door and rotting eaves / soffits but everything else is uPVC double glazed.
    Rural, I guess. A lot of the places we've looked at couldn't be legally rented they are so bad.

    Fortunately, other than the windows, which will need replacing soonish anyway, the place we have found is pretty good otherwise. And has enough space for a heat pump, when that's required.

    Nearly went for a listed building. Kind of glad we didn't in the end.
  • Jezyboy
    Jezyboy Posts: 3,536
    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Munsford0 said:

    As I understand it, replacing a gas boiler with a heat pump requires much bigger radiators and in older properties a lot of sealing and insulation to make it effective? Or have I been sold a myth?

    We're in a 30's semi with solid brick walls and would likely need to have external insulation fitted, so not just a simple swap?

    You've had a decade to make this vast investment and if you face the Hobsons choice of selling a worthless property or spending what its worth making it worth what it used to be, well thats just bad luck. Talk to the hand.

    Is that right folks?
    External insulation is likely to be somewhere around £15-25k at a very rough guess. There are now heat pumps available well under £10k installed. I'm not sure I'd call that vast in the context of, say, a foreign family holiday. I think it's unlikely that the lack of either renders a property worthless. Of course it's not a trivial cost, but neither is a £4k annual energy bill, nor the cost of cleaning up after a flash flood.
    Wow, bubble alert.

    Yeah, most people would have to borrow to find £40k. And some just couldn't, because they, you know, already borrowed?

    Interesting you think that's not that much.

    For me, £10k is an awful lot to spend on a holiday, let alone 3-4 times that. I just managed to get to 5 figures for our 50th, but that included 5 star hotel and scuba diving.

    How the hell much are you spending?
    No sh*t. I'd certainly need to borrow if I was spending that. Pick a different comparator if you like. Point is, it's a fraction of the value of the property and much less than flood or fire damage will cost you.
    How is a new boiler going to prevent flooding?
    Who said anything about a new boiler? See, I can do deliberate misinterpretation, too.

    By all means prioritise whatever else you are spending your money on and moan about the lack of fibre broadband in whichever bit of Devon you eventually pick. Meanwhile the stuff that has happened in southern Europe will be happening here soon enough. Then you'll be moaning about why hasn't someone (else, obviously) done something to avoid this.
    Already happening here. You should pay more attention.

    As I said earlier, the destination is fine, but I intensely dislike that discussing how to get there descends into either you are with us or against us. Either you agree with this route, or you are a climate change denier. Either you agree with ULEZ or you want babies to die prematurely.

    Bit simplistic when it comes down to it.

    Oh but the fires and the babies and the floods. Oh the humanity.
    To counter that, I dislike the pervasive can't-be-done-ism. It's the same mindset that thought vacuum braking on trains, or lifeboats on ships or was unnecessary and far too expensive.

    By all means come up with an alternative proposal but delay is effectively saying that you think other (generally much poorer) people should pay for us continuing to avoid doing our bit.
    We are all decades behind. Bumping the cutoff a couple more years because the world has gone through a pandemic, etc isn't going to make a blind bit of difference to how fukced things are.
    Once you've pushed something back once, it's a lot easier to push it back again.

    Many commentators seem incapable of understanding there may be a difference between all new cars being electric, and all cars on the roads being electric.
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,084
    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    I'm amazed there are still properties out there (other than where heritage issues affect them) that haven't got double glazing. Ours is at least 25 years old and we are now in a position where it really needs to be upgraded so how there are any properties deemed fit to rent out that don't have it at all is ridiculous. There have also been all sorts of grant schemes over the years to improve insulation. I've been looking at the costs of replacing our boiler with a heat pump and with the government grant it looks like it will be less than £5k. The reason I'm not getting it done is the space required for the kit rather than the cost.

    Okay. So are you going to buy more land, or is there not a grant for that?

    Fwiw almost none of the houses we've looked at had double glazing. Perhaps due to type, various barm conversions or listed ones, people have been replacing them peacemeal as required.

    The ones that do have double glazing tend to be two panes either side of a moist tropical ecosystem.
    Did you chuck 1970s into the search bar on Rightmove?

    I've been looking at houses pretty much daily for the last year and can't say I've seen any in the search parameters (£180k - £350k) that haven't had double glazing. There is one house on my street that I think has been owned by the same person / his mother since it was built in the early 70s that still has all the original 'features' including rotting wooden framed single glazed windows, wooden front door and rotting eaves / soffits but everything else is uPVC double glazed.
    Rural, I guess. A lot of the places we've looked at couldn't be legally rented they are so bad.

    Fortunately, other than the windows, which will need replacing soonish anyway, the place we have found is pretty good otherwise. And has enough space for a heat pump, when that's required.

    Nearly went for a listed building. Kind of glad we didn't in the end.
    Lucky escape. V. Lucky.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,084
    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Munsford0 said:

    As I understand it, replacing a gas boiler with a heat pump requires much bigger radiators and in older properties a lot of sealing and insulation to make it effective? Or have I been sold a myth?

    We're in a 30's semi with solid brick walls and would likely need to have external insulation fitted, so not just a simple swap?

    You've had a decade to make this vast investment and if you face the Hobsons choice of selling a worthless property or spending what its worth making it worth what it used to be, well thats just bad luck. Talk to the hand.

    Is that right folks?
    External insulation is likely to be somewhere around £15-25k at a very rough guess. There are now heat pumps available well under £10k installed. I'm not sure I'd call that vast in the context of, say, a foreign family holiday. I think it's unlikely that the lack of either renders a property worthless. Of course it's not a trivial cost, but neither is a £4k annual energy bill, nor the cost of cleaning up after a flash flood.
    Wow, bubble alert.

    Yeah, most people would have to borrow to find £40k. And some just couldn't, because they, you know, already borrowed?

    Interesting you think that's not that much.

    For me, £10k is an awful lot to spend on a holiday, let alone 3-4 times that. I just managed to get to 5 figures for our 50th, but that included 5 star hotel and scuba diving.

    How the hell much are you spending?
    No sh*t. I'd certainly need to borrow if I was spending that. Pick a different comparator if you like. Point is, it's a fraction of the value of the property and much less than flood or fire damage will cost you.
    How is a new boiler going to prevent flooding?
    Who said anything about a new boiler? See, I can do deliberate misinterpretation, too.

    By all means prioritise whatever else you are spending your money on and moan about the lack of fibre broadband in whichever bit of Devon you eventually pick. Meanwhile the stuff that has happened in southern Europe will be happening here soon enough. Then you'll be moaning about why hasn't someone (else, obviously) done something to avoid this.
    Already happening here. You should pay more attention.

    As I said earlier, the destination is fine, but I intensely dislike that discussing how to get there descends into either you are with us or against us. Either you agree with this route, or you are a climate change denier. Either you agree with ULEZ or you want babies to die prematurely.

    Bit simplistic when it comes down to it.

    Oh but the fires and the babies and the floods. Oh the humanity.
    To counter that, I dislike the pervasive can't-be-done-ism. It's the same mindset that thought vacuum braking on trains, or lifeboats on ships or was unnecessary and far too expensive.

    By all means come up with an alternative proposal but delay is effectively saying that you think other (generally much poorer) people should pay for us continuing to avoid doing our bit.
    We are all decades behind. Bumping the cutoff a couple more years because the world has gone through a pandemic, etc isn't going to make a blind bit of difference to how fukced things are.
    I had forgotten to mention fatalist what's the use in trying. 🙂
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 16,683
    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    I'm amazed there are still properties out there (other than where heritage issues affect them) that haven't got double glazing. Ours is at least 25 years old and we are now in a position where it really needs to be upgraded so how there are any properties deemed fit to rent out that don't have it at all is ridiculous. There have also been all sorts of grant schemes over the years to improve insulation. I've been looking at the costs of replacing our boiler with a heat pump and with the government grant it looks like it will be less than £5k. The reason I'm not getting it done is the space required for the kit rather than the cost.

    Okay. So are you going to buy more land, or is there not a grant for that?

    Fwiw almost none of the houses we've looked at had double glazing. Perhaps due to type, various barm conversions or listed ones, people have been replacing them peacemeal as required.

    The ones that do have double glazing tend to be two panes either side of a moist tropical ecosystem.
    Did you chuck 1970s into the search bar on Rightmove?

    I've been looking at houses pretty much daily for the last year and can't say I've seen any in the search parameters (£180k - £350k) that haven't had double glazing. There is one house on my street that I think has been owned by the same person / his mother since it was built in the early 70s that still has all the original 'features' including rotting wooden framed single glazed windows, wooden front door and rotting eaves / soffits but everything else is uPVC double glazed.
    Rural, I guess. A lot of the places we've looked at couldn't be legally rented they are so bad.

    Fortunately, other than the windows, which will need replacing soonish anyway, the place we have found is pretty good otherwise. And has enough space for a heat pump, when that's required.

    Nearly went for a listed building. Kind of glad we didn't in the end.
    Lucky escape. V. Lucky.
    Yeah. Was such a nice house though. Apart from the cob walls, lack of insulation, single glazing you need planning permission to replace, ancient fuse box, ancient septic tank and the dreaded aga.

    Basically, I just reeled off 50 to 100k of fairly imminent costs.
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 19,511
    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    I'm amazed there are still properties out there (other than where heritage issues affect them) that haven't got double glazing. Ours is at least 25 years old and we are now in a position where it really needs to be upgraded so how there are any properties deemed fit to rent out that don't have it at all is ridiculous. There have also been all sorts of grant schemes over the years to improve insulation. I've been looking at the costs of replacing our boiler with a heat pump and with the government grant it looks like it will be less than £5k. The reason I'm not getting it done is the space required for the kit rather than the cost.

    Okay. So are you going to buy more land, or is there not a grant for that?

    Fwiw almost none of the houses we've looked at had double glazing. Perhaps due to type, various barm conversions or listed ones, people have been replacing them peacemeal as required.

    The ones that do have double glazing tend to be two panes either side of a moist tropical ecosystem.
    Did you chuck 1970s into the search bar on Rightmove?

    I've been looking at houses pretty much daily for the last year and can't say I've seen any in the search parameters (£180k - £350k) that haven't had double glazing. There is one house on my street that I think has been owned by the same person / his mother since it was built in the early 70s that still has all the original 'features' including rotting wooden framed single glazed windows, wooden front door and rotting eaves / soffits but everything else is uPVC double glazed.
    Rural, I guess. A lot of the places we've looked at couldn't be legally rented they are so bad.

    Fortunately, other than the windows, which will need replacing soonish anyway, the place we have found is pretty good otherwise. And has enough space for a heat pump, when that's required.

    Nearly went for a listed building. Kind of glad we didn't in the end.
    Lucky escape. V. Lucky.
    Yeah. Was such a nice house though. Apart from the cob walls, lack of insulation, single glazing you need planning permission to replace, ancient fuse box, ancient septic tank and the dreaded aga.

    Basically, I just reeled off 50 to 100k of fairly imminent costs.

    Just missing thatch there for the full bingo card.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 16,683
    briantrumpet said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    I'm amazed there are still properties out there (other than where heritage issues affect them) that haven't got double glazing. Ours is at least 25 years old and we are now in a position where it really needs to be upgraded so how there are any properties deemed fit to rent out that don't have it at all is ridiculous. There have also been all sorts of grant schemes over the years to improve insulation. I've been looking at the costs of replacing our boiler with a heat pump and with the government grant it looks like it will be less than £5k. The reason I'm not getting it done is the space required for the kit rather than the cost.

    Okay. So are you going to buy more land, or is there not a grant for that?

    Fwiw almost none of the houses we've looked at had double glazing. Perhaps due to type, various barm conversions or listed ones, people have been replacing them peacemeal as required.

    The ones that do have double glazing tend to be two panes either side of a moist tropical ecosystem.
    Did you chuck 1970s into the search bar on Rightmove?

    I've been looking at houses pretty much daily for the last year and can't say I've seen any in the search parameters (£180k - £350k) that haven't had double glazing. There is one house on my street that I think has been owned by the same person / his mother since it was built in the early 70s that still has all the original 'features' including rotting wooden framed single glazed windows, wooden front door and rotting eaves / soffits but everything else is uPVC double glazed.
    Rural, I guess. A lot of the places we've looked at couldn't be legally rented they are so bad.

    Fortunately, other than the windows, which will need replacing soonish anyway, the place we have found is pretty good otherwise. And has enough space for a heat pump, when that's required.

    Nearly went for a listed building. Kind of glad we didn't in the end.
    Lucky escape. V. Lucky.
    Yeah. Was such a nice house though. Apart from the cob walls, lack of insulation, single glazing you need planning permission to replace, ancient fuse box, ancient septic tank and the dreaded aga.

    Basically, I just reeled off 50 to 100k of fairly imminent costs.

    Just missing thatch there for the full bingo card.
    That is what the stockbrokers want from their second homes. Didn't you know.

    Anyhow, I've switched that for radon and mining subsidence, as worries go.
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,084
    edited September 2023
    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    I'm amazed there are still properties out there (other than where heritage issues affect them) that haven't got double glazing. Ours is at least 25 years old and we are now in a position where it really needs to be upgraded so how there are any properties deemed fit to rent out that don't have it at all is ridiculous. There have also been all sorts of grant schemes over the years to improve insulation. I've been looking at the costs of replacing our boiler with a heat pump and with the government grant it looks like it will be less than £5k. The reason I'm not getting it done is the space required for the kit rather than the cost.

    Okay. So are you going to buy more land, or is there not a grant for that?

    Fwiw almost none of the houses we've looked at had double glazing. Perhaps due to type, various barm conversions or listed ones, people have been replacing them peacemeal as required.

    The ones that do have double glazing tend to be two panes either side of a moist tropical ecosystem.
    Did you chuck 1970s into the search bar on Rightmove?

    I've been looking at houses pretty much daily for the last year and can't say I've seen any in the search parameters (£180k - £350k) that haven't had double glazing. There is one house on my street that I think has been owned by the same person / his mother since it was built in the early 70s that still has all the original 'features' including rotting wooden framed single glazed windows, wooden front door and rotting eaves / soffits but everything else is uPVC double glazed.
    Rural, I guess. A lot of the places we've looked at couldn't be legally rented they are so bad.

    Fortunately, other than the windows, which will need replacing soonish anyway, the place we have found is pretty good otherwise. And has enough space for a heat pump, when that's required.

    Nearly went for a listed building. Kind of glad we didn't in the end.
    Lucky escape. V. Lucky.
    Yeah. Was such a nice house though. Apart from the cob walls, lack of insulation, single glazing you need planning permission to replace, ancient fuse box, ancient septic tank and the dreaded aga.

    Basically, I just reeled off 50 to 100k of fairly imminent costs.
    Cobb is pretty good for insulation anyway. All the rest will be mired in months of expensive negotiations with a conservation officer before you can even start work.

    Oooh, radon! Exciting stuff.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 7,901
    edited September 2023
    The Norwegian Parliament has decided on a national goal that all new cars sold by 2025 should be zero-emission (electric or hydrogen). By end of 2022, more than 20 percent of registered cars in Norway were battery electric (BEV). Battery electric vehicles held a 79.2 percent market share in 2022. The speed of the transition is closely related to policy instruments and a wide range of incentives.
    https://elbil.no/english/norwegian-ev-policy/
    Blimey, and they're sitting on abundant oil reserves. It's cold there too so the LiFePO4's/Li-ion's must get hit hard by that.
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 7,901
    https://theicct.org/growing-momentum-global-overview-of-government-targets-for-phasing-out-sales-of-new-internal-combustion-engine-vehicles/
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 7,901
    I'm surprised California aren't earlier than 2035.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 60,598
    pinno said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    Pross said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    Sounds like a victory for commons sense and vote winner
    https://telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/09/19/rishi-sunak-net-zero-pledges-petrol-car-ban/

    Wasn’t the original plan part of the Tory manifesto at the last GE (that they won)?

    I’m struggling to see how moving away from policies they were elected to carry out is a vote winner.
    I think you're just hoping it isn't. Smart move by Rishi in any event.
    He upset a lot of his own party, Smart move Rishi.
    I don't think he's upset a lot of the electorate.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 60,598
    rjsterry said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    First.Aspect said:

    It was always daft to try to do it before the rest of Eurup.

    Well quite. No point punishing ourselves trying to be virtuous, especially when there's pressure on the cost of living.
    This isn't the only thing that it was always stupid to do differently to the rest of Eurup. I think "everything else' falls into the same category.
    Stevo_666 said:

    First.Aspect said:

    It was always daft to try to do it before the rest of Eurup.

    Well quite. No point punishing ourselves trying to be virtuous, especially when there's pressure on the cost of living.
    Keep those fingers jammed tightly in your ears.
    Are talking to yourself again? :smile:
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 19,511
    Emily Maitlis might have a point... Stevotories might think that this wafer-thin win means they can forget all that 'green stuff' and U-turn on their previous commitments, and indeed campaign on ungreen policies, but it might not be the winning gambit they think it is...

    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 7,901
    briantrumpet said:

    Emily Maitlis might have a point... Stevotories might think that this wafer-thin win means they can forget all that 'green stuff' and U-turn on their previous commitments, and indeed campaign on ungreen policies, but it might not be the winning gambit they think it is...

    Brain, you travel between two homes in different countries. How is that environmentally efficient?
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,148
    She’s stealing the point I’ve been making for weeks.
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 19,511
    focuszing723 said:

    briantrumpet said:

    Emily Maitlis might have a point... Stevotories might think that this wafer-thin win means they can forget all that 'green stuff' and U-turn on their previous commitments, and indeed campaign on ungreen policies, but it might not be the winning gambit they think it is...

    Brain, you travel between two homes in different countries. How is that environmentally efficient?

    It's not.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • focuszing723
    focuszing723 Posts: 7,901
    edited September 2023
    ...
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,086
    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    kingstongraham said:

    First.Aspect said:

    kingstongraham said:

    I think Starmer will be quite pleased if these changes are enacted before he gets in.

    Correct. Battery technology seems to be getting to a tipping point on range (see the recent stories about better electrodes and solid state electrolytes), at which point there will be a quick pivot by the buying public. This won't happen by 2030 though.

    2035 will also allow more time for non city charging to get better.

    I am less clear on the justification for putting back the ban on new gas and oil boilers through.
    The least justifiable is surely removing the requirement for landlords to provide energy efficient homes.
    Nothing is clear cut. That policy would just reduce the available rental accommodation and push rental prices up. Similarly anyone who stays as a landlord would pass on costs. I certainly wouldn't see the justification for distinguishing between rental and owner occupied though.
    Landlords who feel they can't afford to upgrade to a 'C' rating by the December 2028 deadline could apply for an exemption as follows:

    You can show quotes from three separate installers revealing that “the cost of purchasing and installing the cheapest recommended improvement exceeds £3,500 (including VAT)”. You must also provide confirmation that you are “satisfied that the measure(s) exceed this amount”. This is known as a ‘High cost’ Exemption and applies only to domestic property;

    You have already made all of the changes that could have been proposed in order to meet the regulations, and yet the property has still not achieved the desired rating.
    You can prove that a proposed wall or ceiling insulation system would be unsuitable for your building;

    The required improvements to the house in question require the consent of a third party, which has been refused;

    A RICS-qualified surveyor has informed you that any adjustments to the house – including changing the boiler, heating system, insulation or anything else – will reduce the buildings’ value;

    You have only started letting out rented property very recently (in which case, you may be granted a 6 month exemption).

    Hardly onerous especially if my reading of the first point is correct and you can apply if you have to fork out more than £3.5k inc. VAT to get up to a 'C' rating. It's not like 'C' is particularly onerous either. Part of being a landlord is having to spend money on keeping your asset to an acceptable standard, if landlords are leaving the market because of this I would question whether they are goof landlords to begin with.
    You two are making the mistake of using rational argument. A lot of private landlords will just get out of the market. This will push up prices. It doesn't take much to change sentiment, when being a private landlord is normally not all that worthwhile anyway.
    Would you want someone with that attitude as your landlord? As I've said on here a lot of times before, there are far too many 'property developers' out there who think it is money for old rope egged on by programmes like Homes Under The Hammer that make it seem like you buy a wreck at auction; chuck in a budget kitchen from Wickes, paint the walls and lay some grey carpets then watch the money roll in. If they aren't prepared to invest in basics like making the house energy efficient it makes you wonder what else they are skimping on.
    I would love to invest in decent insulation.
    I have done extra loft insulation in all my properties and replaced many old double glazing units (including doors), as well as fitting constant dehumidifiers and although this has made a big difference to the wellbeing of the tenants, heating bills and keeping my properties in better shape, it's not really as sufficient as it could be.
    I have had quotes for cavity wall insulation that are eye watering (that is only a piece of the insulation jigsaw) and I do not qualify for the Eco Gen external insulated cladding because if you own more than 2 properties (including the one you live in?!), you do not qualify. You are then classed as a business. So, businesses get no assistance in being energy efficient?!
    Else, I could get a grant and only pay £1200. Without any assistance, full cost is £11k+.
    £11k is over 2 years rental income in this part of the world. Add the usual repair, maintenance, insurance, annual boiler inspection, landlord registration fees, bad debt etc and I am looking at not getting that money back for 3 years. Multiply that across the properties I have and, well; do the maths. I have 3 rental properties.

    I can safely say that I have shelled out one third of my total rental income year on year with repairs, upgrades, maintenance and bad debt. Some govt; help would go a long way and in the next 5 years if this does not happen, I will be pulling out of the market.
    New boiler with 10 year warranties including fitting is £2800 (I have forked out for 2). Air source for rental properties without some form of grant? Forget it.
    When the new boilers are due for renewal and I cannot fit them because of legislation, I am out and out well before the deadline or I am facing owning properties that will l have less buyer appeal. This wouldn't happen in more urban areas.
    I am sure a lot of good landlords are in the same position.

    I am an inch from pulling out of the market anyway. If interest rates keep rising, I could sell up and invest elsewhere without all the hassle.

    Tenants in England don't have enough rights and tenants in Scotland have too many. They said this SNP government was anti-business, they certainly are.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,148
    You’d have probably been exempt under the rules that are due to come it and it sounds like you’ve done enough that your property would be at least C rated. Are you not able to replace the current boiler with gas up there until 2035 as it was previously?
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,625
    pinno said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    kingstongraham said:

    First.Aspect said:

    kingstongraham said:

    I think Starmer will be quite pleased if these changes are enacted before he gets in.

    Correct. Battery technology seems to be getting to a tipping point on range (see the recent stories about better electrodes and solid state electrolytes), at which point there will be a quick pivot by the buying public. This won't happen by 2030 though.

    2035 will also allow more time for non city charging to get better.

    I am less clear on the justification for putting back the ban on new gas and oil boilers through.
    The least justifiable is surely removing the requirement for landlords to provide energy efficient homes.
    Nothing is clear cut. That policy would just reduce the available rental accommodation and push rental prices up. Similarly anyone who stays as a landlord would pass on costs. I certainly wouldn't see the justification for distinguishing between rental and owner occupied though.
    Landlords who feel they can't afford to upgrade to a 'C' rating by the December 2028 deadline could apply for an exemption as follows:

    You can show quotes from three separate installers revealing that “the cost of purchasing and installing the cheapest recommended improvement exceeds £3,500 (including VAT)”. You must also provide confirmation that you are “satisfied that the measure(s) exceed this amount”. This is known as a ‘High cost’ Exemption and applies only to domestic property;

    You have already made all of the changes that could have been proposed in order to meet the regulations, and yet the property has still not achieved the desired rating.
    You can prove that a proposed wall or ceiling insulation system would be unsuitable for your building;

    The required improvements to the house in question require the consent of a third party, which has been refused;

    A RICS-qualified surveyor has informed you that any adjustments to the house – including changing the boiler, heating system, insulation or anything else – will reduce the buildings’ value;

    You have only started letting out rented property very recently (in which case, you may be granted a 6 month exemption).

    Hardly onerous especially if my reading of the first point is correct and you can apply if you have to fork out more than £3.5k inc. VAT to get up to a 'C' rating. It's not like 'C' is particularly onerous either. Part of being a landlord is having to spend money on keeping your asset to an acceptable standard, if landlords are leaving the market because of this I would question whether they are goof landlords to begin with.
    You two are making the mistake of using rational argument. A lot of private landlords will just get out of the market. This will push up prices. It doesn't take much to change sentiment, when being a private landlord is normally not all that worthwhile anyway.
    Would you want someone with that attitude as your landlord? As I've said on here a lot of times before, there are far too many 'property developers' out there who think it is money for old rope egged on by programmes like Homes Under The Hammer that make it seem like you buy a wreck at auction; chuck in a budget kitchen from Wickes, paint the walls and lay some grey carpets then watch the money roll in. If they aren't prepared to invest in basics like making the house energy efficient it makes you wonder what else they are skimping on.
    I would love to invest in decent insulation.
    I have done extra loft insulation in all my properties and replaced many old double glazing units (including doors), as well as fitting constant dehumidifiers and although this has made a big difference to the wellbeing of the tenants, heating bills and keeping my properties in better shape, it's not really as sufficient as it could be.
    I have had quotes for cavity wall insulation that are eye watering (that is only a piece of the insulation jigsaw) and I do not qualify for the Eco Gen external insulated cladding because if you own more than 2 properties (including the one you live in?!), you do not qualify. You are then classed as a business. So, businesses get no assistance in being energy efficient?!
    Else, I could get a grant and only pay £1200. Without any assistance, full cost is £11k+.
    £11k is over 2 years rental income in this part of the world. Add the usual repair, maintenance, insurance, annual boiler inspection, landlord registration fees, bad debt etc and I am looking at not getting that money back for 3 years. Multiply that across the properties I have and, well; do the maths. I have 3 rental properties.

    I can safely say that I have shelled out one third of my total rental income year on year with repairs, upgrades, maintenance and bad debt. Some govt; help would go a long way and in the next 5 years if this does not happen, I will be pulling out of the market.
    New boiler with 10 year warranties including fitting is £2800 (I have forked out for 2). Air source for rental properties without some form of grant? Forget it.
    When the new boilers are due for renewal and I cannot fit them because of legislation, I am out and out well before the deadline or I am facing owning properties that will l have less buyer appeal. This wouldn't happen in more urban areas.
    I am sure a lot of good landlords are in the same position.

    I am an inch from pulling out of the market anyway. If interest rates keep rising, I could sell up and invest elsewhere without all the hassle.

    Tenants in England don't have enough rights and tenants in Scotland have too many. They said this SNP government was anti-business, they certainly are.
    Is being a landlord your main job?
    _
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 60,598
    focuszing723 said:

    briantrumpet said:

    Emily Maitlis might have a point... Stevotories might think that this wafer-thin win means they can forget all that 'green stuff' and U-turn on their previous commitments, and indeed campaign on ungreen policies, but it might not be the winning gambit they think it is...

    Brain, you travel between two homes in different countries. How is that environmentally efficient?
    Yeah, we're not taking any lectures from eco hypocrites :smile:
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 60,598
    pinno said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    kingstongraham said:

    First.Aspect said:

    kingstongraham said:

    I think Starmer will be quite pleased if these changes are enacted before he gets in.

    Correct. Battery technology seems to be getting to a tipping point on range (see the recent stories about better electrodes and solid state electrolytes), at which point there will be a quick pivot by the buying public. This won't happen by 2030 though.

    2035 will also allow more time for non city charging to get better.

    I am less clear on the justification for putting back the ban on new gas and oil boilers through.
    The least justifiable is surely removing the requirement for landlords to provide energy efficient homes.
    Nothing is clear cut. That policy would just reduce the available rental accommodation and push rental prices up. Similarly anyone who stays as a landlord would pass on costs. I certainly wouldn't see the justification for distinguishing between rental and owner occupied though.
    Landlords who feel they can't afford to upgrade to a 'C' rating by the December 2028 deadline could apply for an exemption as follows:

    You can show quotes from three separate installers revealing that “the cost of purchasing and installing the cheapest recommended improvement exceeds £3,500 (including VAT)”. You must also provide confirmation that you are “satisfied that the measure(s) exceed this amount”. This is known as a ‘High cost’ Exemption and applies only to domestic property;

    You have already made all of the changes that could have been proposed in order to meet the regulations, and yet the property has still not achieved the desired rating.
    You can prove that a proposed wall or ceiling insulation system would be unsuitable for your building;

    The required improvements to the house in question require the consent of a third party, which has been refused;

    A RICS-qualified surveyor has informed you that any adjustments to the house – including changing the boiler, heating system, insulation or anything else – will reduce the buildings’ value;

    You have only started letting out rented property very recently (in which case, you may be granted a 6 month exemption).

    Hardly onerous especially if my reading of the first point is correct and you can apply if you have to fork out more than £3.5k inc. VAT to get up to a 'C' rating. It's not like 'C' is particularly onerous either. Part of being a landlord is having to spend money on keeping your asset to an acceptable standard, if landlords are leaving the market because of this I would question whether they are goof landlords to begin with.
    You two are making the mistake of using rational argument. A lot of private landlords will just get out of the market. This will push up prices. It doesn't take much to change sentiment, when being a private landlord is normally not all that worthwhile anyway.
    Would you want someone with that attitude as your landlord? As I've said on here a lot of times before, there are far too many 'property developers' out there who think it is money for old rope egged on by programmes like Homes Under The Hammer that make it seem like you buy a wreck at auction; chuck in a budget kitchen from Wickes, paint the walls and lay some grey carpets then watch the money roll in. If they aren't prepared to invest in basics like making the house energy efficient it makes you wonder what else they are skimping on.
    I would love to invest in decent insulation.
    I have done extra loft insulation in all my properties and replaced many old double glazing units (including doors), as well as fitting constant dehumidifiers and although this has made a big difference to the wellbeing of the tenants, heating bills and keeping my properties in better shape, it's not really as sufficient as it could be.
    I have had quotes for cavity wall insulation that are eye watering (that is only a piece of the insulation jigsaw) and I do not qualify for the Eco Gen external insulated cladding because if you own more than 2 properties (including the one you live in?!), you do not qualify. You are then classed as a business. So, businesses get no assistance in being energy efficient?!
    Else, I could get a grant and only pay £1200. Without any assistance, full cost is £11k+.
    £11k is over 2 years rental income in this part of the world. Add the usual repair, maintenance, insurance, annual boiler inspection, landlord registration fees, bad debt etc and I am looking at not getting that money back for 3 years. Multiply that across the properties I have and, well; do the maths. I have 3 rental properties.

    I can safely say that I have shelled out one third of my total rental income year on year with repairs, upgrades, maintenance and bad debt. Some govt; help would go a long way and in the next 5 years if this does not happen, I will be pulling out of the market.
    New boiler with 10 year warranties including fitting is £2800 (I have forked out for 2). Air source for rental properties without some form of grant? Forget it.
    When the new boilers are due for renewal and I cannot fit them because of legislation, I am out and out well before the deadline or I am facing owning properties that will l have less buyer appeal. This wouldn't happen in more urban areas.
    I am sure a lot of good landlords are in the same position.

    I am an inch from pulling out of the market anyway. If interest rates keep rising, I could sell up and invest elsewhere without all the hassle.

    Tenants in England don't have enough rights and tenants in Scotland have too many. They said this SNP government was anti-business, they certainly are.
    The realities of being a landlord and the realities of going eco. Probably quite an education for some people on here.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,625
    Stevo_666 said:



    The realities of being a landlord and the realities of going eco. Probably quite an education for some people on here.

    If you're too small a scale landlord to afford the necessary capex to make the country sustainable, I'd suggest getting out of the game.

    The reality of property ownership is that investment is going to be required in order to keep the buildings sustainable.

    Real estate produces roughly 30% of all emissions globally. Either suck it up or sell to someone who does have the capital spare.
    _

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