Seemingly trivial things that intrigue you

rick_chasey

First.Aspect said:

rick_chasey said:

First.Aspect said:

This includes listening to a bearded crackpot fiddler on YouTube rather than a reputable journalist.

I regularly get told on here that I put too much faith in the views and opinions of those more qualified than me (or indeed, anyone on the forum); I think you've held that criticism against me recently.

So where do you draw the line between that argument and this one?

My criticism of you is not believing something tweeted by the FT, it is more asserting it must be right because its been tweeted by the FT, rather than engaging in a discussion about problems with it.

I don't see the tension you do. By all means listen to what a beardy crackpot fiddler has to say, but weigh it based on the facts it relies on. If there's lots of hyperbole and no facts, ignore it. If there are facts at least try to assess for yourself what can be concluded from those facts. It's unlikely to be as drastic as the bearded ones suggest.

Same principles apply to mainstream news. And I include FT tweets in that.
.

I'm genuinely not having a go, just trying to understand.

On the ULEZ argument you felt that you knew better than the various researchers and policy experts and committees of various very qualified people, right?

It wasn't the FT, it was the actual policy makers and the comissioned research. No need to rake over the specifics of that, but in that instance you felt you knew better than they did, and even hinted at a conspiracy of raising money off the poorest.

So where do you draw the line between your own reasoning that runs against the consensus and and believing on experts?

First.Aspect

rick_chasey said:

First.Aspect said:

rick_chasey said:

First.Aspect said:

This includes listening to a bearded crackpot fiddler on YouTube rather than a reputable journalist.

I regularly get told on here that I put too much faith in the views and opinions of those more qualified than me (or indeed, anyone on the forum); I think you've held that criticism against me recently.

So where do you draw the line between that argument and this one?

My criticism of you is not believing something tweeted by the FT, it is more asserting it must be right because its been tweeted by the FT, rather than engaging in a discussion about problems with it.

I don't see the tension you do. By all means listen to what a beardy crackpot fiddler has to say, but weigh it based on the facts it relies on. If there's lots of hyperbole and no facts, ignore it. If there are facts at least try to assess for yourself what can be concluded from those facts. It's unlikely to be as drastic as the bearded ones suggest.

Same principles apply to mainstream news. And I include FT tweets in that.
.

I'm genuinely not having a go, just trying to understand.

On the ULEZ argument you felt that you knew better than the various researchers and policy experts and committees of various very qualified people, right?

It wasn't the FT, it was the actual policy makers and the comissioned research. No need to rake over the specifics of that, but in that instance you felt you knew better than they did, and even hinted at a conspiracy of raising money off the poorest.

So where do you draw the line between your own reasoning that runs against the consensus and and believing on experts?

It wasn't a conspiracy to raise money off the poorest, it was an observation that it would raise money and that this would disproportionately affect the poorest.

That's not in contention, but a lot of people think that's an acceptable consequence because of all the good it would do.

On the point of how much good it would do I pointed to research that contradicts the research the policy makers have selected and that specifically questions the magnitude of the causal link between the measurements taken (which are fairly objective) and health effects.

So, if you are arguing that a policy that hurts some people because it benefits others, you should probably be able to quantify that benefit. No one can.

The reality is that the policy is necessary to meet legal requirements, which are based on those spot air quality measurements. The debate we had was not me thinking I knew best, but me pointing two two groups of researchers who each think they know best, but who don't agree.

Objectively, based on my knowledge and experience, I simply don't know. Nor do you. And yet based on what appears to be a fairly arbitrary subset of literature, you are happy to ridicule any dissenting voice.

See my comment on climate change deniers above. It's the same dynamic.

Munsford0

briantrumpet said:

Wondering how old this brickwork is in my crumbly house, revealed by my removing some crumbly render where there seems to have been some water ingress over the years. (An expensive job coming up is to have all the non-breathable external render removed and replaced with a something more suited to brick & cob.)

What a beautiful palette of brickwork colours! have you posted it in the photography thread too?

I'm no expert, but that looks proper old innit.

Good work on having the render replaced

rjsterry

briantrumpet said:

Wondering how old this brickwork is in my crumbly house, revealed by my removing some crumbly render where there seems to have been some water ingress over the years. (An expensive job coming up is to have all the removed and replaced with a something more suited to brick & cob.)

😱😱

Get rid of that stuff ASAP. There are some absolute horror stories of cement rendered cobb, reverting to mud internally. The first people know is a bit of cracking in the render and then there's a big hole in the house and props everywhere.

Anyway, the bricks look pretty old (and damp) especially the smaller ones. There are quite a few building conservation guys on Twitter, who may be able to help.

https://x.com/DarrenMcLean_uk?t=5A3b47-ysnr41G9zDhEvKA&s=09

briantrumpet

rjsterry said:

briantrumpet said:

Wondering how old this brickwork is in my crumbly house, revealed by my removing some crumbly render where there seems to have been some water ingress over the years. (An expensive job coming up is to have all the removed and replaced with a something more suited to brick & cob.)

😱😱

Get rid of that stuff ASAP. There are some absolute horror stories of cement rendered cobb, reverting to mud internally. The first people know is a bit of cracking in the render and then there's a big hole in the house and props everywhere.

Anyway, the bricks look pretty old (and damp) especially the smaller ones. There are quite a few building conservation guys on Twitter, who may be able to help.

https://x.com/DarrenMcLean_uk?t=5A3b47-ysnr41G9zDhEvKA&s=09

Yep, I'm getting a quote from the (builder) son of the builder who did my kitchen 31 years ago, and has lots of experience of old Topsham buildings and cob, and I've already had a local structural engineer round whose speciality is cob... he was the one who said that the render needed replacing then limewashing (rather than painting), and has worked with the builder who will do te work, and said that when the old concrete render comes off to get him to check on what's underneath before it's re-rendered. I got him in initially, because he dealt with the cob house around the corner that lost an end wall (and was subsequently demolished), though he said that that was down to diagonal shearing of the cob, rather than settlement.

I suspect the brickwork is 17th-century, which is when Topsham was booming. I'd thought it was rubble under the render, which is why the brickwork brought a smile to my face when I saw it.

TheBigBean

Out of interest what are modern houses built out of and how are they protected against the elements?

Pross

I took the dogs for a walk up the normal lane this morning and there were two squashed frogs within 100m of each other which seemed odd on such a lightly trafficked road. I then had to do a site inspection on a new housing development in Wiltshire this afternoon and there was another on the quiet cul-de-sac estate road.

I’m used to seeing dozens of them flattened, usually two up with the male clamped to the female, in spring but not sure why there is this sudden autumn surge.

First.Aspect

TheBigBean said:

Out of interest what are modern houses built out of and how are they protected against the elements?

Cheese, and protected in the same way that modern supermarket cheese is entirely plastic.

TheBigBean

First.Aspect said:

TheBigBean said:

Out of interest what are modern houses built out of and how are they protected against the elements?

Cheese, and protected in the same way that modern supermarket cheese is entirely plastic.

From the moon or the cheddar sort?

First.Aspect

TheBigBean said:

First.Aspect said:

TheBigBean said:

Out of interest what are modern houses built out of and how are they protected against the elements?

Cheese, and protected in the same way that modern supermarket cheese is entirely plastic.

From the moon or the cheddar sort?

Cheddar. Completely waterproof. Also insulating.

rjsterry

briantrumpet said:

rjsterry said:

briantrumpet said:

Wondering how old this brickwork is in my crumbly house, revealed by my removing some crumbly render where there seems to have been some water ingress over the years. (An expensive job coming up is to have all the removed and replaced with a something more suited to brick & cob.)

😱😱

Get rid of that stuff ASAP. There are some absolute horror stories of cement rendered cobb, reverting to mud internally. The first people know is a bit of cracking in the render and then there's a big hole in the house and props everywhere.

Anyway, the bricks look pretty old (and damp) especially the smaller ones. There are quite a few building conservation guys on Twitter, who may be able to help.

https://x.com/DarrenMcLean_uk?t=5A3b47-ysnr41G9zDhEvKA&s=09

Yep, I'm getting a quote from the (builder) son of the builder who did my kitchen 31 years ago, and has lots of experience of old Topsham buildings and cob, and I've already had a local structural engineer round whose speciality is cob... he was the one who said that the render needed replacing then limewashing (rather than painting), and has worked with the builder who will do te work, and said that when the old concrete render comes off to get him to check on what's underneath before it's re-rendered. I got him in initially, because he dealt with the cob house around the corner that lost an end wall (and was subsequently demolished), though he said that that was down to diagonal shearing of the cob, rather than settlement.

I suspect the brickwork is 17th-century, which is when Topsham was booming. I'd thought it was rubble under the render, which is why the brickwork brought a smile to my face when I saw it.

Sounds good. Diagonal sheering sounds not good. 17th century would be pretty early but definitely possible. I think it was still a relatively expensive material then (compared with cobb anyway) but they do get used for chimneys first for fairly obvious reasons.

First.Aspect

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

rjsterry

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

First.Aspect

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

I've got a hat.

Question - as they are non load bearing and covered in render, is there a compelling reason to replace your dung and horsehair wall with another dung and horsehair wall?

First.Aspect

.

pangolin

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

I've got a hat.

Question - as they are non load bearing and covered in render, is there a compelling reason to replace your dung and horsehair wall with another dung and horsehair wall?

Probably because they were only recently covered in non breathable render

briantrumpet

rjsterry said:

briantrumpet said:

rjsterry said:

briantrumpet said:

Wondering how old this brickwork is in my crumbly house, revealed by my removing some crumbly render where there seems to have been some water ingress over the years. (An expensive job coming up is to have all the removed and replaced with a something more suited to brick & cob.)

😱😱

Get rid of that stuff ASAP. There are some absolute horror stories of cement rendered cobb, reverting to mud internally. The first people know is a bit of cracking in the render and then there's a big hole in the house and props everywhere.

Anyway, the bricks look pretty old (and damp) especially the smaller ones. There are quite a few building conservation guys on Twitter, who may be able to help.

https://x.com/DarrenMcLean_uk?t=5A3b47-ysnr41G9zDhEvKA&s=09

Yep, I'm getting a quote from the (builder) son of the builder who did my kitchen 31 years ago, and has lots of experience of old Topsham buildings and cob, and I've already had a local structural engineer round whose speciality is cob... he was the one who said that the render needed replacing then limewashing (rather than painting), and has worked with the builder who will do te work, and said that when the old concrete render comes off to get him to check on what's underneath before it's re-rendered. I got him in initially, because he dealt with the cob house around the corner that lost an end wall (and was subsequently demolished), though he said that that was down to diagonal shearing of the cob, rather than settlement.

I suspect the brickwork is 17th-century, which is when Topsham was booming. I'd thought it was rubble under the render, which is why the brickwork brought a smile to my face when I saw it.

Sounds good. Diagonal sheering sounds not good. 17th century would be pretty early but definitely possible. I think it was still a relatively expensive material then (compared with cobb anyway) but they do get used for chimneys first for fairly obvious reasons.

There's a lot of 17th-century brick in Topsham, thanks to the merchants who had made Topsham the more important port than Topsham (before the Exeter Ship Canal was built). As I'm sure you know, cob needs a solid base up from ground level, but often it's stone rubble, hence my surprise at the brick.

rjsterry

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

I've got a hat.

Question - as they are non load bearing and covered in render, is there a compelling reason to replace your dung and horsehair wall with another dung and horsehair wall?

Ideally you want to leave it alone. Just peel off the cement render and replace with limewash. So long as it's kept reasonably dry it's fine. The render traps moisture, so is bad news for any permeable construction.

First.Aspect

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

I've got a hat.

Question - as they are non load bearing and covered in render, is there a compelling reason to replace your dung and horsehair wall with another dung and horsehair wall?

Ideally you want to leave it alone. Just peel off the cement render and replace with limewash. So long as it's kept reasonably dry it's fine. The render traps moisture, so bad news.

I get that bit, but I mean if its turned back into mud and needs replacing.

briantrumpet

pangolin said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

I've got a hat.

Question - as they are non load bearing and covered in render, is there a compelling reason to replace your dung and horsehair wall with another dung and horsehair wall?

Probably because they were only recently covered in non breathable render

Yes, that's what I would assume. Next two are even pebble-dashed on top of what I've got.

rjsterry

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

I've got a hat.

Question - as they are non load bearing and covered in render, is there a compelling reason to replace your dung and horsehair wall with another dung and horsehair wall?

Ideally you want to leave it alone. Just peel off the cement render and replace with limewash. So long as it's kept reasonably dry it's fine. The render traps moisture, so bad news.

I get that bit, but I mean if its turned back into mud and needs replacing.

Tricky to have lots of different types of construction in one small building. If you replaced in something other than Cobb what would it be? Stone or brick would probably be too rigid and would be heavier so need new foundations. Trying to dig those next to an old cobb wall will be tricky and then you may start to get differential settlement and so on.

First.Aspect

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

I've got a hat.

Question - as they are non load bearing and covered in render, is there a compelling reason to replace your dung and horsehair wall with another dung and horsehair wall?

Ideally you want to leave it alone. Just peel off the cement render and replace with limewash. So long as it's kept reasonably dry it's fine. The render traps moisture, so bad news.

I get that bit, but I mean if its turned back into mud and needs replacing.

Tricky to have lots of different types of construction in one small building. If you replaced in something other than Cobb what would it be? Stone or brick would probably be too rigid and would be heavier so need new foundations. Trying to dig those next to an old cobb wall will be tricky and then you may start to get differential settlement and so on.

I thought breeze ocks were the solution to that sort of thing?

Shows what I know. Dung it is then Brian.

briantrumpet

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

I've got a hat.

Question - as they are non load bearing and covered in render, is there a compelling reason to replace your dung and horsehair wall with another dung and horsehair wall?

Ideally you want to leave it alone. Just peel off the cement render and replace with limewash. So long as it's kept reasonably dry it's fine. The render traps moisture, so bad news.

I get that bit, but I mean if its turned back into mud and needs replacing.

Tricky to have lots of different types of construction in one small building. If you replaced in something other than Cobb what would it be? Stone or brick would probably be too rigid and would be heavier so need new foundations. Trying to dig those next to an old cobb wall will be tricky and then you may start to get differential settlement and so on.

I thought breeze ocks were the solution to that sort of thing?

Shows what I know. Dung it is then Brian.

It's also incumbent upon me not to let my mud hut (with nice old bricks - which are also mud, I suppose) fall into the road, as I would block the entrance to two houses and about five garages, which would have nowhere else to go... my front wall is on the road (literally - no pavement even), and the entire road is slightly wider than a transit van. I wouldn't mind some rustic buttresses, but they'd block the road.

They didn't build Topsham for cars, that's for sure. This is my street in the 1940s, I think. With a car.

briantrumpet

One of my ex-pupils is the son of a well-known cob builder in East Devon (RJS will probably have clocked him in Grand Designs), and it's amazing stuff.

First.Aspect

briantrumpet said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

First.Aspect said:

So I just looked up cob bricks. It's basically mud.

Okay, clay. With some grass in it. And they probably dry it out first.

Brian - have you got a garden? I think I may have a solution for you.

You missed out cowshit. It's true that getting hold of the materials is easy. The skills for building it into a wall are a bit rarer.

I've got a hat.

Question - as they are non load bearing and covered in render, is there a compelling reason to replace your dung and horsehair wall with another dung and horsehair wall?

Ideally you want to leave it alone. Just peel off the cement render and replace with limewash. So long as it's kept reasonably dry it's fine. The render traps moisture, so bad news.

I get that bit, but I mean if its turned back into mud and needs replacing.

Tricky to have lots of different types of construction in one small building. If you replaced in something other than Cobb what would it be? Stone or brick would probably be too rigid and would be heavier so need new foundations. Trying to dig those next to an old cobb wall will be tricky and then you may start to get differential settlement and so on.

I thought breeze ocks were the solution to that sort of thing?

Shows what I know. Dung it is then Brian.

It's also incumbent upon me not to let my mud hut (with nice old bricks - which are also mud, I suppose) fall into the road, as I would block the entrance to two houses and about five garages, which would have nowhere else to go... my front wall is on the road (literally - no pavement even), and the entire road is slightly wider than a transit van. I wouldn't mind some rustic buttresses, but they'd block the road.

They didn't build Topsham for cars, that's for sure. This is my street in the 1940s, I think. With a car.

And you even still have the same car.

Pross

The stealth fighter that crashed (and has now been found in bits) apparently flew on auto-pilot for a couple of hours after the pilot ejected. Why did the pilot eject? Surely they could have found somewhere to land it safely if it was able to continue to fly for 2 hours rather than just leaving it cruising around the sky on its own and risk it crashing into people?

wilberforce

Pross said:

The stealth fighter that crashed (and has now been found in bits) apparently flew on auto-pilot for a couple of hours after the pilot ejected. Why did the pilot eject? Surely they could have found somewhere to land it safely if it was able to continue to fly for 2 hours rather than just leaving it cruising around the sky on its own and risk it crashing into people?

They are currently describing the issue as a "mishap" and also identified the squadron it was from as a training squadron.

........ mmmmmmm, I wonder what this handle does??

orraloon

Who knew that R Brand (he of the max news headlining / c-baiting the now) was a self entitled, misogynistic wee tadger?

Now then, where's Spaffer's phone? And where is 'Baroness' Michelle Money Money Money?

webboo

Given King Charles is being warmly received on his visit to France. Would this be an appropriate time to reclaim it.

First.Aspect

webboo said:

Given King Charles is being warmly received on his visit to France. Would this be an appropriate time to reclaim it.

Think you have this the wrong way around.