LEAVE the Conservative Party and save your country!

rjsterry

🙄

kingstongraham

Stevo_666 said:

briantrumpet said:

Stevo_666 said:

briantrumpet said:

I missed "Yebbut Rick". Sorry.

What's up Brian, not enjoying the thought of quarantine and feel like having a go?

Not too bothered about quarantine,especially as I'm having a fantastic time here in the French sun. But debate is tiresome when the stock response is deflection. Which you've just done again.

Some call it debate, others might call it a half arsed attempt at interrogation. I can tell the difference and react accordingly. Maybe you should learn to tell the difference as well.

I am genuinely interested in the thoughts of a Conservative supporter on this.

briantrumpet

kingstongraham said:

Stevo_666 said:

briantrumpet said:

Stevo_666 said:

briantrumpet said:

I missed "Yebbut Rick". Sorry.

What's up Brian, not enjoying the thought of quarantine and feel like having a go?

Not too bothered about quarantine,especially as I'm having a fantastic time here in the French sun. But debate is tiresome when the stock response is deflection. Which you've just done again.

Some call it debate, others might call it a half arsed attempt at interrogation. I can tell the difference and react accordingly. Maybe you should learn to tell the difference as well.

I am genuinely interested in the thoughts of a Conservative supporter on this.

So am I. Which is why it's a pity we're just getting deflection.

kingstongraham

(Even a Conservative supporter who ticked a box saying "I support the aims and values of the Labour party".)

bompington

kingstongraham said:

Stevo_666 said:

briantrumpet said:

Stevo_666 said:

briantrumpet said:

I missed "Yebbut Rick". Sorry.

What's up Brian, not enjoying the thought of quarantine and feel like having a go?

Not too bothered about quarantine,especially as I'm having a fantastic time here in the French sun. But debate is tiresome when the stock response is deflection. Which you've just done again.

Some call it debate, others might call it a half arsed attempt at interrogation. I can tell the difference and react accordingly. Maybe you should learn to tell the difference as well.

I am genuinely interested in the thoughts of a Conservative supporter on this.

I think I count as a conservative supporter: I am in favour of free markets, minimal government, giving people opportunities to make their own way, heck, even traditional moral values.

Unfortunately the conservative party doesn't seem to support much of this any more. They don't appear to have any ideological platform at all apart from a vaguely defined but viciously implememented nationalism, and their actions are starting to look more and more statist - something that may be necessary in terms of COVID emergency policies, but certainly not the total censored-up of exam grades. I'd have expected the soviet style statistical adjustment from the SNP, the European champions of ill-thought out nanny statism: seeing it come from the tories is the final straw to convince me that it is no longer the Conservative Party at all.


So what to make of Stevo's tiresome deflection and 40,000-odd other cheap "debating" tricks?

I really can't see the motivation for it in terms of loyalty to policies, ideas or even people - after all, the tories are now Cummings's b!tch, not Johnson's, still less Thatcher's, Cameron's, Major's, Churchill's, or Disraeli's party....

They're reduced to Cummings's "genius" interventions, Boris's shallowness, flightiness and lies, and their support in the country doesn't look like much more than a bunch of internet trolls trying to own the libs.

coopster_the_1st

kingstongraham said:

Stevo_666 said:

briantrumpet said:

Stevo_666 said:

briantrumpet said:

I missed "Yebbut Rick". Sorry.

What's up Brian, not enjoying the thought of quarantine and feel like having a go?

Not too bothered about quarantine,especially as I'm having a fantastic time here in the French sun. But debate is tiresome when the stock response is deflection. Which you've just done again.

Some call it debate, others might call it a half arsed attempt at interrogation. I can tell the difference and react accordingly. Maybe you should learn to tell the difference as well.

I am genuinely interested in the thoughts of a Conservative supporter on this.

As a Conservative supporter and voter:

An absolute c0ck-up from the point of cancelling exams, to 'trusting' the teaching profession to be professional when predicting grades, to expecting a public sector quango to be up to the job of doing their bit correctly.

Personally, I would caveat a students grade uplift back to their teachers prediction by saying they have to sit the exam and get within a grade of the prediction to keep that predicted grade, otherwise they get the original grade and teacher goes on an investigation list.

However, it goes right back to the start regarding taking pragmatic, not panic decisions. Exams should never have been cancelled. By their nature, exam halls are socially distanced and the students would have got an additional month of study leave. There would not be much of the course left to teach and that could have been completed remotely if needed.

I don't think the Conservatives have done any worse on this than any other party as I see no party that would have taken the correct decision at the start. Which is the only way to head off the rest of what occurred.

Stevo_666

As I've said before, whinging with no better alternative is a bit pointless. But that is often the way on here.

That said, not sure what good it will do to get me to say something when all the wannabe interrogators have already made up their minds.

rjsterry

There were lots of better alternatives within the party. Lots.

TheBigBean

rjsterry said:

There were lots of better alternatives within the party. Lots.

Not ones that would deliver a majority of 80 though.

rick_chasey

TheBigBean said:

rjsterry said:

There were lots of better alternatives within the party. Lots.

Not ones that would deliver a majority of 80 though.

Johnson can be a leader who doesn't do much and entertains the public if he'd just put some good people around him.

No-one, and I mean no-one, expects Johnson to be some Gordon Brown, all over the details type.

That's fine. Everyone leads differently. But have the good grace to have some good quality ministers around you.

morstar

rick_chasey said:

TheBigBean said:

rjsterry said:

There were lots of better alternatives within the party. Lots.

Not ones that would deliver a majority of 80 though.

Johnson can be a leader who doesn't do much and entertains the public if he'd just put some good people around him.

No-one, and I mean no-one, expects Johnson to be some Gordon Brown, all over the details type.

That's fine. Everyone leads differently. But have the good grace to have some good quality ministers around you.

Fair comment. He thinks he only needs one though. That is the problem.

rjsterry

TheBigBean said:

rjsterry said:

There were lots of better alternatives within the party. Lots.

Not ones that would deliver a majority of 80 though.

As RC points out this need not just relate to the PM.

briantrumpet

Stevo_666 said:

As I've said before, whinging with no better alternative is a bit pointless.

You dismiss all criticism of your 'team' as whinging, but as I've pointed out several times before, if an argument has merit, it can withstand criticism, and if the criticisms have merit, then good politicians will take them on board to improve outcomes, rather than just dismissing them as whinging. It's as lame as screaming 'fake news'.

kingstongraham

Stevo_666 said:

As I've said before, whinging with no better alternative is a bit pointless. But that is often the way on here.

That said, not sure what good it will do to get me to say something when all the wannabe interrogators have already made up their minds.

I mentioned some alternatives before, but they're irrelevant now, surely?

At the moment, I'd mostly prefer the incumbents to do the things they end up doing, but right first time.

tailwindhome

While I appreciate it causes other complications, it seems to me that an outcome which gives a group of kids an opportunity they 'didn't deserve' is more desirable than an outcome which denies another group of kids an opportunity they did.

tailwindhome

coopster_the_1st said:

Personally, I would caveat a students grade uplift back to their teachers prediction by saying they have to sit the exam and get within a grade of the prediction to keep that predicted grade, otherwise they get the original grade and teacher goes on an investigation list.

Do you ever read this shit back to yourself?

tailwindhome

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

rick_chasey

tailwindhome said:

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

I can't imagine someone like Coopster being anything but loved by his teachers, so the antipathy seems rather far fetched.....

coopster_the_1st

tailwindhome said:

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

If the student thinks an A is correct, and your teacher thinks you would have got an A, getting a B will be easy. Or you and the teacher get found out for scamming the system. Will quickly bring integrity back into the system which right now is seriously lacking.

The worst case is the student resits the year and get the grade they deserved, rather than having the grading undermined for this year.

But hey, I believe in the achievement and having to work for it. The opposite to you who would give all students A* because the little darlings have had a 'tough' few months sitting around doing nothing.

rick_chasey

So what did you get at A level Coop?

Had figured that whole saga was too elitist for someone like you in the real world.

tailwindhome

coopster_the_1st said:

tailwindhome said:

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

If the student thinks an A is correct, and your teacher thinks you would have got an A, getting a B will be easy. Or you and the teacher get found out for scamming the system. Will quickly bring integrity back into the system which right now is seriously lacking.

The worst case is the student resits the year and get the grade they deserved, rather than having the grading undermined for this year.

But hey, I believe in the achievement and having to work for it. The opposite to you who would give all students A* because the little darlings have had a 'tough' few months sitting around doing nothing.

This is about owning the libs again, isn't it?

tailwindhome

coopster_the_1st said:

tailwindhome said:

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

If the student thinks an A is correct, and your teacher thinks you would have got an A, getting a B will be easy. Or you and the teacher get found out for scamming the system. Will quickly bring integrity back into the system which right now is seriously lacking.

The worst case is the student resits the year and get the grade they deserved, rather than having the grading undermined for this year.

But hey, I believe in the achievement and having to work for it. The opposite to you who would give all students A* because the little darlings have had a 'tough' few months sitting around doing nothing.

Amazing how quickly the 'red wall' voting Boris to stick one to the elites to level up the country for the disadvantaged reverts to fuck em' they don't deserve it.

rick_chasey

tailwindhome said:

coopster_the_1st said:

tailwindhome said:

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

If the student thinks an A is correct, and your teacher thinks you would have got an A, getting a B will be easy. Or you and the teacher get found out for scamming the system. Will quickly bring integrity back into the system which right now is seriously lacking.

The worst case is the student resits the year and get the grade they deserved, rather than having the grading undermined for this year.

But hey, I believe in the achievement and having to work for it. The opposite to you who would give all students A* because the little darlings have had a 'tough' few months sitting around doing nothing.

This is about owning the libs again, isn't it?

Aside from the fact that if you are an A student, getting a B is probably harder than getting an A as you'd have to throw just the right number of marks .

coopster_the_1st

tailwindhome said:

coopster_the_1st said:

tailwindhome said:

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

If the student thinks an A is correct, and your teacher thinks you would have got an A, getting a B will be easy. Or you and the teacher get found out for scamming the system. Will quickly bring integrity back into the system which right now is seriously lacking.

The worst case is the student resits the year and get the grade they deserved, rather than having the grading undermined for this year.

But hey, I believe in the achievement and having to work for it. The opposite to you who would give all students A* because the little darlings have had a 'tough' few months sitting around doing nothing.

This is about owning the libs again, isn't it?

That chip must be weighing heavily on your shoulder...

This is about integrity in the system and gives a reality check to all those who are trying to cheat it. It would quickly uncover those who are blagging it!

kingstongraham

coopster_the_1st said:

tailwindhome said:

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

If the student thinks an A is correct, and your teacher thinks you would have got an A, getting a B will be easy. Or you and the teacher get found out for scamming the system. Will quickly bring integrity back into the system which right now is seriously lacking.

The worst case is the student resits the year and get the grade they deserved, rather than having the grading undermined for this year.

But hey, I believe in the achievement and having to work for it. The opposite to you who would give all students A* because the little darlings have had a 'tough' few months sitting around doing nothing.

Best way to for a student to spend their first month at university would be preparing for an A-level. And if they don't do well in the A-level, they have to leave university and go back to school. Can't see any issues that causes anyone regarding the university place, fees, accommodation, school, or what they were supposed to be studying at university if they actually get the grade. Nice one.

But actually, you are underestimating things. This should apply to every student, as the algorithm could have been wrong even when it agreed with the teacher.

rick_chasey

I feel Coopster doesn't really know what uni is like...

tailwindhome

coopster_the_1st said:

tailwindhome said:

coopster_the_1st said:

tailwindhome said:

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

If the student thinks an A is correct, and your teacher thinks you would have got an A, getting a B will be easy. Or you and the teacher get found out for scamming the system. Will quickly bring integrity back into the system which right now is seriously lacking.

The worst case is the student resits the year and get the grade they deserved, rather than having the grading undermined for this year.

But hey, I believe in the achievement and having to work for it. The opposite to you who would give all students A* because the little darlings have had a 'tough' few months sitting around doing nothing.

This is about owning the libs again, isn't it?

That chip must be weighing heavily on your shoulder...

This is about integrity in the system and gives a reality check to all those who are trying to cheat it. It would quickly uncover those who are blagging it!

oh,mate

TheBigBean

tailwindhome said:

While I appreciate it causes other complications, it seems to me that an outcome which gives a group of kids an opportunity they 'didn't deserve' is more desirable than an outcome which denies another group of kids an opportunity they did.

If there is the same number of opportunities, I'm not sure that is correct is it? Anyone with a pessimistic teacher who was awarded BBB is going to have people saying that they couldn't even get As in 2020 and therefore they must be useless. In this case, the lost opportunity is harder to tweet about, but still exists.

coopster_the_1st

kingstongraham said:

coopster_the_1st said:

tailwindhome said:

No pressure, you've got an A, but you're doing the exam anyway, and if you don't get at least a B we're investigating your teacher.

If the student thinks an A is correct, and your teacher thinks you would have got an A, getting a B will be easy. Or you and the teacher get found out for scamming the system. Will quickly bring integrity back into the system which right now is seriously lacking.

The worst case is the student resits the year and get the grade they deserved, rather than having the grading undermined for this year.

But hey, I believe in the achievement and having to work for it. The opposite to you who would give all students A* because the little darlings have had a 'tough' few months sitting around doing nothing.

Best way to for a student to spend their first month at university would be preparing for an A-level. And if they don't do well in the A-level, they have to leave university and go back to school. Can't see any issues that causes anyone regarding the university place, fees, accommodation, school, or what they were supposed to be studying at university if they actually get the grade. Nice one.

But actually, you are underestimating things. This should apply to every student, as the algorithm could have been wrong even when it agreed with the teacher.

Why would they not be preparing now? Exam in 2-3 weeks ahead of Uni starting.

Does not need to be everyone, just the ones that feel their grade is wrong. Will identify those teachers and students who have been trying to blag it! We both know this would sort the wheat from the chaff before the day of the exams.

rjsterry

rick_chasey said:

I feel Coopster doesn't really know what uni is like...

He's said as much himself.