Boris Johnson's Burkha Comments

Ben6899

I'm out, mate.

Who decides what you're mocking, the religious choice or the ethnicity?

Jesus wept.

nickice

Ben6899 wrote:

I'm out, mate.

Who decides what you're mocking, the religious choice or the ethnicity?

Jesus wept.

I don't know why this is that difficult to be honest. If you start giving the usual stereotypes that Jews are tight, they run the World etc. that's antisemitic. If you say Judaism is clearly nonsense, it's not antisemitic. In fact, you'll find a lot of Jewish comedians do the latter but not the former.

Ben6899

nickice wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

I'm out, mate.

Who decides what you're mocking, the religious choice or the ethnicity?

Jesus wept.

I don't know why this is that difficult to be honest. If you start giving the usual stereotypes that Jews are tight, they run the World etc. that's antisemitic. If you say Judaism is clearly nonsense, it's not antisemitic. In fact, you'll find a lot of Jewish comedians do the latter but not the former.

And a lot of black comedians use the "N" word, but I'm not going there.

nickice

Ben6899 wrote:

nickice wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

I'm out, mate.

Who decides what you're mocking, the religious choice or the ethnicity?

Jesus wept.

I don't know why this is that difficult to be honest. If you start giving the usual stereotypes that Jews are tight, they run the World etc. that's antisemitic. If you say Judaism is clearly nonsense, it's not antisemitic. In fact, you'll find a lot of Jewish comedians do the latter but not the former.

And a lot of black comedians use the "N" word, but I'm not going there.

Which would be mocking ethnicity not beliefs. That was my point entirely...

Ben6899

Look. No one should be mocking Judaism and then saying "hey I was mocking the belief system, not the ethnicity!" as a defence. Whether it's the truth or not. Just don't go there.

And, FWIW, I don't think "mocking ethnicity" really does justice to using the "N" word.

nickice

Ben6899 wrote:

Look. No one should be mocking Judaism and then saying "hey I was mocking the belief system, not the ethnicity!" as a defence. Whether it's the truth or not. Just don't go there.

And, FWIW, I don't think "mocking ethnicity" really does justice to using the "N" word.

So Judaism is protected? Got you. What other religions are protected from criticism? I don't really mock any religions but I'd be curious to see your reasoning behind that.

And most people mocking Christianity tend to at least partly be mocking Judaism and Islam considering many of the texts and stories are largely similar. Any comedian who mocks the story of creation, for example.

Ben6899

Totally misinterpreting what I said, but fair enough.

nickice

Ben6899 wrote:

Totally misinterpreting what I said, but fair enough.

What was the misinterpretation?

coopster_the_1st

Ben6899 wrote:

nickice wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

In one post you recognise that being Jewish is about one's ethnicity and culture just as much as (more?) the religious element.

But you also say mocking orthodox Jewish traditions shouldn't be taboo because you wouldn't be mocking someone's ethnicity.

You don't have the religious element without the ethnicity. That's the one thing that's common to almost all Jews. Judaism is just a set of beliefs. Most Jews are secular and very few are orthodox.

So if you mock Judaism, you're probably mocking someone who is ethnically Jewish.

Am I going mad here? Someone neutral to this sub-discussion (not FishFish or Coopster) please chip in either way.

You seem very animated regarding the mocking of Jews but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

surrey_commuter

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

nickice wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

In one post you recognise that being Jewish is about one's ethnicity and culture just as much as (more?) the religious element.

But you also say mocking orthodox Jewish traditions shouldn't be taboo because you wouldn't be mocking someone's ethnicity.

You don't have the religious element without the ethnicity. That's the one thing that's common to almost all Jews. Judaism is just a set of beliefs. Most Jews are secular and very few are orthodox.

So if you mock Judaism, you're probably mocking someone who is ethnically Jewish.

Am I going mad here? Someone neutral to this sub-discussion (not FishFish or Coopster) please chip in either way.

You seem very animated regarding the mocking of Jews but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

Why not give us one example of the news being suppressed

coopster_the_1st

Surrey Commuter wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

nickice wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

In one post you recognise that being Jewish is about one's ethnicity and culture just as much as (more?) the religious element.

But you also say mocking orthodox Jewish traditions shouldn't be taboo because you wouldn't be mocking someone's ethnicity.

You don't have the religious element without the ethnicity. That's the one thing that's common to almost all Jews. Judaism is just a set of beliefs. Most Jews are secular and very few are orthodox.

So if you mock Judaism, you're probably mocking someone who is ethnically Jewish.

Am I going mad here? Someone neutral to this sub-discussion (not FishFish or Coopster) please chip in either way.

You seem very animated regarding the mocking of Jews but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

Why not give us one example of the news being suppressed

I already did. Read the thread!

rjsterry

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Surrey Commuter wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

nickice wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

In one post you recognise that being Jewish is about one's ethnicity and culture just as much as (more?) the religious element.

But you also say mocking orthodox Jewish traditions shouldn't be taboo because you wouldn't be mocking someone's ethnicity.

You don't have the religious element without the ethnicity. That's the one thing that's common to almost all Jews. Judaism is just a set of beliefs. Most Jews are secular and very few are orthodox.

So if you mock Judaism, you're probably mocking someone who is ethnically Jewish.

Am I going mad here? Someone neutral to this sub-discussion (not FishFish or Coopster) please chip in either way.

You seem very animated regarding the mocking of Jews but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

Why not give us one example of the news being suppressed

I already did. Read the thread!

Whoever is trying to suppress the news is doing a really bad job. I mean there are various studies of the issue in the public domain and endless reports on a variety of local and national news sites.

Ben6899

Coopster the 1st wrote:

You... are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

I'd like you to retract that accusation, please.

1. It's not being suppressed.
2. If it genuinely was being suppressed, then I'd be pretty angered by that for the obvious reasons.

You'll be calling me a terrorist sympathiser next.

coopster_the_1st

rjsterry wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Surrey Commuter wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

nickice wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

In one post you recognise that being Jewish is about one's ethnicity and culture just as much as (more?) the religious element.

But you also say mocking orthodox Jewish traditions shouldn't be taboo because you wouldn't be mocking someone's ethnicity.

You don't have the religious element without the ethnicity. That's the one thing that's common to almost all Jews. Judaism is just a set of beliefs. Most Jews are secular and very few are orthodox.

So if you mock Judaism, you're probably mocking someone who is ethnically Jewish.

Am I going mad here? Someone neutral to this sub-discussion (not FishFish or Coopster) please chip in either way.

You seem very animated regarding the mocking of Jews but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

Why not give us one example of the news being suppressed

I already did. Read the thread!

Whoever is trying to suppress the news is doing a really bad job. I mean there are various studies of the issue in the public domain and endless reports on a variety of local and national news sites.

Really? KingstonGraham who is one of the better forumites on here thought this was just the old news story with more Pakistani men implicated

These pedophile Pakistani gangs are being protected by the media under the fear of the racism card.

Are you saying that of this was 31 men of white British origin that this would be hushed up in the same way?

coopster_the_1st

Ben6899 wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

You... are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

I'd like you to retract that accusation, please.

1. It's not being suppressed.
2. If it genuinely was being suppressed, then I'd be pretty angered by that for the obvious reasons.

You'll be calling me a terrorist sympathiser next.

You are not a terrorist sympathiser although you can be sure I will call you out on that if it were the case.

On the other point, if the cap fits...

Ben6899

Great this, isn't it. I swear at you and get a board warning. You say I'm happy that news about paedophiles is suppressed and everything just carries on as if nothing happened...

DeVlaeminck

Ben6899 wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

You... are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

I'd like you to retract that accusation, please.

1. It's not being suppressed.
2. If it genuinely was being suppressed, then I'd be pretty angered by that for the obvious reasons.

You'll be calling me a terrorist sympathiser next.

One example would be West Yorkshire police asking Ch4 not to screen the Edge of the City documentary in 2004. Ch4 actually complied though they did screen it later that year.

rjsterry

Coopster the 1st wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Surrey Commuter wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

nickice wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

In one post you recognise that being Jewish is about one's ethnicity and culture just as much as (more?) the religious element.

But you also say mocking orthodox Jewish traditions shouldn't be taboo because you wouldn't be mocking someone's ethnicity.

You don't have the religious element without the ethnicity. That's the one thing that's common to almost all Jews. Judaism is just a set of beliefs. Most Jews are secular and very few are orthodox.

So if you mock Judaism, you're probably mocking someone who is ethnically Jewish.

Am I going mad here? Someone neutral to this sub-discussion (not FishFish or Coopster) please chip in either way.

You seem very animated regarding the mocking of Jews but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

Why not give us one example of the news being suppressed

I already did. Read the thread!

Whoever is trying to suppress the news is doing a really bad job. I mean there are various studies of the issue in the public domain and endless reports on a variety of local and national news sites.

Really? KingstonGraham who is one of the better forumites on here thought this was just the old news story with more Pakistani men implicated

These pedophile Pakistani gangs are being protected by the media under the fear of the racism card.

Are you saying that of this was 31 men of white British origin that this would be hushed up in the same way?

Well, I don't believe it is being hushed up, so the question is moot. If you're only evidence is that KG wasn't aware of the particular case you mentioned, then I'll stick to my previous point.

Reporting restrictions to avoid jeopardising a trial is not suppression.

veronese68

Coopster the 1st wrote:

... but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

He has never said anything like that.

rjsterry

Veronese68 wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

... but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

He has never said anything like that.

More to the point, what has any of this to do with Johnson's comments?

veronese68

rjsterry wrote:

Veronese68 wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

... but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

He has never said anything like that.

More to the point, what has any of this to do with Johnson's comments?

Nothing at all, but some people are like children and their only defence is "yeah but the left did this and it's wrong too." The fact that it was reported well enough that it's common knowledge doesn't fit with Coopster's agenda so he's ignoring it.

kingstongraham

Coopster the 1st wrote:

KingstonGraham wrote:

Are we talking about the story that has been reported on several times over the past few years whenever there are more arrests/charges?

And this comment proves my point precisely.

They are completely different stories in separate locations. Rotherham, Telford & now Huddersfield this week and there are plenty more but you have to go looking for them. Same MO, which is a large group of Pakistani men groom, abuse and rape vulnerable young girls, many of the girls being under 16 when it starts.

Pakistani men make up less than 2% of the population but are way over represented in recent cases where gangs groom, abuse and rape young girls yet the media, police and authorities ignore this because racism now provides a convenient cover for the crimes to take place.

No, my comment does not prove your point at all. The Huddersfield story has been reported on over the last few years when there are more arrests/charges. I did not mean the other places. That was your connection.

2016: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-36810230

2017: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-39368278

2017: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-40666160

2018: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-45193514

kingstongraham

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Really? KingstonGraham who is one of the better forumites on here thought this was just the old news story with more Pakistani men implicated

No I didn't. I thought it was the continuation of the Huddersfield inquiry, which it is.

coopster_the_1st

KingstonGraham wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

KingstonGraham wrote:

Are we talking about the story that has been reported on several times over the past few years whenever there are more arrests/charges?

And this comment proves my point precisely.

They are completely different stories in separate locations. Rotherham, Telford & now Huddersfield this week and there are plenty more but you have to go looking for them. Same MO, which is a large group of Pakistani men groom, abuse and rape vulnerable young girls, many of the girls being under 16 when it starts.

Pakistani men make up less than 2% of the population but are way over represented in recent cases where gangs groom, abuse and rape young girls yet the media, police and authorities ignore this because racism now provides a convenient cover for the crimes to take place.

No, my comment does not prove your point at all. The Huddersfield story has been reported on over the last few years when there are more arrests/charges. I did not mean the other places. That was your connection.

2016: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-36810230

2017: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-39368278

2017: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-40666160

2018: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-45193514

Wow, all those stories in Hudderfield alone, yet no scandal, outrage or investigation into the underlying causes of this. You were aware of this and much more media savvy that I gave you credit for. I take back what I said about you but still

In the recent Telford paedophile scandal, there was never any reference to what was going on in Huddersfield, it was so well hushed up. Telford was only brought to mainstream media's attention by the Sunday Mirror and this follow-up tweet from Andrew Neil:

https://twitter.com/afneil/status/973282765226602497?lang=en

This thread sums the situation up perfectly.

Boris compared wearers of the burka to looking like a letter box and it is headline news for a week with the faux outrage demonstrated on this thread.

Hundreds and thousands of young girls get groomed, raped and abused by gangs of paedophile Pakistani men and the news is hushed up by the majority of the mainstream media with no comment from most of the previous faux outraged on this site.

Many on this site need to take a good look at themselves and sort their priorities out, as they are the part of the problem and the continued suppression of this type of story is only leading to the increased influence of those to the far right of politics.

surrey_commuter

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Surrey Commuter wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

nickice wrote:

Ben6899 wrote:

In one post you recognise that being Jewish is about one's ethnicity and culture just as much as (more?) the religious element.

But you also say mocking orthodox Jewish traditions shouldn't be taboo because you wouldn't be mocking someone's ethnicity.

You don't have the religious element without the ethnicity. That's the one thing that's common to almost all Jews. Judaism is just a set of beliefs. Most Jews are secular and very few are orthodox.

So if you mock Judaism, you're probably mocking someone who is ethnically Jewish.

Am I going mad here? Someone neutral to this sub-discussion (not FishFish or Coopster) please chip in either way.

You seem very animated regarding the mocking of Jews but are happy to facilitate the suppression of news of gangs of paedophile Pakistani men grooming, raping and abuse girls in many places across the UK.

Why not give us one example of the news being suppressed

I already did. Read the thread!

No you listed a lot of cases that had been reported FFS you linked to them.

Point us in the direction of some cases that have not been reported

pblakeney

Surrey Commuter wrote:

Point us in the direction of some cases that have not been reported

Here you go.
.
.
.

Ben6899

Coopster the 1st wrote:

This thread sums the situation up perfectly.

Boris compared wearers of the burka to looking like a letter box and it is headline news for a week with the faux outrage demonstrated on this thread.

Hundreds and thousands of young girls get groomed, raped and abused by gangs of paedophile Pakistani men and the news is hushed up by the majority of the mainstream media with no comment from most of the previous faux outraged on this site.

Many on this site need to take a good look at themselves and sort their priorities out, as they are the part of the problem and the continued suppression of this type of story is only leading to the increased influence of those to the far right of politics.

You place way too much importance on Bikeradar fora>Cake Stop as a yardstick for what people are bothered about on a daily basis.

I haven't seen you start a thread on Israel. I'll presume you don't give a single damn about the thousands of innocents caught up in that sh1tstorm.

You need to take a good look at yourself.

(we can all throw around groundless insults, mate)

bompington

My goodness, whataboutery is the common language of political discussion these days but I have rarely seen it as strong as in this thread.

Ben6899

bompington wrote:

My goodness, whataboutery is the common language of political discussion these days but I have rarely seen it as strong as in this thread.

I was using Israel to make a point. I fully agree that whataboutery is the worst type of argument.

verylonglegs

It's no surprise Coopster has finally gone full on Daily Mail reader over a couple of threads but it is surprising some of you who should know better are still entertaining his nonsense and offering a reply. Why even bother with it?